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Old 12-14-2012, 07:26 AM   #181
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70 hour weeks aren't very conducive to wheeling. Choose one--enough money to make it happen or enough time to use it.

Wheeling will commence in late December or early January, no worries.

What this should be showing people is that on and offroad performance are not mutually exclusive.

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Old 12-14-2012, 08:28 AM   #182
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70 hour weeks aren't very conducive to wheeling. Choose one--enough money to make it happen or enough time to use it.

Wheeling will commence in late December or early January, no worries.

What this should be showing people is that on and offroad performance are not mutually exclusive.
Im just givin ya sh*t. I know how it goes...you can't always be wheeling, sometimes there are other priorities. Definitely lookin forward to how it does when you get it out though.

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Old 12-17-2012, 11:28 AM   #183
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OK, just ran some numbers. I thought this was fun and really put into perspective what all I've gained and what I've lost since this recent stint of building began.

Before surgery:














Frame clearance: 20"
Belly clearance: 19.75"
Windshield height: 72"
Diffs: 1" lower than they are now
Front up travel: 4.5"
Rear up travel: 5"

The problems were mainly in the rear. Due to my much-lighter-than-stock *** end, I had to use the short stock springs to sit the Jeep right. With those, I was unseating with room to fall out with 10" shocks....I dropped one of the springs on more than one occasion. That means I didn't have **** for usable travel in the rear but had a suspension capable of plenty of it. That was the main deciding factor in starting from scratch on the frame and while I was at it, I might as well get that wheelbase and departure angle I wanted. When building the frame, I knew I wanted the upper coil buckets to be as high as I could possibly get them. The result was the ability to run 2.5-3" longer coil springs with no increase in ride height. In actuality, I actually lost 1" in suspension height, a good thing given my goal.

I had no intention of even bothering with the front end but once I started, somehow that ended up on the list. I wanted more clearance at the LCA brackets and wanted to put to use the front axle brackets I had sitting on the shelf. The only sensible thing to do was cut off everything--frame and axle--and start fresh. The result was a 3 link with mid-length arms, the same lower mounts I use in the rear, a trussed and sleeved HP30 with flush-mounted LCA mounts, big JJ's all around and added simplicity (no more housing mounted joints, simple lower bump stop fastening, etc). I put a lot of work into making the axle-end coil mounts sit as low to the housing as possible and also removed the top coil spring isolator just to see where it would all sit. It also ended up about 1" lower than stock.

After measurements:
Frame clearance: 19 7/8" (might as well round up to 20")
Belly clearance: 18 1/8"
Windshield height: 72"
Diffs: +1"
Front up travel: 5.5"
Rear up travel: 5.5"

So, I lost 1" in suspension height and gained it back in tire height. So I was running 2.5-3" in suspension height before, I'm now sitting at 1.5-2" now while using the same springs. I was pretty surprised at that and found it pretty cool. I'm now able to use every inch of shock travel and will no longer have to worry about unseating the rear coils. And due to the front fenders and higher rear wheel wells, I'm able to use that travel without interference. The front increase in up travel was due to a lot of grinding and manipulating the diff cover and track bar gusset, along with positioning the housing just right. Tire to fender contact was not the primary interference point. That takes into account 1/2" of deflection of the bump stops during hard, dynamic compression. In the rear, the primary interference point was the upper link mounts against the bottom of the tub. Full bump (hard, without the foam piece) is 1/4" before they hit the tub. I setup the shock mounts to agree and the result was 5.5" from ride height.

As for the losses, I lost a little belly height due to the skid change. But I also lost weight and gained the ability to remove the skid separately. If I have belly clearance issues, I'll look at going up 1" with some new springs.

The downtime:












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Old 12-17-2012, 11:30 AM   #184
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Old 12-17-2012, 11:31 AM   #185
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Old 12-17-2012, 05:10 PM   #186
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Thanks Imped, i've learned a lot from reading your build. I appreciate your unconventional (at least in terms of what everyone else seems to be doing, i.e. more lift is more better) yet (to me, anyway) more sensible approach. I'm still working on getting my head wrapped around it all.
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Old 12-17-2012, 05:14 PM   #187
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Now you're gona get bored...
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Old 12-17-2012, 05:37 PM   #188
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Now you're gona get bored...
Please see "One-Tons and 40s" thread
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Old 12-17-2012, 05:40 PM   #189
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Please see "One-Tons and 40s" thread
Not seeing the one your talking about? I have about 20 links to pirate though
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:18 PM   #190
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Not seeing the one your talking about? I have about 20 links to pirate though
That is just the imaginary thread that I could eventually see happening when he gets "bored."

As far as pirate...35s are the small tires haha.
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:24 PM   #191
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Hey Imped...

I have a question about coverage concerning the standard savvy full corners (not the cut to fit that you are running with the stretch) because I am going to be looking at getting some next month hopefully. Do they extend down and cover the small area where the flares normally sit (the front part of the wheel well closer to the doors)? Or is that spot covered by your Savvy sliders? I plan on ditching the rear flares if I get the full corners, but wasnt sure if your sliders cover that area or your corners do. If the corners dont, I will most likely "modify" my current sliders to cover that spot.
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Old 12-17-2012, 08:35 PM   #192
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Shes got a phat ass yo..
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Old 12-17-2012, 09:01 PM   #193
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That is just the imaginary thread that I could eventually see happening when he gets "bored."

As far as pirate...35s are the small tires haha.
Oh I got ya. I was just under the Imp(ed)ression that he was kinda done after this. Kinda his vision has finally been accomplished. Now he gets to wheel and enjoy.. For now.

Yeah I don't even think they know what a 35 is over there. Lol.


See what I did there^
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Old 12-18-2012, 07:12 AM   #194
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Thanks Imped, i've learned a lot from reading your build. I appreciate your unconventional (at least in terms of what everyone else seems to be doing, i.e. more lift is more better) yet (to me, anyway) more sensible approach. I'm still working on getting my head wrapped around it all.
Thanks for the kind words, but my methods really aren't all that uncommon. There are two types of wheelers--you get it or you don't. The guys who get it build smart.

Use common sense and logical reasoning and don't pay attention to the gimmicky, senseless terms used all over the industry. Example--'lift kit.' There's more to suspension than height, and all 'lift' refers to is height but doesn't take into account anything of value. Just one term I absolutely hate.
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Now you're gona get bored...
Nah, I highly doubt it. This thing has limits. It should wheel awesome for what I like to do but there are some very large rocks I'll still have trouble with.
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Please see "One-Tons and 40s" thread
We'll see. Right now, I'm content but the next project is already in the works and when I start getting the itch to build again, that will probably happen. Hint: Hi9

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That is just the imaginary thread that I could eventually see happening when he gets "bored."

As far as pirate...35s are the small tires haha.
There are some very nice rigs on 35's over there and elsewhere that will go where worse-built rigs on 40's can't. Example--Savvy comp LJ. It's not about the tire size, it's about the foundation.
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Hey Imped...

I have a question about coverage concerning the standard savvy full corners (not the cut to fit that you are running with the stretch) because I am going to be looking at getting some next month hopefully. Do they extend down and cover the small area where the flares normally sit (the front part of the wheel well closer to the doors)? Or is that spot covered by your Savvy sliders? I plan on ditching the rear flares if I get the full corners, but wasnt sure if your sliders cover that area or your corners do. If the corners dont, I will most likely "modify" my current sliders to cover that spot.
I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but you can clearly see that 'full' corners cover everything they can, from the door to the tailgate. As for which panel covers it, I'm not sure. The rocker guards go straight back and the corners are butted up right on top.
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Shes got a phat ass yo..
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Oh I got ya. I was just under the Imp(ed)ression that he was kinda done after this. Kinda his vision has finally been accomplished. Now he gets to wheel and enjoy.. For now.
Let's just say this is the first time I've been truly happy with it in a long, long time. It's not done but unless it gets new axles, there's not much more that can be done. The steering will be taken care of shortly--PSC Extreme box is already sitting in the garage.
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Old 12-18-2012, 07:17 AM   #195
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I meant bored building, you are gona have a hell of a time wheeling now. You are set up to take on a lot of stuff, with more skill then just point and shoot now that you can hit some tougher stuff. Can't wait to see it in action.

You should be happy with it, you did some awesome work. For a DD I don't think you would go much bigger than you are but maybe I am wrong. I thought you mentioned the steering and stuff so I know you have it all lined up and are just wrapping up a few loose ends. When do you plan on taking it out? Anything specific you want to try now trail wise?
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Old 12-18-2012, 07:25 AM   #196
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I meant bored building, you are gona have a hell of a time wheeling now. You are set up to take on a lot of stuff, with more skill then just point and shoot now that you can hit some tougher stuff. Can't wait to see it in action.

You should be happy with it, you did some awesome work. For a DD I don't think you would go much bigger than you are but maybe I am wrong. I thought you mentioned the steering and stuff so I know you have it all lined up and are just wrapping up a few loose ends. When do you plan on taking it out? Anything specific you want to try now trail wise?
Well, I've got a couple other rigs that will be taking up the small amount of free time I have (cough, Wes (IndyJeepMan), cough) so I won't be bored. I'm fairly burnt out on my rig so it'll be a while before I have any interest on doing much on it. When it comes time for axles, I'll build them outside of the Jeep so I can still play with it.

It works very nice on the road but I haven't been driving it every day just due to the fact that my other car gets 2x the mileage. After not having to experience such poor mileage over the past 9 months, it was kind of a shock. It's very fun to drive, though and sometimes I can't help but to take it. I went out downtown last weekend and had it parked at the Conrad Hotel....it looked pretty out of place next to the Porsches and Benz's. As for when I'll have time to wheel, it looks like we're planning a big run after the new year so that'll probably be the shake-down. There's a certain wall in Attica that's got my name written all over it. Hopefully I can finally do it. I've tried it a hundred times and can honestly say my Jeep was holding me back.....that was the main motivation for about everything I've done.
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Old 12-18-2012, 09:47 AM   #197
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We'll see. Right now, I'm content but the next project is already in the works and when I start getting the itch to build again, that will probably happen. Hint: Hi9


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There are some very nice rigs on 35's over there and elsewhere that will go where worse-built rigs on 40's can't. Example--Savvy comp LJ. It's not about the tire size, it's about the foundation. .
Well technically...I think the savvy rig bumped up to 37s ...AND an LS.

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I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but you can clearly see that 'full' corners cover everything they can, from the door to the tailgate. As for which panel covers it, I'm not sure. The rocker guards go straight back and the corners are butted up right on top. .
Ya...what I was trying to explain didnt make sense for sh*t, but I still tried to explain it the best I could. From the looks of it (after looking through your pics again), your rocker guards are covering the section that I was curious about. Looks like a few modifications will be made to my current sliders until I change them to something else.
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Old 12-18-2012, 10:00 AM   #198
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OK, I see what you're talking about. I used LJ-length sliders and TJ blank corners in order to make it look just right. That was actually the single most expensive order for this entire project--the corners, sliders and tub rails--and that's what made doing this so cost prohibitive in the past. If you look at my JF build thread, I mentioned that exact thing almost two years ago.

I wanted the blanks because all you get are the mounting holes....so I wouldn't have any unused license plate holes, a fuel filler hole, fender flare mounting holes, etc. Not event he tailgate holes come drilled for those who want to run a drop-down gate.
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Old 12-18-2012, 10:10 AM   #199
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OK, I see what you're talking about. I used LJ-length sliders and TJ blank corners in order to make it look just right. That was actually the single most expensive order for this entire project--the corners, sliders and tub rails--and that's what made doing this so cost prohibitive in the past. If you look at my JF build thread, I mentioned that exact thing almost two years ago.

I wanted the blanks because all you get are the mounting holes....so I wouldn't have any unused license plate holes, a fuel filler hole, fender flare mounting holes, etc. Not event he tailgate holes come drilled for those who want to run a drop-down gate.
Thanks for that I will most likely be getting the TJ no flare corners...to cut down on the amount of holes as well. Since my fuel filler and license plate are still in tact, I dont need to go to quite the same extent as you.
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Old 12-18-2012, 10:30 AM   #200
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Well, I've got a couple other rigs that will be taking up the small amount of free time I have (cough, Wes (IndyJeepMan), cough) so I won't be bored. I'm fairly burnt out on my rig so it'll be a while before I have any interest on doing much on it. When it comes time for axles, I'll build them outside of the Jeep so I can still play with it.

It works very nice on the road but I haven't been driving it every day just due to the fact that my other car gets 2x the mileage. After not having to experience such poor mileage over the past 9 months, it was kind of a shock. It's very fun to drive, though and sometimes I can't help but to take it. I went out downtown last weekend and had it parked at the Conrad Hotel....it looked pretty out of place next to the Porsches and Benz's. As for when I'll have time to wheel, it looks like we're planning a big run after the new year so that'll probably be the shake-down. There's a certain wall in Attica that's got my name written all over it. Hopefully I can finally do it. I've tried it a hundred times and can honestly say my Jeep was holding me back.....that was the main motivation for about everything I've done.
I'll have two gopros ready for that trip..
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Old 12-18-2012, 10:35 AM   #201
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Thanks for that I will most likely be getting the TJ no flare corners...to cut down on the amount of holes as well. Since my fuel filler and license plate are still in tact, I dont need to go to quite the same extent as you.
I don't think Savvy makes 'no flare' corners. If you want that, get blanks and cut out/drill what you need. You'll end up with everything you need, nothing you don't, and a really clean look. You can also change the shape of the wheel well since that's all up to you.
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Old 12-18-2012, 11:28 AM   #202
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I don't think Savvy makes 'no flare' corners. If you want that, get blanks and cut out/drill what you need. You'll end up with everything you need, nothing you don't, and a really clean look. You can also change the shape of the wheel well since that's all up to you.
Savvy Full Corner Armor
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Old 12-18-2012, 11:49 AM   #203
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Well I'll be damned, that's cool. Guess I should've just looked first.
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Old 12-18-2012, 11:55 AM   #204
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Well I'll be damned, that's cool. Guess I should've just looked first.
Itd just save me a little work since I dont need any "custom" wheel wells right now.
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Old 12-18-2012, 11:58 AM   #205
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Haha of course. His rig is going to be interesting, for sure. Sad that it is not a DD but understandable, especially on long trips. What kind of mileage are you pulling now? That must have been quite a sight, haha.

Is the wall the one you have pictured above? Goodluck on it, I know you always said you wanted to take it down.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:10 PM   #206
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Haha of course. His rig is going to be interesting, for sure. Sad that it is not a DD but understandable, especially on long trips. What kind of mileage are you pulling now? That must have been quite a sight, haha.

Is the wall the one you have pictured above? Goodluck on it, I know you always said you wanted to take it down.
Who's rig? lol
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:12 PM   #207
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Who's rig? lol
Your rig is going to be interesting, Imped isn't DDing his rig. Driving a car instead.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:20 PM   #208
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Your rig is going to be interesting, Imped isn't DDing his rig. Driving a car instead.
Oh yeah.. We both have DD trucks instead. But! My jeep gets better mileage than my truck lol.

Just isnt as comfy
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:34 PM   #209
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Just because I don't drive it every day doesn't mean I couldn't.....the only reason I don't is because getting 24mpg is better than 12mpg. I still drive it 2-3 days out of the week minimum. If my other car went down, I'd DD the Jeep with no issues. It drives as good as anything else on the road.
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:45 PM   #210
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Just because I don't drive it every day doesn't mean I couldn't.....the only reason I don't is because getting 24mpg is better than 12mpg. I still drive it 2-3 days out of the week minimum. If my other car went down, I'd DD the Jeep with no issues. It drives as good as anything else on the road.
Of course, I just mean it's sad that gas has to be a factor, of course you'd love to drive your rig everyday. Obviously it drives well

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Oh yeah.. We both have DD trucks instead. But! My jeep gets better mileage than my truck lol.

Just isnt as comfy
understandable. The ride will be better when you're done, no?

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