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Old 06-03-2011, 12:44 AM   #1
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Bittersweet

I become very depressed when I think of what has happened to the Jeep brand. I own a 2001 TJ and it is made similarly to the way Jeeps were made in the golden era of the 1980's. It breaks my heart to think that I'll never be able to own that 4.0L brand new in a Jeep vehicle with 10 miles on it. It saddens me to realize that now Jeep tries to pass off vehicles like Patriot and Liberty as "real honest to goodness" Jeep vehicles. It sickens me to think that because a couple of hippies in Washington wanted to save some stupid bird we can't have the legendary vehicles that made the Jeep brand great. Jeep has gone from being the Gods of the off road world to just another grocery getter.

I hate new cars.... I can't hate Jeep though, no matter how watered down they are.

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Old 06-03-2011, 12:53 AM   #2
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Bird? Say what? i must have missed something here...

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Old 06-03-2011, 01:08 AM   #3
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think about the V8 muscle cars...
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Old 06-03-2011, 06:37 AM   #4
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Your memory is a bit off. The tj might have the same engine, but that's about all it shares with a CJ or Yj. It has a completely different suspension that was widely scorned by the "purests" of the day.

As far as other vehicles, the liberty is all jeep and quite capable, especially the KK. Did you forget about the wagoneer and eagle? Actually the eagle was just too far ahead of its time.
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Old 06-03-2011, 08:27 AM   #5
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I've owned a lotta Corvettes and I hated it when they started getting bigger and wider and adding more elex to my 1961 "fuely"-but

It happens with ALL VEHICLES-, I thought my 1947 Ford BLACK coupe, was the best that ever came down the pike, but

Look at all the safety improvements/power/seat restraints/transmissions/clutchs-on&on&on&on

Thats progress/advance technology/the AUTO industry-suckit up and go on with your life !!

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Old 06-03-2011, 12:19 PM   #6
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id still like a new jk rubi although i dont like the van engine the real jeep shame in the lack of solid axles on the grands and the death of the xj
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Old 06-03-2011, 12:26 PM   #7
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Can't figure out what it is about the word MINIVAN, thats discusts so many YOUNG jeeper wannabes


Quote:
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id still like a new jk rubi although i dont like the van engine the real jeep shame in the lack of solid axles on the grands and the death of the xj
It's a tried/ trued/ trusted v6 and has plenty of power/w proper gearing-

Doesn't really matter though, there's a new one coming out that will go directly to NASCAR/ WINSTON/ NHRA--no doubt, but

I'll just stick with my poor little 3.8L "MINIVAN" engine !!

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Old 06-03-2011, 12:35 PM   #8
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I'm just curious what was similar about the TJs and CJs that makes you long for Glory Days, Mr. Springsteen.

CJs were tiny rustbucket tubs with metal interiors (quite hard metal, if you were clanging off of it during a wreck or some harsh off-roading...).

TJs have as much plastic on the dash and interior as a JK.

TJs have suspensions more in common with JKs than CJs.

TJ fender flares and bumper pieces are plastic, prone to fading over time, very much like the JK. CJs, if they had anything, would have a rubber strip that you wound up tearing off before it fell off.

You could get a 4 cyl for the CJ and TJ. +1 for the old days, I guess.

I think your rose-colored glasses have some dirt on them, making it hard for you to see out of them.
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Old 06-03-2011, 01:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jebby
id still like a new jk rubi although i dont like the van engine the real jeep shame in the lack of solid axles on the grands and the death of the xj
You mean as opposed to the previous AMC Gremlin engine?
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Old 06-03-2011, 01:49 PM   #10
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cummon both the 2.5 and 4.0 are build to last...... nothing wrong with the jk i just like the straight 6 best..... the 6speed is cool though.... its the big brother losing SFA that gets me most..... and the death of xj just cuz i loved them...... miss the pickups of old as well.....

ps the fogs in the bumper looks um....."special"
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Old 06-03-2011, 01:50 PM   #11
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like i said i like the jks and when my tj goes i would love another wrangler....
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Old 06-03-2011, 02:13 PM   #12
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You mean as opposed to the previous AMC Gremlin engine?
That little 232 slant 6 was an unstoppable motor. I know this because my first car was a '77 Gremlin. I had to pay my Dad $500 for that thing and it just wouldn't die.

Now, back to the not-Jeeps. I don't care how "capable" they might be while driving down a dirt road with a little mud on the sides, the Liberty, Patriot, or Compass do NOT deserve to have a Jeep badge on them. The old ZJs and XJs were great before Chrysler killed them. Now, the only real Jeep has a removeable top and two solid axles. I had to add the axle part because apparently you can get a JK in 2wd. That's the biggest travesty of all. The JK isn't bad but the 4-doors look like an H3 to me.
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Old 06-03-2011, 02:27 PM   #13
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No different then any other object. Remember way back about 4 yrs ago the iPhone first came out. It was expensive and you were cool if you had one. Everybody has some sort of smartphone now, whether it be an iPhone or an android. I do understand you a bit though, I bought my jeep back in 01, it felt cool to own it. Now there is a lot of jeeps on the road and no certain type of person that drives one. Good thing for the Rubicon. To me if you own one, kind of separates you from the rest of the crowd
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Old 06-03-2011, 02:56 PM   #14
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Just do what I do....never buy new and redo the old ones
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:04 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jebby View Post
cummon both the 2.5 and 4.0 are build to last...... nothing wrong with the jk i just like the straight 6 best..... the 6speed is cool though.... its the big brother losing SFA that gets me most..... and the death of xj just cuz i loved them...... miss the pickups of old as well.....

ps the fogs in the bumper looks um....."special"
The 3.8 is also a proven engine that is built to last.
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:07 PM   #16
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True but...a V engine will not outlast straight one
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:07 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bone View Post
That little 232 slant 6 was an unstoppable motor. I know this because my first car was a '77 Gremlin. I had to pay my Dad $500 for that thing and it just wouldn't die.

Now, back to the not-Jeeps. I don't care how "capable" they might be while driving down a dirt road with a little mud on the sides, the Liberty, Patriot, or Compass do NOT deserve to have a Jeep badge on them. The old ZJs and XJs were great before Chrysler killed them. Now, the only real Jeep has a removeable top and two solid axles. I had to add the axle part because apparently you can get a JK in 2wd. That's the biggest travesty of all. The JK isn't bad but the 4-doors look like an H3 to me.
You can no longer get a 2WD JK. The Liberty is not the same as the Patriot or Compass. The KK is a natural descendant of the XJ and is in fact named Cherokee in Europe.
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:27 PM   #18
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Take a deep breath. Who cares what else Jeep does so long as they continue to put out legitimate Wranglers? As popular and great as the Wrangler is, it could not support the entire brand--more is required.

I'm happy with Jeep so long as we're getting a real Wrangler. That means solid axles, legitimate 4wd and 4lo, manual transmissions, removable doors/top, a Rubicon level trim that offers stock lockers etc., iconic styling, and minimal electronics when compared to the rest of the market.

When they stop doing that, I'll get annoyed. Although truthfully, I've gotten mine already so I almost wouldn't care about that either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by daggo66 View Post
The 3.8 is also a proven engine that is built to last.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibuildembig View Post
True but...a V engine will not outlast straight one
M'eh--but when we're talking reasonably proven engines of the modern era, how significant is this distinction, really? It's reasonable to expect a well-maintained (or even not well-maintained) 3.8 to last for well over a decade, maybe even two, before a rebuild is required. Perhaps the 4.0 could be expected to go even longer. But if we factor in other issues, such as improved mileage, doesn't it all sort of shake out in the wash? It's not like one routinely lasts 50 years and the other only makes it 4.

Quote:
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id still like a new jk rubi although i dont like the van engine . . .
C'mon folks, the "van engine" thing has got to go. Like Daggo mentioned, the I6 was the "Gremlin engine" and we're not cracking on it for that. The mythical Pentastar coming next year is powering all the Chrysler/Dodge minivans. A vehicle is more than the engine--it's a package. The question isn't where else the particular engine has been used, it's how it works in the current set up.
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:35 PM   #19
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I was being more general than 3.8 versus 4.0. Its a proven fact that an inline assembly is smoother, quieter, and wears parts at a rate less than half of what a V engine does. This is easily seen in the diesel market...sure there are durmax and powerstrokes with over 200-300K on them (I own one)...but there are tons of cummins out there with over 600-800K.
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Old 06-03-2011, 03:37 PM   #20
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Hey look everyone, I found that dead horse!

I personally will get over the watered down crap when they release a diesel Wrangler in the US. (oh wait, I really don't care...but a diesel would be cool)
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Old 06-03-2011, 05:19 PM   #21
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I miss a few things, but the flat-head 4 in my CJ3A ain't one of them
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Old 06-03-2011, 07:20 PM   #22
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Quote:
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I miss a few things, but the flat-head 4 in my CJ3A ain't one of them
You mean you didn't like a top speed of 40 going down hill?
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Old 06-03-2011, 10:15 PM   #23
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Quote:
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like i said i like the jks and when my tj goes i would love another wrangler....
When your TJ goes? I will never let my YJ die!
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Old 06-03-2011, 11:02 PM   #24
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Quote:
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When your TJ goes? I will never let my YJ die!
I was thinking the same thing...where's it gonna go? I love my TJ and LJ, I doubt my taste will change so I plan on keeping them both for a LONG time! They will still make parts for them as long as I'm alive. In fact, I'm in the process of hunting down my YJ that I had in high school 15 years ago. I know that it's kept in a garage and rarely driven. Oh how sweet it would be to buy that baby back!
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Old 06-04-2011, 01:31 AM   #25
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I still wanna know what this hype about the birds is! New jeeps are sloooowly growing on me, but I'd still take my tj over one any day, and a good old cj7 over anything anytime!
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Old 06-05-2011, 12:29 PM   #26
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I hear all this lamenting about YJs.... I took so much CRAP when I bought my first YJ I almost got rid of it immediately......square headlights.....BLASPHEMY......

When I was a pup..... there was no WRANGLER.........only CJs, MJs and those OTHER Jeeps......(Wagoneer, Cherokee, etc).

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