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Old 12-15-2012, 11:37 AM   #1
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Premium/Plus/Unleaded?

Which gas do you guys prefer and get at the pump? Besides difference in price, is there really a difference at all in the actual gas itself? A buddy of mine told me that both plus and premium are higher octane which gives you more power and is better for your engine, but I started using premium fuel and to be honest I haven't noticed any difference in fuel mileage or power. I'm almost wondering if the gas stations just say plus or premium to tell you its better and its really not, and its actually just the same as unleaded to get you to pay an extra buck?

So what is your guys/gals opinions on the different types of gas and what one do you go with and why?
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Old 12-15-2012, 11:46 AM   #2
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Not my opinion ... just the facts.....

The octane requirements of the fuel is directly related to the compression ratio and timing. Unless your engine is a high compression unit (your stock Jeep motor is not) or your timing is advanced a bunch you have absolutely no need for anything above 87 or 89 octane. Contrary to what most folks think (your friend is an example) the higher octane fuel will actually run WORSE in your engine. It is not being compressed enough to reach optimum combustion conditions for the octane. No offense to your friend, but if I were you I'd take his advice about things with a lot of caution. He totally missed this one.

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Old 12-15-2012, 12:35 PM   #3
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^X2. If your motor is stock, the owners manual will tell you what gas to run.

My '04 has been burning regular since it was born with no issues.
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Old 12-15-2012, 12:41 PM   #4
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I totally agree with Steve. The only thing I try to do is only run Non Ethenol gas in all of my vehicles. I had to have the carbs overhauled on my GoldWing from using Ethenol gas. That was a very expensive lesson.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:28 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diver9543 View Post
I totally agree with Steve. The only thing I try to do is only run Non Ethenol gas in all of my vehicles. I had to have the carbs overhauled on my GoldWing from using Ethenol gas. That was a very expensive lesson.
If you had a carbureted 4.2 in a YJ or CJ, then I would recommend non-ethenol gas. Modern fuel injected motors can run ethanol gas all day. From what I've heard on here running higher octane can actually be harmful to your motor.
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:19 PM   #6
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I run 87 Octane, just as the Owner's Manual recommends. No reason to run anything else...
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:32 PM   #7
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Mine seems to prefer Chevron regular
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:56 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Lando25 View Post
If you had a carbureted 4.2 in a YJ or CJ, then I would recommend non-ethenol gas. Modern fuel injected motors can run ethanol gas all day.
As you said, ethanol fuels can and do perform quite well in modern engines. The problems with ethanol is water absorption and separation if left sitting in the tank for extended periods. If your Jeep is a "casual" vehicle that is only driven every few weeks, then I would strongly suggest that you add StarTron or another similar treatment to your fuel.
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:01 PM   #9
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Basically already stated in this thread, but to keep it simple to understand

Our Jeep motors were designed for 87 octane....
  • 87 Octane = optimal power
  • 89 Octane = less power
  • 92 Octane = even less power
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:24 PM   #10
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Ok, well I put $20 worth of V-Power Premium today in the Jeep, went to 2 gas stations and both were out of Regular and Mid Grade, but one of them was selling Premium for the price of Regular ($2.99) so I put $20 because I was sitting right on E
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:42 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Turbostixxx View Post
Ok, well I put $20 worth of V-Power Premium today in the Jeep, went to 2 gas stations and both were out of Regular and Mid Grade, but one of them was selling Premium for the price of Regular ($2.99) so I put $20 because I was sitting right on E
Premium is not going to hurt anything...it will just produce less power than Regular.
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Old 12-15-2012, 04:10 PM   #12
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I would REALLY like to hear the explanation (rational) of how ethanol containing fuel contributes to early failure of CARBs.......

Been running it in CARBed & injected......lawnmowers.....motorcycles.....Jeeps .......for DECADES...... no issues......
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Old 12-15-2012, 04:23 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by bc3_Jeep View Post
I would REALLY like to hear the explanation (rational) of how ethanol containing fuel contributes to early failure of CARBs.......

Been running it in CARBed & injected......lawnmowers.....motorcycles.....Jeeps .......for DECADES...... no issues......
Ethanol breaks down some rubber compounds and most all plastics. Granted, it takes time for it to do damage. Ethanol is a SOLVENT. But the degradation of these materials is one of the biggest concerns of ethanol on older boats, RVs, mowers, etc. Two-cycle engines are especially at risk because they get their lubrication from the fuel/oil mixture. Far more important is the problem with water attraction and separation. GOOGLE "ethanol problems" and you can read for days ......
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Old 12-15-2012, 04:42 PM   #14
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just follow what the owner's manual recommends. i'm glad jeep recommends 87 octane for my jeep, because 87 octane is 10%-12% cheaper per gallon than 89 octane (which my Hemi Grand Cherokee has to use).
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Old 12-15-2012, 07:17 PM   #15
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I run regular and it purrs like a kitten.
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Old 12-15-2012, 10:38 PM   #16
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All of this is conjecture......

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve305 View Post
Ethanol breaks down some rubber compounds and most all plastics. Granted, it takes time for it to do damage. Ethanol is a SOLVENT. But the degradation of these materials is one of the biggest concerns of ethanol on older boats, RVs, mowers, etc. Two-cycle engines are especially at risk because they get their lubrication from the fuel/oil mixture. Far more important is the problem with water attraction and separation. GOOGLE "ethanol problems" and you can read for days ......

Gasoline is ALSO a solvent...... and any degradation of lubricity caused by ethanol is more than compensated by the lubricity of the gasoline......

People have been putting ethanol in their cars for decades to PREVENT water issues....(HEET)......Ethanol does not CAUSE water issues.... it PREVENTS them.


I do not consider GOOGLE a QUOTABLE source for anything but conjecture and rumors..... you would be wise to refrain as well. Chemistry is a FAR better teacher of WHY this is not so.......
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:53 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by bc3_Jeep View Post
Gasoline is ALSO a solvent...... and any degradation of lubricity caused by ethanol is more than compensated by the lubricity of the gasoline......

People have been putting ethanol in their cars for decades to PREVENT water issues....(HEET)......Ethanol does not CAUSE water issues.... it PREVENTS them.


I do not consider GOOGLE a QUOTABLE source for anything but conjecture and rumors..... you would be wise to refrain as well. Chemistry is a FAR better teacher of WHY this is not so.......
You obviously have the facts, but you're not understanding the problems. OK ... let's go again ....

E10 ethanol blends will undergo phase separation and water contamination in 90 days, and sometimes even sooner. Ethanol is a form of alcohol. Actually, it's a direct derivative of corn, or more commonly known as moonshine. And since you are referring to chemistry, then you should know that alcohol attracts water. You knew that ... right? And guess why people have been pouring it in their gas tanks for years? To remove water that had contaminated their fuel. That's right ... they used it to attract the water that was ALREADY THERE so it could be carried away in the fuel. You were right on that. But, they weren't trying to ATTRACT MORE water (as ethanol will do over time). So there's your reason for using HEET and other products ... to remove accumulated water in fuel tanks. Not to attract more water.

As for the "degradation of lubricity" comment (what big words you use!), the lubricity has absolutely nothing to do with it. Nice try. Problems with ethanol-based fuels include de-lamination (chemical breakdown) of rubber, plastic, and synthetic components such as hoses, fuel lines, plastic fuel pumps, plastic fuel tanks, fiberglass fuel tanks, fuel tanks that are epoxy coated, or with rubberized or plasticized liners, and aluminum, copper, brass, or bronze fuel system and injection system components. Yep ... it's a solvent alright. Ethanol is a strong solvent and has been used by industry for hundreds of years to clean various types of contaminants and to dissolve and suspend solids. But I've never heard of gasoline (which you refer to as a solvent also) doing any of that? Hmmmmmmmm...........

And guess what that ethanol mixture with dissolved solids (plastics, styrenes, rubber materials, etc) will do as the fuel evaporates? The dissolved materials will reform! The reforming of the dissolved material shows up as deposits in the fuel system and engine. This material has shown up as deposits on the throttle plate, injectors, piston crowns, and exhaust valves. It is also a problem with PCV systems and turbochargers. Gasoline alone will not dissolve these materials to the point that ethanol does. It isn't that strong.

Now ....... you might want to re-think your position about ethanol or alcohol and it's reaction in vehicle usage until you research some more and get your facts straight. You might also want to do a little research on how ethanol reacts in a combustion engine, also. These aren't my opinions. They are facts that are published (in places other than Google!) by some of the best chemists in the industry.

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Old 12-16-2012, 10:08 AM   #18
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Good job getting the facts out Steve305. I prefer no ethanol in my gasoline and no bacon grease in my diesel fuel.
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Old 12-16-2012, 10:27 AM   #19
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Good job getting the facts out Steve305. I prefer no ethanol in my gasoline and no bacon grease in my diesel fuel.
Anyone can find these facts, as well as test results, but simply doing an internet search. They are out there for the reading. Lots of them. And even if someone doesn't trust Google, Bing, or whoever .... all you need to do is look at the address of the website that you are being directed to. When it's obviously a reputable site, then the "trust" factor goes out the window. I have first-hand experience with the effects of ethanol through family friends who are outboard technicians and automobile dealers.

Ethanol has been a problem with the marine industry for a while. It eats up the older "non ethanol compliant" fuel lines and causes them to collapse and deteriorate, leaving particles of rubber in the fuel flow. Any boat older than 2001 probably has the non-compliant fuel lines and they need to be changed. This is of particular concern to those running 2-cycle motors that depend on fuel flow to provide lubrication.

Unfortunately, E90 and even possibly E85 is going to be in our future for a long time. It's in our best interest to educate ourselves as much as possible on these fuels to avoid possible problems with our engines and supporting pumps, hoses, etc. Products like StarTron have proven to counteract some of the separation problems, but there are still issues. The best protection is to purchase fuel from a dealer that sells a lot of volume, and not to let fuel sit in your tank for extended periods. There have been tests that have shown that phase separation can occur at 30 days in certain conditions. If your vehicle sits for extended periods you would be well served to dose it with StarTron or another ethanol stabilizer. It's cheap insurance.

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