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First day Jeep owner with a MAJOR issue.

4K views 26 replies 14 participants last post by  demarpaint 
#1 ·
I just picked up my first Jeep from a few states away. Made the 13hr trek back home without any issues. 07 Jeep Unlimited Rubicon (auto) with 120k on the clock. Good condition, well maintained vehicle. Mods are as follows: 4.5" BDS lift kit, 20" Poison Spyder wheels on 35's, 5.13 gears and Bully Dog GT. The only issue was a "wobble" shake at 40mph, regardless if you're accelerating or decelerating.

Driving home, the transmission never showed any signs of having issues. Earlier today, after napping from my long trek, I decided to meet up with a buddy whom also has a JKU for a cold one. On my way, I needed to punch it to get over so I can get onto the next freeway. Executed and got over just fine but I noticed the engine was still in high revs, so I glanced down and notice that the RPM was up there in the range. Glanced over at the BD computer and it shows that I'm in 3rd gear still with transmission temp at 173F. I then proceed to let off the gas and reapply a little throttle, transmission now engages into 4th. Cool, I thought to myself. Except I wish that were the case. I noticed I was losing speed and any attempt to apply more throttle had little use except for shooting up the engine revs. As I then coast off the freeway, the engine cuts out.

At this point, I decided to attempt to fire her back up but nothing. It was dead silent. I then turned the key to the ON position and looked at my engine temp gauge and it was at MAXIMUM, glanced over at the Bully and the transmission temp was 1,100F!! I then sat it out and let it cool down for over an hour. When I attempted to start the car, it was really hesitant and sounded really weak. My buddy went across the road and just got a whole new battery. Installed that and the Jeep sounds as if it's almost about to start. It turns over once or maybe twice. Tried again but it's less action and now I get an "electronic" burn smell from the vicinity of the starter.

Any help would be appreciated. And if anyone is a Jeep mechanic in the Houston area, please PM me. Attached are a few pics for your viewing pleasure.



 
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#2 ·
Well, I can assure you that your engine temperature was not 1100 degrees. The exhaust gasses on my diesel rarely see 1100f. My first thought would be to completely remove the tuner. Doesnt cost a penny. I'd bet it is something computer or transmission related due to the strange shifting and burning smell.
 
#6 ·
Interesting enough, I after a vast amount of time searching, I found out about how a cracked header can cause a "knock" so I went ahead and pulled that and guess what I found? Also, the previous owner stated that he used 6qts of oil while doing an oil change for me for my trek home and this is what is showing with a cold engine..






In the mean time, I'm going to change the following:
-spark plugs
-oil & filter
-uninstall tune
-knock sensor
-put a bottle of octane booster in the tank
Anything else you would recommend?
 
#12 ·
The transmission fluid temp never hit 1,100F, a sensor or something else is bad. The exhaust manifold is cracked probably causing you some problems. The oil is over filled probably causing another set of problems, like foaming oil which in time will cause engine damage. Hard to tell from the pic, either the oil was foaming, or coolant is mixed in with it. I would pressure test the cooling system when the engine is COLD to rule out a bad head gasket.

Why use Octane booster? If you need higher octane gas buy premium gas.
 
#7 ·
I'm not seeing the dip stick/ oil too well. Dirty? Looks over filled, unless you didn't clean and redip
 
#10 ·
Yes, it is overfilled.

Since ur putting in new plugs and ur current wires are all receiving spark, I would say a double check of the ignition timing
How would I go about checking the ignition timing?

The oil looks like it is significantly overfilled. What does the coolant level look like? I would predict that your coolant level is low, because it is in the crankcase. The hard starting would also be indicative of coolant in the cylinder and the cylinder hydro-locking. If I were a betting man, I would bet that you find coolant on one or more of the spark plugs you remove. This smells like a head gasket failure at best or possibly a cracked cylinder head or block. It's also a little fishy that the previous owner had just changed oil. Because he knew there was coolant in the oil? Did he install stop leak and change the oil and sell it? The timing is very peculiar.

I would start by doing a cooling system pressure test first. If that somehow doesn't point to a failure, I would next do a block test (to see if exhaust gasses are getting into the cooling system).

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I think you have bigger problems.
Wow, I actually thought about that too so I opened up the radiator earlier today and it was still full with no signs of oil contamination. So far, I've only removed the spark plugs from the driver side and all three are dry. Actually, the owner initially suggested that I stop by a lube shop to get an oil change on my way back but eventually caved and offered to change it for me since he couldn't recall the last time he changed the oil.


The more I think about this, I'm leaning more towards a fuel issue due to the following reasons:
-loss of power on the freeway but electronics were still working
-loss of power immediately after high engine RPM
-no CEL codes
-the more I attempted to start the car, the closer the engine would get to actually turning over. Which it eventually did when it was towed home and after a few additional cranks.
-knocking noise, running too lean

The only thing countering this is that I actually hear a whining noise in the rear when I put the key to the ON position. I'm going to rent a fuel pressure test kit from AutoZone tomorrow.
 
#9 ·
The oil looks like it is significantly overfilled. What does the coolant level look like? I would predict that your coolant level is low, because it is in the crankcase. The hard starting would also be indicative of coolant in the cylinder and the cylinder hydro-locking. If I were a betting man, I would bet that you find coolant on one or more of the spark plugs you remove. This smells like a head gasket failure at best or possibly a cracked cylinder head or block. It's also a little fishy that the previous owner had just changed oil. Because he knew there was coolant in the oil? Did he install stop leak and change the oil and sell it? The timing is very peculiar.

I would start by doing a cooling system pressure test first. If that somehow doesn't point to a failure, I would next do a block test (to see if exhaust gasses are getting into the cooling system).

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I think you have bigger problems.
 
#11 ·
No codes is likely due to the tuner. Ignition timing is likely not adjustable at all, it is entirely computer controlled. The whirring noise you hear in the rear of the vehicle is from the fuel pump doing an initial prime with key on and engine off, this is normal. I am assuming you didn't have significant exhaust noise during your trip home? If not, the crack is likely due to coolant being introduced into the combustion chamber and creating super heated steam causing the manifold to crack. How is the coolant level in the recovery bottle? Is it low? Does the oil look milky at all? It appears like it has that chocolate milk look starting to happen. Does the oil smell sweet? I have even put a dab on my finger and tasted the oil before (I am aware of the eww factor but it works). If it tastes sweet, you have coolant in your oil. I would also get a coolant pressure tester while you are at autozone. Your cooling system should hold 16 psi for at least 30 minutes. If it holds while the engine is cold, then you may need to warm the engine up (assuming you can get it to run) and then retest the cooling system. BE VERY CAREFUL WITH HOT ENGINE COOLANT UNDER PRESSURE!

Also when you change your oil, if you have raw coolant getting into the crankcase it will separate and come out immediately when removing the drain plug. The oil will be sitting on top of the coolant.

I truly hope it is something much simpler, but I don't think your even close to out of the forest of overheating/head gasket problems.
 
#13 ·
I did not notice any odd exhaust noise or any out of the ordinary engine noise. Coolant overflow tank is 3/4 full with no odd discoloration. I watched the entire stream of oil draining and there wasn't anything worth noting. The only smell I get from the oil is a tinge of fuel. I will definitely grab a coolant test kit and probably a compression test kit as well.

The transmission fluid temp never hit 1,100F, a sensor or something else is bad. The exhaust manifold is cracked probably causing you some problems. The oil is over filled probably causing another set of problems, like foaming oil which in time will cause engine damage. Hard to tell from the pic, either the oil was foaming, or coolant is mixed in with it. I would pressure test the cooling system when the engine is COLD to rule out a bad head gasket.

Why use Octane booster? If you need higher octane gas buy premium gas.
I was afraid of that foaming issue. I didn't check the oil level before I headed home because the engine was hot (he picked me up from the airport in it). Plus I asked him how many quarts he used and he stated 6, which is the correct amount. I'm holding off on the header purchase since I've sourced a motor locally that has them already on there. I want to try to get to the bottom of this before tossing in the towel and buying another motor (without breaking the bank).

Do these 3.8L engine's main fuel line have a test port? Or am I looking at having to remove the intake manifold?
 
#21 ·
What's the difference? (From a legal aspect?)
 
#22 ·
If the payment was made at the time of delivery then the transaction was made in his state. If he sent the payment prior to deliver to the seller in the other state, then it is a Federal matter because it crossed state lines. Whether the feds get involved or not is not all that important, but it gives him a bigger hammer to use. They miss represented the condition of the vehicle which can easily be construed as fraud.
 
#23 ·
It sucks that you got screwed. If you have legal options I hope you use them. On the upside, this is a great opportunity for a LS or Hemi conversion. I know its a big bunch of change but then its yours forever and it will be a beast. Good Luck and keep us informed.
 
#25 ·
I actually have a C5 vette sitting in the garage. It's just the damn conversion kits are so expensive! Otherwise, I totally would.

13 hour drive after taking possession does not sound like there was a known issue at time of sale. If a motor was already damaged to a point it is going to implode, your not going to be able to mask it enough that it makes a 13 hour drive down the hiway with no indication what so ever. To me sounds like the luck of the draw buying a used auto.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yeah, this what I'm thinking. You win some and you lose some. Maybe his morals will come into play and offer a partial refund to help cover some costs? Lets hope so.
 
#24 ·
13 hour drive after taking possession does not sound like there was a known issue at time of sale. If a motor was already damaged to a point it is going to implode, your not going to be able to mask it enough that it makes a 13 hour drive down the hiway with no indication what so ever. To me sounds like the luck of the draw buying a used auto.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#27 ·
Man that sucks. I bet he knew it too. He probably added some nice thick Lucas to the oil mix, to quiet it down, crossed his fingers and got away with it. If he wrote up an invoice saying "sold as is" you're screwed. You could try taking him to court, good luck with that, I think you're screwed either way. Court might be worth a try though. Good luck!
 
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