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Old 02-03-2014, 12:56 PM   #31
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No upper arms right ?

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Old 02-03-2014, 01:20 PM   #32
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No upper arms right ?
Correct. No upper arms with kit. Still have factory UCAs.

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Old 02-03-2014, 01:35 PM   #33
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Oh ok ... I would be concerned a bit with almost 6* caster if that's what he is getting.

Cam bolts are used for
Increasing caster running the stock arms. To lesson caster (with lower arms) -never heard of that done. Makes no sense


As far as the difference from side to side.
The passenger side on JK's always seems to be a bit higher on caster for road crown --I believe. If she drives straight, keep the cross caster and dial each arm back a turn (if possible)

To try and even it out, only dial back the high side. You are shooting for 4.5-5*

At 5.5* average caster.. Pinion angle should show .5 to 0 * or a touch over 90*
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:09 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjeeper10 View Post
Oh ok ... I would be concerned a bit with almost 6* caster if that's what he is getting.

Cam bolts are used for
Increasing caster running the stock arms. To lesson caster (with lower arms) -never heard of that done. Makes no sense


As far as the difference from side to side.
The passenger side on JK's always seems to be a bit higher on caster for road crown --I believe. If she drives straight, keep the cross caster and dial each arm back a turn (if possible)

To try and even it out, only dial back the high side. You are shooting for 4.5-5*

At 5.5* average caster.. Pinion angle should show .5 to 0 * or a touch over 90*
Sounds like someone installed the dreaded cam bolts rotated 180║ (backwards).
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:12 PM   #35
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I think I will try to see if I can get the LCS to turn in (shorter) anymore. Shouldn't affect anything else other than castor right?

Below is a pic of the alignment specs I got back.
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:14 PM   #36
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Quote:
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Sounds like someone installed the dreaded cam bolts rotated 180║ (backwards).
I installed the lift and I didn't install any cam bolts. I only took it to the shop for an alignment and the guy mentioned he could try that and I told him no...don't install any cam bolts.
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:20 PM   #37
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Oh ok .. You are pretty even at 6*
Pinion angle is changed but in a good way
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:39 PM   #38
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Oh ok .. You are pretty even at 6*
Pinion angle is changed but in a good way
I assume that your comment "Pinion angle is changed but in a good way" is in reference to me questioning/confirming that if I try to see if I can get the LCA to turn in (shorter) that it shouldn't affect anything else other than castor. Is this a correct assumption?

Also, do you think that even half a rotation of the joint will make much of a difference? With such a small difference in angles I would think it wouldn't take much.

Also, what do you think of my attempt of checking the angle (see pics in previous post). Based upon the angle finder readings...angle finder sitting on the floor shows 89*. Angle finder on the round ole on the differential housing shows a hair over 87* so let's call it 87.25*. So with 6* separate and taking into account the 1* for the garage floor...that would make caster 4.25*. Make sense?

I know that's a rough way of doing it, but seems like a big difference between my numbers and the shops. Kind of hard to argue though if they've got it hooked up to a computer that that use on vehicles everyday.
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:59 PM   #39
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Yes, the axle measurement is just a base but should get you close setting up arms. Then you would have the jeep aligned for accurate numbers.
That is a big difference though, did you try the other side for s**ts?
There is always a chance the tech screwed up. I don't know how common that is.

What I meant. Lowering caster has the opposite effect on pinion. Your pinion will raise a little which is better for the DS
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:19 PM   #40
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Yes, the axle measurement is just a base but should get you close setting up arms. Then you would have the jeep aligned for accurate numbers.
That is a big difference though, did you try the other side for s**ts?
There is always a chance the tech screwed up. I don't know how common that is.

What I meant. Lowering caster has the opposite effect on pinion. Your pinion will raise a little which is better for the DS
I thought that was a bit of a difference as well. I will try the other side/circle as well just to see. I will also try it at the pinion flange as well just to see what I come up with.

Okay, I thought that was what you meant so I think we are on the same page.

Depending upon what I find by measuring again and in different spots, I will try to see if I can unbolt the LCA and check to see if I can shorten them anymore. Do you think that even half a rotation of the joint will make much of a difference? With such a small difference in angles I would think it wouldn't take much. Also, if my thinking is correct, I should be able to do this with the jeep on the ground....correct? I would disconnect the LCA, shorten it if possible and then use a jack to help rotate the axle to line up the holes by either placing it under the LCA mount or the tie rod close to the joint....correct?

Just FYI...the jeep seems to drive just fine (city and interstate) and I haven't noticed any vibrations or flightiness.

Thanks again. You have been a tremendous help in the process of me installing the lift myself.
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:28 PM   #41
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Snap a pic of the Cv joint at the TC. That would be my only concern. Although You have less to worry about since RK coils are rated for your 4 door. Height shouldn't be too extreme. Adjusting the ends. Hmm, not sure. With my TF joints, they had to be turned 360 or the joint would be crooked. 1 turn for me was about 1* iirc.
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:30 PM   #42
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Drop one arm at a time. You might be able to just push the tire from the front and chuck it. Obviously a 2nd person helps. Under the pinion might help too. Leave the bolts loose until everything is set, then tighten.
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:37 PM   #43
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Did you check with RK to make sure they sent you the right CAs? The ones you have may be for a larger lift. Every adjustable CA I have installed could be shortened by at least 3-4 full turns.

How does the Jeep drive?
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:44 PM   #44
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I think there is only one RK front upper, lower, and rear upper.. Two rear lowers.
The rear uppers are only used with the longer lowers to move the axle back. The shorter rear lowers are the ones in his kit.
I don't know how RK is set up. Some company's arms will adjust to stock length. If not uppers are used for pinion/caster.
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:46 PM   #45
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If I can't shorten the LCAs any, is there any other suggestions besides ordering adjustable UCAs?

Is what I'm setting at now gonna tear things up or be a safety concern?
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Old 02-03-2014, 03:58 PM   #46
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If I can't shorten the LCAs any, is there any other suggestions besides ordering adjustable UCAs? Is what I'm setting at now gonna tear things up or be a safety concern?
Could shorten the arms themselves. Prob not worth the cost if somebody is doing them.

Problem? Just keep a eye on the Cv joint.

Do you have a lift height estimate ?
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Old 02-03-2014, 04:09 PM   #47
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Could shorten the arms themselves. Prob not worth the cost if somebody is doing them.

Problem? Just keep a eye on the Cv joint.

Do you have a lift height estimate ?
I have stock bumpers front and rear and rubi rails with Ace rock sliders so my jeep is fairly light at the moment. It appears that I gained 3" in the rear and 4" in the front (rough measurement).
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Old 02-03-2014, 04:28 PM   #48
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Ewe ... Hopefully she settles some. Def try getting those arms back.

That is exactly how I lost my DS. Running 6* caster and 4.5-4" front/rear height.
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Old 02-03-2014, 04:40 PM   #49
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Ewe ... Hopefully she settles some. Def try getting those arms back.

That is exactly how I lost my DS. Running 6* caster and 4.5-4" front/rear height.
I guess if I can't then I may have to look real hard into getting the adjustable UCAs. Looks like that would be another $250...uuggh.
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Old 02-03-2014, 04:46 PM   #50
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Just added the rough country front CA drop brackets to my '11 JK with 4 inch lift and 35s.. All I can say is WOW!! What a difference in ride and handling quality. I fought with ordering new adjustable CAs or the brackets.. I don't do any rock crawling so clearance wasn't a big issue.. Didn't lose much anyway. I am just amazed at how much better it handles. We'll worth the 90 bucks!!
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Old 02-03-2014, 05:22 PM   #51
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Just added the rough country front CA drop brackets to my '11 JK with 4 inch lift and 35s.. All I can say is WOW!! What a difference in ride and handling quality. I fought with ordering new adjustable CAs or the brackets.. I don't do any rock crawling so clearance wasn't a big issue.. Didn't lose much anyway. I am just amazed at how much better it handles. We'll worth the 90 bucks!!
Yes they do help !!
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Old 02-03-2014, 06:33 PM   #52
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Are you sure you measured them correctly before torqueing the jam nuts? I have the same kit on a 2 door and with rk's measurements the castor was dead on. Each side should have the same amount of threads showing. Maybe I got lucky???
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Old 02-03-2014, 06:46 PM   #53
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Are you sure you measured them correctly before torqueing the jam nuts? I have the same kit on a 2 door and with rk's measurements the castor was dead on. Each side should have the same amount of threads showing. Maybe I got lucky???
Pretty sure. I measured twice before installing. Center of bolt hole to center of bolt hole using the measurement for 4drs give in RKs instructions.
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Old 02-03-2014, 06:47 PM   #54
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What is the measurement btw ?


Sent from AutoGuide.com App
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Old 02-03-2014, 08:45 PM   #55
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I'd look it up but not at home for a few days. I know I measured more than twice and then my brother double checked my work.
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Old 02-05-2014, 03:29 PM   #56
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Did either of you find measurements for the lCA's ?
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Old 02-05-2014, 03:48 PM   #57
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Yes. From the RK instructions..... 2.5" Front Lower Control Arm Assembled Length = 23 1/8"

Also, I did a lift height measurement on the front based upon a diagram showing stock measurement taken at the shock tower and also taken at the spring perches. Based upon those measurements, I ended up with 3 3/8" of lift on the front.
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Old 02-05-2014, 03:51 PM   #58
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Yes. From the RK instructions..... 2.5" Front Lower Control Arm Assembled Length = 23 1/8" Also, I did a lift height measurement on the front based upon a diagram showing stock measurement taken at the shock tower and also taken at the spring perches. Based upon those measurements, I ended up with 3 3/8" of lift on the front.
I saw that
Do you have a bumper/winch ?

231/8 Is common if that's what they list.
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Old 02-05-2014, 04:13 PM   #59
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No, I don't have an aftermarket bumper or winch yet. On the list though. ;-)

I haven't had a chance to get back under there and take one of the LCAs loose to see if I can shorten it any yet. From what I remember and can see there isn't any real visible threads showing so if I can shorten them any at all, it will only be maybe a half (180*) turn. The krawler joint looks pretty symmetrical in that the protruding sleeve looks like its the same length on either side, so I don't think getting only a half turn will misalign anything.

I also e-mailed with Jason at Krawl-Offroad.com whom I purchased the lift from. He said that, "RK is saying that a castor of anything less that 6* is normal for this setup. So with you being at 5.9*, we should be good. That is for the 1.5” and the 2.5” lifts." My only concern on that is if they are basing that comment on only 2.5" of lift. Although this comment was after I sent him all of my info including lift height.

I think I am still going to:
1. re-check what numbers I get by doing the angle measurement off of both circles on the housing
2. try to get a measurement off of the pinion flange
3. take one of the LCAs loose and see if I can turn it (shorten) it any.

I figure it can't hurt anything, right? Who knows...things may have settled in some since first putting it on and now driving it around some.

It seems to drive just fine both in town, on the interstate and on a real beat up city road.
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Old 02-05-2014, 05:07 PM   #60
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Yes !! that's the key "actual height" although RK did lower the new front coils by 3/8 or so compared to the first gen.
You won't find anybody running close to 6* with 4" of lift. Like I mentioned in my post. 3/3 or even 2/4 (now this is with a double carden) you do have a little more leeway with the stock DS, but risk CV failure.
6* is where I was at with TF lowers and my shaft went bad.

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