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Old 05-29-2008, 02:45 AM   #1
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exhaust system

ok so i have read mixed reviews on the exhaust systems on the 4.0 L
some say replacing the header is a waste of time/money.... some say its worth it.

one thing i have always done on all my vehicles is upgrade the intake system, and the exhaust system.

im a newbie to the wrangler world, but i dont think that this wouldnt apply to the same situation.

1st: are replacing the headers a waste?? are aftermarket ones gonna yield me anything better. (my stock header is fine)

2nd: does anyone have any experience with a high flow catalytic converter? anything worth while?? (my stock cat is fine)

3rd: anyone have a deep sounding muffler they like? ive had experience with the flowmaster 40 series on other vehicles, and i have loved it. but i wouldnt mind something LOUDER! on the jeep. its not my daily driver... so i dont mind pissing off the neighbors. but not being totally obnoxious!

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Old 05-29-2008, 07:08 AM   #2
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Go with a super 40 if you want something louder. I always just chopped the cat off and ran my exhaust without it. I dont have experience with high flow cats but from what I hear they work well in not restricting flow. I still dont think I'll ever use one, but thats just me. As far as the header thing, I dont have personal experience but a buddy of mine got a set of Banks headers for his 4.0L TJ and I can say that it deffinatley livened it up a bit. Made it sound amazing too. I loved the sound but I cant justify paying the higher price tag for it myself.

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Old 05-29-2008, 09:39 AM   #3
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i wouldn't bother with the header. i would go with a flowmaster 40. high flow cat if you want...but personally i wouldn't bother with it.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:37 PM   #4
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I have a super 44 on my 4.0 and like it. I have a super 40 on my Excursion V10 and it is much louder than the 44 although FM says the 44 is the most aggressive. My wife likes it which proves it is not loud enough. She can hear the Excursion 1/4 mile before I get home, jeep only in driveway.
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Old 05-29-2008, 03:31 PM   #5
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Juspinpin, remove the tail pipe on your jeep. She will hear you when you leave work then.


As for the original thread goes, i have a 50 delta and it sounds nice however i'd be happy to exchange it for a hooker max flow.
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Old 05-29-2008, 04:11 PM   #6
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i've got a '98 4.0 with a high flow cat and a FloPro muffler. the high flow cat helped out tremendously. i can really feel a difference all throughout the powerband. the muffler has a good girthy sound, but it's not obscenely loud. i also spoke to the exhaust fabricator/shop owner that did my exhaust about changing the headers. he said new headers are a waste, and the jeep headers promote the best flow. hope this helps.
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Old 05-29-2008, 04:17 PM   #7
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clintwaaron, what high flow cat did you buy? from where? Thanks
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Old 05-29-2008, 04:37 PM   #8
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triple88a- i'll have to double check on the brand of the cat. the installer is Jim Carver from little tire shop in fredericksburg, va. he does all of my exhaust systems on all my cars. i see you're from illinois, but if you're ever out this way you should look him up. he welds everything up. no clamps. i really love his work.
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Old 05-29-2008, 06:29 PM   #9
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I have a friend here that has a shop so i'll get it welded in there.. I just want to know where to put my money, i dont feel like getting a high flow "crappy" cat.
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Old 05-29-2008, 10:08 PM   #10
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the stock exhaust is more than enough for these little engines.
ive had stock, flowmaster and now cherry bomb. none made one iota of difference other than the flowmaster definatly sounded the best, the cherry bomb sounds like hell.
there is absolutly no reason to change your exhaust unless you just want more noise, or because you installed a trick triangulated suspension.

if you want more power focus on your intake, mainly the cylendar head itself
exhaust is forced out under high pressue, the intake is forced in by ambiant air pressure, more air in(with the addition of more fuel) equals more power, more air out makes a marginal difference and usually ends up doing more harm than good.

its not so much that you "need" back pressure, its that your engine is designed with that backpressure in mind and the valve timing is adjusted as such. my heep was great with the stock exhaust, misfired a bit with the flowmaster, coughs and sputters with the cherry bomb, coincidence?
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Old 05-29-2008, 10:55 PM   #11
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the stock exhaust is more than enough for these little engines.
ive had stock, flowmaster and now cherry bomb. none made one iota of difference other than the flowmaster definatly sounded the best, the cherry bomb sounds like hell.
there is absolutly no reason to change your exhaust unless you just want more noise, or because you installed a trick triangulated suspension.

if you want more power focus on your intake, mainly the cylendar head itself
exhaust is forced out under high pressue, the intake is forced in by ambiant air pressure, more air in(with the addition of more fuel) equals more power, more air out makes a marginal difference and usually ends up doing more harm than good.

its not so much that you "need" back pressure, its that your engine is designed with that backpressure in mind and the valve timing is adjusted as such. my heep was great with the stock exhaust, misfired a bit with the flowmaster, coughs and sputters with the cherry bomb, coincidence?
ok, so the stock parts are great?? does that mean the aftermarket parts arent better?

i dont know what you consider "a trick triangulated suspension" but i would like my exhaust system to better conform to my specific application.

im not messing with anything inside the engine... read my sig and youd know that i have stroked my 4.0L. i know that im not gonna go back and change anything inside that thing. so thats not an option.

so yeah... maybe i need to factor in the stroked engine into the equation, but i dont think its gonna make big of difference is it??
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Old 05-29-2008, 10:57 PM   #12
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sean, i have the feeling that you can just hear it more now because of the louder exhaust.

From the way i understand it is the more backpressure you have, the more power the engine needs to force the gases out of the cylinders. It might be small amount in comparison to other things but its there and its taking power away so.. From experience i've found that low back pressure does seem to cause rough idle and loose a bit of lower end power however it gives power in the higher rpm so its an exchange from low to high.

As for the intake goes, the more free flowing it is, the better the cylinder can "fill" when the intake valve opens however with too big of a pipe, the air becomes "lazy" so it gets a negative effect and flow decreases. The basic idea is you will never really fill the cylinder 100% with air and fuel mixture however at specific rpm and a proper pipe (for that rpm) you get close to that number.
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Old 07-18-2008, 12:18 AM   #13
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im gonna awaken an old thread i posted.

so like i said, and like others have said, a flowmaster 40 is the way to go. ive liked them on other vehicles, so why not the jeep!

lets say i leave the header and cat alone as they are both fine. what size pipe do you recommend ? what is stock? what works better ?

also i was considering this, only because its sitting on the shelf at pep boys
cherry bomb glasspack
http://www.cherrybomb.com/products/glasspack

i dont know what size would be best...... BUT if there were a size, which would be the best?

these things are so cheap i dont mind getting one just to experiment.

anyone with cherry bomb glasspacks experience ?
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Old 07-18-2008, 01:27 AM   #14
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Juspinpin, remove the tail pipe on your jeep. She will hear you when you leave work then.


As for the original thread goes, i have a 50 delta and it sounds nice however i'd be happy to exchange it for a hooker max flow.
ha, funny that you said this...my buddy has a 91 YJ and he had a stack going up the side but it fell off so currently he's running a cutoff exhaust about 2 feet after the header...its nice and loud
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Old 07-18-2008, 03:30 AM   #15
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My exhaust system had a lot of rust from a previous owner's neglect. I put on a header (real pain to install), a Random Technology high-flow converter and a Banks Stinger Cat-back system. My highway mileage increased by about 2 mpg's and the mid-range torque increased quite a bit...it really comes alive between 2,000 and 2,500 rpm's and the sound is incredible. I think the whole set-up is the key. One individual exhaust component probably doesn't make a big difference.
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Old 07-18-2008, 11:43 AM   #16
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I think the whole set-up is the key. One individual exhaust component probably doesn't make a big difference.
Bert
yup this is why i disagree with all the people here that say intakes or exhausts or headers or chips or whatever else are useless. alone.. yes they are however if you go with the full deal you WILL see a difference. Getting a muffler with out anything else is like getting only the cheese of a cheeseburger and asking why it doesn't taste like a cheeseburger... Now if some specific part is made restrictive on purpose from the factory and you replace it with a good one.. thats another story but not on our wranglers.
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Old 07-18-2008, 11:48 AM   #17
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im happy with the banks exhaust that i installed a month ago, it sounds great has a nice deep tone and it did give me a noticeable amount of power but i own a 4 cylinder tj.
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Old 07-19-2008, 12:08 AM   #18
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Old 07-19-2008, 12:31 AM   #19
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trip: i like cheeseburgers
lol
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Old 07-19-2008, 01:54 PM   #20
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yup this is why i disagree with all the people here that say intakes or exhausts or headers or chips or whatever else are useless. alone.. yes they are however if you go with the full deal you WILL see a difference. Getting a muffler with out anything else is like getting only the cheese of a cheeseburger and asking why it doesn't taste like a cheeseburger... Now if some specific part is made restrictive on purpose from the factory and you replace it with a good one.. thats another story but not on our wranglers.
I think what they are saying is for the dollar spent there is only a negligible gain in performance/economy, even with all the components. Since the jeep is used primarily for off-road you will never see the benefits of these types of performance products.
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Old 07-19-2008, 02:18 PM   #21
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In the next year or so i plann on a stroker. It will be a 4.5l or 4.6l stroker with a ported head comp cam and custom pistons to alow a lower CR but still have good qaunch. I also plann to add a header high flow cat and a CAI.
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Old 07-19-2008, 04:18 PM   #22
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I think what they are saying is for the dollar spent there is only a negligible gain in performance/economy, even with all the components. Since the jeep is used primarily for off-road you will never see the benefits of these types of performance products.
well for a DD i say its worth it. Almost 2 years ago when i got my rig (stock) i was doing ~200 on a full tank of gas before the light turned on. This year with all my mods i'm getting about 300. Can you explain to me why? I'm still doing the same trips, same routes...
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Old 07-19-2008, 04:22 PM   #23
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well for a DD i say its worth it. Almost 2 years ago when i got my rig (stock) i was doing ~200 on a full tank of gas before the light turned on. This year with all my mods i'm getting about 300. Can you explain to me why? I'm still doing the same trips, same routes...
Mine does that too, and not one performance modification.

No, I cant tell you why. Can you tell me why?
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Old 07-19-2008, 04:32 PM   #24
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Mine does that too, and not one performance modification.

No, I cant tell you why. Can you tell me why?
driving styles, winter.. summer.. more waiting to warm up, etc.. all those will make a difference.

also what size tires did you get? my 35s improved my mpg also

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