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Old 07-23-2008, 11:58 AM   #1
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Front End Sag

Howdy Cool Dudes and Dudettes,

Got some serious front end sag on my TJ. Looks like a dragster. Between the front tire and the fender I have 4" of clearance. The rear tire/fender has 6" of clearance. Front end has a custom bumper, 8K winch and a pair of lights. I contribute this to the sag. Anyway, lift is a 2" BB. Thinking about removing the front spacers and installing a set of Rusty's 3" front coil springs.

Since there is 2" of sag, I originally thought to go with the 2" springs and leave the spacers in, but Rusty's mentioned going with 3" and removing the spacer.

Any thoughts, good or bad?

Thanks.

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Old 07-23-2008, 01:33 PM   #2
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If you're using spacers on your tired old springs, you might consider trying to source some newer stock take-off springs that you can probably get for free.

Also, don't measure tire/fender clearance. Measure body/ground clearance. Your body should have some rake to it, so there will be more measured tire/fender clearance in the back than in the front.

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Old 07-23-2008, 01:41 PM   #3
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You will not be able to determine the correct amount of sagg your front end has by measuring the fender wells. There is an illusion that would make you think that the space between the fenderwell and tire should be the same between the front and the back, but that is not correct. The rear fenderwell actuallly sits higher up on the body than the front one.You actually need to measure from the bottom of the frame to the ground. One good way to do this is to measure right behind your front tire, where the frame is exposed under the door. Then move back to just in front of your back tire, several feet back from your first measurement. This will give you an accurate measurement.
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:38 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compshooter View Post

Since there is 2" of sag, I originally thought to go with the 2" springs and leave the spacers in, but Rusty's mentioned going with 3" and removing the spacer.

.
My 2000 did the same with my 1000# winch. I got the rusty's 3". I am a happy camper.
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Old 07-24-2008, 09:58 AM   #5
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Branty,

Thanks. I measured right behind the front LCA mount and got 14.75". Measuring in front of the rear LCA mount I have 15.75 inches. So it looks to be only an inch of sag. Chris stated trying new freebie springs, but I figure the problem will replicate itself later down the line. So what does the consensus here think? Should I go with a 2" spring and keep the spacer or 3" and ditch the spacer? I am thinking the 3" route since it measures out and JJ did the same thing and he is happy. Thoughts?

Thanks.
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Old 07-24-2008, 10:31 AM   #6
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I would ditch the factory springs and throw the spacers in a drawer somewere and get the 3" Rusty springs.I would also throw in a set of longer travel new shockes.If you go this route don't forget to throw a bumpstop spacer in.Just drop it in the spring during the install and once the spring is in JB Weld it to the bottom spring perch.A hockey puck works real well for this.
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Old 07-24-2008, 01:09 PM   #7
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I think you need to consider a few things. First, what are the estimated weight of the winch and bumper combined. Springs all have different compression rates. For examle, the only difference between the RockKrawler 5.5" lift and the 7" lift are the compression rate of the springs. I have 160lb springs. This means that for every 160lbs I put on the front of the jeep, the front springs will sagg 1 inch. So I would look at Rusty's 3" springs, find out their compression rate, then look at how much weight you have and see what you will end up netting. If later on down the line you needed a little boost, you could throw your spacers back under there.
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Old 07-24-2008, 09:29 PM   #8
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I think you need to consider a few things. First, what are the estimated weight of the winch and bumper combined. Springs all have different compression rates. For examle, the only difference between the RockKrawler 5.5" lift and the 7" lift are the compression rate of the springs. I have 160lb springs. This means that for every 160lbs I put on the front of the jeep, the front springs will sagg 1 inch. So I would look at Rusty's 3" springs, find out their compression rate, then look at how much weight you have and see what you will end up netting. If later on down the line you needed a little boost, you could throw your spacers back under there.
That is the reason I said to throw the spacers in a drawer somewere.
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Old 07-24-2008, 10:20 PM   #9
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just order 2'' coils from rustys.. they are the same price.. and keep the bb..

i had the sagging problem.. still do since i dont have adjustable control arms yet.. but i have 2'' coils all around and bought jks acos for all 4 corners to adjust my lift to sit level.. right now as shes sitting the acos are at their minimum and i have about 1.75'' different in the spaces in between my fenders..
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Old 07-31-2008, 10:07 PM   #10
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what if one front fender well is "sagging" more than the other? It seems that my passenger side front is lower than the drivers side front by about an inch.
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:10 AM   #11
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what if one front fender well is "sagging" more than the other? It seems that my passenger side front is lower than the drivers side front by about an inch.
I parked on "level" ground and the front passenger tire to fender is still about a half inch lower. Not as bad as I thought, but still lower. Of course, when I sit in it, it's probably about even.

Is this normal? What would cause one side to be lower than the other? Springs? Low tire pressure?
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:14 AM   #12
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Sounds more like springs to me. If it was your tire there wouldn't be a change in distance from tire to fender only from body to ground. I've got the i6 in my 01 with a bumper and winch and the front sags more than I like. It is even on both sides though. I'm gonna get that fixed as soon as I can afford the lift though!
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:26 AM   #13
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Sounds more like springs to me. If it was your tire there wouldn't be a change in distance from tire to fender only from body to ground. I've got the i6 in my 01 with a bumper and winch and the front sags more than I like. It is even on both sides though. I'm gonna get that fixed as soon as I can afford the lift though!
Is there any other way to tell that the spring is bad/worn?
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:29 AM   #14
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Other than uneven sag I can't really think of a way. Usually by the time I'm hitting that problem I've been in the process of an upgrade so I haven't really researched it much.
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:34 AM   #15
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Other than uneven sag I can't really think of a way. Usually by the time I'm hitting that problem I've been in the process of an upgrade so I haven't really researched it much.
Any suggestions with an upgrade?
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:50 AM   #16
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It all depends on how high you want to go or if you want to lift it at all. If you don't feel like lifting you might be able to get away with a set of springs someone is taking off or go with an ACOS system to level out your jeep. As far as lifts the sky's the limit just depending on what you want to do with it.
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Old 08-01-2008, 09:52 AM   #17
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It all depends on how high you want to go or if you want to lift it at all. If you don't feel like lifting you might be able to get away with a set of springs someone is taking off or go with an ACOS system to level out your jeep. As far as lifts the sky's the limit just depending on what you want to do with it.
Don't mind my ignorance, but what is a ACOS system?

EDIT: Got it...a Adjustable Coil Over Spring system. Thanks! Are they safe?
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Old 08-01-2008, 12:50 PM   #18
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Stand by for the verdict.......

I was given a set of Rubicon springs that I am going to put in first, before buying a new set.

So far some people have said the Rubicon springs are taller or have a stiffer spring rate. Others have said they are the exact same as standard TJ springs. Who is right?

So...I'm a think'in that Rubicons came from the factory with 31's while standard TJ's came with 28's or 29's. So, since the springs were free, I am going to take measurements and photos before and after I put these Rubicon springs in. This should give us a good idea if they are different (one dealer told me they were the same part number, while another told me they were different). However, the data may still be slightly skewed. My factory springs have been in the Jeep since 99, while the Rubicon springs were only in the Rubicon for about 2-3 months. So I cannot factor in the usage/part wearing out factor, but this will still give us some idea.

Stay tuned later next week, same channel, for the outcome.
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Old 08-01-2008, 01:17 PM   #19
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Don't mind my ignorance, but what is a ACOS system?

EDIT: Got it...a Adjustable Coil Over Spring system. Thanks! Are they safe?

Safe..... hmmm.... can't say I have ever heard of anyone saying they aren't, but I can't say I've ever heard of anyone saying they are either. Unfortunately no personal experience on my end! I'm thinking about getting them for my front sag once I get the lift so if you decide to go that way let me know how they ride! I'd imagine they are safe but you may want to ask someone with a little more experience/knowledge about them.
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Old 08-01-2008, 06:16 PM   #20
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Safe..... hmmm.... can't say I have ever heard of anyone saying they aren't, but I can't say I've ever heard of anyone saying they are either. Unfortunately no personal experience on my end! I'm thinking about getting them for my front sag once I get the lift so if you decide to go that way let me know how they ride! I'd imagine they are safe but you may want to ask someone with a little more experience/knowledge about them.
Thanks!

Calling on MOA here. I saw that he has the JKS Acos coils.

MOA...how do they ride and since they are adjustable up to about 3.5", are any other modifications needed if using at 3" or above?
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Old 08-01-2008, 07:10 PM   #21
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seems like your questions are answered so i'm gonna go on a limb here and give you a solution specifically for your title...


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