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Old 03-20-2013, 02:13 PM   #91
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Ok. Now I see it. Just needed to be told what that was. I'll go play with the calc for now. If I have anymore questions I'll post here again. Thanks for all the input! This turned out to be a great thread in the end.
If you're interested in learning more there are many good threads to read out there, but this is one in particular and it has links to others as well:

Suspension Geometry - JeepForum.com

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Old 03-20-2013, 02:15 PM   #92
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If you're interested in learning more there are many good threads to read out there, but this is one in particular and it has links to others as well:

Suspension Geometry - JeepForum.com
Thanks. I'm gonna give that one and the many others I've book marked a reread.

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Old 03-20-2013, 03:17 PM   #93
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Carrol Shelby has some books that are still relevant to this day. "Tuning to win" has some pretty straightforward explanations of stuff. I have all of his books, but I am also interested in "Race car vehicle dynamics" by Douglas Milliken.

I'm trying to wrap my head around approaching the solid axle, and the knowledge I had in the front of my brain has moved into a foggy back corner so I'll be reading and re-reading lots of stuff this summer.

What I would LOVE to have is the CG data on a stock TJ. If anyone has weighed one and has the tangents from as high of a rise as possible I would be most grateful. I sold the scales when I gave up my track toy and gadgets.

Thanks to those that have a working knowledge of what the subject actually is here for sharing some fact-based, real world experience.

As for the other BS: It's generally considered wise to know the "why" of your disagreement BEFORE you challenge someone on a subject. This way, when you're right you don't look like a tool, and when you're wrong you can actually learn something because your ego isn't at stake.
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Old 03-20-2013, 03:28 PM   #94
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So lets talk so numbers now. So AS in the front end. Is it essentially like the rear but during breaking? Or is it during rearward acceleration? I know not to get my head too wrapped around the calc but it is fun to play with. But what is ideal AS range for a tri-link with a track bar for the front end?
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Old 03-20-2013, 03:39 PM   #95
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That would be "lift" and "dive" properties in the front. Move the mounting point down and you decrease lift, move it up and you decrease dive.
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Old 03-20-2013, 04:01 PM   #96
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That would be "lift" and "dive" properties in the front. Move the mounting point down and you decrease lift, move it up and you decrease dive.
Which mounting point are you referring too? Axle or frame side? Upper or lower CA or the panhard? And can you be a little more descriptive with "dive" and "lift?

I'm guessing lift is the raise in height seen by the front end during acceleration? And dive is the decrease in height seen by the front end during braking?
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Old 03-20-2013, 04:17 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by PStov98TJ View Post

Which mounting point are you referring too? Axle or frame side? Upper or lower CA or the panhard? And can you be a little more descriptive with "dive" and "lift?

I'm guessing lift is the raise in height seen by the front end during acceleration? And dive is the decrease in height seen by the front end during braking?
This is where my inexperience with a live axle multi-link is going to get me. I probably should have kept my mouth shut but I wanted to help with the distinction. On a McPherson setup it would be the lower rearward mounting point that would alter it directly, but there may be a better way to alter the effect on the link setup.

Anti-dive decreases the downward force that occurs in the front during forward weight transfer. Dive can load the front tires pretty good.

Anti-lift decreases the front lift associated with reward weight transfer.

I probably want to go back to listening because of my lack of experience with the vehicle/system in question.
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Old 03-20-2013, 04:44 PM   #98
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Imped, did you cut all your mounts off? (upper, lower and axle - front and rear). Did you fab any of your mounts or did you buy pre-fab? I thought I read you used some Poly mounts, but all of mind are crushed and bent. I would like to scrap all the stock mounts - frame and axle to build off clean parts.
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Old 03-20-2013, 04:55 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by UFOtestpilot View Post

This is where my inexperience with a live axle multi-link is going to get me. I probably should have kept my mouth shut but I wanted to help with the distinction. On a McPherson setup it would be the lower rearward mounting point that would alter it directly, but there may be a better way to alter the effect on the link setup.

Anti-dive decreases the downward force that occurs in the front during forward weight transfer. Dive can load the front tires pretty good.

Anti-lift decreases the front lift associated with reward weight transfer.

I probably want to go back to listening because of my lack of experience with the vehicle/system in question.
It's all good! Ha thanks for the new vocab either way. We're all here to learn. The reason I asked about AS instead of anti-dive or anti-lift was because on the 3 link calc it said AS percentage at the top. And unless I'm just getting everything backwards, Imped's front is set up with the 3 link and panhard.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:47 AM   #100
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Imped, did you cut all your mounts off? (upper, lower and axle - front and rear). Did you fab any of your mounts or did you buy pre-fab? I thought I read you used some Poly mounts, but all of mind are crushed and bent. I would like to scrap all the stock mounts - frame and axle to build off clean parts.
Rok1 I belive Imped made his own mounts for the front and used the Poly brackets for the back. I am gettting ready to stretch the rear, 4 link, One ton and Coilovers on my rig and will be using the same mounts. Here is a link

Poly Performance JEEP/TRUCK & BUGGY*::*Fabrication Parts*::*Axle & Chassis Brackets*::*Synergy Suspension Universal 4-Link Frame Mount Brackets - 4X4 Off-Road Parts, JK Synergy Suspension Systems, Fox Racing Shox, Beard, CNC Brakes, Johnny Joints®, C
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Old 04-03-2013, 10:59 AM   #101
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I am a little late but here is my rc x-flex end after 5000 miles.


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Old 04-03-2013, 07:49 PM   #102
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I am a little late but here is my rc x-flex end after 5000 miles.

Is that the threads rattling or the joint?ive built some of these,they do have to be maintained after breakin.but mine are holding up well.with some work that is.
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Old 04-04-2013, 02:56 PM   #103
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The bushings shrunk. they were set up right and after 5000 miles or so I kept hearing this loud clunk every so often. Got down there and found this. RC sent me rebuild kits for all the joints but still 5k miles! i have gotten about 8 out of the set on it now and they are almost to the same point that the old ones are. Swapping them all out for a tnt long arm.
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Old 04-04-2013, 04:35 PM   #104
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The bushings shrunk. they were set up right and after 5000 miles or so I kept hearing this loud clunk every so often. Got down there and found this. RC sent me rebuild kits for all the joints but still 5k miles! i have gotten about 8 out of the set on it now and they are almost to the same point that the old ones are. Swapping them all out for a tnt long arm.
What if u bowel the joint previes to putting it in.i need to check mine.
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Old 04-04-2013, 04:42 PM   #105
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The bushings shrunk. they were set up right and after 5000 miles or so I kept hearing this loud clunk every so often. Got down there and found this. RC sent me rebuild kits for all the joints but still 5k miles! i have gotten about 8 out of the set on it now and they are almost to the same point that the old ones are. Swapping them all out for a tnt long arm.
I have well over 5k on my xflex joints and have no complaints, everything is as tight as the day I built the joint. You sure you built it right?
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Old 04-04-2013, 04:57 PM   #106
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So a 4 link... Double or Single triangulated?
Double!!!

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