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Old 02-23-2013, 08:06 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by TJDave View Post
There is no bumpstop in the cup either. Nothing good in that set up.

The spacer on the bottom looks small and wrong. Maybe why he put it there.
It's installed wrong, and not only is there no jounce bumper, but there are no bumpstop extensions. With a budget boost spacer, bumpstop extensions of the same length as the spacer are required to push the cup down away from the frame. This prevents coil bind/damage.

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Would it be a hard task correcting them my self with the help of some friends? I don't want to take it back to him since he obviously didn't know what he was doing.
nope, not hard at all. here's a write-up: http://www.4x4xplor.com/REBB.html

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Where can I get the bump stops and jounce bumpers? Do I have to order them on line or would a local auto parts store carry them?
93-98 ZJ Grand Cherokee front bumpstop cups and jounce bumpers are the same as TJ front and rear. You can get them in just about any junkyard. If salt/weather has destroyed your junkyard options, Crown Automotive sells replacement jounce bumpers.

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What's the difference between jounce bumpers and bump stops?
The "bumpstop" consists of three main components - 1) the jounce bumper, 2) the bumpstop cup, 3) bumpstop pad & tower.

The jounce bumper acts as a cushion to slow the impact of the axle hitting the frame. Sounds bad, but it's supposed to do this, and needs to, so don't panic. The bumpstop cup holds the jounce bumper, and is held in place my an M10 bolt on TJ's (and ZJ's). The bumpstop pad & tower are the parts of the axle & frame where the cup mounts, and where the jounce bumper impacts.

When you install basically any suspension lift, you will need to adjust the bumpstops. You do this by reducing the distance between the bumpstop pad and the cup - this is called a bumpstop extension. This keeps shocks from bottoming out, prevents suspension interferences, and prevents damage.

Read this:
http://www.wranglerforum.com/f5/corr...gth-70047.html

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Old 02-24-2013, 07:04 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by Sycboi View Post
So dangerous! I find it hard to believe at least one hasn't popped out already...
X2

I just cant get over the fact the the "mechanic" would be so dumb as to install a spacer like that. I mean looking at it from any angle, its just common sense that the spacer goes on top. I would be going over anything else he installed as well just to be on the safe side and make sure your rig safe and everything is installed correctly. If your not sure what to look at find a local, well accredited shop and take it there. Show them what he did and just ask for a piece of mind inspection. Cause I have unfortionatly seen people wheeling with broken or improperly installed springs, its not pretty when they finally decide to let go. One was wheeling up a rock wall on one of our trails and with the amount of compression the spring ejected and pierced the gas tank... Not cool. Very glad you threw that up here

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Old 02-26-2013, 11:59 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by UnlimitedLJ04

It's installed wrong, and not only is there no jounce bumper, but there are no bumpstop extensions. With a budget boost spacer, bumpstop extensions of the same length as the spacer are required to push the cup down away from the frame. This prevents coil bind/damage.

nope, not hard at all. here's a write-up: http://www.4x4xplor.com/REBB.html

93-98 ZJ Grand Cherokee front bumpstop cups and jounce bumpers are the same as TJ front and rear. You can get them in just about any junkyard. If salt/weather has destroyed your junkyard options, Crown Automotive sells replacement jounce bumpers.

The "bumpstop" consists of three main components - 1) the jounce bumper, 2) the bumpstop cup, 3) bumpstop pad & tower.

The jounce bumper acts as a cushion to slow the impact of the axle hitting the frame. Sounds bad, but it's supposed to do this, and needs to, so don't panic. The bumpstop cup holds the jounce bumper, and is held in place my an M10 bolt on TJ's (and ZJ's). The bumpstop pad & tower are the parts of the axle & frame where the cup mounts, and where the jounce bumper impacts.

When you install basically any suspension lift, you will need to adjust the bumpstops. You do this by reducing the distance between the bumpstop pad and the cup - this is called a bumpstop extension. This keeps shocks from bottoming out, prevents suspension interferences, and prevents damage.

Read this:
http://www.wranglerforum.com/f5/corr...gth-70047.html
So with my 3 inch coil spacers I should get 3 inch bump stop extensions?
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Old 02-27-2013, 12:02 AM   #34
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So with my 3 inch coil spacers I should get 3 inch bump stop extensions?

Yessir...
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:00 AM   #35
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you will need a spacer to move the jounce bumper cup down that's the same length as the coil spring spacer
YES! The cup is what hold the spring in, and has to be spaced down along with the spring spacer.
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:21 AM   #36
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He'd probably put the peanut butter on the outside of the sandwich.

that was so epic its not even funny..
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:30 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Benalbright24 View Post
So with my 3 inch coil spacers I should get 3 inch bump stop extensions?
for the rear, yes. need 2" in front too.

that means zero to minimal travel gain, and just one reason why a 3" coil spacer is a bad idea anyway...
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:24 AM   #38
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Yeah man! Thats crazy! im glade you made this post before some bad happened.
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:23 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by UnlimitedLJ04
for the rear, yes. need 2" in front too.

that means zero to minimal travel gain, and just one reason why a 3" coil spacer is a bad idea anyway...
What do you mean by travel gain?
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Old 02-27-2013, 04:09 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Benalbright24 View Post

What do you mean by travel gain?
You'll have the exact same uptavel before the bumpstop impacts the spring pad as you did before lifting.
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Old 02-27-2013, 04:41 PM   #41
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What do you mean by travel gain?
suspension is described by the travel. this is the amount the axle is allowed to move up and down when you're driving down the road - whether it's off-road or on.

with your 3" spacer setup, you basically have the same travel as stock. You gain nothing over a stock Jeep...and the main reason to do a lift is to improve the travel (no, it's not so you can fit bigger tires). In addition, the 3" spacer lift has screwed up the stock control arm geometry, but this pretty much happens with any lift that uses the stock mounting points.

The main difference is your new geometry is worse than stock, and you still haven't even gained any travel. Basically, it's worse than a stock Jeep...it'll ride worse, the geometry is worse, and the travel is the same.

It's what we call a mall crawler. It looks good to the untrained eye while parked, but the functionality sucks.
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Old 02-27-2013, 06:00 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by UnlimitedLJ04
suspension is described by the travel. this is the amount the axle is allowed to move up and down when you're driving down the road - whether it's off-road or on.

with your 3" spacer setup, you basically have the same travel as stock. You gain nothing over a stock Jeep...and the main reason to do a lift is to improve the travel (no, it's not so you can fit bigger tires). In addition, the 3" spacer lift has screwed up the stock control arm geometry, but this pretty much happens with any lift that uses the stock mounting points.

The main difference is your new geometry is worse than stock, and you still haven't even gained any travel. Basically, it's worse than a stock Jeep...it'll ride worse, the geometry is worse, and the travel is the same.

It's what we call a mall crawler. It looks good to the untrained eye while parked, but the functionality sucks.
Ok thanks for the info. And I know I went the cheap way to lift my Jeep ( at least I didn't put a 3 inch body lift on there) but I'm 17 years old and don't have themoney to pay for an expensive lift right now. And I bought the Jeep my self and have to pay for mods my self. And yes in the future when I have the money I'll get rid of the BB and put a real suspension lift on there. But right now the BB and 33s I'm about to buy is better than a stock Jeep to me.
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Old 02-27-2013, 09:55 PM   #43
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You'd be surprised at how well you'll still perform on stock springs and coil spacers. Personally, I prefer 1.75"-2.0" spacers so it doesn't have everything so tight. 3" is about the limit for stock length control arms without having some nice arms in there.

2" BB and 1-1.25" body lift is a great starting point for a TJ on 33s.

I believe I have a set of TJ jounce bumpers from when I put the budget boost on my '04. If you're interested and trust the Internet enough to send me your shipping address I could drop them in the mail for you. I'm definitely not doing anything with them and it could save you some heartache trying to track down a part that pretty much no one stocks. That's, of course, assuming I can find them in she shop.
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:49 PM   #44
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I'm 17 years old and don't have themoney to pay for an expensive lift right now.
so don't lift it. don't mod it. save your money for books, college, gas, etc.

the thing people seem to forget is that not having a lift isn't hurting anything. but having a bad lift is hurting stuff. it's already hurt your pocketbook because you paid somebody that did crappy work, which you now have to undo and fix.

Lifting not only changes control arm geometry, but also steering, alignment, brakes, gearing, track bar relationships, and a whole bunch more...which are otherwise perfectly fine in stock form. Lifting is opening a can of worms, and if you can't afford to play, then don't open that can.

At 17, save your money for more important stuff...like education. You'll have plenty of money to sink into a jeep after finding a good job with said education. I'm sure that's not the answer you want to hear, but it's the reality.
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Old 02-28-2013, 12:05 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by UnlimitedLJ04

so don't lift it. don't mod it. save your money for books, college, gas, etc.

the thing people seem to forget is that not having a lift isn't hurting anything. but having a bad lift is hurting stuff. it's already hurt your pocketbook because you paid somebody that did crappy work, which you now have to undo and fix.

Lifting not only changes control arm geometry, but also steering, alignment, brakes, gearing, track bar relationships, and a whole bunch more...which are otherwise perfectly fine in stock form. Lifting is opening a can of worms, and if you can't afford to play, then don't open that can.

At 17, save your money for more important stuff...like education. You'll have plenty of money to sink into a jeep after finding a good job with said education. I'm sure that's not the answer you want to hear, but it's the reality.
Well I appreciate your opinion and you're probably right but I'll be more happy with my 3 inch BB and the 1.25 inch BL and 1 inch MML with 33 inch tires that I'll be getting soon than I'd be driving around a stock Jeep on 28 inch tires. Eventually I'll swap out that BB for a good 2.5 or 3 inch spring lift but (as long as they're installed right) my BB isn't hurting anything right now.
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Old 07-08-2013, 12:53 PM   #46
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That mechanic is a moron...
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Old 08-13-2013, 12:20 AM   #47
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An update on this thread. Ok, so I ended up installing the spacers correctly and had no problems. But since then I have gotten rid of the spacers and bought a set of used RE (what I was told were 4" but I think are 4.5") springs. Now my question is what all other suspension parts do I need to upgrade? Everything is stock besides the springs and shocks. And also recommendations on good brands of the parts I should get would be appreciated. Thanks
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Old 08-13-2013, 12:38 AM   #48
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An update on this thread. Ok, so I ended up installing the spacers correctly and had no problems. But since then I have gotten rid of the spacers and bought a set of used RE (what I was told were 4" but I think are 4.5") springs. Now my question is what all other suspension parts do I need to upgrade? Everything is stock besides the springs and shocks. And also recommendations on good brands of the parts I should get would be appreciated. Thanks
I dont think your gonna like this... But there are many components that go into a 4 inch or above lift. And as you stated above you cant afford an expensive lift. Well, a 4 inch lift IS an expensive lift when done safely and correctly. Youd probably be better off swapping out your 3 inch spacers for some good 2-3 inch lift coils and calling it a day. Youll gain alot more that way and be able to effectively run your 33s. With a 4 inch lift youll need so many things like new control arms, extended sway bar links, sye and cv shaft, new shocks, sometimes extended brake lines, etc etc etc. It adds up very quickly..
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Old 08-13-2013, 12:54 AM   #49
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I dont think your gonna like this... But there are many components that go into a 4 inch or above lift. And as you stated above you cant afford an expensive lift. Well, a 4 inch lift IS an expensive lift when done safely and correctly. Youd probably be better off swapping out your 3 inch spacers for some good 2-3 inch lift coils and calling it a day. Youll gain alot more that way and be able to effectively run your 33s. With a 4 inch lift youll need so many things like new control arms, extended sway bar links, sye and cv shaft, new shocks, sometimes extended brake lines, etc etc etc. It adds up very quickly..
I know that going to that 4 inch mark is an expensive jump but I got a great deal on the springs and couldn't pass it up. I've already got shocks, I know I need new sway bar links, I'm about to get them and as far as SYE/CV I know it's not the best way but I'm running a transfer case lowering kit for right now. I know I needed new lower control arms,(what about uppers?) but I do not know about track bars etc
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Old 08-13-2013, 08:58 AM   #50
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An update on this thread. Ok, so I ended up installing the spacers correctly and had no problems. But since then I have gotten rid of the spacers and bought a set of used RE (what I was told were 4" but I think are 4.5") springs. Now my question is what all other suspension parts do I need to upgrade? Everything is stock besides the springs and shocks. And also recommendations on good brands of the parts I should get would be appreciated. Thanks
You'll need to replace quite a lot of stuff, and do some minor welding for 4-4.5" lift.

  • SYE/CV driveshaft and speedometer correction
  • New upper and lower control arms with Currie Johnny Joints or Metalcloak bushings on both ends.
  • New adjustable front and rear track bars - good ones, without clearance issues (Currie, JKS, Metalcloak)
  • Rear track bar relocation bracket for CV axle shaft to account of housing rotation. Weld on reinforcement to prevent ripping the bracket off.
  • Also weld a 1/8" or 3/16" plate over the front axle side bracket to prevent the hole from wallowing.
  • New shocks of the correct length
  • Proper bumpstop extensions
  • Longer sway bar links front and rear
  • Longer brake lines
  • Steering upgrade for larger tires
  • Vanco big brake kit so you can stop
  • Regear the axles for larger tires
  • Cycle the axle to full bump, full flex, full droop to test all components.
Generally speaking, plan on $4000-5000 or so.
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Old 08-13-2013, 09:35 AM   #51
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I know that going to that 4 inch mark is an expensive jump but I got a great deal on the springs and couldn't pass it up. I've already got shocks, I know I need new sway bar links, I'm about to get them and as far as SYE/CV I know it's not the best way but I'm running a transfer case lowering kit for right now. I know I needed new lower control arms,(what about uppers?) but I do not know about track bars etc
It does not matter if the springs were free. They are not worth it, give them back.

Free parts that make you compromise doing things correctly are not a good deal, in fact they are a very bad deal. If you can afford to do the rest of the things that even a free set of incorrect springs will cost you, then you can afford to buy the correct set of springs because when you are done spending what it takes to make them work right, a 100-200 bucks one way or the other isn't a deal breaker.
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Old 08-13-2013, 01:34 PM   #52
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It does not matter if the springs were free. They are not worth it, give them back.

Free parts that make you compromise doing things correctly are not a good deal, in fact they are a very bad deal. If you can afford to do the rest of the things that even a free set of incorrect springs will cost you, then you can afford to buy the correct set of springs because when you are done spending what it takes to make them work right, a 100-200 bucks one way or the other isn't a deal breaker.
Just because I can't buy everything I need at one time doesn't mean I'm not going to do it right. I'm going to get everything I need one part at a time. And the springs are the size that I want because I do plan on running 35s eventually.
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Old 08-13-2013, 01:38 PM   #53
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You'll need to replace quite a lot of stuff, and do some minor welding for 4-4.5" lift.

[*]SYE/CV driveshaft and speedometer correction[*]New upper and lower control arms with Currie Johnny Joints or Metalcloak bushings on both ends.[*]New adjustable front and rear track bars - good ones, without clearance issues (Currie, JKS, Metalcloak)[*]Rear track bar relocation bracket for CV axle shaft to account of housing rotation. Weld on reinforcement to prevent ripping the bracket off.[*]Also weld a 1/8" or 3/16" plate over the front axle side bracket to prevent the hole from wallowing.[*]New shocks of the correct length[*]Proper bumpstop extensions[*]Longer sway bar links front and rear[*]Longer brake lines[*]Steering upgrade for larger tires[*]Vanco big brake kit so you can stop[*]Regear the axles for larger tires[*] Cycle the axle to full bump, full flex, full droop to test all components.

Generally speaking, plan on $4000-5000 or so.
Thanks for the info. I'll use this guide for my build. It may take me a while to get everything I need but I plan on doing it right.
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Old 08-13-2013, 02:18 PM   #54
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I hate being a prick but if your jeep is your daily driver and you are not very mechanically inclined and loaded w cash, you should listen to these guys!
You will be in a huge hole financially once you start and a ton of mods will need to be made.
Get some 3 inch springs or do a 2inch bb with 1 inch body lift. Both are much cheaper and will still allow you to get laid from the young chicks
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Old 08-13-2013, 06:20 PM   #55
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I hate being a prick but if your jeep is your daily driver and you are not very mechanically inclined and loaded w cash, you should listen to these guys!
You will be in a huge hole financially once you start and a ton of mods will need to be made.
Get some 3 inch springs or do a 2inch bb with 1 inch body lift. Both are much cheaper and will still allow you to get laid from the young chicks
I appreciate your opinion but I've already decided that this is the size lift I want to run, I wouldn't have bought the springs if it wasn't. And as far as mechanically inclined, I have access to all the tools and everything that I need and I have people that can help me. I've already had a bb and the springs are way better.
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Old 08-13-2013, 06:34 PM   #56
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I appreciate your opinion but I've already decided that this is the size lift I want to run, I wouldn't have bought the springs if it wasn't. And as far as mechanically inclined, I have access to all the tools and everything that I need and I have people that can help me. I've already had a bb and the springs are way better.
You also mentioned running 35s... Have you looked into what it takes to run those? It takes a lot of money. I mean a lot. To run a 4 inch suspension lift and 35s. If thats what you want to do then no ones stopping you.. Were just trying to warn you about all the money and conponents needed to do what your wanting to do. Your just confusing me by saying your only 17 and dont want an expensive lift kit just yet.. Yet your wanting to run a 4 inch kit and 35s. Thats a huge chunk of cash to get your jeep to that state.. But hey its your choice in the end. Were just here to give you advice. And from your previous posts.. My advice is to get rid of the four inch springs and get 2-3 inch lift springs. No extra money required yet youll still gain about an inch and get better ride quality and more flex depending if you get good ones.
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Old 08-13-2013, 06:43 PM   #57
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You also mentioned running 35s... Have you looked into what it takes to run those? It takes a lot of money. I mean a lot. To run a 4 inch suspension lift and 35s. If thats what you want to do then no ones stopping you.. Were just trying to warn you about all the money and conponents needed to do what your wanting to do. Your just confusing me by saying your only 17 and dont want an expensive lift kit just yet.. Yet your wanting to run a 4 inch kit and 35s. Thats a huge chunk of cash to get your jeep to that state.. But hey its your choice in the end. Were just here to give you advice. And from your previous posts.. My advice is to get rid of the four inch springs and get 2-3 inch lift springs. No extra money required yet youll still gain about an inch and get better ride quality and more flex depending if you get good ones.
I said I didn't want an expensive kit a while back before I knew any better. And I also said that I plan to run 35s eventually, not any time soon. Yes I do know what it takes to run 35s properly and I know that it is expensive, but it is what I want to do.

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