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Old 04-02-2012, 10:21 AM   #1
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Coverting my TJ to leaf springs

K not looking to argue or get into what suspension is best. Mainly the TJ forums were really annoying on this. It's my jeep, my build, and my use for what I want. And to me makes a ton more sense and long term durability. Here is why I want to do, and start researching and picking brains on perhaps spring lengths and springs rates for chassis weight. Perhaps shackles questions. Lot to come up with so hopefully I can get it done. Doubt it's as easy as ordering a lift for a YJ and going from there.

I have 2004 Rubicon all stock clean perfect condition. Factory Dana 44's and air lockers. Love it with the auto for trails and my girlfriend can use it. Also love the airbags to keep my girl happy and safe as well as myself I guess haha.

I loved my past 2 YJ's but they no matter what were just dirty nasty old jeeps nobody would wanna get in it clean haha. I liked it but maybe I'm just changing. I have fabricated plenty on them, and with my friends we build with have done many SOA lifts now 8.8 swaps and have all welding cutting fabbing tools needed. Just to give you idea of m level of building I'm not just picturing them bolt right in haha. I have found on a ruffstuff fabrication website SOA plates for 44 axles which is nice. Also all u bolts and top plates. As for what I read seems rumor has it that CJ front shackles bolt to the frame and a YJ rear shackle works for rear. Some people use XJ rear leaf springs, and I do not need or want stretch the wheel base I am happy with it as it is. With the spring over axle I figure use a 1-2" lift spring perhaps old man emu, mainly match whatever springs with the shocks valves for it to at least get the best ride I can. However my goal is the ride a Yj has I do like it it's more a truck and solid feel. In the salt belt of NY my plans of a 5.5" Clayton long arm, Johnny joints everywhere and having it flex like a gymnast on muscle relaxers sounds fun but in the end I'm spending up into 6-7 grand. Now that wasn't an issue however I don't feel I'll be happy at all with it, deal with death wobble, alignments never ending, and for the small times I wheel I always got by great with my old YJ on 33's stock springs SOA. So there is where I am at for now, and open to your knowledge on parts springs all that. Being your in YJ forum I doubt I'll hear much on the bad idea of it haha. For those who feel that, happily click on the next thread and hold back from replying. I have plenty SOA jeeps on lift springs too that I feel I could do more accurate and solid to get just ass much flex as I need for where I go and have a stable TJ. Planning on running 35's with 5.13 gears in axles. I'll build a rear traction bar or perhaps a triangulated type setup. Front I plan no sway bars or track bar but could always get an adjustable one to use if stability in front is needed. In my past few even with 35's I liked the road habits without. That's the easy stuff for now need to figure out mounts and what springs will be best and weights.

Thanks for reading hopefully I'll have a TJ\YJ RUBICON haha.

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Old 04-02-2012, 10:37 AM   #2
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unfortunately it sounds like you have far more experience and knowledge about it than I, however it is always nice to know I am not the only one who prefers the stiffer ride of leaf springs. A lot of my friends think I'm crazy, but I would take my rotten old YJ over a TJ any time for just that reason

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Old 04-02-2012, 10:50 AM   #3
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Best person for advice is ibuildthembig. Good luck with the swap! Just be sure to have a flame suit ready, because you know TJ/JK guys are going to flaming worse than Elton John!
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Old 04-02-2012, 11:07 AM   #4
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Amen to that I read some old threads people asked, and no one was an ounce of help but telling him ow backwards it was haha. I agree that's all great, but I want leaf springs. And I can have a sweet very strong rig for driving daily and highway use and do just fine for the trails I have. I went for the rubicon cause it elevates axles swapping and lockers.
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Old 04-02-2012, 11:56 AM   #5
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You should make a write up on this because I would like to see pix of the process!
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Old 04-02-2012, 11:58 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bta2011
You should make a write up on this because I would like to see pix of the process!
Seems like I may have to I am more excited about this than I was for a lot of suspension mods I was thinking.

And the fun part is to make a ton of TJ guys boil out of their skin for doing this to a perfect non molested RUBICON! Haha
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Old 04-02-2012, 12:21 PM   #7
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Also what shackles. I rather stock shackles not a set of fangs. Is it worth for boom ones or angled type or just do a strong stock style one. Obviously grease able, so many ideas I am just trying to not start ordering things haha.

Just making notes as a refferance and some can chime in with better ones if needed

Springs: YJ lift springs 2.5" wide perhaps 1-2" lift such as OME

Shocks: rancho 9000's, bilsteins, whatever is best suggested will need to finish install before measurements are taken

Brackets: ruff stuff website has Dana 44 spring perches, also spring shackles for frame end

Shackles: stock length - boom, or OME ones if I used their spring with grease able bolts

Traction bar: brackets are available from ruff stuff for a center type one traditional, easy to make when all done

U-bolts/top plate: ruff stuff makes standard ones, are the rock Krawler ones with built in anti wrap worth it or leave simple design

Steering: because a TJ I'll do the currie currectlync with a 4" drop pitman arm I feel should work. Since no front track bar is planned no bump steer issue should come of it. Just need to know it doesn't come in contact with the passenger side leaf spring on turn. Steering damper as well

Wheels/tires: would like to use stock rubicon wheels to really polish it up, 1.25" wheel spacers, 35x12.5 tires. Worse case run a set of new wheels I'll have the funds to going this route of lift

Driveshafts: front I think is fine such it is with a 5.5" lift no transfer case drop according to TJ people. So I'll do the longer Tom woods one for rear (rubicon is a fixed yoke factory) and do a 1" transfer case drop to help angles.

Brakes: plan to upgrade fronts a bit to help with 35's not sure or worried about it yet.


As for weight of jeep and spring choice I ask even though I want them soft, I will have a winch on a small stubby bumper in front. And plan on a 35" spare on a big carrier as well. An plan on either passengers or when trails a tool box that has some weight. I would say minimal weight compared to many so heavy springs may be not needed, just mediums to allow some sag with chassis weight on it.
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Old 04-02-2012, 12:39 PM   #8
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This sounds like a pretty good challenge, keep us updated with the build, i cant wait to see pics lol i love the leaf springs, i think their better honestly
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:13 PM   #9
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I agree. Love the YJ but can't fid one as clean as my rubicon. With the axles lockers. Clean. Solid frame. Airbags. No leaks hard top soft tops am style of it. So why not I think it's perfect. Just matter of someone with real knowledge to say spring length an maybe a height effecting a TJ more or less than a Yj
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:15 PM   #10
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Since youre getting a new driveshaft anyways, you might as well stretch with the BTF kit and call it a day.

Youll have better performance from your suspension offroad, and on.
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:17 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyJeepMan
Since youre getting a new driveshaft anyways, you might as well stretch with the BTF kit and call it a day.

Youll have better performance from your suspension offroad, and on.
What's the details. I agree while I am here mods don't hurt.
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:19 PM   #12
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Shouldn't be too bad, my axle buddy did one about 8 years ago. Good thing about the rubi case is its already fixed yoke, so all I would do is swap the stock yoke out for a 1350 version and cut down a 1-ton truck driveshaft and your good to go.
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:21 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibuildembig
Shouldn't be too bad, my axle buddy did one about 8 years ago. Good thing about the rubi case is its already fixed yoke, so all I would do is swap the stock yoke out for a 1350 version and cut down a 1-ton truck driveshaft and your good to go.
Man of the hour. Ok now what about spring mounts. Can I use the lower control arm frame brackets. They r 2.75" so a 2.5" spring will fit perfect. What suggestion about mounting front. And did you buddy use a YJ spring set?
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:23 PM   #14
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i would love a coil system on mine...
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:25 PM   #15
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Man I dunno, I will have to call and ask him but I dont think they are in the same spot. I have a tj at home right now I am messing with so I can take some measurments and see how close they are. Actually the springs dont measure 2.5, more like 2.25 but wider at the bushing ends. Im thinking it would be alot easier doing what your planning with the body off it simply because you can see all the tires then and make sure your square.
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:25 PM   #16
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i would love a coil system on mine...
Coils are easy too
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:32 PM   #17
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Would you suggest Yj springs though? Worse case cut off control arm brackets from frame and make a set where needed. Center the axle and make sure both springs are centered with axle on all axis.
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:33 PM   #18
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I dont have a problem with YJ springs, im using OME's on my current build.
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Old 04-02-2012, 01:40 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibuildembig
I dont have a problem with YJ springs, im using OME's on my current build.
Well not there is anything against them but figure they are as close as it would be for a factory setup on this frame. Maybe to same frame but seem to work great on a Yj so why try something diferent. So the OME 2.5" springs you are using I hear a lot of good on them and soft which I lift. D they make a lower spring? I figure than and keep the rest as Los as I can mounting wise and stock shackles and should not be to bad to get all square up so long as front to back is measured perfect for wheel base on both sides, then center pins do the rest on the axle.

Think this is as easy as I am picturing it or gona be more to it. No big deal to grind off factory TJ brackets and mount up my own. For the price I see I would happily buy all new brackets even if I don't use just so when it comes apart I can be sure on it. An can set wheel base with springs and all on axles under jeep and weld the perches in where I need.

As for the shackle end how do you suggest mounting to frame.. Just use a round mount weld to frame do I an just bolt the shackle up into it? I have a few parts junk YJ's anything worth grinding off for spring mounts where shackles go.

Thanks for all help. If you can measure our TJ and Yj stuff I would appreciate it. Won't be around a Yj till later today so I could measure an inspect frame side by side
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:19 PM   #20
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So doing some shopping here is a picture of my shopping cart for all new stuff and being lazy to not even make my own brackets. Least they have everything. Just weld in and bolt up if you ask me haha. Assuming I cut off lower control arm mount tabs and weld in mine here if it had to be relocated to center axle.

Shows shopping cart. A set of front and rear shackle hanger mounts which are nice also the leaf mounts for center of cab.

On quadrajunk website just as a reference I purchased all OME leaf springs, all new bushings, new boom hangers, brake lines, driveshaft, steering from currie, drop pitman arm, everything and I'm at like 1800 bucks. That's nothing compared to a 3000 long arm kit. Still plenty to regear, buy shocks when I know length, and wheels for the 35's.
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Old 04-02-2012, 04:44 PM   #21
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So instead of ruining a perfectly good Rubicon with a great resale value, why not sell it and buy a YJ for 1/5 the money, buy the fancy axles and springs, and have some money left over?
You can even find a wrecked TJ and swap all teh creature comforts over, like air bags and comfy seats and STILL come out ahead....

Im not tryin to bring you down, you have an interesting project, but the money is smarter spent on a different approach..
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Old 04-02-2012, 04:57 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2xs
So instead of ruining a perfectly good Rubicon with a great resale value, why not sell it and buy a YJ for 1/5 the money, buy the fancy axles and springs, and have some money left over?
You can even find a wrecked TJ and swap all teh creature comforts over, like air bags and comfy seats and STILL come out ahead....
Once again, I am very happy with the TJ body, interior, AIRBAGS, and being to a pile. I have considered a ton of YJ's again but why find one either stock an rotting out, or even finding a perfect like new one dsomewhere out west not salted up or abused pay to have it shipped and pay top dollar for it. On top of that still have a really out dated jeep interior and out. Then have to start searching down axles I want that will need rebuilding, carriers, lockers, brakes, and of course be rusted and again not near my town. So shipping again for some junk. After that spend another hand full of time trying to make a Yj back to clean and solid no rust as my TJ is...... It's my rubicon whether I want to drive it stock, or burn the pos to the ground it's what I want to build and do with my time and in the end say that is my jeep. Might not flex 5ft an keep 3 tires on ground, might not have the latest long arm out there, but it won't get death wobble, it won't kill me if I get a bad bushing, Johnny joint, or whatever NY winter salt will throw at me while I own it and deal with 3000 plus for a decent lift that no matter what will require Maintenon. If I'm working on something I wanna know it the most and know its for the better, not just to keep chasing around alignment shops that are not familiar with jeep alignments and 3 link arms and all this.... To me I like the simplicity and strength of a YJ leaf spring setup but the solid clean and very available TJ body, seats, all it is stock. And with a rubicon everything is perfectly integrated into the jeep..... Even stock as it sits I get death wobble which makes me just laugh the hardest when it has nothing done to it. Got new tires rebalanced and it went down almost gone but feel it wants to.... On my old Yj unbalanced tires just made it vibrate not visioucly wanna throw me in the woods and if my girlfriend is driving it or someone borrows it I would have to say ok be careful over railroad tracks or don't hit a bump at 50+. Have fun.....


Again my jeep, my plans, my build. If it makes someone cry inside to tear apart a good condition rubicon than I suggest look away cause I love watching ya freak out after I start cutting factory parts off haha.... I have a welder, plasma cutter, and a whole bunch of ideas worse thing I do it weld it back stock right? Not saying your arguing with me but I know some TJ guys an gals r going to get up my a$$ like most other people got when they posted this idea. For every top notch bolt on part and my fabrication and Time which I enjoy doing on my spare time I'll have one solid capable jeep for all I do.
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Old 04-02-2012, 05:02 PM   #23
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And as for th emoney end of things.... I see it like this. I have my life, my girl dogs and a house. I work my ass off, I enjoy a cold beer and a glass of whiskey. I don't do drugs, I don't blow my money gambling, I don't hold back.... For the money I can build it for I rather it over a crazy rubicon build or a Crap wrecked jeep. I went down that road so many times trying to "save money" and end up screwing myself. If I wanna blow money I'll pick up a fun crack addiction.... For now this is still way cheaper than me playing with my Powerstroke diesels trucks. They are my old faithful daily driver this is my toy to play with. And I have an urge to be a stand out odd ball idiot so when I park my jeep next to someone else's, we're nothing alike!

No argument don't take me the wrong way I'm not blowing up at you just explaining this so I don't have to hear it over and over from people. I won't tell you what color to paint your house or what your girl wants to eat for dinner. There is an a$$ for ever seat :P
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Old 04-02-2012, 05:07 PM   #24
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I understand you are set in your ways, Good luck to you.
Im not going to laugh or cry, however I will recommend the builders section, You might find some good ideas there as well.
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Old 04-02-2012, 05:21 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by 2xs
I understand you are set in your ways, Good luck to you.
Im not going to laugh or cry, however I will recommend the builders section, You might find some good ideas there as well.
Sorry I got way off topic. I'm shot today

Had it up but everyone keeps inputting in this section. Hopefully I can pick ibuildembig soon and see what he suggests. I pretty confident on it and install specially with these brackets and hangers.
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:21 PM   #26
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I just got home so I will measure the frame stuff in a little bit. You might want to price the springs and stuff from polyperformance.com as they were cheaper than anyone when I bought mine. Also I wouldn't waste my money on the currie steering stuff when you can build your own for 1/3 the cash or less.
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:35 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Ibuildembig
I just got home so I will measure the frame stuff in a little bit. You might want to price the springs and stuff from polyperformance.com as they were cheaper than anyone when I bought mine. Also I wouldn't waste my money on the currie steering stuff when you can build your own for 1/3 the cash or less.
I appreciate the advise that can be done yes for cheaper. Not worried about those things right now. Curious what you say for measurements I did some myself on a buddies quick to get an idea. And if I can use the factory lower control arm mount on the TJ or making my own will be better to align it all.

Email or pm me what your thinking or come up with. All your advise is again very appreciated.

Moroney167@yahoo.com is my email
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:36 PM   #28
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Well the BTF is a lo pro crossmember that takes care of your bumper, its got shackle mounts on it, then you run your choice shackles and springs, but they claim with XJ's they gain like 6" of stretch, youll need corners to match the wheel, and deal with the gas tank though.
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:40 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IndyJeepMan
Well the BTF is a lo pro crossmember that takes care of your bumper, its got shackle mounts on it, then you run your choice shackles and springs, but they claim with XJ's they gain like 6" of stretch, youll need corners to match the wheel, and deal with the gas tank though.
Appreciate the info. If I do this I am not to interested in stretching wheel base. Happy with how it would be and with the brackets I have found that I can weld in that seems simple enough over moving steering box all that.
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:42 PM   #30
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I measured the 02 I have out here and I measured my GE frame along with a couple others I have as well and it looks like the TJ control arm bracket is 2 inches further forward of the YJ leaf spring bracket. I couldn't get a good ID measurement on it because of the control arm being in the way. The good news is that it will move your front end out 2 inches, but the bad news is your going to have to stretch the front of the frame that extra 2 in the front to make it where the spring will actually fit. Now, that's with a YJ spring, if you use something longer, thats a wholenother can o worms. I wouldn't stretch it out if you plan on driving it alot on the road simply because you do have to mess with a fuel cell of some sort and I dont like any sort of fuel inside the passenger compartment with me unless its a trail only rig.

edit, I did forget to measure the length of the brackets down from the frame to see if there was any difference.

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