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Old 11-26-2013, 11:47 AM   #1
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Angry Dear God.... please let her start...

Ok, so, this is the full situation that i'm facing... about a week ago my clutch started feeling a bit soft, i thought nothing of it, after about a week of it getting gradually softer i took a look in and around the clutch master cylinder and discovered that it was in fact leaking to the interior side of the firewall. Simple enough i went to my local jobber, got a new clutch master cylinder and installed it that night.... then the fun began, while bleeding the lines, well the lines ruptured while bleeding them. the next day I needed to pull the jeep out of the shop so started in gear (i know... bad... gotta do what you gotta do...) got the jeep outside and after about 30 seconds of idle i turned it off, it sounded rough on shutdown so i waited about 5 seconds then tried to start her up again in neutral and she just cranked and cranked, pulled and replaced the spark plugs (granted they were gross) but even with new spark plugs in she wouldn't fire up, so i took a torch to each cylinder thinking maybe she was flooded and sure enough they were flooded, put the plugs back on and she fires right up... once... the second start she's flooded again... please for the love of all things good and holy can someone give me a direction to start trying to figure this out! the engine is a 4.0L with about 330,000 kms, it has good fuel, (it's my daily driver) all the rest of the fluids are good, (except clutch, still waiting on a new clutch line) i really just have no idea how to approach this conundrum.

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Old 11-26-2013, 05:06 PM   #2
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You are obviously getting fuel, but how is your spark? I am trying to think of what might have happened by starting it in gear. I am guessing here but maybe check timing when you get it started.

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Old 11-26-2013, 05:38 PM   #3
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Starting it in gear should not have affected anything but I would suspect in repairing the clutch components you damaged something or knocked a wire off if the Jeep ran fine before you got under the hood.
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Old 11-26-2013, 07:41 PM   #4
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Good luck man. I'm subscribing, I'd like to know what's up...
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Old 11-26-2013, 09:13 PM   #5
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Sounds like your injectors are bad not restricting the fuel flow to a mist. Sounds like it's throwing to much fuel at it without the need for it. Is the cel on? If so what codes do you have?
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Old 11-28-2013, 06:26 PM   #6
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sorry not sure what the cel is, and it's not throwing any codes, also new question does anyone know what the thing at the bottom end of the clutch line is, it's not the slave because that's inside the transmission on this year of jeep, it looks like a check valve but seems to allow free flow of pressure both directions. it's just a plastic cylinder with a push on nipple connector on one end then the screw on fitting on the other end to connect to the clutch line coming out of the transmission. i'm leaning towards the idea that the jeep is just slightly out of timing on the starting issue so tonight i'm going to try adjusting the timing, i'll post again soon with updates.
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Old 11-28-2013, 06:27 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by AllMudd View Post
Sounds like your injectors are bad not restricting the fuel flow to a mist. Sounds like it's throwing to much fuel at it without the need for it. Is the cel on? If so what codes do you have?
but if the injectors are bad wouldn't that cause it to not start at all rather than only when it's recently been shut off?
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Old 11-28-2013, 06:28 PM   #8
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CEL is check engine light....picture of the thing your talking about? Cause it almost sounds like your referring to the bleed screw but uncoils be wrong.
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Old 11-28-2013, 06:29 PM   #9
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Starting it in gear should not have affected anything but I would suspect in repairing the clutch components you damaged something or knocked a wire off if the Jeep ran fine before you got under the hood.
only things that's got me stumped about this suggestion is that the cylinder replacement went really smoothly, i don't recall banging or stressing anything on removal or installation.
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Old 12-01-2013, 12:15 AM   #10
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i think you are describing the quick connect on the master to slave line and the bleeder these are the only lines on the tranny if not like said above post a pic if you can
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Old 12-01-2013, 04:41 AM   #11
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Your crankshaft position sensor blots to the driverside of the bell housing near your clutch hydraulic line. Check to make sure you didn't inadvertently disconnect it or damage it.
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Old 12-01-2013, 07:07 PM   #12
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ok so this just keeps getting weirder, i've now convinced a local shop to manufacture me a piece of hydraulic line to replace the broken clutch line, installation went really smooth and me and my buddy bled it out to the point where there is no air spurts just a solid stream of dot 3 coming from the bleeder, at this point i pulled all of the spark plugs and re-gapped them to .035 (the biggest gap was .038 and smallest was .032) after re-gapping each plug i would try to start her and she would not go, as soon as the sixth plug was gapped and re-installed she roared to life with a quick turn of the key and now runs smooth again... very confusing for me... so with it running i depressed the clutch to back out of the shop and she would not go into gear, even with rapid pumping of the clutch no luck, the pedal feels exactly the same as it did before and there was no fluid loss from the resevoir or leaks on the floor in the process... as a diagnostic test i pushed the jeep outside for the night (i live in Canada, it was -26 that night) to see if allowing the various bushings seals fluids etc in the system would work, if stiffer from the cold, in the morning i went outside and with only 3-5 pumps of the clutch i could get the jeep to slip into gear smoothly however the catch point on the pedal was just off the floor, so not completely right but functional... so the final question here is what part of the clutch system works sort of when cold but not at all when warm? any ideas or other diagnostic tests i can do to get a definitive idea what's wrong?
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Old 12-01-2013, 07:21 PM   #13
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I know parts are costly, but if your old plugs looked that bad and if they are old I would start with new plugs after checking for something that may have came lose.
I have seen plugs that would fire out side in the open and not fire inside the cylinder under compression, nothing new.

Starting the engine in first or reverse gear should not harm it, Rock Crawler do it all the time!
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Old 12-01-2013, 07:27 PM   #14
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Glad she running, it sounds like you still have air in the line. Did the master ever get very low while bleeding and maybe get air?
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Old 12-02-2013, 12:57 AM   #15
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the plugs used in her now are brand new but didn't work until after i gapped them, i was very diligent about the master reservoir never getting too low

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'92 , flooding , start engine problem , starting issues , starting problems

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