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Old 04-11-2012, 07:49 PM   #121
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Lol I can def see what I can do about that

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Old 04-11-2012, 08:46 PM   #122
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where @ in PA.. I gotta 2br apt for rent.. all utils included in washington PA

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Old 04-11-2012, 09:05 PM   #123
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O really? He's looking for a place I'll ask him
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Old 04-11-2012, 09:11 PM   #124
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Ehh he's working in noxen..5 hours from you I think
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Old 04-11-2012, 11:04 PM   #125
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Just discovered this thread, I am a mechanic and have never heard of this, this is very exciting conversation. I have always focused on stock set ups, but have been toying with mods to my 2.5L. I should really record the before and afters. I already get 20mpg. On the trail , around town, highway, all about the same. I need more POWER....lol.
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Old 04-12-2012, 09:47 AM   #126
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This hho kit def gives you more power there is a huge difference however not right when you switch it on it takes just a few mins to warm up but then you can totally tell the difference
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Old 04-12-2012, 01:03 PM   #127
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I have been watching this thread from when it started, I posted a couple of comments early on. I am sorry you took my comment in a negative light, but like I said I have done some research on this subject, and as you stated in the original post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben-o View Post
First off if you want to tell me how stupid it is go ahead and tell me, I'll talk you down and out of thinking that way.
So here is the science behind why it does not work.Scientific proof proving that HHO scams are a fraud
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Old 04-12-2012, 01:41 PM   #128
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I hate to be the bad guy here, but in the video, when the fella said that you had to lean out the mixture, I immediatly thought back to the day when my hippie mother brought these home from the "crystal retreat"...


LARGE CAR FUEL IONIZER [fuel_ionizer_large1] - $89.99 : Purple Plates, Energy Plates and Jewelry


I'm not trying to tell anyone what to think, but I also don't want to see anyone else lose $$$$ to these schysters. Leaning out your engine will save you gas, but it is detrimental to the internal components of the engine as well as the cat, and will cost you many times over what savings you might have gained in the first place.



/rant.
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Old 04-12-2012, 01:49 PM   #129
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Just caught this thread. Very interesting. Subscribed
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Old 04-12-2012, 01:50 PM   #130
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^x2. Any gains that are seem from these systems are from a lean fuel mixture, but with no tuning(or add on electronics)the mixture will more than likely go fat, burning more fuel.
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Old 04-12-2012, 03:05 PM   #131
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Look guys I know about all the articles ad everything first saying they work and all the articles saying they don't...I know I have read a lot of them that's why I am doing this so you guys can get the facts from an ordinary guy no b.s and that way people arnt going out and getting scammed or in lighting people in a good product...I'm just looking for the truth is all
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Old 04-12-2012, 03:23 PM   #132
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Good to know. I just don't understand how this could possible work. If it takes say 3hp to create a certain amout of hho, then that same amount of hho could only produce 3hp. Other wise you would have created perpetual energy, which like perpetual motion is scientifically impossible.
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Old 04-12-2012, 03:43 PM   #133
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Well I mean the way I thought about it is that you have electrolyte in the system so it doesn't take as much energy to create and your producing pure hydrogen and pure oxygen...hydrogen is used in rocket fuel and oxygen is highly combustible...and engine efficiency rates are so poor as it is by added this your making your engine breath better thus using less fuel
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Old 04-12-2012, 03:55 PM   #134
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That is all correct, but it still takes a certain amount of energy to split the water into hydrogen and oxygen the amount of energy it takes to create is the same amount of engery you can produce. This is way you can not take foward motion, say from a spinning wheel and attach it to a generator then the generator to an electric motor and continue to go with no other power source. You can only harness as much engergy as you produce(and that is all at 100% efficiency).
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Old 04-12-2012, 03:56 PM   #135
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no point in arguing over it guys. wait for the numbers. Ben-o was kind enough to buy the kit and install it while reporting numbers, stop hassling him. he is not trying to sell these to us and he is not an engineer (right?) so all this talk of perpetual energy/motion and 3hp being used versus what is being created is wasted since the numbers will tell the truth
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Old 04-12-2012, 04:00 PM   #136
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Wow, I am not trying to harass him. I am trying to have a conversation as to why I don't think this is possible. My apologies Ben, if you are feeling harassed.
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Old 04-12-2012, 04:04 PM   #137
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it just read that way to me, that everyone was ganging up on him.
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Old 04-12-2012, 04:07 PM   #138
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It's all good guys no worries.
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Old 04-12-2012, 05:45 PM   #139
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Oh, Ben, I honestly never meant to be an a-hole, I was just stating a point. I understand your position, I mean, if $300 turns into thousands of dollars saved over the lifetime of your Jeep, then it was a good investment. If you lose $300, and don't break your Jeep, then it was worth the gamble.
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Old 04-12-2012, 06:52 PM   #140
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O it's fine I never took it like that...I started this on another forum and got all negative :x lol so I stopped it but ya man it's all good no worries I just took it as more info...no worries
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Old 04-12-2012, 08:35 PM   #141
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From what I've read and seen on a lot of these systems now they aren't saying they are a perpetual motion device they just make the engine more efficient, kind of the same as engineering has over the years
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Old 04-12-2012, 09:14 PM   #142
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these systems have never been about boosting HP, their purpose is to replace some of the fuel with hydrogen

that part only works if the fuel mixture is leaned out, otherwise you may get more HP because you are using more fuel

the hydrogen does not take any extra fuel or horsepower to produce, it uses some of the wasted energy already being produced by the alternator

(I have no proof of this, but it sounds good, doesn't it?)
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Old 04-13-2012, 12:07 AM   #143
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Peterbuilt factory just installed 4 hho units on 4 trucks, and is crunching numbers as we speak. any mileage reports from Pennsylvania Ben? I don't believe the thread was started as a forum to debate whether hho works or not... it was more of a build thread. if HHO increases HP as a byproduct.. then that's pretty cool. but everyone wants to see if indeed there was increased MPG's right?
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Old 04-13-2012, 07:36 AM   #144
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Lol no update yet I guess he hasn't filled up yet...and that's pretty cool with the trucks let us know what happens
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Old 04-13-2012, 10:01 AM   #145
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Hey Ben If you don't want to discuss this just say and I will stop. Timberwolf, an alternator does not alway but out its max amps, this is what the regulator does, so in turn if the alternator has a higher demand(running the hho generator)fuel consumption will increase.
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Old 04-13-2012, 10:37 AM   #146
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It is true that increased load on an alternator will require more energy to turn it, and the regulator attempts to maintain a steady output voltage, which would otherwise vary with changing current draw. It's also theoretically not possible to get more energy out than you put in. However, because the generator does not create the energy, but instead only separates the fuel from the water, I'm not sure that law applies. It takes energy to pump gasoline from the tank and operate the injectors, turn the distributor, compress the intake charge, and overcome friction, but a car runs because a fuel is involved as opposed to it trying to make its own energy. The feat here will be to see if the fuel in the water is potent enough to overcome the high energy requirement of extracting it. I'm not convinced it will work either, but 99% of the people who say it won't work have never tried, only applied theory, and not always the correct theory at that.
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Old 04-13-2012, 12:06 PM   #147
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You know I could calculate exactly how much it takes
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Old 04-13-2012, 01:18 PM   #148
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The calculations is where the question lays. I don't think anyone disputes that the first and second laws of physics apply, the question is always about the calculation used to reach the results. If i remember correctly 1hp is equivalent to some where in the mid 700watts. What are you using as a catalyst? What is the power consumption of your hho generator? How many lpm are you producing?
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Old 04-13-2012, 04:15 PM   #149
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KNOH I believe I can't remember now that it's not infront of me but it draws like 6amps cold
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Old 04-13-2012, 09:53 PM   #150
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thinkin you said your creates a solid 3 lpm I wanna know why the exhaust temp is so important..???

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