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Old 01-28-2012, 06:31 PM   #1
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Won't start after rebuild, ugh

91- 4.0, turns over fine, there is fuel in the rail. Pretty sure its getting spark . Any ideas?

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Old 01-28-2012, 07:19 PM   #2
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If you know it is getting fuel and you know it is getting spark the next thing would be to check timing. Has to get the fuel and spark together to make fire.

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Old 01-28-2012, 07:31 PM   #3
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91- 4.0, turns over fine, there is fuel in the rail. Pretty sure its getting spark . Any ideas?
Yes...Make 100% sure you got spark....pull a plug and observe...then I would start with the timing...Explain your procedure for dropping in the distributor please
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Old 01-28-2012, 09:46 PM   #4
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I pulled all plugs and laid them on the valve cover while connected. Only 3 were sparking. Changed the cap and rotor to the original ones ( I had new ones). But haven't checked visually yet, just with all the plugs back in place. It sounds like its trying to crank but just won't. My dad thinks its not getting enough fuel.

How much pressure should I have? I've got a brand new pressure regulator too but may put old one back in tomorrow just to make sure.

As for installing the dizzy, I lined the oil pump drive at 11o clock, with rotor pointing to 4oclock, I slid it down with the rotor ending up pointing to 5oclock ( directly at the contact for #1)

Only codes I have are 12 and 33 ( I have no ac installed)

Keep the help coming
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Old 01-28-2012, 11:08 PM   #5
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Tips from the beas

I had the same problem. You may have your cam out of alignment. I know when I put mine back together, it was a pain in the ass! Also, check the cam positioning sensor. This is located at the top of the bell housing on the transmission on the drivers side. Unfortunately, there is no way to test it and it is a $90 part. There should be 39-40psi in the fuel rail when running at idle. Just recheck all the required steps of a rebuild in a Haynes manual and then, like I said. It is most likely the CPS sensor on the trans. Hope this helps!
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Old 01-28-2012, 11:19 PM   #6
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Your distributor could be 180 degrees out of time, firing on the exhaust stroke instead of the compression stroke. Real easy to do and will cause it to act like it wants to run but not. You can bring number one back up to TDC, pull the dizzy and reinstall at 180 degrees.
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Old 01-29-2012, 03:51 AM   #7
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Your distributor could be 180 degrees out of time, firing on the exhaust stroke instead of the compression stroke. Real easy to do and will cause it to act like it wants to run but not. You can bring number one back up to TDC, pull the dizzy and reinstall at 180 degrees.
Bingo..Your probably not even in the ballpark of it timed right..You need to remove the #number 1 spark [furthest forward]plug and put you thumb over the hole while your dad cranks the key..when your thumb blows off from compression stroke that is when the # 1 cylinder should be firing on the distributor,you will also notice the notch on the harmonic balancer is in the timing scale for "0" or TDC at that moment.Then align the oil pump so when the distributor drops down on the gears the rotor is in the vicinity of number one on the cap....you might have to adjust one gear tooth or so + or - if you run out of room to rotate the dis. to set time with your light.
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Old 01-29-2012, 06:14 AM   #8
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you may have set tdc on the exhaust stroke rather than on the compresion stroke, try turning no1 piston round 1 revolusion so piston hits tdc next time round. good luck. ian
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Old 01-29-2012, 10:20 AM   #9
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I'm pretty sure its timed right, but I'm verify.the issue doesn't seem to be that its firing on exhaust stroke, more that its just not firing on all cylinders. With all the plugs layed up on the head and someone turning the key not all of the plugs spark.
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Old 01-29-2012, 11:52 AM   #10
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I'm pretty sure its timed right, but I'm verify.the issue doesn't seem to be that its firing on exhaust stroke, more that its just not firing on all cylinders. With all the plugs layed up on the head and someone turning the key not all of the plugs spark.
That's not the best way to check for spark, check them one at time with a decent ground or with an inline tester.
I vote for bad timing too...
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:10 PM   #11
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what do you consider a rebuild ? did you replace the timing chain and gears? are you a tooth off ? if not you need to pull the distributor and make sure you have #1 at tdc and have the plug wires right.
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:19 PM   #12
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It was a complete rebuild. I also checked plugs with online tester. Coil does not show proper resistance on primary, abt to replace and see what happens
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:37 PM   #13
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Online = inline.... Typing from my phone
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:50 PM   #14
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No dice.... Could the stator cause an intermittent spark?
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Old 01-29-2012, 05:28 PM   #15
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ok, i rechecked to make sure that the no1 was at tdc on compression and it was, reinstalled dizzy and same issues. i'm thinking its an ignition issue here, not timing. also, i checked fuel pressure in the rail and its at abt 45psi, so i've gotten that out of the way as an issue. i'm just getting intermittent spark. not like all 6 plugs are sparking, just at the wrong time, some of them just arent sparking at all and some arent sparking every time.

i've replaced cap, rotor, coil and still exact same problem. i guess i'll swap crank position sensor and dizzy pickup next. i just dont see how either would have just gone bad bc i pulled and swapped the engine. any ideas at all?

thanks for the help so far
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Old 01-29-2012, 06:14 PM   #16
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grounds

Check all ignition system grounds.
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Old 01-29-2012, 06:22 PM   #17
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that thought hit me not long ago. do you happen to know if any of the grounds by the dipstick tube are for the ignition system? i wasnt super confident in them when i hooked them back up. i put the grounds btwn the bolt head and bracket for the tube, should i have gone btwn the bracket and the block?

also, i'm researching and it seems both the crank and cam position sensors should cut fuel if they are bad, but i've got fuel in the rail. someone said they only cut out the injectors not the priming ability of the pump, but my spark plugs all seemed wet like they were getting fuel sprayed in.
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Old 01-29-2012, 07:03 PM   #18
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i wonder if you have a bad ecm but i would start with the icm ( distributor module)
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Old 01-29-2012, 07:49 PM   #19
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How tight are the rocker arms?...Is it possible some are adjusted too tight and holding the valve open leaking compression?..does the engine show any signs of life popping or belching when you crank?
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Old 01-29-2012, 08:48 PM   #20
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How tight are the rocker arms?...Is it possible some are adjusted too tight and holding the valve open leaking compression?..does the engine show any signs of life popping or belching when you crank?
negative, when it does crank it sounds good for the second its live, but the ignition is almost certainly my problem. i'm not seeing constant or strong spark
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Old 01-29-2012, 09:12 PM   #21
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i wonder if you have a bad ecm but i would start with the icm ( distributor module)
not positive if i've got an icm, didnt they get rid of that in 91 when they left the renix system?
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Old 01-30-2012, 11:46 AM   #22
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replaced crank position sensor to no avail. running out of ideas here
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Old 01-30-2012, 12:41 PM   #23
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Try fresh spark plugs...I have seen them get fuel soaked and foul.
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:01 PM   #24
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brand new plugs, i'm not getting spark to the plugs
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:27 PM   #25
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brand new plugs, i'm not getting spark to the plugs
Now you have No spark at all?..post #4 you said only 3 sparked but weak?
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:29 PM   #26
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do you have anything going into or out of your coil?
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:52 PM   #27
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I believe that I do
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Old 01-30-2012, 02:54 PM   #28
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make sue you have the full 12v going in and coming out, if nothing going in find your ground problem, if nothing going out you need a new coil
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Old 01-30-2012, 04:44 PM   #29
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isnt it going to have a lot more than 12v coming out? i thought that was the point of the coil, boost the 12v to something much higher.

also, i've tried with a new coil already and still same issue remains
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Old 01-30-2012, 04:56 PM   #30
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Only at the plug wires, something like 30k volts

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