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Old 11-16-2010, 05:20 PM   #1
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2010 wrangler unlimited camber

I purchased a 2010 wrangler unlimited last month. I just installed a ZONE OFFROAD 4" suspension lift. I did the work myself and all went as per instruction. I noticed right off the bat that an alignment was required. Steering wheel was about 90 degrees off and pulling to one side. Oddly I got traction control alarms as well. limped to Tire Kingdom for a front end alignment. Once complete the tech said that all aspects of the alignment went well. Significant tow error was corrected, steering wheel offset corrected, no more stability control alarms test drive was successful. The only remaining issue was a 1 degree camber error as this wrangler has no camber adjustment and he found no adjustment kit available. Talked to ZONE tech support and was told that there was no way that the lift could have caused the camber to be out of spec and that most likely the ball joints were bad. This Jeep is brand new so that seems unlikely. The thing drives perfectly just like before the lift so obviously this camber error is undetectable except by alignment equipment so I guess the camber could have been off from the factory. Any Ideas?

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Old 11-16-2010, 07:17 PM   #2
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The only way camber would be off is if your axle is bent. There is no way to adjust or change the JK's camber, except by bending the axle. If the ball joints are out already on a 2010 in a MONTH, assumedly on stock tires (since you didn't mention any changes), it's under warranty, but wouldn't cause a degree of camber change unless they were shot. If they were that bad, you'd both A. know it, and B. be able to see it.

Next up, grammatical note- it's called a paragraph. PLEASE USE THEM- it makes things much more legible (big word meaning I can read it!)

Following that, steering wheel clocking has NOTHING to do with alignment. Do a bit of research and you'll find that you adjust the sleeve on the drag link to re-center that. That's why your ESP light is flashing, and cutting your power- because it needs a centered steering wheel to work properly, otherwise it thinks you're crabbing down the road, and cuts power.

Find a new shop- your TK guys are morons- Mark W.

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Old 11-16-2010, 08:13 PM   #3
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I installed the lift myself so I guess I would be the moron to which you refer. I am admittedly not a front end mechanic nor have I ever tried to pass as an English professor but my decision to take the post install issues to a professional rather than start making adjustments that were outside my understanding and the scope of the installation instructions I'm sure you would agree was valid.

As for the structure of my message, I was stealing a bit of time while at work to do just what you suggested; a little research... didn't have a lot of time to focus on such things as paragraph structure. Perhaps that was inconsiderate. If so I apologize.

I have wanted a Jeep since I was a kid and am very proud to finally be in a position to own one. This forum seems to be a wealth of information from people who know what they are talking about. As a new member I'd just like to say thanks for making me feel welcome.
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Old 11-16-2010, 08:41 PM   #4
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Sorry I cant help, but welcome to the club!
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Old 11-16-2010, 08:43 PM   #5
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Instead of taking all the negative from my jerk-ish self, take the knowledge I dropped. Not only did I answer all of your questions (even the ones not posed as questions) thoroughly, I added in quite a bit as well.

Also, at no point did I call YOU a moron. I actually mis-read the post, as it was, in all reality, hard to read, as I mentioned. I thought I read that the TK guys told you a ball joint was bad, not the Zone folks. I am neither a "front end mechanic" or an English professor. I, and any other person trying to break down so many points would agree, find it hard to glean all of the pertinent facts from a single, jumbled paragraph.

If you don't want sarcasm, a Jeep forum isn't the place for you. It's one of the free services offered by most Jeepers. We're a thick-skinned bunch, and a bit of a hard time about grammar shouldn't be enough to send you running. You'll get used to A holes like me in time, and see that, through the BS, what I say is all entirely valid, useful information, that'll help out 99% of the time. I don't mean any offense, just a point on grammar. If it's easier to read, you'll get better responses, quicker. Cheers, and smile- life's too short to take seriously Mark W.
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:12 PM   #6
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Don't break your arm patting yourself on the back Mark....hahaha
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Old 11-16-2010, 10:54 PM   #7
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Thankfully, I have two bum shoulders that dislocate from time to time, so it's easy Mark W.
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Old 11-16-2010, 11:18 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thaduke2003
Thankfully, I have two bum shoulders that dislocate from time to time, so it's easy Mark W.
That's a neat trick. I have metal in my leg but the only super power I got is the ability to tell how cold it is without going outside.
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Old 11-17-2010, 07:11 AM   #9
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Thanks Guys

The main intent of my question was to verify that there is little chance that some aspect of the lift could have caused the camber to be out of spec.

The ZONE guys did identify the same two possibilities Mark had mentioned and given the tender age of my jeep, I can claim responsibility for neither bad ball joints nor a bent axel. My guess is that this camber spec issue was most likely present at the time of purchase.

I spoke with my local dealer about the issue and after telling me that a 4" lift was excessive and could possibly void certain points of my power train warranty, offered to perform an alignment, checking the camber against the factory specs and correcting any issues covered under my warranty. Because a lift was installed they say I will have to pay for the alignment. I kind of expected that.

Mark's explanation of the stability control alarms seems entirely accurate because this issue was resolved once the steering wheel was realigned.

Thanks guys
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Old 11-17-2010, 07:28 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by thaduke2003 View Post
Thankfully, I have two bum shoulders that dislocate from time to time, so it's easy Mark W.
That's it, no one make bets with Mark regarding whether or not he can get out of a straight jacket.

(I was going to insert a Mel-Gibson-getting-out-of-a-straight-jacket photo here, but they're surprisingly hard to find!)
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Old 11-17-2010, 07:46 AM   #11
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The Zone Offroad lift has in no way the ability to change camber. I also installed my lift from Zone, and had a little negative camber which is ok. Most vehicles have some negative or positive camber. Very rarely did I ever see a vehicle that the factory specs were straight up 0 degrees with no tolerance. One degree negative camber might be just outside the specs, but it's not going to chew your tires up or make your Jeep drive crazy. If you have anymore questions, I'll be glad to try and answer them. I'm a former Hunter Engineering trained alignment tech and a current ASE Master Tech.
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Old 11-17-2010, 08:41 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by jeffk42 View Post
That's it, no one make bets with Mark regarding whether or not he can get out of a straight jacket.

(I was going to insert a Mel-Gibson-getting-out-of-a-straight-jacket photo here, but they're surprisingly hard to find!)
Hah! I have seen it in LW, but I've never had the opportunity to try it. One day... Mark W.
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Old 11-17-2010, 09:39 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetmech1 View Post
The Zone Offroad lift has in no way the ability to change camber. I also installed my lift from Zone, and had a little negative camber which is ok. Most vehicles have some negative or positive camber. Very rarely did I ever see a vehicle that the factory specs were straight up 0 degrees with no tolerance. One degree negative camber might be just outside the specs, but it's not going to chew your tires up or make your Jeep drive crazy. If you have anymore questions, I'll be glad to try and answer them. I'm a former Hunter Engineering trained alignment tech and a current ASE Master Tech.
Thanks Jetmech1. That was another question that I omitted originally. The mech. mentioned the camber issue afterwards stating that it was about 1 degree off spec... didn't say + or _ but I was curious how bad that was. Thanks for the info.

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