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Old 07-14-2011, 11:01 AM   #1
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2012 Wrangler: 285hp @ 6,350 & 260lb-ft @ 4,200

I'm not sure if you heard the confirmed engine hp/torque but I wanted to share the news with everyone - the following link has all specs for 2012:

https://www.fleet.chrysler.com/v7fle...%27s_Guide.pdf (if the link does not open - copy it and past it into a new window)


Enjoy the facts,

Ayman

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Old 07-14-2011, 11:52 AM   #2
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I can't get the link to work... however...

Those numbers seem pretty good.

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Old 07-14-2011, 11:59 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by MaMopar View Post
I can't get the link to work... however...

Those numbers seem pretty good.
Right click on the attachment and save on your desk top. You should be able to open it then.
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Old 07-14-2011, 12:17 PM   #4
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well, what does that do for cruising on the freeway at 2000 rpm/auto and Off-road in 4hi at 15 mph ???

I suppose it's gonna be an improvement, but lets wait and see if the new buyers are happy with the power/heating/cooling, with the addition of bigger tires and perhaps an auto tranny ??

Time will tell--

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Old 07-14-2011, 12:31 PM   #5
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The peak numbers look nice, but I'd like to see a dyno graph to see what the power curve looks like. Peak HP at 6250 and TQ at 4200 isn't really awe inspiring considering where most Jeeps operate. Hopefully it will be nice and flat, delivering most of it's torque down low.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:07 PM   #6
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well you can only get 4.10 in a rubi and still 3.21 with the regular jk\jku. 6 speed...3.73 with auto,,, chrysler should offer better gear choice,, at least 4.88..
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:11 PM   #7
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This is what the dyno shows on the 3.6L in the 2011 Challenger with 304hp. I know it wont be exact for the wrangler but I have to say with the HP numbers that many talk about being over 6000rpm's, I doubt many will ever see anything close to this motors potential in a Wrangler. Looks around 100hp at 2700 rpms and that is with a 304 hp tuned Challenger (3.8L get 90hp at 2700rpm's). Thats why I think many are looking at the gearing wrong for the 3.6L. I think you need the higher ratio to see this motors potential.


3.6 at the wheel (Challenger)


3.8 at the wheel
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:22 PM   #8
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Here's a link to a post with engine dynos for both engines.

It looks to be about a 13.6% increase in torque from the 3.8 below 2000 RPM. It also looks like it adds about 5 to 10 hp at that same RPM. At least that's how I read them. I'm not sure it's going to blow anybody away, but it should be a welcome improvement.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:30 PM   #9
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But those graphs are at the engine not the wheel. The numbers look less far apart at the wheel. More like 10% at the wheel at normal driving conditions but still an improvement. Where the best advantage will be putting the gas to the floor. The 3.6 will have more get up and go but at cruising speeds with minimal increases, not sure there will be as big of a bang.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:37 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by rics1997 View Post
But that is at the engine. The numbers look less far apart at the wheel. More like 10% at the wheel at normal driving conditions but still an improvement. Where the best advantage will be putting the gas to the floor. The 3.6 will have more get up and go but at cruising speeds with minimal increases, not sure there will be as big of a bang.
Yeah I know, but all things being equal the ratios should be similar. I hadn't seen an at the wheel dyno for the 3.6 yet, so I'm glad you posted it.

The 3.6 should be an improvement in all aspects--from the line, at slow speeds, at high speeds, cruising, etc. Nothing about the 3.6 should be worse than (or even equal to) the 3.8.

I expect for most of the RPMs folks are using there will be around a 10% to 15% improvement. That's great. I'd love to have a 10% to 15% raise in my salary, or get 10% to 15% better gas mileage, or have 10% to 15% more power (whether its hp or torque).

That said though, if you were hoping for a Hemi or diesel type experience, I wouldn't think you'll be satisfied. It's moving incrementally closer.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:49 PM   #11
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Definitely looks like solid improvements over the 3.8 throughout the powerband, though not as dramatic down low as up high. I'd expect power delivery to feel a lot like the 3.8 does now, but with more power. Will it scratch the itch? I'd bet in practical daily driving, where you're not seeing RPM over 4000, it will feel a little peppier, but I don't think it's going to be the huge difference some people are thinking it will be, unless you're drag racing.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:50 PM   #12
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Here is where I see that many trying to figure out what gears to get between the 3.21-3.73 in non-rubis to 3.73-4.10 for Rubis are looking at it wrong. They are comparing the rpm's to the current JK and looking at the dyno's either at wheel or engine, you should be running at a higher rpm for the 3.6L then the 3.8L. The 3.8 maxes at 5300 rpm's while the 3.6 is 6200 rpm's. It just looks like that the 3.6L will run better at higher rpms then the 3.8.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:51 PM   #13
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Yep, that engine will LOVE some gear. I'd be willing to bet a step up to 4.56 on a stocker would really wake it up.
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Old 07-14-2011, 01:52 PM   #14
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Heh Heh, thats all so evertrue, but

I have to brag about my 30% increase in APPLIED HP-thru all gears and 15% increase in mileage (driven sanely, so thats out)-

I can't cap on anyone wanting a new jeep, but It's not gonna be like jumping from a Miata into a Viper !!

Can't wait for some realistic experience, especially when bigger tires are added or towing !!

Smokemifyougotem-

I'm kinda PITA-huh !

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Old 07-14-2011, 01:57 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by MTH View Post
Here's a link to a post with engine dynos for both engines.

It looks to be about a 13.6% increase in torque from the 3.8 below 2000 RPM. It also looks like it adds about 5 to 10 hp at that same RPM. At least that's how I read them. I'm not sure it's going to blow anybody away, but it should be a welcome improvement.

Im new to the whole jeep thing, But I see lots of people saying how gutless the 3.8L is vs the older 4.0L. Looking at one of the dyno's you posted, they look very similar..

What am i missing?


3.6 Looks like its going te be a winner... expecially once they make chips/exhausts to boost performance alittle more
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:08 PM   #16
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Just thought everyone would appreciate this little exchange from about 4 months ago:

Quote:
Originally Posted by MOPWR2U View Post
It may very well turn out that regearing a 3.8 gives you more hp at highway speed than you will get from a 3.6 Pentastar that has stock gearing.
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Originally Posted by Wrangler2012 View Post
It's laughable to even suggest that regearing the 3.8 will even get you close to the Pentastar.
We don't have any 3.6 Wranglers to test, but it's not so laughable now. A 10% to 15% difference at usuable RPMs is a gap that can be nearly closed, especially with the manual transmissions which are unchanged for 2012.

Again, not to say the 3.6 won't be better in every way, including being able to be regeared (and presumably supercharged eventually) so as to further distance itself from any 3.8.

It's just a statement on expectations.
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:11 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Chasin Tail View Post
Im new to the whole jeep thing, But I see lots of people saying how gutless the 3.8L is vs the older 4.0L. Looking at one of the dyno's you posted, they look very similar..

What am i missing?
You're not missing anything.

What you're hearing is about wishful thinking and nostalgia more than anything else. There's also some differences in the rides of both Jeeps (the 4.0 Jeeps were stiffer and had a different throttle system) that helped foster the illusion that there's a big difference. The "seat of the pants" experience in the older Jeeps definitely feels a lot faster/wilder. However, the reality is when you dyno them or race them (0-60 in a Jeep? Strange) they turn out to be very similar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chasin Tail View Post
3.6 Looks like its going te be a winner... expecially once they make chips/exhausts to boost performance alittle more
Yep. If I were in the market today, I'd wait for the 2012.
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Old 07-14-2011, 02:17 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chasin Tail View Post
Im new to the whole jeep thing, But I see lots of people saying how gutless the 3.8L is vs the older 4.0L. Looking at one of the dyno's you posted, they look very similar..

What am i missing?


3.6 Looks like its going te be a winner... expecially once they make chips/exhausts to boost performance alittle more
The 4.0 and 3.8 are very similar. If the 3.8 was in the TJ I doubt you would even notice the difference. The problem was the JK was a bigger Jeep so it takes more to move it especially the Unlimited. I think many confused the power of the 3.8 as underpowered because they just seen it in heavy beasts like the JKUs, and Minivans. It was in some cars also and not even in the minivan first like the New Yorker / Imperial and Dodge Dynasty.
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Old 07-14-2011, 03:20 PM   #19
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I was hoping they would shave off some of the top end to make more down.
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Old 07-14-2011, 03:47 PM   #20
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I was hoping they would shave off some of the top end to make more down.
But that's not how engines work...
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Old 07-14-2011, 04:06 PM   #21
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But that's not how engines work...
Actually, it is. It's all in the heads and cam. These days, in the variable valve timing as well. Longer intake runners, smaller ports on the heads, and a cam cut to work with the smaller ports will boost low end, and typically sacrifice some top end. It works the other way, too. Short runners, big ports, lots of duration and lift in the cam will increase top end quite a bit, almost always as the expense of low end torque.
Displacement plays into that equation as well, since more displacement usually means more torque, and hp is in simple terms torque multiplied by rpm. Smaller engines make up for the lack of torque by having higher redlines. Look at the Honda S-2000. It has a 2 liter engine that only makes 153 ft/lbs, but makes a pretty stout 237hp, which is over 100hp per liter. But, it has to rev to 8300 rpm to do it.
Engines are nothing but air pumps. They either move air through a lot of displacement, or a lot of RPM. It gets more complex with VVT and multiple cams, but the basics are the same.
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Old 07-16-2011, 03:37 PM   #22
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If it indeed comes down to only a 10 to 12 percent power increase at the wheel, that will be barely noticeable. Probably not noticeable much at all under normal driving conditions. I have experienced those level "increases" in enough cars and bikes over the years now to know it takes at least about a 25% increase at the asphalt / dirt to make a difference worth mentioning. Good numbers for selling point and bragging rights, but not an epic driving improvement at all by any means.
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Old 07-16-2011, 05:32 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chasin Tail

Im new to the whole jeep thing, But I see lots of people saying how gutless the 3.8L is vs the older 4.0L. Looking at one of the dyno's you posted, they look very similar..

What am i missing?

3.6 Looks like its going te be a winner... expecially once they make chips/exhausts to boost performance alittle more
Drove the good ol' 4.0 for like 15 yrs. The 3.8 has power, but it's at a higher rpm range. it took me a few days to get used to it along with the 6 speed manual. If you get it up to 3-4000 rpms she'll move.
Starting off in 2nd is a must. I'll start in first if no ones behind me. No problem on the highway, don't see why people are complaining so much. Gas mileage is awesome compared to the 4.0.
I'm loving all this chat about the new 3.6
I would never buy something without trying it. Hopefully it all works out for them
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Old 07-16-2011, 07:46 PM   #24
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I have had three 3.8 engines in two Dodge Grand Caravans and one JKU. Great engine.

We all know the PentaStar 3.6 is going to be a piece of Cr@p with a capital C.

So, being the magnanimous and dedicated Jeeper I am, I am going to shell out $37k+ on a new 2012 JKU just so y'all can say "I told you so"!

Ain't I a heck of a guy?

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