2013 sport 2D roll over - Jeep Wrangler Forum
Jeep Wrangler Forum

Go Back   Jeep Wrangler Forum > JK Jeep Wrangler Forum > JK General Discussion Forum

Join Wrangler Forum Today


Reply
 
Thread Tools

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on WranglerForum.com
Old 01-18-2014, 04:24 PM   #1
Newb
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 4
2013 sport 2D roll over

well i was going 60 then switched from 4wd-2wd. my middle traction symbol came on flashing. lost power from throttle. then i was sliding side ways. i tried to counter it with a correct turn because its common for the rear to slip out.. but i slid from left lane in a 4 lane to right side into the snow.. then flipped over. i went sliding on my roof for 20 feet. my T-top popped off and snow filled the rear.. so if you have passengers that my really suck for them.. really suck.. if not deadly.. when i hit i was rear first into the snow bank. the back of the hard top pushing inward .. pushing the T-top out so to grab on to anything.. Lucky i had no passenger because the back was all full of snow.. full full of snow.. My advice is never go rear first.. Near change from 4-2 while moving at highway speeds.. I tried to disable the Traction with the button but the throttle still loses power and the wheels still slow down.. allowing for your vehicle to slid off the road… I just want NO WHEEL SLOW DOWN so i may coast to a traction spot.. none of this pull left or right silly traction control stuff while not pushing the throttle..

Robert Olson is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 04:29 PM   #2
Newb
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 4
The roll cage need to match the hard top for no play. that would keep the T-top from pushing out and possible catching on something like hard snow and flying off..

Robert Olson is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 04:38 PM   #3
Jeeper
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Central Ca
Posts: 647
I personally don't do any gear shifting at 60 mph with the 4wd system. I always come to a crawl or stop. For fear of just this! Glad your safe, ask the state dept to give you a check for scraping their roads for them seeing how you filled up your back seat.
lando76 is online now   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 05:31 PM   #4
Jeeper
 
Scott2373's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Williamson, NY
Posts: 1,213
Why in hell were you doing 60MPH if you felt that you needed to be in 4x4 in the first place?
__________________
2013 Sport in Commando Green
3.73 Gears, A/C, 6-Speed
/_|o[___]o
[I---L-OllllllO
-
()_)()_)=°°=)_)
MOLON LABE
Scott2373 is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 05:38 PM   #5
Jeeper
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 472
You must not have been going no more than 50 right? Your mistaken you got shaken in the roll you were not going 60...
Not only that but switching at HWY speeds is not recommended I almost always switch under 20 mph if not just rolling less than 5.
peanut09 is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 05:57 PM   #6
Jeeper
 
spinlock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: 37.9° N, 121.7° W
Posts: 4,318
Quote:
Originally Posted by lando76 View Post
I personally don't do any gear shifting at 60 mph with the 4wd system. I always come to a crawl or stop. For fear of just this! Glad your safe, ask the state dept to give you a check for scraping their roads for them seeing how you filled up your back seat.
First, I agree I am glad you are safe and hope you and any occupants suffered no injuries and thank you for sharing your scary experience.

If you were in 4WD in the first place you must have traveling in poor traction conditions. When you went from 4WD to 2WD you probably did it because you were exceeding the speed for 4WD and wanted to go faster. Why would you want to go faster in poor driving conditions?

For a moment please forget about the design of the hard top, excessive understeer and how to roll down an embankment and focus on not putting yourself in that situation to begin with by slowing down.
__________________
"A man has got to know his limitations."
H. Callahan
spinlock is online now   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 05:59 PM   #7
Moderator

WF Supporting Member
::WF Moderator::
 
Sinister6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 5,669
This is why the idiots that tell you to take your vehicle out of 4wd when there's a dry area on the road for fear of ruining your 4wd are just that...IDIOTS! Glad you're ok!
__________________
The Wolf is not concerned with the opinion of sheep.

MY BUILD: :
http://www.wranglerforum.com/f322/si...ad-235526.html
Sinister6 is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 06:29 PM   #8
Jeeper
 
rdg04578's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: northern maine
Posts: 588
Shifting in and out of 4wd at highway speeds is not a problem--I do it all the time and have done so for years--usually the owners manual says not to do it over 50 or 60 mph but the system is designed to do so.

What it sounds to me--when you describe the middle traction control light---that is actually the stability control light and activated when the system senses sliding side ways--which is what may have occurred. Mine comes on all the time if I hit a wash board or a series of bumps in the road--and that would explain your "throttle" going dead. I do not think you would loose traction shifting from 4wd to 2wd causing you to slide sideways unless you were accelerating really hard when you shifted. It sounds more like black ice and you felt the slide compensated and caused the stability control to try and take over---either way good thing you made it through it.
rdg04578 is online now   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 06:48 PM   #9
Jeeper
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tollhouse PRK
Posts: 120
...so without the 'stability control' this may not have occcured? that's what it sounds like to me...it sensed a loss of traction and tried to kill you-I mean "help" you...by applying brakes when none were needed?
rayz is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 06:57 PM   #10
QUEEN OF MALLCRAWLERS

WF Supporting Member
 
mommymallcrawler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona
Posts: 3,374
Glad you are ok Robert! Although it seems to me that if the road was bad enough to need 4wd, it was too bad to be going 60 mph?
__________________
2014 JKR Granite Crystal, 5.13 Auto: RK X Factor 2.5 Inch Lift, Artec Front and Rear Truss, Artec Rear LCA Mounts/Skids, Poison Spyder HD Crossmember, Rock Hard Gas/TC/Evap/Oil Skids, Rough Country Front & Rear Diff Sliders, Nitto Trail Grapplers 37x12.5x17, Pro Comp 97 Series Wheels.
COMING SOON: new driveshafts lol COMING MARCH: HD Steering and Hydroassist
mommymallcrawler is online now   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 07:04 PM   #11
Jeeper
 
spinlock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: 37.9° N, 121.7° W
Posts: 4,318
If stability control is active and the driver switches from 4WD to 2WD it instantaneously removes two active control mechanisms used by the ESP system. Then when the system tries to adapt to the change when you introduce large inputs to steering or braking, the results may be unexpected. The ESP is very intrusive. If traction is sketchy, maybe you should slow down, hit the ESP button first and then drop out of 4WD. This way if the Jeep starts to slide you can your use driving skills to control it.
__________________
"A man has got to know his limitations."
H. Callahan
spinlock is online now   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 08:29 PM   #12
The Bad Guy

WF Supporting Member
 
daggo66's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: NJ exile living in Baltimore
Posts: 22,314
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinister6 View Post
This is why the idiots that tell you to take your vehicle out of 4wd when there's a dry area on the road for fear of ruining your 4wd are just that...IDIOTS! Glad you're ok!
The only idiot in this thread is the one who was going 60 in 4WD.
__________________
Tom

"I've got two things in this world, my balls and my word and I don't break them for no one."
daggo66 is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 08:32 PM   #13
Supporting Member

WF Supporting Member
 
Mcrock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 276
Quote:
Originally Posted by daggo66 View Post
The only idiot in this thread is the one who was going 60 in 4WD.
And the crowd cheers
__________________
'85CJ, '92YJ, '00 TJ, '08 JK, '13 JK, '17 ??
Mcrock is offline   Quote
Old 01-18-2014, 08:53 PM   #14
Jeeper
 
unityroad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: ohio
Posts: 106
so you remember all those details in a blink of an eye. Glad your ok tho.
unityroad is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 10:31 AM   #15
Jeeper
 
Michel347's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Laurentians, QC, Canada
Posts: 555
You will find a nice reading and table here on how ESP, TCS, ...,are working.

'07-Present Wrangler's Control System - ESP Off - Jp Magazine

As far as switching from 2WD to 4WD and the opposite, this shouldn't be done above 50mph. Shifting in between the two must be done when going at constant speed, not while accelerating or slowing down.

We see often this comment (when you went from 4WD to 2WD you probably did it because you were exceeding the speed for 4WD and wanted to go faster), this is not true, you can drive way higher over 50mph in 4WD no problem, there is no limit. Wise or not, it all depends on so many factors of road conditions, temperature, tires, ..., I do it often but not to allow to drive at an higher speed then what I could do in 2WD, just as a prevention to gain more stability.
__________________
2012 Wrangler JK Sport 2dr, man 6 spd, 3.73 diff
Michel347 is online now   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 12:07 PM   #16
Jeeper
 
onetraveller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Alaska
Posts: 873
You were driving too fast for conditions and had an accident. Don't blame the Jeep.

I shift in and out of 4wd a dozen times a day during the winter, at speeds from 0 to 65mph depending on the road conditions. I leave the traction and stability controls on and as long as I do my job they never intrude. Smooth is the key to driving in winter. No sudden movements or inputs.

Mike
__________________
2013 JKU Sahara, Commando Green - 2.5" Franken Lift - Rancho 9000xl shocks - 275/70r18 Cooper ST Maxx in summer - 265/70r18 Bizzaks in winter

http://www.wranglerforum.com/f202/re...ho-627602.html
onetraveller is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 12:38 PM   #17
Jeeper
 
Tweak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Keller, TX
Posts: 2,842
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinister6 View Post
This is why the idiots that tell you to take your vehicle out of 4wd when there's a dry area on the road for fear of ruining your 4wd are just that...IDIOTS! Glad you're ok!
us idiots arent doing 60 in obviously poor driving conditions.

we say that because it happens and we have seen it first hand. would you rather slow down to a safe speed and shift or continue driving like a moron and lose the front driveshaft at 60? or worse, roll the jeep?

not only that, but 4wd isnt going to help you for shit at 60mph
Tweak is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 01:14 PM   #18
Jeeper
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 40
The 3 letter acronyms your vehicle has DO NOT make it capable of driving through bad conditions like it's a sunny dry 70 degree day.
scooter185 is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 06:06 PM   #19
Jeeper
 
Toshbins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Berkshire UK
Posts: 90
When I'm sliding upside down at 50 mph into a snow bank, I always try to do it forwards so as to avoid just the problem that you describe. Never, ever do it rearwards.
Toshbins is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 06:44 PM   #20
Jeeper
 
Txrdstr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 888
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Olson View Post
well i was going 60 then switched from 4wd-2wd. my middle traction symbol came on flashing. lost power from throttle. then i was sliding side ways. i tried to counter it with a correct turn because its common for the rear to slip out.. but i slid from left lane in a 4 lane to right side into the snow.. then flipped over. i went sliding on my roof for 20 feet. my T-top popped off and snow filled the rear.. so if you have passengers that my really suck for them.. really suck.. if not deadly.. when i hit i was rear first into the snow bank. the back of the hard top pushing inward .. pushing the T-top out so to grab on to anything.. Lucky i had no passenger because the back was all full of snow.. full full of snow.. My advice is never go rear first.. Near change from 4-2 while moving at highway speeds.. I tried to disable the Traction with the button but the throttle still loses power and the wheels still slow down.. allowing for your vehicle to slid off the road… I just want NO WHEEL SLOW DOWN so i may coast to a traction spot.. none of this pull left or right silly traction control stuff while not pushing the throttle..
how bout not go 60 on icy roads? Says right in the jeep the top and doors are not expected to be of any structural barrier in event of crash...
Txrdstr is online now   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 09:56 PM   #21
yeah,,,, im that good

5-Year WF Supporting Member
 
panthermark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Chicago-land
Posts: 9,937
Images: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Olson View Post
well i was going 60 then switched from 4wd-2wd. my middle traction symbol came on flashing. lost power from throttle. then i was sliding side ways. i tried to counter it with a correct turn because its common for the rear to slip out.. but i slid from left lane in a 4 lane to right side into the snow.. then flipped over. i went sliding on my roof for 20 feet. my T-top popped off and snow filled the rear.. so if you have passengers that my really suck for them.. really suck.. if not deadly.. when i hit i was rear first into the snow bank. the back of the hard top pushing inward .. pushing the T-top out so to grab on to anything.. Lucky i had no passenger because the back was all full of snow.. full full of snow.. My advice is never go rear first.. Near change from 4-2 while moving at highway speeds.. I tried to disable the Traction with the button but the throttle still loses power and the wheels still slow down.. allowing for your vehicle to slid off the road… I just want NO WHEEL SLOW DOWN so i may coast to a traction spot.. none of this pull left or right silly traction control stuff while not pushing the throttle..
Sorry you had an accident. You have to keep in mind that you are in a short wheelbase, RWD vehicle with a high center of gravity. Because it a Jeep does not mean that it has more traction.

What tires where you running?
__________________
2013 Sahara Unlimited
Billet - Auto - 3.73 - Connectivity - Painted Hardtop - LSD - Remote Start - Saddle Leather - Side Airbags

I may mall crawl...but I look good doing it.....
panthermark is online now   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 10:02 PM   #22
Supporting Member

WF Supporting Member
 
Holton345's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Yazoo City, MS
Posts: 1,638
OP - You were driving in an unsafe manner. Do not blame the Jeep. You probably should get a Smart Car. Good luck with life.
__________________
Wade

2003 Shale Green TJ Sport
2013 Black JK Sport S

The terms "PO" and POS" are interchangeable when referring to the guy who used to own my TJ.
Holton345 is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 11:22 PM   #23
Jeeper
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 347
What I do in unsafe driving conditions...

1. Ask myself and asses if it is safe to slow down. Don't want to brake check the guy behind you.

2. Slow down so I can manage the road conditions.

3. If needed get off the highway at the next exit.

4. If needed pull over on the embankment. Went through a horrid rainstorm and I pulled over and most of the folks behind me did the same thing.

5. Don't shift on the fly when traveling at highway speed.


In the end this isn't Jeeps fault...it's driver error.



.
socalwk is offline   Quote
Old 01-19-2014, 11:47 PM   #24
Jeeper
 
kmrtnsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 728
Quote:
Originally Posted by onetraveller View Post
You were driving too fast for conditions and had an accident. Don't blame the Jeep.

This^^^^^^^^^
kmrtnsn is offline   Quote
Old 01-20-2014, 03:29 AM   #25
Jeeper
 
lostboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 32
Aside from the vast amounts of idiots calling you a bad driver, or accusing you of doing stupid things, yes, the ESP and traction control does the same for me in this situation.

Come to Canada, where roadspeed is 60mph on icy roads and we handle it just fine. And according to MY userguide from Jeep, I can shift on the fly at 100kph (62mph).

But the short wheelbase and high center of gravity make it very susceptible to tipping. Glad you're ok friend.
lostboy is offline   Quote
Old 01-20-2014, 03:33 AM   #26
Jeeper
 
lostboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 32
And if anyone wants to argue with Highway speed 4WD shifting, take it up with Jeep. Watch the 1:09 mark. 55mph is totally safe.

lostboy is offline   Quote
Old 01-20-2014, 03:53 AM   #27
Jeeper
 
spinlock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: 37.9° N, 121.7° W
Posts: 4,318
Everyone is very pleased that no one was injured.

55 seconds into the video the narrator states "shift your vehicle into 4 wheel drive high range when you take your vehicle off paved roads and onto loose terrain ..." and the bottom of the video has a caption that states "Only use on slippery or loose surfaces" while the icon on the top shows 4WD highlighted. This minor detail precedes your 1:09 remarks.

Out of curiosity what do you think your min stopping distance is at 100KPH on ice including reaction time?
__________________
"A man has got to know his limitations."
H. Callahan
spinlock is online now   Quote
Old 01-20-2014, 05:45 AM   #28
Jeeper
 
rdg04578's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: northern maine
Posts: 588
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostboy View Post
Aside from the vast amounts of idiots calling you a bad driver, or accusing you of doing stupid things, yes, the ESP and traction control does the same for me in this situation.

Come to Canada, where roadspeed is 60mph on icy roads and we handle it just fine. And according to MY userguide from Jeep, I can shift on the fly at 100kph (62mph).

But the short wheelbase and high center of gravity make it very susceptible to tipping. Glad you're ok friend.
That about sums it up. It is hard for some people to understand that driving 50 - 60 MPH on snow covered roads is not unsafe---in northern maine it is a part of everyday life for 4 months a year. You learn at a young age things like tires make a difference and being in 4WD doesn't mean you can go faster it just means you can go---lol.
rdg04578 is online now   Quote
Old 01-20-2014, 07:47 AM   #29
Jeeper
 
GeckoJK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Windsor, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 879
Pics of the Jeep? Insurance fixing it or writing it off?
GeckoJK is offline   Quote
Old 01-20-2014, 07:51 AM   #30
Jeeper
 
theotis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 195
People often think that we get Jeep's for winter driving. In Central Ohio, the 2dr Jeep is actually my last choice for winter driving behind my front wheel sedan and minivan. An event that causes roads to be a problem due to deep snow is an every few years occurrence. A rear wheel drive, short wheel base, high center of gravity vehicle, is not the best vehicle for icy, snow packed roads. In those conditions, stopping is the concern not needing 4wd to get going. I understand this is not true for all climates and topographies.

When I was in Colorado, I saw many a Jeep spin on black ice when traveling on I70. Now that was before traction control, but I assume Jeep's are still dangerous in the black ice environment. Especially when driven by people who think they are bullet proof because they are driving a 4wd.

theotis is offline   Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Download our Mobile App

» Network Links
»Jeep Parts
» Featured Product

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:31 PM.



Jeep®, Wrangler, Liberty, Wagoneer, Cherokee, and Grand Cherokee are copyrighted and trademarked to Chrysler Motors LLC.
Wranglerforum.com is not in any way associated with the Chrysler Motors LLC