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Old 06-08-2012, 12:21 PM   #661
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Any pictures or dates available on the Rugged Brown color?
Google: "Rugged Brown" "Grand Cherokee." It's going to give you a much better idea of what the color will look like than these photoshopped pictures will, even if they are are official Jeep photoshops.

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Old 06-08-2012, 12:27 PM   #662
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Google: "Rugged Brown" "Grand Cherokee." It's going to give you a much better idea of what the color will look like than these photoshopped pictures will, even if they are are official Jeep photoshops.
Thanks, found this 01/06/12 Just picked up my new Overland Summit Rugged Brown - JeepGarage.Org - We Are Jeep!

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Old 06-08-2012, 12:34 PM   #663
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Just about every dealer I emailed, 5 total, said they would honor the Chrysler affiliates program. When I emailed the 6th one I simply asked for best price with options and he ended up beating the others so I never brought up the affiliates program. I'd try that approach, all dealers within 15 miles of 01760 is what i did, maybe the competition in this area (metro west Boston) is why? If you want I can pm you my salesman contact info and you can call him direct, be a little drive for you as it was the dealer furthest south of me.
Did these dealers provide pricing via email? I cannot get anything other than an automated response followed by a call.
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:43 PM   #664
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Did these dealers provide pricing via email? I cannot get anything other than an automated response followed by a call.
The one I purchased from did, I honestly didn't go too far with the others since their response was they'd honor the affiliates program so I figured I new their price.
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:45 PM   #665
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Well it all sounds good...I did enjoy buying my jeep so that makes me a little jealous...but I think I will stick to my 2010 with my plug and play Super chips programer :P
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Old 06-08-2012, 12:54 PM   #666
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@Milous or @Up_Hill_Bill (or anyone else with info), can you confirm the 2013 Interior colors please? I received a POC on 6/5 that included "-XV Black / Dark Saddle", but they would only go to $500 under invoice, so I went with another dealer on 6/6 who offered $1,000 under invoice, but when we did the build out, the only interior option that was available was -X9 Black, -XV was no longer listed. Is that just a ordering glitch or have they restricted the Dark Saddle interior (or are in the process of changing it to a new color)? According to the dealer, I still have time to change the interior color. They are trying to track down what's going on with the interior colors, but I haven't heard back from them.

Thanks!
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:02 PM   #667
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The one I purchased from did, I honestly didn't go too far with the others since their response was they'd honor the affiliates program so I figured I new their price.
I sent you a PM ....
Rob ...
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:21 PM   #668
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Billet & Commando start date is set for September 4th (not 14th as I mentioned in post #596, that was a typo).
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:22 PM   #669
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Thank you Milous for the information and thank you Jeep for releasing the information.
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Old 06-08-2012, 01:31 PM   #670
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Hmm...so 4 Sept start date for Commando. Start date on Dune and Rugged Brown? Mid-Oct?

Just trying to line up my purchase window.
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:01 PM   #671
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Hmm...so 4 Sept start date for Commando. Start date on Dune and Rugged Brown? Mid-Oct?
Launch dates are not yet set for those colors...
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:03 PM   #672
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Launch dates are not yet set for those colors...
Can you confirm (or no comment) if Anvil and Furious Fuchsia are on the list for 2013?
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:05 PM   #673
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Question Anniversary Rubincon

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Launch dates are not yet set for those colors...
Any idea on the Anniversary Rubicon?
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:22 PM   #674
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@Milous or @Up_Hill_Bill (or anyone else with info), can you confirm the 2013 Interior colors please? I received a POC on 6/5 that included "-XV Black / Dark Saddle", but they would only go to $500 under invoice, so I went with another dealer on 6/6 who offered $1,000 under invoice, but when we did the build out, the only interior option that was available was -X9 Black, -XV was no longer listed. Is that just a ordering glitch or have they restricted the Dark Saddle interior (or are in the process of changing it to a new color)? According to the dealer, I still have time to change the interior color. They are trying to track down what's going on with the interior colors, but I haven't heard back from them.

Thanks!
WRANGLER Black/Dark Saddle leather seats (ALXV) are constrained temporarily and will reopen in the next allocation period. 2012-06-07
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:33 PM   #675
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Can you confirm (or no comment) if Anvil and Furious Fuchsia are on the list for 2013?
Any other info on Anvil (swatches, rough explanation of color, etc) would be greatly appreciated. I've been looking to order a black 13, but if Anvil is anywhere close to a flat black, I am in on Anvil.
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:40 PM   #676
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WRANGLER Black/Dark Saddle leather seats (ALXV) are constrained temporarily and will reopen in the next allocation period. 2012-06-07
Any idea how this affects orders that were placed on 6/5 that did include the ALXV option?
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:56 PM   #677
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Can anyone tell me if there is a difference between Factory Dealer Cost and Invoice?

Had dealer offer $500 below Factory Dealer Cost and am wondering if there is any difference. Had another dealer offer $1038 below invoice on...

2013 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon
Customer Preferred Package 24R
Automatic Transmission
Deep Cherry Red Crystal Pearl Coat
Black Leather Trimmed Bucket Seats
Media Center 730N CD/DVD/MP3/NAV
Heated Front Seats
Supplemental Front Seat Side Air Bags
Connectivity Group
Air Conditioning w/Auto Temp. Control
4.10 Rear Axle Ratio
Remote Start
Black 3-Piece Hard Top
MSRP: $41,185
Your Price: $37,500 plus $490 Dealer Handling Fee, plus Sales Tax
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:59 PM   #678
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Can anyone tell me if there is a difference between Factory Dealer Cost and Invoice?

Had dealer offer $500 below Factory Dealer Cost and am wondering if there is any difference. Had another dealer offer $1038 below invoice on...

2013 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon
Customer Preferred Package 24R
Automatic Transmission
Deep Cherry Red Crystal Pearl Coat
Black Leather Trimmed Bucket Seats
Media Center 730N CD/DVD/MP3/NAV
Heated Front Seats
Supplemental Front Seat Side Air Bags
Connectivity Group
Air Conditioning w/Auto Temp. Control
4.10 Rear Axle Ratio
Remote Start
Black 3-Piece Hard Top
MSRP: $41,185
Your Price: $37,500 plus $490 Dealer Handling Fee, plus Sales Tax
Invoice and FWP(factory wholesale price) are the same. Just out of curiousity is the $490 delaer handling fee like a doc fee? Or is it another fee?
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Old 06-08-2012, 02:59 PM   #679
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Can anyone tell me if there is a difference between Factory Dealer Cost and Invoice?
Some dealers I have worked with seem to use the two terms interchangeably. As someone who does pricing and costing analysis for a living, the practice drives me nuts.
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:05 PM   #680
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Can anyone tell me if there is a difference between Factory Dealer Cost and Invoice?
Dealer cost is NOT the same as the invoice price. They wouldn't be selling vehicles below invoice and remaining in business. Good luck discovering the true dealer cost, it's a mix of holdbacks, incentives, volume and overhead that all impact the true cost of a vehicle to the dealer, but in the end it is typically thousands less than the invoice.
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:10 PM   #681
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I want to thank Milous and Pat for all of the information they have provided in this thread. I was having trouble deciding between a standard color 2012, a freedom edition 2012, or holding out for a 2013. No offense to anyone, but I am not a big fan of any of the 2012 colors. Since Pat and Milous have provided/confirmed the changes to the 2013 including the new colors, I'm going to go for a 2013. (I REALLY like the commando, the billet, and the tru blue.)

I also wanted to share my experience with my local Jeep dealer. Today, I met with my salesman and the store manager. I told them that I would be purchasing a Jeep using the Chrysler Affiliate program. The store manager said "No problem." I told them that I was a Ph.D. student and qualified for the $500 college graduate rebate. The store manager said that as long as that rebate is effective that it is no problem as well. I also told him that I would receive a bonus check for several thousand dollars at the end of July so I would like to order my vehicle sometime in July. Again, no problem. Finally, I told him that I really want a 2013. However, if he had to sell a 2012 at the end of June to meet a quota and if he really wanted to give me a good deal, he was welcome to call me at the end of June and maybe we could work something out.

My current plan is to do nothing until June passes. I want to see if he will offer me an unbelievable deal on a 2012. (I don't expect anything to happen.) I plan to place a deposit and order my 2013 during the first week of July. I will arrange financing with the dealer and with my bank and see which one is better. I will buy the Jeep after July 31 once I receive my bonus money.

Does anyone see a problem with this scenario? I think I will get a good but not great deal following this approach. (I find the haggling process distasteful and I don't want to spend the time necessary to get a great deal.) Also, if I place my 2013 order during the first week in July, when do you think it will actually arrive at the dealer?

Again, thanks to Pat and Milous. Your 2013 info helped me get to this point in my decision making process. Pat, I honestly feel like I should do business with you but I am located 8 hours away in Alabama. If you want to talk to me about it, send me a private message. Otherwise, I will deal with my local dealer.

My last big worry is the Pentastar ticking issue. I've decided to roll the dice and hope Jeep has it resolved for 2013. Also, I drove a 2012 with the Pentastar today. Holy crap! While the Wrangler didn't feel like a sports car, it was a million times better than my 2002 Wrangler X and my 1973 CJ-5.

Ron
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:21 PM   #682
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To reply to my own post, I'm leaning towards the commando color which starts production on September 4th. Am I correct in assuming that I would have to wait 4-6 weeks after this date to receive my Jeep?

Ron
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:48 PM   #683
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Dealer cost is NOT the same as the invoice price. They wouldn't be selling vehicles below invoice and remaining in business. Good luck discovering the true dealer cost, it's a mix of holdbacks, incentives, volume and overhead that all impact the true cost of a vehicle to the dealer, but in the end it is typically thousands less than the invoice.
Correct, but both FWP and invoice are the same number.


True dealer cost is not thousands less than invoice. There is dealer holdback of 3% built into invoice. If a dealer tells you invoice is $30,000, then they have $900 in holdback. Invoice less the 3% is net cost to the dealership. There is no longer any advertising built in.

So here's where it gets a little complicated. Chrysler has a program known as VPA. Basically it's a monthly and quarterly quota program. Basically Chrysler wants to show these huge sales gains and kicks the dealers back X amount per vehicle if they hit the monthly quota. Chrysler also lets the dealer make it up quarterly. AS an example, if Chryhsler gives a dealer a quartlery quota of: frst month 100, second month 80 and third month 100 the total is 280. If the dealer hits that number or higher they get money back. If they fall short one month and then exceed another months target and sell at least 280 new vehicles they still get the money back. Here's the kicker, all new vehicle sales qualify as a unit toward the quota but not every vehicle gets money back. So lets say the dealer sells the 280 new and hits the quarterly objective they get X amount back. Let's say Wranglers don't qualify so out of the 280 the dealer sold 75 wranglers they don't get paid X amount on the wranglers. Using money here, each vehicle gets $650 back if the dealer hits the quota of 280, but Wranglers(75 total sales for the quarter)
205 X $650 = 133,250. That's how the dealer makes up selling under invoice or under net. They hope to hit the quota and get reimbursed. So now lets say the dealer has to advertise at net or below to stay competitve. The dealer sells 280 units and since Wranglers don't qualify the average is $475 back. $133,250/280=475.

Second part to this, if the dealer hits the quota then Chrysler also gives the dealer X amount toward advertising. And Chrysler will co op some of the advertising costs. That helps bring down the advertising costs which is a good thing. What most don't realize is a big dealership will spend a ton on advertising. Print, online, TV, radio, etc. I thinkwe spend an average of 50,000 per month and that does not include targeted direct mail pieces that can cost $5000 or more depending on the quantity.

Don't blame the dealerships, this is all Chryslers fault, it's their program. If we want to be competitive and we want the allocation we have to play their game. Chrysler wants to show the sales gains and to get every dealer onboard this is what they have come up with to do it.
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:55 PM   #684
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Correct, but both FWP and invoice are the same number.


True dealer cost is not thousands less than invoice. There is dealer holdback of 3% built into invoice. If a dealer tells you invoice is $30,000, then they have $900 in holdback. Invoice less the 3% is net cost to the dealership. There is no longer any advertising built in.

So here's where it gets a little complicated. Chrysler has a program known as VPA. Basically it's a monthly and quarterly quota program. Basically Chrysler wants to show these huge sales gains and kicks the dealers back X amount per vehicle if they hit the monthly quota. Chrysler also lets the dealer make it up quarterly. AS an example, if Chryhsler gives a dealer a quartlery quota of: frst month 100, second month 80 and third month 100 the total is 280. If the dealer hits that number or higher they get money back. If they fall short one month and then exceed another months target and sell at least 280 new vehicles they still get the money back. Here's the kicker, all new vehicle sales qualify as a unit toward the quota but not every vehicle gets money back. So lets say the dealer sells the 280 new and hits the quarterly objective they get X amount back. Let's say Wranglers don't qualify so out of the 280 the dealer sold 75 wranglers they don't get paid X amount on the wranglers. Using money here, each vehicle gets $650 back if the dealer hits the quota of 280, but Wranglers(75 total sales for the quarter)
205 X $650 = 133,250. That's how the dealer makes up selling under invoice or under net. They hope to hit the quota and get reimbursed. So now lets say the dealer has to advertise at net or below to stay competitve. The dealer sells 280 units and since Wranglers don't qualify the average is $475 back. $133,250/280=475.

Second part to this, if the dealer hits the quota then Chrysler also gives the dealer X amount toward advertising. And Chrysler will co op some of the advertising costs. That helps bring down the advertising costs which is a good thing. What most don't realize is a big dealership will spend a ton on advertising. Print, online, TV, radio, etc. I thinkwe spend an average of 50,000 per month and that does not include targeted direct mail pieces that can cost $5000 or more depending on the quantity.

Don't blame the dealerships, this is all Chryslers fault, it's their program. If we want to be competitive and we want the allocation we have to play their game. Chrysler wants to show the sales gains and to get every dealer onboard this is what they have come up with to do it.
Thanks for the honestly Pat....
Greatly appreciated.
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:14 PM   #685
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...There is dealer holdback of 3% built into invoice. If a dealer tells you invoice is $30,000, then they have $900 in holdback. Invoice less the 3% is net cost to the dealership. ...
I thought holdback was 3% of (MSRP - destination charge.)

Is that still correct?
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:19 PM   #686
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I thought holdback was 3% of (MSRP - destination charge.)

Is that still correct?
Here's one I built, cpoied and pasted since it was the fastest way for me to do it.


Sales Code Description MSRP(USD) FWP(USD)
Model: JKJL72 WRANGLER SPORT 4X4 22,195 21,622
Package: 24S Customer Preferred Package 24S 2,200 1,958
ERB 3.6L V6 24V VVT Engine 0 0
DGJ 5-Speed Auto W5A580 Transmission 1,125 1,001
Paint/Seat/Trim: PX8 Black Clear Coat 0 0
APA Monotone Paint 0 0
*A7 Cloth Seats w/Adj. Head Restraints 0 0
-X9 Black 0 0
Options: 4EA Sold Vehicle 0 0
Discounts: YGE 5 Additional Gallons of Gas 0 20
Destination Fees: 925 925
HB: 766 Total Price: 26,445 25,526
FFP: 25,271
EP: 24,325


Total invoice with destination is $25,526. Holdback is $766. Take 25,526 X 3% = 765.78

It's pretty much the same using your calculation UHB. 26,445-925=25,520X3%=765.60
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:24 PM   #687
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Pat, thanks for your explanation of the VPA. Two questions:

1. So are dealers even more motivated to move stock that DOES qualify?

2. Is there any reason a dealer would rather sell a new model off the lot than order one? Both sales have the same effect on the quota, right?

Thanks again. I'm new here but I find your posts especially helpful. If all auto salespeople were as straightforward as you are, I think we'd all be better off - including the salespeople!
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:28 PM   #688
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Here's one I built, cpoied and pasted since it was the fastest way for me to do it.
...

Total invoice with destination is $25,526. Holdback is $766. Take 25,526 X 3% = 765.78

It's pretty much the same using your calculation UHB. 26,445-925=25,520X3%=765.60
Interesting.... Your method is a bit easier, and probably the right one, though. So, I'll correct my memory banks, thanks!
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:33 PM   #689
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Interesting.... Your method is a bit easier, and probably the right one, though. So, I'll correct my memory banks, thanks!
Leave your memory alone, both methods work. That's the important thing, plus I really don't want you to try to move stuff around up there just so you can cram in more info!
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:33 PM   #690
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It's always more beneficial for a dealer to move current inventory than order....that's common sense.

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