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Old 07-02-2012, 01:06 PM   #1
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3.6L Problems - valve seat failure

Bought a JK 6 months ago. 11,000 miles check engine lite came on.
I went to the dealer and asked if they could check the code to see if there was anything to worry about. He said he was sure he knew what it was. Multible mis-fire on #6 cylinder.
He said they needed to replace the heads!!!!!!!!!
He said all the early heads had cheap valve seats and they were failing. The new heads have good seats. He said all the 2011 and early 2012 had the bad seats. He said leave it for 3 days and they would replace the heads. I asked if he needed to get the parts first he said no they shipped us a ton of them.
Love the motor, hate the valve seats. Hard to believe.

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Old 07-02-2012, 01:11 PM   #2
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This happens all the time with the "global economy."

A manufacturer can't build and price a competitive vehicle without sourcing parts from all over the globe. When one of the suppliers lets the manufacturer down, they end up looking bad.

Google "Toyota V6 sludge", "BMW fuel pump", etc if you feel the need to learn that just about every manufacturer has been stung by this.

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Old 07-03-2012, 07:29 AM   #3
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It just makes your gut hurt to tear down a brand new engine. I did have the forsite to purchase the extra 5 year warrantee on the motor. It didn't have a track record, and being VVT and new design i didn't want to take a chance.
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Old 07-03-2012, 07:34 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azputz
He said all the early heads had cheap valve seats and they were failing. The new heads have good seats. He said all the 2011 and early 2012 had the bad seats.
Unless he's talking about the gc engines, he doesn't know what he is talking about. Wranglers had a different engine in 2011.
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Old 07-03-2012, 07:42 AM   #5
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Unless he's talking about the gc engines, he doesn't know what he is talking about. Wranglers had a different engine in 2011.
Pretty sure he meant the 2012 Wranglers produced in 2011.
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:28 AM   #6
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3.6 supposidly fixed

I went to pick it up at the dealer and they said they only replaced one head, left side #6. I woulding except it. the paperwork said 40% leak down on exhaust #6 cylinder. I told them i wouldn't except it back with only one head replaced.
I was originally told it was bad valve seats causing the problem. Today is was told that it was a casting flaw that cooled the #6 cylinder and the new head was corrected.
On my way now to compair a new head to the head that was removed to see if there is any difference in the valve seats.
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:31 AM   #7
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unless he's talking about the gc engines, he doesn't know what he is talking about. Wranglers had a different engine in 2011.

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Old 07-18-2012, 09:37 AM   #8
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just consider ur self lucky he will do the work in 3 days. i hope i never face the defected head problem cause i know they're gonna take me for a ride once i do.
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:50 AM   #9
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just consider ur self lucky he will do the work in 3 days. i hope i never face the defected head problem cause i know they're gonna take me for a ride once i do.
+1. I'm almost 3 weeks into this deal and still no new head.
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Old 07-18-2012, 10:04 AM   #10
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+1. I'm almost 3 weeks into this deal and still no new head.
I'd say it's time for a new girlfriend.
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Old 07-18-2012, 01:53 PM   #11
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Old 07-19-2012, 08:00 AM   #12
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Picked it up. Runs good. Now time will tell.
It's going to K & N Monday for the first Intake for the 3.6.
We'll see what the Dyno says.
The dealer said almost all of the head failures were on the West Coast. Leads me to believe it may have been a cooling issue with #6 getting hot enough to burn exhaust valves.
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Old 07-19-2012, 08:06 AM   #13
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Picked it up. Runs good. Now time will tell.
It's going to K & N Monday for the first Intake for the 3.6.
We'll see what the Dyno says.
The dealer said almost all of the head failures were on the West Coast. Leads me to believe it may have been a cooling issue with #6 getting hot enough to burn exhaust valves.
Do yourself a favor and get some independent dyno numbers instead of relying on what K&N tells you. A good dyno operator can make it read anything he wants it to.

The dealer is either clueless, a liar or both. The failures have been all over. Even if it was temp related we would be seeing the failures localized in other parts of the country. Engine temp has very little to do with burning valves. That is an air/fuel problem, not a temp problem.
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Old 07-19-2012, 08:17 AM   #14
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The failures have been all over. Even if it was temp related we would be seeing the failures localized in other parts of the country. Engine temp has very little to do with burning valves. That is an air/fuel problem, not a temp problem.
CA emissions requirements???
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Old 07-19-2012, 08:27 AM   #15
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Good Lord some of these dealers are total hucksters or clueless about what's going on with their own damn vehicles. Scary.
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Old 07-19-2012, 08:34 AM   #16
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CA emissions requirements???
What about them? They have nothing to do with the mechanical components of the engine and there are enough other states that have adopted the same requirements that it would still be widespread if this was the source of the problem.
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Old 07-19-2012, 09:37 AM   #17
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Why in the world would you put on a K&N. It is considered the worst intake for a Jeep, unless you don;t mind sucking in more dirt. Worst investment you could do to your Jeep
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Old 07-19-2012, 09:50 AM   #18
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Why in the world would you put on a K&N. It is considered the worst intake for a Jeep, unless you don;t mind sucking in more dirt. Worst investment you could do to your Jeep
wow..you are missinformed...do some research.
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Old 07-19-2012, 09:57 AM   #19
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wow..you are missinformed...do some research.


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Old 07-19-2012, 10:23 AM   #20
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wow..you are missinformed...do some research.

Unfortunately, I have done my research. Just check out threads in this forum. And yes K&N is the worst by far. Not that any aftermarket intake does much on the JK system because the computer compensates the fuel air ratio. And without a tuner the system will adjust for any new air flow. A K&N will allow as much as 6 to 12 times the amount of dirt particles to escape through compared to the stock filter depending on if you go to a dry filter or the oiled filter. No one has broke the 2012 ECU code to have a tuner for the 2012 by the way. These systems provided extra power in older systems but with the new computer systems they do very little and can cause more harm then good.

I do know what I am talking about but the manufactures are great at marketing and convincing people to buy these systems at outrageous prices. ANd they are good at it. If your going to get one, at least get a Airaid instead of a K&N. Not that they will do much either but they have some claims of success on a JK. Of course they are the ones claiming it.
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Old 07-19-2012, 10:51 AM   #21
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We can actually use the AFe intake as an example. There was a video posted a while back of them adding a AFe CAI with a Cat back system and a Superchip tuner. This was a 3,8 so a tuner is available. They ran a before and after video. They take a hot Jeep that was just pulled in and hook it to a Dyno and run three runs but only showed one run so we never seen what the other runs looked like. Then they added the new mods, I assume letting the Jeep cool down. While the intake sit in the same hot location as the stock box, they ran three passes of the with the intake/exhaust/tuner and they get 10hp gains and that is with the hood up getting cold air. Of course they didn't mention it was only like 2 to 3 hp in drivable rpm range and also they mislead in the video showing the torque line and say look at the hp jump here. Not to mention the third run stayed exacly on the stock line but they just deleted it and went on with the video.

They made the 10hp sound great but that was at 5000 rpms. No where near that at lower rpms and also Superchips claim they give as much as 10 hp at max rpm's alone. Not to mention what the exhaust may have done with the equation. But even still the data that they used was even shaky at best and misleading in parts. It is so easy to manipulate a Dyno result.
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Old 07-19-2012, 11:31 AM   #22
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We can actually use the AFe intake as an example. There was a video posted a while back of them adding a AFe CAI with a Cat back system and a Superchip tuner. This was a 3,8 so a tuner is available. They ran a before and after video. They take a hot Jeep that was just pulled in and hook it to a Dyno and run three runs but only showed one run so we never seen what the other runs looked like. Then they added the new mods, I assume letting the Jeep cool down. While the intake sit in the same hot location as the stock box, they ran three passes of the with the intake/exhaust/tuner and they get 10hp gains and that is with the hood up getting cold air. Of course they didn't mention it was only like 2 to 3 hp in drivable rpm range and also they mislead in the video showing the torque line and say look at the hp jump here. Not to mention the third run stayed exacly on the stock line but they just deleted it and went on with the video.

They made the 10hp sound great but that was at 5000 rpms. No where near that at lower rpms and also Superchips claim they give as much as 10 hp at max rpm's alone. Not to mention what the exhaust may have done with the equation. But even still the data that they used was even shaky at best and misleading in parts. It is so easy to manipulate a Dyno result.
Point taken...K&N has been known to make tremendous improvements on alot of vehicles.If he does put it on a dyno..it might be interesting to see the results.I don't think I would do that after a dealership just installed new heads..kind of scarey!
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Old 07-20-2012, 07:38 AM   #23
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As far as the K&N goes I have a friend that works there. When a new moter comes out the use it to mock up the production part and a rental car and the intake is FREE. K&N also produces Mopar exhaust. They installed a new exhaust on my JK for FREE also. I'm looking for gas milage not proformance. The new motor hauls ass, has plenty of power. Due to the fact all this hasn't cost me a dime I can't bitch.
They are going to install and dyno next week. We'll see. This will be the first intake for a 3.6 then they are forsale.
As far as the dealers knowing what there taking about I aggree. You always want facts and they always tell you what they think you want to hear. Remember the Service guys hang out with the Salesmen. It rubs off.
Just before the head failure I went for a run in Arizona all day. It was 112. I let the thing run all day to keep it cool inside for the grandaughter. Sometimes letting it sit idle for 30 min to an hour. If something was going to get hot this was the time.

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