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Old 04-17-2013, 09:40 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Brasco20 View Post
Why doesn't jeep offer a wrangler with a hemi from the factory?
Cost would be a major factor.

Because of the antiquated, expensive, and relatively heavy duty axle and frame design, wranglers are already expensive in terms of what you get (interior and creature comfort wise) for the money. An optioned up rubicon has already crept past the $40k mark and is nowhere near as comfortable or feature laden as similarly priced SUVs.

A hemi would probably add another $10k to any wrangler. Even a base sport would be pushing $30k or more, and rubis could be past $50k. That's moving into BMW SUV territory.

Also as noted above, wranglers (especially 2 doors) are terrible choices for high power engines from a manufacturer standpoint. They're not a tow vehicle or work truck, so there's really no need for anything other than a sturdy 6 cylinder, and in any event they have a high center of gravity, removable top and doors, poor road handling, short wheelbase (2 door), are routinely lifted aftermarket, and already get terrible gas mileage on account of the aerodynamics.

You could maybe justify putting a V8 in a 4 door from the factory on account of the wheelbase, but the wrangler purists would revolt if that option was 4 door only. And having various engines available to put into the same vehicle is probably not a cost Chrysler wants to carry for no real reason.

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Old 04-17-2013, 02:36 PM   #32
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Having said all that ^, I'll bet Jeep would sell every Hemi powered Jeep they made, even with a $10,000 premium.

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Old 04-17-2013, 02:47 PM   #33
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Its a horrible vehicle for 400+ horsepower... Short wheelbase, high center of gravity and mushy suspension. .
Have you driven one? I did a lot of research before deciding to have AEV put a 6.4 Hemi in my new JK (several years worth of research).

I drove a Burnsville 5.7 Hemi JKU. The power was "ok", but that JKU had 40" tires and a big tall wallowy lift. Handling was poor, but it wasn't because of the 5.7 Hemi. I just wasn't all that impressed with the power of the 5.7 in that Jeep.

I drove a Motech 5.3 Vortec JKU. It felt a lot like my 2012 3.6 JK. Not a surprise considering the 3.6 makes 285 hp, and the 5.3 makes 300 hp. The 5.3 made more torque, but was certainly not worth the $15K it cost to do the swap.

I drove a Motech 6.2 Vortec JKU. It felt better than the 5.3 Vortec, but still just wasn't all that impressive. That particular 6.2 made about 370 hp.

I drove a Burnsville 6.4 Hemi JK. It was a 2-door with a 3" lift and 35" tires. The handling was actually great, as good as any 2-door JK I've driven. The power was incredible, but still managable. From a dead stop, if you really laid into it, the rear end would squat, the front end would lift until you were sure the front tires were off the ground, and it would launch HARD, keeping you pinned right to the back of the seat. By the time you could look down at the speedometer you were already going 60 mph (a few seconds). That Jeep was awesome in every way. The power was increadible, but it did not make the Jeep undrivable. That Jeep was what made me decide on the 6.4.
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Old 04-17-2013, 02:54 PM   #34
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Having said all that ^, I'll bet Jeep would sell every Hemi powered Jeep they made, even with a $10,000 premium.
I dunno man . . . maybe if they just made a few. Maybe 10% or less of the production line.

Just think about it. We here are the MINORITY. Most folks that buy Wranglers are going to be perfectly happy with the mpg ratings, power ratings, and lower price tag offered by a 3.6 powered Jeep. Big powered V8s--especially those that aren't work trucks--don't exactly fly off the shelves anymore.

No doubt they'd sell some, but the vast majority of folks interested in them would be those who are looking toward big mods . . . the type of people that frequent forums like this one. Most new wranglers just go to suburbanites looking for a slightly "edgy" SUV.
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Old 04-17-2013, 03:07 PM   #35
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Have you driven one? I did a lot of research before deciding to have AEV put a 6.4 Hemi in my new JK (several years worth of research).

I drove a Burnsville 5.7 Hemi JKU. The power was "ok", but that JKU had 40" tires and a big tall wallowy lift. Handling was poor, but it wasn't because of the 5.7 Hemi. I just wasn't all that impressed with the power of the 5.7 in that Jeep.

I drove a Motech 5.3 Vortec JKU. It felt a lot like my 2012 3.6 JK. Not a surprise considering the 3.6 makes 285 hp, and the 5.3 makes 300 hp. The 5.3 made more torque, but was certainly not worth the $15K it cost to do the swap.

I drove a Motech 6.2 Vortec JKU. It felt better than the 5.3 Vortec, but still just wasn't all that impressive. That particular 6.2 made about 370 hp.

I drove a Burnsville 6.4 Hemi JK. It was a 2-door with a 3" lift and 35" tires. The handling was actually great, as good as any 2-door JK I've driven. The power was incredible, but still managable. From a dead stop, if you really laid into it, the rear end would squat, the front end would lift until you were sure the front tires were off the ground, and it would launch HARD, keeping you pinned right to the back of the seat. By the time you could look down at the speedometer you were already going 60 mph (a few seconds). That Jeep was awesome in every way. The power was increadible, but it did not make the Jeep undrivable. That Jeep was what made me decide on the 6.4.
Nope... The only scenario that even appeals to me is the last one, and if I wanted to that, I'd get a Camaro SS or something that could do it 10 times better for 10k less. That is just not the appeal of a Jeep for me.
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Old 04-17-2013, 03:12 PM   #36
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I looked at a picture of the BOR Hemi upgrade and from what I saw the the right bank exhaust was run directly under the transmission pan. Maybe they all do or the pic was old but to me, it would seem the heat from the exhaust pipe would certainly raise the temp of the tranny fluid quite a bit, plus reduce ground clearance at that point.

Just a thought.
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Old 04-17-2013, 05:08 PM   #37
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Having said all that ^, I'll bet Jeep would sell every Hemi powered Jeep they made, even with a $10,000 premium.

I agree with you on the V8. I would have ponied up for it. One day I hope to put one in our 2012. These V6 engines up here in the altitude just don't have it! Once you start lifting, tires etc. then you have to regear the crap out of these little engines to restore the lost power. I've been researching it all I can too. I really like the LS conversion too and was surprised the 6.2 liter didn't impress you as much as the 6.4 Hemi. That LS sure fits in there nicely. My hats off to you for getting what you want.
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:32 AM   #38
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my friend has one on his jku with 40s and 5.38 ( I think, might be 5.13s) But he was getting 14 mpg when I last talked to him. I believe he had the work done by cop4x4.
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Old 04-18-2013, 10:48 AM   #39
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supercharged hemi is where it's really at


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Old 04-18-2013, 04:08 PM   #40
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That supercharged 6.1 really scoots.
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Old 04-19-2013, 09:49 AM   #41
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Why doesn't jeep offer a wrangler with a hemi from the factory?
I've heard a few reasons. The main reasons are because of overheating and safety.

The Jeep's front grill is not large enough to provide enough airflow for a V8. It can be made to work, but under certain conditions like towing at higher elevations or driving up long steep grades, the Hemi could overheat. The overheating will probably only impact about 2-3 percent of JK Hemi owners.

The Wrangler was also not designed for the weight and torque of the Hemi. Mopar likes to put them in their prototype vehicles because it makes good press, but the Jeep hasn't been put through the Federal crash safety tests with the Hemi because it won't pass.

Chrysler also is having issues with the Federal CAFE standards. As more and more people buy Jeeps, the average fuel mileage across Chrysler's fleet sales drops. When it gets to a low enough point, Chrysler will have to pay a fine to the Federal Government for not making fuel efficent cars. They need to improve their overall fleet fuel mileage across all of their vehicle sales and putting a Hemi in a JK will not help increase their average fuel mileage across the board.
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Old 05-06-2013, 07:55 PM   #42
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U can get hemi as v-6 engine there are few aroundin some cars at dodge but i know 5.7 hemi is v-8 plm it too long if u wanna have some room around it get a v6 in it. It up to u u can mod it to extra hp out of it!!!
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Old 05-06-2013, 08:07 PM   #43
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I think the 6.4 Hemi would be the way to go, if you had to do it. The more I think about it, the worse it sounds though. Rather than being more reliable and durable, I think the overall vehicle reliability would sink.
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Old 05-06-2013, 09:12 PM   #44
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Having said all that ^, I'll bet Jeep would sell every Hemi powered Jeep they made, even with a $10,000 premium.
I would have bought one.
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Old 05-06-2013, 09:15 PM   #45
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If it were done by Chrysler- possibly me too. Not if done by BOR or anyone else.
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Old 05-06-2013, 09:23 PM   #46
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If it were done by Chrysler- possibly me too. Not if done by BOR or anyone else.
I hear you, I want the warranty. I would prefer a decent diesel though.
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Old 05-07-2013, 02:59 PM   #47
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I'm with Sgt93 -

If you want me to pay a premium for a better engine in my Wrangler it's diesel or nothing. Why on earth would I want to cope with the cost and weight of a large Hemi V-8 when a smaller displacement diesel will stomp that gas engine in any performance category that matters to me.
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Old 05-07-2013, 03:09 PM   #48
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I'd agree, if that diesel engine was trouble-free and not a nightmare to maintain. Then again, I am not sure how reliable Hemis are. I don't buy Chrysler vehicles (except this Jeep...my first) so I have no personal experience. However, several buddies do and their non-Wrangler Jeeps are in the shop quite often. Not sure why they end up in the shop, but I'll start asking.
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Old 05-07-2013, 06:11 PM   #49
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U can get hemi as v-6 engine there are few aroundin some cars at dodge but i know 5.7 hemi is v-8 plm it too long if u wanna have some room around it get a v6 in it. It up to u u can mod it to extra hp out of it!!!
There are plenty of hemi engines. Toyota has had hemi engines in various displacements for years, even 4 cylinders. They never made a big deal out of it. Its not just the hemispherical combustion chamber that makes it powerful, you need the displacement too. Dodge just grabbed onto the hemi name and used it as a marketing tool.

I'm with the other guys saying a Diesel is the superior option for a Jeep. They make as much torque as the 5.7 with half the displacement, half the RPM. Perfect for offroad. The better MPG is a nice perk.

The only downside is cost... The Diesel in the new Grand Cherokee ends up being about a $4500 option. The hurts compared to the Pentastar price, but still sounds like a bargain compared to the cost and aggravation of a V8 swap. Hope they do it in the next couple years!
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Old 05-07-2013, 08:47 PM   #50
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Diesel ?? Sorry!!! Not for me !!!!
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Old 05-07-2013, 08:52 PM   #51
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Or u can go to engine company called (( golen engine )) they have long block I-6 with 350 hp in it price go for $4,999 for it .
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Old 05-08-2013, 12:27 PM   #52
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I have the 5.7L in my '08 Unlimited Rubicon. Cost me over $20K, but I had the work done by Screamin' Lizard Customs in Bedford. It's a crate motor with a 54RFE trans, and I couldn't be more pleased with how it runs. I didn't want to go with a bigger motor. Don't need it. The 5.7 has plenty of power on and off road. It drives just like the Jeep should. The 3.8 was a slug after I put 35s on it (even with 4.88s), and front/rear AEV bumpers, skidplates, etc. It was OK in 4-Lo on the trail, but on the road, it was downright dangerous. Now, it's a true pleasure to drive. Mileage? Horrible, but about what I got with the 3.8 after lifting it and adding all that weight - 11-13 mpg. Economically advantageous? No way. But, it's so dang much fun to drive with that V-8 rumbling under me, it was worth every penny. I've had it over a year now, and the dealer has covered warranty issues not directly related to the motor/trans. If you've got the opportunity to do such a swap, I'd say you'll not regret it. I haven't.
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Old 05-08-2013, 03:47 PM   #53
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penstar motor crap

I don't know if any of you are having the problems I am, but two head replacements later, I think Jeep wranglers have a major problem in the "new" penstar motor! So I think they would opt to switch out the motor for you. In my case, when the head goes out a third time, I get to claim lemon law, I just hope they don't try to replace it with another Penstar motor. just saying


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Really ? ? ? Chrysler is going to warranty pulling the 3.6 out of a brand new (and i assume it'll be brand new since your talking about warranty) Wrangler..and putting in a "Crate" 5.7 HEMI ? ? I 'd be shocked if this is true. I'm not trying to doubt you but really... why? Why would Chrysler warranty this?
At best i could see them giving a warranty on the motor, if it's a "crate" but i can't see them backing an axle if you waste it, or your tranny if it goes south.
And you also said "I'd rather have the motor installed by the factory".. are you saying you are working on a plan to have this thing roll off the line with the HEMI in it? You must be one HELL of a salesman to have that kinda pull with Chrysler.....
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Old 05-08-2013, 03:58 PM   #54
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Well, the motor is not exactly one to go into the history books but if new heads are also frying, I am pretty perplexed by Chrysler's inability (or unwillingness?) to fix this issue once and for all. Maybe they should just use someone else's motor.
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Old 05-08-2013, 04:52 PM   #55
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For a DD the Diesel would be superior.More torque to get you moving and better fuel economy.For a trail rig not so much. Deep mud and rocks require quick rpms to get up on top or over.A Hemi will turn the tires quicker and faster with a wider rpm range not needing a gear change.Where a Diesel is slower to come up on rpms and limited max rpms needing a gear change loosing momentum.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:02 PM   #56
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From what I have gathered, the actual sole reason they don't offer it from the factory is safety regulations i.e. crash testing. These things barely fit inside the engine bay in fact previous install kits required hammering in the firewall to make them fit. I don't know the intricacies of the regulations whether you need to have x inches clearance around an engine in a vehicle in order to get certified, but crow-barring in a massive engine into a tiny engine bay and not being "approved" makes sense to me.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:03 PM   #57
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Because what a Jeep does has never been about horsepower, its about gearing. The Pentastar already has more power than anything they've ever offered in the CJ/YJ/TJ/Wrangler platform.

Its a horrible vehicle for 400+ horsepower... Short wheelbase, high center of gravity and mushy suspension. The fact the OP is trying to have a swap like this "make sense" tells me he's doing it for all the wrong reasons. The Hemi swap is something you do for the pure crazyness of it.

I'm sure AEV does it right, but the V8 brings other potential issues... My buddies Chevy 350 YJ overheats on the really slow trails, even with a 4 core radiator and electric fan.
Well said but one slight error, it's not gearing, it's torque. Gearing is only used to allow the engine to operate in it's (supposedly) peak torque range. but you have the right idea. For decades buick engines were the best choice due to the lower speed peak torque output, then GM developed the "corporate engine philosophy" and the buick 350 died off. what you really want is a low cylinder count high displacement engine, with a long stroke and large bore... Gee that almost sounds like a built 258 or a bored and stroked 4.0... well thanks to emissions regs in many states the 258 is almost out of the question. bringing you back to the 4.0... Also once you go beyond the weight of a 6 you start running into additional issues that pop up, that are not so simple to deal with. EVERY vehicle is a balance of it's components. you change that balance, in this instance the actual weight, you start running into other handling issues which include trailability. In short there is a reason thoroughbreds are not used as draft horses...
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:10 PM   #58
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For a DD the Diesel would be superior.More torque to get you moving and better fuel economy.For a trail rig not so much. Deep mud and rocks require quick rpms to get up on top or over.A Hemi will turn the tires quicker and faster with a wider rpm range not needing a gear change.Where a Diesel is slower to come up on rpms and limited max rpms needing a gear change loosing momentum.
Not true. this is a been there done that... the speed of high horse engines is a major detriment. Spinning tires do NOT offer traction they lose it, Tires are not propellers on a boat. Torque and ONLY torque is what moves a vehicle through rocks and mud. mud requires the right size tires and clearance and again torque to turn them. Start spinning tires on rocks and you start sliding. Low speed torque in both instances.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:15 PM   #59
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Talking

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Originally Posted by utjdh04 View Post
I have the 5.7L in my '08 Unlimited Rubicon. Cost me over $20K, but I had the work done by Screamin' Lizard Customs in Bedford. It's a crate motor with a 54RFE trans, and I couldn't be more pleased with how it runs. I didn't want to go with a bigger motor. Don't need it. The 5.7 has plenty of power on and off road. It drives just like the Jeep should. The 3.8 was a slug after I put 35s on it (even with 4.88s), and front/rear AEV bumpers, skidplates, etc. It was OK in 4-Lo on the trail, but on the road, it was downright dangerous. Now, it's a true pleasure to drive. Mileage? Horrible, but about what I got with the 3.8 after lifting it and adding all that weight - 11-13 mpg. Economically advantageous? No way. But, it's so dang much fun to drive with that V-8 rumbling under me, it was worth every penny. I've had it over a year now, and the dealer has covered warranty issues not directly related to the motor/trans. If you've got the opportunity to do such a swap, I'd say you'll not regret it. I haven't.
WHAT warranty issues are left after you eliminate the drive line? burned out glove box light?
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Old 05-09-2013, 03:32 PM   #60
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I usually laugh at customers who ask about hemis and tell them you get either the wrangler OR the hemi. For what and how the wrangler is designed, a hemi just doesn't make sense. You wanna go that big buy a truck or build a buggy; a wrangler isn't for you. The wrangler has evolved into the JK for a reason and as soon as they try and start building them with hemi chrysler will get more crap about selling out over lost wheeling performance to satisfy the "popular" market like the 2 wd wranglers in 07 and the 3.8.

Message to the original poster: love what's on your lot. Don't discount factory performance or you'll never make it in the industry. Buy a wrangler and leave it stock. Find a local group and learn how to wheel and you'll be surprised at what a stock wrangler can do.

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