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Old 10-24-2011, 05:01 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by El Gringo View Post
I'm fairly certain that you can, if you are going down a hill. I did it in my bronco and in my ranger. Both were FI, both had left lights on. Both started up after about 1 second.
If you only had the left light, why didn`t you fix the right one ??

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Old 10-24-2011, 05:51 PM   #32
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Nothing better than working up through the gears and hitting the sweet spot just right for each gear. Getting the right output at just the right times. And it keeps me off the phone.

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Old 10-24-2011, 06:01 PM   #33
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Heh Heh, "Nothing Better" ??


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Nothing better than working up through the gears and hitting the sweet spot just right for each gear. Getting the right output at just the right times. And it keeps me off the phone.
Every days a challenge !

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Old 10-24-2011, 06:31 PM   #34
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It takes a whole lot less power to run those things than it does to crank the engine and once it's running the alternator will hopefully be producing the power to keep them going. A battery that doesn't have enough juice to crank the engine can keep the engine running for hours once it's started.
Although somewhat true, a battery that is that far gone will not have the steady current to have the vehicle "run for hours" with any dependability or quality. Modern electronics require very steady current thus the reason for the huge batteries modern vehicle have.
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Old 10-24-2011, 07:03 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by nvkid
If you only had the left light, why didn`t you fix the right one ??
What are you talking about crazy man?
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Old 10-24-2011, 07:10 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by el gringo

what are you talking about crazy man?
x2
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Old 10-24-2011, 07:39 PM   #37
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Have liked manuals due to increased control going down mountains without riding brakes.
How well does the Hill Descent Control work compared to the control of a manual?

Your first question has an argument I hear for manuals all the time yet it makes no sense to me. First and foremost, brakes do a better job of stopping a vehicle and controlling speed than a transmission (auto or manual). That is what they are designed for where as a transmission is designed to help get the vehicle moving.

I would much rather put the wear and tear on my inexpensive to repair brakes (relatively speaking) than my more expensive to repair transmission.

Also you have a greater degree of control in using brakes .vs transmission to slow a vehicle. Braking pressure is much more variable using your foot where as the RPM is going to be where its at based on speed and current gear and that's it. You can control it somewhat using the clutch, but now you are putting more work on a another set of parts not designed to stop a vehicle.

Let's be honest, engine breaking has but one real scenario that necessitates its use and that is while hauling heavy loads down extended steep inclines for the sole purpose of preventing brake fade/failure due to over heating.

That is not to say that there are no practical scenarios to engine brake, I just find that in those cases I prefer to put the stress on the less expensive and easier to repair parts.
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Old 10-24-2011, 07:46 PM   #38
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what are you talking about crazy man?
x3
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Old 10-24-2011, 07:47 PM   #39
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If you only had the left light, why didn`t you fix the right one ??
Those guys didn't get it, but I sure did. Congratulations on noticing. HPH
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Old 10-24-2011, 07:50 PM   #40
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The rare time that my engine braking comes into play, is in 4lo going down a steep hill--

With my auto, I rarely have to touch the brakes in that situation !!

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Old 10-24-2011, 07:51 PM   #41
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Your first question has an argument I hear for manuals all the time yet it makes no sense to me. First and foremost, brakes do a better job of stopping a vehicle and controlling speed than a transmission (auto or manual). That is what they are designed for where as a transmission is designed to help get the vehicle moving...
Bzzzzzt!!! Wrong!

You must live in a flat place. Those of us who have lived in really hilly places have smelled the smoking brakes of people in front of us -- brakes that eventually burn out and are useless -- on long downgrades.

Save your brakes. Use the gears.

But, of course, it's not necessary to have a manual transmission to do this. Indeed, many modern automatics shift down (automatically) to try to match whatever speed you're trying to maintain using the brakes.

I don't know, though, if the new 5AT in the 2012 JKs does this. HPH
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Old 10-24-2011, 08:42 PM   #42
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Those guys didn't get it, but I sure did. Congratulations on noticing. HPH
I got it as well...
I laughed and wondered if anyone would catch it....
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Old 10-24-2011, 08:44 PM   #43
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Bzzzzzt!!! Wrong!

You must live in a flat place. Those of us who have lived in really hilly places have smelled the smoking brakes of people in front of us -- brakes that eventually burn out and are useless -- on long downgrades.

Save your brakes. Use the gears.

But, of course, it's not necessary to have a manual transmission to do this. Indeed, many modern automatics shift down (automatically) to try to match whatever speed you're trying to maintain using the brakes.

I don't know, though, if the new 5AT in the 2012 JKs does this. HPH
There is an autostick feature on the 2012....so hills should be breeze. Going up, you could limit the top gear to 2nd or 3rd (or whatever). Going down...simply downshift to again limit the top gear.
This is all in theory mind you... I'm assuming that how it should work.
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Old 10-24-2011, 08:46 PM   #44
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And they call "me" crazy.
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Old 10-25-2011, 01:21 AM   #45
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And they call "me" crazy.
That's what "we" said.

Plus I'll probably have to go on worker's comp now because of an injury I just suffered at work, so no manuals for me. I know paramedic's backs don't last long, but I figured it would happen much later in my career.
Guess I shouldn't have tried to lift a patient that weighs 624 lbs having a stroke with only one other person helping. I deal with crazy people almost every three days, so I recognize "crazy talk" when I see it.
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Old 10-25-2011, 01:22 AM   #46
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There is an autostick feature on the 2012....so hills should be breeze. Going up, you could limit the top gear to 2nd or 3rd (or whatever). Going down...simply downshift to again limit the top gear.
This is all in theory mind you... I'm assuming that how it should work.
In my 2010 I can put it in O/D off or 2 or 1. So it's not just the 11's+. it doesnt lock it to a gear but it does limit your max gear.
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Old 10-25-2011, 03:31 AM   #47
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HA!. Auto. While I love stick shifts I decided I'd rather have the right hand free to fondle the girl in the passenger seat....
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Old 10-25-2011, 03:45 AM   #48
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HA!. Auto. While I love stick shifts I decided I'd rather have the right hand free to fondle the girl in the passenger seat....
This.

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Old 10-25-2011, 11:44 AM   #49
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That's what "we" said.

Plus I'll probably have to go on worker's comp now because of an injury I just suffered at work, so no manuals for me. I know paramedic's backs don't last long, but I figured it would happen much later in my career.
Guess I shouldn't have tried to lift a patient that weighs 624 lbs having a stroke with only one other person helping. I deal with crazy people almost every three days, so I recognize "crazy talk" when I see it.
Did they give you a "brownie button" ? Are you over weight ?
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Old 10-25-2011, 11:52 AM   #50
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manual is more fun to drive in my opinion. Only advantage of auto for me would be ease of crawling and I could text and drive while eating a cheeseburger and tuning the radio.
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Old 10-25-2011, 09:01 PM   #51
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manual is more fun to drive in my opinion. Only advantage of auto for me would be ease of crawling
For the standard/manual in 1st gear and 4 LO the manual is literally effortless while crawling. Feet flat on the floor or slight throttle pressure going up and feet flat letting the engine and gearing do the braking going down. Will crawl much slower downhill than the auto - no need to ride the brakes [not sure how it compares to the 2012s with Hill Decent Control].
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Old 10-25-2011, 10:05 PM   #52
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Have not done serious off-roading with an auto.
How do the current autos excel off road?
Do not understand.
Autos ARE better than manuals in low speed, higher traction, offroad situations (like rockcrawling) without question. Take the same driver, two identical trucks except for transmission, a technical rock-crawling course, and the auto will run the trail smoother every time ... and sometimes, even more succesfully.

The slippage in the torque converter 'ACTS' to double your crawl ratio (to preemtively clarify - no, it DOES NOT actually double - it only acts like it doubles). It allows you far more control over a same-equipped manual. An auto also mitigates some of the shock loads on the drivetrain ...less stress on the drivetrain means smaller likelihood of something in the drivetrain breaking.

In nearly 20 years of driving off-road, having driven literally hundreds of days off-road on all types of trails in all kinds of vehicles, leading trail runs and getting instruction from a couple of professionals, there are only 2 situations where I've seen a manual out perform an automatic:

1. on steep, slick, muddy downhills where compression braking in the right gear (with lockers off) is the only thing that's going to get you down without the rear end sliding around on you .... and the last thing you want to do is touch the brake. (With an auto, the torque converter allows for slippage going down -effectively negating the engine compression braking and creating a situation where the vehicle descends faster than desired.)

...and ...

2. When running long tracks of slick mud and you need to start in 2nd or 3rd gear (think 'winter mode' in your sedan with traction control).

I can't speak for any JK older than a 2012. But, in the 2012s, Jeep appears to have addressed #2 above ... A least in low range. Before wheeling this past Friday, I thought using the 'shift stick' would only max out what gear the the auto would shift up to. In low range that is not the case. I spent half the day in low range alternating between 3rd and 4th gear. Whenever I came to stop and then started again, the transmission stayed in whatever gear I had selected ... It did not downshift unless I did it manually or unless I took it out of manual mode.

That's contrary to what I thought and to what someone wrote earlier about earlier years.

T
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Old 10-25-2011, 10:20 PM   #53
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You say you can't speak for any JK OLDER than a 2012 !!!!!

Thats fairly evident-I go down STEEP ledges/hills in my '08 JKUR (regeared), in 4lo, with my automatic tranny and don't have to touch the brakes at all-

In the NX241 OR Rock-Trac transfer case, in 4lo the torque converter is 95% locked all the time-and the crawl ratio in 1st gear/4lo is 61/1-

Just thought you might wanna know-

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Old 10-25-2011, 10:30 PM   #54
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You say you can't speak for any JK OLDER than a 2012 !!!!!

Thats fairly evident-I go down STEEP ledges/hills in my '08 JKUR (regeared), in 4lo, with my automatic tranny and don't have to touch the brakes at all-

In the NX241 OR Rock-Trac transfer case, in 4lo the torque converter is 95% locked all the time-and the crawl ratio in 1st gear/4lo is 61/1-

Just thought you might wanna know-

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Caught me ... JK newbie with a 2012.

Good to know on the specs ... Being as though I've been primarly a Land Rover guy for those two decades. I've seen a handful of scary situations with some older auto rigs on steep muddy downhills ... And especially those that felt the need to keep their rear locker engaged.

Good to have you JK vets around to fill in the tech specs for us JK newbies.

T
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Old 10-25-2011, 10:38 PM   #55
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Yeah, I've had some Dodge A727 autos in 4lo and going downhill was always a praying incident, but


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Good to know ... Being as though I've been primarly a Land Rover guy for those two decades. I've seen a handful of scary situations with some older auto rigs on steep muddy downhills ... And especially those that felt the need to keep their rear locker engaged.

Good to have you Jeep vets around to fill in the tech specs.

T
This Rubi xfer case and a set of (5.38) gears, makes hills a real cakewalk , with my poor old 42rle auto !!

I really can appreciate that new (2012) 5spd auto, must be a real "HOOT"-

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Old 10-25-2011, 11:05 PM   #56
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Did they give you a "brownie button" ? Are you over weight ?
Not as much as you
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Old 10-25-2011, 11:25 PM   #57
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You must be very dirty, you spend alot of time in bath.

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