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Old 02-25-2012, 02:24 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ESP

There are fixed one's for your height that would work just as well.

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Old 02-25-2012, 02:32 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ESP View Post
There are fixed one's for your height that would work just as well.
I read that earlier I almost thought it got bumped down until I read the quote.


I guess I want the ability to adjust, wouldn't be THAT much more expensive would it?

Sorry for the thread jack gluestick:

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Old 02-25-2012, 02:36 PM   #63
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Post away.... All comes down to "caster"
correction.... Right?

Plus.... He's my boy
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Old 02-25-2012, 02:47 PM   #64
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Even though Teraflex provides FIXED GOOD LCAs, they're unchangeable and many times you may want/have to change your front axle CASTER-especially if you change your lift--AGAIN !

Any LCAs with Johnny Joints/Spherical joints, will require greasing at least when you change engine oil (reminder)--no biggee-

The spherical, or HEIM (open) type allow much more axle articulation (twisting) with out compromising the socket/bushing type and that wear, along with the trackbar can cause Death Wobble !!

Curry/Synergy Rusty's makes LCAs for $250 to $500 bucks--

Can'tbeatem

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Old 02-25-2012, 02:55 PM   #65
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"especially if you change your lift--AGAIN !"

This ^^
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Old 02-25-2012, 03:09 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjeeper10 View Post
"especially if you change your lift--AGAIN !"

This ^^
Undoubtably will at some point... to a better one
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Old 02-25-2012, 03:11 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post

Curry/Synergy Rusty's makes LCAs for $250 to $500 bucks--


JIMBO


Got a favorite amongst those? I was looking at Full Traction, Synergy, and Teraflex; but someone a while ago mentioned Rusty's.
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Old 02-25-2012, 03:20 PM   #68
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I'd have to recommend Currys, they've got the biggest following-


Quote:
Originally Posted by chris.george View Post
Got a favorite amongst those? I was looking at Full Traction, Synergy, and Teraflex; but someone a while ago mentioned Rusty's.
I use Rusty's and they are pretty HD-less tha $300 bucks, but you have to be careful with the preload ring and locking screw (Locktite)-but

You can twist your front axle till it takes on chinese appearance and the LCA stays unchanged-pretty good -

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Old 02-25-2012, 03:34 PM   #69
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Old 02-25-2012, 03:48 PM   #70
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yea, thats looks close, but

It's almost impossible to measure, using a tape, without knowing that both LCA ends are PERFECTLY PARALLEL--

Otherwise your eye can fudge 1/4" easy-

If Teraflex says they are 23"--probably aughta believeem--

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Old 02-25-2012, 03:56 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gluestick View Post
If you google these brackets, you can read countless lowbrow arguments on other forums between nay sayers who have never tried them making deductions as well as very seasoned rock crawlers who say they are bullet proof and have had no problems. That is not the purpose of this thread, as it has all been done before, and nothing positive came of it. In the mean time, there are many here who take offense to the mall crawler connotation .
Gawd damn this thread exploded quick. I have no doubt they work to correct castor but are not as good as adj. control arms. They do as advertised. I am also weary of anything that hangs down as much as these do. I don't think my arguments are low brow, they are legitimate concerns for me and I'm sure others. The point of a forum is to give opinions and that's what I do and perhaps another hadn't thought of.

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Old 02-25-2012, 04:07 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel_M

Gawd damn this thread exploded quick. I have no doubt they work to correct castor but are not as good as adj. control arms. They do as advertised. I am also weary of anything that hangs down as much as these do. I don't think my arguments are low brow, they are legitimate concerns for me and I'm sure others. The point of a forum is to give opinions and that's what I do and perhaps another hadn't thought of.

-Dan
I had some concerns seeing the brackets before install. But they are somewhat beefy. I don't know how much clearance -if any is lost with them installed.
For $100 from AEV. I see no problems running them.
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Old 02-25-2012, 04:20 PM   #73
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Just my G.A.S. attitude--I wouldn't usem,because--

They are another set of bolts/bushings ADDED ! and they reduce your Coming-off-rocks clearance/w brackets that are MORE subject to damage-

Now they may be parallel/level with the frame attitude, but thay aren't parallel to the UCAs anymore and that means everytime your axle moves up/down--your caster will change !

Now I honestly don't know how detrirnental that MAY BE, but--I'm not taking any chances !

Put that in your pipe and smokeit !!!

JMBO
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Old 02-25-2012, 04:27 PM   #74
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All I know is that they're in practically all of AEV's suspension kits greater than 3". I hear nothing but rants and raves about them. So they must be doing something right.

References in case people do not believe me:
Dualsport SC 3.5 or 4.5" Lift
DualSport RS 3.5/4.5"
DualSport 3.5" ST
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Old 02-25-2012, 04:28 PM   #75
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I'm not taking any chances !
That's where I'm coming from too. I was (and still am) excited to see these on gluestick's ride though
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Old 02-25-2012, 09:41 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
I'd have to recommend Currys, they've got the biggest following-




I use Rusty's and they are pretty HD-less tha $300 bucks, but you have to be careful with the preload ring and locking screw (Locktite)-but

You can twist your front axle till it takes on chinese appearance and the LCA stays unchanged-pretty good -

JIMBO
So like, I re-read the "HD-Less" part, and I translated as "for not being classified as heavy-duty and for less than $300, they do awesome and they are like tiger champs."
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Old 02-25-2012, 09:43 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris.george

So like, I re-read the "HD-Less" part, and I translated as "for not being classified as heavy-duty and for less than $300, they do awesome and they are like tiger champs."
Lol.

Like the "scratching head" smiley"

Good fit
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Old 02-25-2012, 10:07 PM   #78
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Lol.

Like the "scratching head" smiley"

Good fit
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:15 AM   #79
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I thought so too, but here are some pics:

Rear Spring:


Front Spring:



Random-ish but what is the highlighted area from here:
Picture 1: Rear measurement does not matter, these brackets are for the front CA's.

Picture 2: You are not measuring the right place. It looks like you are measuring from your spring perch (correct) to your track bar mouting point (incorrect). Take another look at the AEV instructions, your topmost point you should be measuring is from the frame rail.

Picture 3: That sir is your rear bumpstop (the pretty yellow bumper). The cable shroud is protecting your electronic speed control wiring, me thinks.

To all others, thank you for expanding the discussion on caster and control arms, I think it is a very relevant point to discuss in this thread, not a hijack by any means. I know a lot of people, myself included, have questions about adjustables and other geometry related issues, and may be to shy to ask a "dumb" question.

In regards to the clearance issues, I wheel mostly fireroads/woods trails, and have been known to tear the hell out of abandoned/incomplete subdevelopment lots. I likely will not ever have a good comprehensive, "I crawled the Rubicon trail with these" critique. I can understand how some may feel there is an unfair amount of compromise as far as ground clearance, but as I mentioned, these things are pretty tough, and there are many who have put these through their paces, other forums have beat these to hell and back on taller lift reviews.

IMHO, for the price and my "less than extreme" off roading habits, these are in my opinion a dead-nuts perfect fix for handling concerns of a DD/occasional mild weekend warrior rig. I aint no mall crawler. YMMV.

Again, thanks to those in the know for dropping their knowledge of control arms and caster on us- this is where most of us get our Jeep education.
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:27 AM   #80
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Picture 3: That sir is your rear bumpstop (the pretty yellow bumper). The cable shroud is protecting your electronic speed control wiring, me thinks.
Ha ha, thanks! I figured it out later in the day when I started watchin (and drooling over) some King Coil Overs and TeraFlex Speedbumps!
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:35 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by chris.george

Ha ha, thanks! I figured it out later in the day when I started watchin (and drooling over) some King Coil Overs and TeraFlex Speedbumps!
Ah man... Thats overkill for most of us, lol

Oh .... Good morning ya'll
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Old 02-26-2012, 08:42 AM   #82
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Ah man... Thats overkill for most of us, lol

Oh .... Good morning ya'll
There's such a thing as overkill?

Ha ha, they look awesome though, and can't complain about their performance!

The SpeedBumps might be a little overkill though
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Old 02-26-2012, 09:50 AM   #83
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There's such a thing as overkill?

Ha ha, they look awesome though, and can't complain about their performance!

The SpeedBumps might be a little overkill though
Ya... More so talking about the speed bumps. Visualizing a jeep flying over rough terrain pushing 50 mph
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Old 03-01-2012, 08:07 PM   #84
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As promised, here is the follow up review with some off-road and highway time put in. First, the boring part- off-road, there is no noticeable difference driving with the brackets vs. no brackets. I didn't do any bouldering or anything, but shooting around some abandoned fire roads and some local "Jeep" trails (rocks/mud/roots just wide enough for branches to scrape the doors) no perceivable difference. Did not catch the LCA's, and on closer inspection, based on the radius of the LCA, I think you would have to be going in reverse to have any chance of snagging these things.

And now the part not many like to brag about- the DD highway handling. In CT, as you are traveling Eastbound on I-84 from West Hartford into and through the city there are several series of s-turns, most of which are complimented with various expansion joints/pot holes/ and "ledges". This section of highway, in light traffic conditions, is traversed anywhere from 60-80 mph, depending on your driving style and lane choice.

The main precursor to buying these brackets was a few negative post lift experiences on this stretch. The first, around 75 mph and in the left lane, flanked by an 18 wheeler in the center lane, threw a few unpleasant shimmies and sensations of lack of positive feedback from the front end. Again, not the dreaded DW, but not a user friendly, drive to work everyday, don't think twice about tossing the wife the keys sorta feeling. The next few passes were taken in the center lane, closer to 60-65 mph, but with similar results. She just didn't feel very tight or in command. If I never drove this on the highway, probably never would have noticed or cared, but I expected more from my DD, and didn't want to out-modify it's main, real, and practical purpose.

Well, I wanted to take a few passes here before reporting and can honestly say those bad manners are totally gone. Totally. As I used as a comparison point earlier in the thread my wife's minivan, the ride was honestly not far off. Pretty comfy and plush ride, really no rattle/feedback/shimmy to speak off, just consistent and predictable handling through the s-turns, even at speed. There are a few other less conspicuous pieces of high speed road that were brought to my post-lift attention with large expansion joints/ledges/washboard potholes, and I honestly passed over them without any notice, even double checking the rearview a few times to make sure it had not been repaired, smiling ear to ear. Only negative is I have now found myself unconsciously driving faster on the highway than I used to, having very little negative road feedback, I find myself creeping around 80 mph regularly, and need to use the cruise control to keep myself at safer lifted Jeep highway speeds.

Conclusion: as a few have noted in the AEV 2.5" thread who incorporated these brackets as part of their lift, ride is the same, if not better than stock. This is after experiencing some negative "lifted" ride characteristics myself since I modded my suspension. I am very happy with these brackets and think they may be the best $100 I have spent so far, especially as highways/DD driveablitliy must be a part of the equation for my rig. I like that I can address the changes in camber (adjustable LCA expense) as well as the negative steering feedback from more acute CA angles, all in one easy to instal mod. If you park your Jeep Sunday afternoon after hitting the trails and don't start it again until playtime next weekend, I doubt you have read this far into the thread. If you are looking for a simple, inexpensive, no-nonsense way to make your lifted Jeep drive like it should, getting you to work and having some fun on the weekend too, I suggest you give these a try. Nice job, AEV .
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Old 03-01-2012, 08:24 PM   #85
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Glad it worked out for you!
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Old 03-01-2012, 09:33 PM   #86
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Thanks gluestick
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Old 03-01-2012, 10:04 PM   #87
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Glad to here you like it. My lift will be here tomorrow. Softball season here, so next three weekends I will be at a ball field.
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Old 03-05-2012, 08:37 AM   #88
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Quote:
-Loosen, but do not remove, all front LCA and UCA bolts. Even though the axle side bolts don't need to come out to install the brackets, failure to loosen these will cause binding in the bushings. If you don't know what I mean, try disconnecting either your LCA or UCA at the frame and pushing down on it. It does not want to move, as the front is tightened (or at least should be) to the original geometry. This kit will be changing that.
Just one small addition to above instructions. I would also loosen up the trackbar bolt and lock nut (if adjustable track bar) to facilitate the rotation of the axle and not binding of the track bushing(s) when re-connecting of the control arms in the drop bracket. Then just torque back to spec when finished. Just a recommendation in my experience and following planman.

Great write up gluestick!!!!
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Old 03-06-2012, 01:10 PM   #89
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I had promised myself I would avoid the AEV threads, but after bring the jeep to the service dealer to be worked on (again, under warranty, truely amazing), the tech pointed out how I had.... How did he put it?

"Sir, it looks like you picked up your jeep, and beat a boulder to death with it"

Anyways, its things like this that folks like myself are concerned for the AEV brackets




Now, I still have stock tires. You can see how awesome those teraflex flexarms look though; they could probably be used to break into fort knox, they are beefy as hell. The factory brackets however? Not so much. As of now, those brackets and my diff covers are the lowest hanging parts of my jeep. everything else is tucked up nice and high, the only "low hanging fruit" are my skids. I've only been wheeling maybe a half dozen times or so. Granted, I actually go wheeling, and not driving down a gravel covered driveway, but still. I a) like replacing factory parts with beefier parts. There are HD replacements for almost every part of the jeep that can be exposed to a rock, and if you see rocks, no reason not to use those replacements. I also b) like having a few things hanging down as possible. Someone noted that the brackets only look like they would be bad if you were backing up. That alone is reason enough to not want them; if you pick a bad line, do you want to think "Hey, can you winch me out because I can't back up because I will literally hang my control arms on every log and rock that can wedge itself in there" or just "hmmm, let me back up and try that again". I remember one of my first wheeling trips, I went through a rock garden and nearly cried, because my control arms got caught on damn near every rock they could. I destroyed one obstacle because I got hung up on the control arm mount. I went and lifted my jeep to help prevent such things; why the hell would I want to drop those mounts again?

If you will never take your jeep over boulders and logs and whatnot, I think the AEV lift is probably very nice. I also think it's a complete waste of money to build up an offroad rig that will never go offroad, but hey, I think underglow lights are dumb too, so what do I know. Just saying, there's a good reason folks don't like those brackets. I hope my pictures explain why.
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Old 03-06-2012, 01:23 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sneck
I had promised myself I would avoid the AEV threads, but after bring the jeep to the service dealer to be worked on (again, under warranty, truely amazing), the tech pointed out how I had.... How did he put it?

"Sir, it looks like you picked up your jeep, and beat a boulder to death with it"

Anyways, its things like this that folks like myself are concerned for the AEV brackets

Now, I still have stock tires. You can see how awesome those teraflex flexarms look though; they could probably be used to break into fort knox, they are beefy as hell. The factory brackets however? Not so much. As of now, those brackets and my diff covers are the lowest hanging parts of my jeep. everything else is tucked up nice and high, the only "low hanging fruit" are my skids. I've only been wheeling maybe a half dozen times or so. Granted, I actually go wheeling, and not driving down a gravel covered driveway, but still. I a) like replacing factory parts with beefier parts. There are HD replacements for almost every part of the jeep that can be exposed to a rock, and if you see rocks, no reason not to use those replacements. I also b) like having a few things hanging down as possible. Someone noted that the brackets only look like they would be bad if you were backing up. That alone is reason enough to not want them; if you pick a bad line, do you want to think "Hey, can you winch me out because I can't back up because I will literally hang my control arms on every log and rock that can wedge itself in there" or just "hmmm, let me back up and try that again". I remember one of my first wheeling trips, I went through a rock garden and nearly cried, because my control arms got caught on damn near every rock they could. I destroyed one obstacle because I got hung up on the control arm mount. I went and lifted my jeep to help prevent such things; why the hell would I want to drop those mounts again?

If you will never take your jeep over boulders and logs and whatnot, I think the AEV lift is probably very nice. I also think it's a complete waste of money to build up an offroad rig that will never go offroad, but hey, I think underglow lights are dumb too, so what do I know. Just saying, there's a good reason folks don't like those brackets. I hope my pictures explain why.
you my friend are a jeeper

__________________
2007 Rubicon/Rock Krawler TR 2.5 coils/rear TB/Rancho 9000 31/32XL shocks/Teraflex monster TB/Synergy highsteer,tie rod, ball joints/Hankook MT 315-75-16 on Level 8 ZX's/MC front SB links/Rancho geo brackets & shocks/Fox ATS stabilizer/Adams front DS=Frankinlift from hell.

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