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Old 08-02-2010, 08:31 PM   #1
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Assuming the Pentastar arrives in 2012...

do you think there will be a lot of other changes made or just engine, transmission, gearing, etc?

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Old 08-02-2010, 10:00 PM   #2
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Do we for sure know that it won't be in the 2011?

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Old 08-02-2010, 10:21 PM   #3
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the Pentastar 3.6 might be mated with a 5-speed W5A580 automatic transmission in vehicles. this transmission is FANTASTIC. IMHO, one of the best. you can find them in Mercedes vehicles

not sure about year. I heard Chrysler was having trouble with block so 2012 looks about right for it.
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Old 08-02-2010, 10:35 PM   #4
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What is the Pentastar?
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Old 08-02-2010, 10:43 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Ageless Stranger
What is the Pentastar?
the Pentastar is a flex-fuel, 3.6 V6 engine in development by Chrysler rumored to be installed in the 2011 Wranglers and other models
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Old 08-02-2010, 10:46 PM   #6
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Better than the current 3.8?
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Old 08-02-2010, 11:06 PM   #7
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probably not

everyone is hopeful, and on paper it looks good.

personally, I think it's going to be similar to the 4.0 vs. 3.8. the 3.8 looks better on paper than the 4.0, but in reality it's the same engine with the power band moved.

I just can't see the smaller Pentastar running off E85 producing more real life power than a gas powered straight 6 or 3.8 V6 gasoline engine.

I'm no engineer though. but IMO, JK's need something a little bigger than even the 4.0. the 4.0 is good for a little YJ or TJ, but a heavy JK needs more, not less. add in a sucky transmission and you get the current problem with JK power.

I view the Pentastar engine as more sucking up to street use. better fuel economy, it's green, runs flex-fuel, etc. I'll be shocked if it's got any real muscle. like I said though, I could be wrong.
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Old 08-02-2010, 11:13 PM   #8
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Bummer.

So far I really like my straight six.
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Old 08-03-2010, 12:04 AM   #9
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that engine is PERFECT in a TJ. in a JK it would perform similar to the 3.8. personally, I don't notice much of a difference between the 2. The 3.8 likes to rev higher, but the feel is the same. this damn auto trans though upshifts way early for fuel economy. I'll be in 3rd at 30mph, and 4th at 40, with my RPM's at 1100 then people complain the 3.8 has no power. it does...it's the trans that's the problem. the manuals have that shift light pop on early too.

the 4.0 and 3.8 are good. it's just this "go green" thing screwing things up. JK's get high gears now except Rubicons, the 3.8 replaced the 4.0 due to emissions, Pentastar will replace the 3.8 for MPG's, it'll never stop.

it's like the mods we do. every offroad modification takes away from street. big tires, lifts, bumpers..all decrease top end and MPG and street handling toward the negative. the opposite is also true. higher gears, fuel efficient engines, smaller tires..rob you of power and ground clearance offroad but increase MPG and acceleration onroad.

the trend is Jeeps are catering to street use. first in 07 with the 3.8. then eliminating 4.10 as a ratio in X's and Sports. now the Pentastar for better MPG. what next? an aerodynamic, IFS Jeep?

that's my theory anyway. there's only so much that can be done with a combustion engine. the cold hard fact that no one wants to admit is there is NOTHING on this planet that produces power and efficiency as well as a gasoline combustion engine. diesel is a very close second. but E85 fuel, electric, hydrogen, solar...not even close. it's AT LEAST a decade away. so as a result, you're slowly seeing every vehicle get neutered more every year as the government forces companies to increase fuel economy standards. the technology isn't there, so companies tweak compression ratios, install sh*tty gears and transmissions, and program PCM's to restrict you...robbing power in the name of saving the planet on a global warming theory that hasn't even been proven to exist.

I'm shutting up now before DHS knocks on my door. I can hear the black helicopters already.

like I said though, I could be wrong. I hope I am. maybe the 3.6 will be a hog that spins the rear tires like a Top Fuel dragster and gets 30mpg while cruising at 65 running E85 corn juice.

sounds too good to be true. for now, I'll say it's going to suck compared to the 4.0 and 3.8. it might get 5, maybe 10 more MPG, but you'll compromise it someplace, probably that hill in the woods covered in mud that ALREADY needs 4lo and about 4500 RPM's, or that rock that makes you say "man, one lower gear set would destroy this thing" it might just get a little tougher.
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:23 AM   #10
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Do we for sure know that it won't be in the 2011?
in the brochure for the 2011 the 3.8 is listed as the available engine.
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:37 AM   #11
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I met a guy locally that had purchased a '07 Rubicon Unlimited that a dealer in Michigan had done a 2.8L CRD swap into; the motor and all parts were factory parts obtained through a dealer in Germany.
The Jeep had 4.10s and was on Toyo 35s with Jeeperman bumpers, tire carrier, and a Warn winch. It was lifted 4".
The kicker: 25 mpg, real world driving.

A little turbo diesel would suit me fine. And a bigger fuel tank...
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:42 AM   #12
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the Pentastar is a flex-fuel, 3.6 V6 engine in development by Chrysler rumored to be installed in the 2011 Wranglers and other models
Not rumored, it's out on the street in the 2011 Grand Cherokee.
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Old 08-03-2010, 05:52 AM   #13
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Do we for sure know that it won't be in the 2011?
Yes.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:27 AM   #14
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I heard it will be in the 2011 Wranglers as a 'late availability' item.

The brochure you saw floating around was just the fleet brochure, not the retail brochure….the fleet brochure is a little more care-free i.e. they show 2007 jeeps on the cover of a 2011 order guide.
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Old 08-03-2010, 08:58 AM   #15
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Quote:
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I heard it will be in the 2011 Wranglers as a 'late availability' item.

The brochure you saw floating around was just the fleet brochure, not the retail brochure….the fleet brochure is a little more care-free i.e. they show 2007 jeeps on the cover of a 2011 order guide.
Heard it where?
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Old 08-03-2010, 09:27 AM   #16
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dealer
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Old 08-03-2010, 09:35 AM   #17
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They are a notoriously unreliable source of information.
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Old 08-03-2010, 09:47 AM   #18
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I get my info from the internet so it must be true (ok, Allpar is pretty reliable) and here is what they say...

There are dozens of different door, top and windshield combinations including a three-piece modular hardtop and Sunrider™ soft top. The beloved AMC straight-six was replaced with a new 3.8 liter V6 with 202 horsepower and 237 lb.-ft. of torque, boosting gas mileage (17 city, 19 highway); it is not the Jeepers’ favorite, but appears to be standard in the 2011s. The 2012 Wrangler promises not only the Pentastar V6 but possibly a Fiat or VM Motori diesel.

So, take that for what it's worth.
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Old 08-03-2010, 09:59 AM   #19
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What is the Pentastar?
Its more or less for Satanic Worship.
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:03 AM   #20
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My new Car and Driver just tested the new Jeep GC with the new V6.

This truck weighs 4772 lbs. And got to 60 in 8.4 seconds.

Our Wranglers are under 4000 lbs. Thou I never seen any 60 times on the Wranglers.

Im betting mid 7's. And Car and Driver just loved the new Pentastar, saying why go for the v8 when this new motor is sooo good!

Just what the Wrangler needs is a little more peep. Should be very nice!
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Old 08-03-2010, 10:07 AM   #21
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I met a guy locally that had purchased a '07 Rubicon Unlimited that a dealer in Michigan had done a 2.8L CRD swap into; the motor and all parts were factory parts obtained through a dealer in Germany.
The Jeep had 4.10s and was on Toyo 35s with Jeeperman bumpers, tire carrier, and a Warn winch. It was lifted 4".
The kicker: 25 mpg, real world driving.

A little turbo diesel would suit me fine. And a bigger fuel tank...


Wernt those dropped into the Liberties for a few years?

Thru a "Toon" at these turbo diesels , and you see very big gains! Like an extra 100lb/ft.

Now this would be the smart idea.

Side note,,, ever wonder why Europe gets all the Diesels,, and we dont?

Im kinda thinking cause they last forever,, and our market needs new car turn over... Plus Big Oil...
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Old 08-03-2010, 12:43 PM   #22
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Side note,,, ever wonder why Europe gets all the Diesels,, and we dont?
Americans don't buy enough diesels, plain and simple. Market demand.
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Old 08-03-2010, 12:59 PM   #23
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we dont buy them because most people dont know anything about them. and at the pump diesel is more expensive, so layman puts two and two together and doesnt trust the numbers or even does the math on it. good ole 87 octane gasoline with no corn oil is mans best friend aint it? wrong... diesels are where its at but the american public wont get on board.
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Old 08-03-2010, 01:20 PM   #24
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The American public has also had bad experiences with diesels. Anybody remember the GM fiasco in the 80s? And anybody remember Vin Diesel? That'll kill it for you.
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Old 08-03-2010, 02:10 PM   #25
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Its more or less for Satanic Worship.
That is the Pentagram-and we are watching you.
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Old 08-03-2010, 02:18 PM   #26
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I'm not excited about the Pentastar, but a diesel or Hemi would be sweet. I might be willing to sell my modified Jeep for a diesel stocker and start over again. I bet those things are monsters.

there's a Jeep apparently at the shop right now with a supercharged 3.8. I'm headed up there tonight to check it out and drive it I've never seen a SC'd JK, so I'm very anxious to check it out
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Old 08-03-2010, 02:36 PM   #27
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Yo GH, check and see if it's the "AVENGER KIT" that uses the EATON "ROOTS" type supercharger !!


Quote:
Originally Posted by GroundHawg View Post
I'm not excited about the Pentastar, but a diesel or Hemi would be sweet. I might be willing to sell my modified Jeep for a diesel stocker and start over again. I bet those things are monsters.

there's a Jeep apparently at the shop right now with a supercharged 3.8. I'm headed up there tonight to check it out and drive it I've never seen a SC'd JK, so I'm very anxious to check it out
If it doesn't it's probably a RIPP Turbo--

Look forward to seeing your evaluation !!

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Old 08-03-2010, 02:50 PM   #28
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Yo GH, check and see if it's the "AVENGER KIT" that uses the EATON "ROOTS" type supercharger !!

If it doesn't it's probably a RIPP Turbo--

Look forward to seeing your evaluation !!

JIMBO
oh for sure. I'll post it up in this thread. this thing is going to be so cool I'm going to want one I bet
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Old 08-03-2010, 02:58 PM   #29
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Yea, I did to--a whiile back, but


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oh for sure. I'll post it up in this thread. this thing is going to be so cool I'm going to want one I bet
The AVENGER KIT is SUPER, with ROOTS supercharger, that applies power at LOW RPM, but

They just can't get the software to settle down with the JK-ECM systems and there's always trouble codes and "limp mode" problems--don't want that

The RIPP Turbocharger sys is really well engineered and doesn't have any ops trouble, but

It only really works above 2500 rpm--I couldn't use that off-road, but might be OK on the freeways/trailer

Time will tell !

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Old 08-03-2010, 03:05 PM   #30
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The Pentastar IS in the new Cherokee. 255 or 265 hp i believe it was rated at. They had a '11 Cherokee in the showroom at my dealer.
E85 is basically really high octane gasoline. It contains less energy than gasoline, so mileage drops significantly. Recent advancements have lessened or negated this, but only on more high end cars for now. Turbocharged engines make a good bit more power on E85, when tuned to run on it. Higher compression engines also benefit from E85 since being a higher octane fuel, you can safely run more compression and timing. It equates to running race fuel, but you can buy it at the pump. E85 also burns cooler than gasoline.
It's big drawbacks are the loss of mileage and the ethanol content is really hard on rubber seals that are designed to be gasoline safe. Then there's the corn for food vs. fuel debate.

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