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Old 05-15-2011, 05:36 PM   #31
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I'll help you some. First off I have a TJ but the same principles apply here.

Your rear axle is great and your front for 35 inch tires. You will have no problem.

Gears:
4.88 sounds like a good recommendation from everyone. You will also need a master rebuild kit that includes all new bearing and what not. You will need a shop to do all of this for you.

Lockers (traction aid)
Now traction is the most important thing in off roading. Without traction you will not be going anywhere. There are limited slips, fulltime lockers, air lockers, electronic lockers, and spools. Fist off this is a daily driver and you DO NOT want spools and ill explain why. This is basically how an axles works( we will be using the rear axle but the front is the same way). When you go down the road straight both tires will be getting 100% of the power. The power comes from the engine to transmission to transfercase through the drive shaft to the pinion that spins the ring gear that spins the axle shafts that are connected to the tires. Now lets say that you are going to make a left hand turn. Your body rolls to the right therefore all of Jeeps weight is going to the outside (right side) and there isnít as much weight on the inside (left side). All of the power will be going to the inside tire (left side) and very little to the outside (right side). Now if you think all the weight is on the outside and none on the inside therefore it will be easy for the axle to turn that inside tire because there is no weight. Now lets take this example to off roading. The ground is hardly level when wheeling. Now lets say that your wheeling and you come across some obstacle where the left tire goes up and right drops down. Now remember the body rolls and weight went to the right side. Now for this example you need traction on the right side thatís down low to make you move. Now from the street example the left tire it will get all of the power and none right. Well when we are off roading we want both tires to have traction. This is where a locker helps. It grabs both axle shafts and will give each the same power and you will move. Lockers can also be used on the street where you need the tires spinning at different speeds when making turns and off road they make them turn the same. Some lockers do this better than others. Air locker are the best and the most expensive. They allow you to run the tires at different speeds like there is no traction aid on the road and then when you get off road a button can be pushed and makes them work like a locker. They are the best of both worlds. Limited slips allow the tires to slip so much and then they grab the shafts. Spools are the cheapest but they lock the shafts together all the time and never let them go. Bad for street driving since your tires canít turn different speeds.

Lifts:
Most brands are great. They wouldnít be making them if not. Get whatever is recommended. Now you donít want the tallest lift there is because it is terrible for your center of gravity. The higher the center of gravity the easier it is to roll over since jeeps does not have full width axles. You can get a lift 1 inch smaller in suspension and get a 1 inch body lift. Body lift does not raise your center of gravity at all. 1 inch body lift do not look bad and are also help in other arrears (ill explain that). Now depending on how high of a suspension (not body) lift you go you will need a new rear drive shaft if you have drive line vibrations that are coming from the pinion being unhappy. You will need to do one of two things: 1. skid plate drop which is one inch will help or 2. new rear double carden drive shaft and an SYE (slip yoke eliminator kit). Now you really donít want a skid plate drop because you are trying to get things higher up to clear stuff and it will just hang on junk. Now when doing a new rear drive shaft it reduces the angle and gets rid of vibrations. You will also need new rear and upper control arms to rotate the rear axle upward. Go with either Currie or Rokmen Johnny Joints at both ends. If you do the body lift you will also want to do a Motor Mount Lift, keeps you from having to relocate the radiator. With a motor mount lift you might not have drive line vibrations (then again then depends on how much of a suspension lift you have).Since my internet is messing up so bad at work I would link you a few sites to read but since it is Iím typing this really long response to explain everything to you. A tummy tuck could also be done if you need a new rear drive shaft. A tummy tuck is a special skid plate that put the transmission and transfercase really high to make sure you clear thing easier (this requires new double cardin drive shaft and rear and upper control arms, Johnny joint control arms are a lot better than ones with rubber bushings. It will allow you to flex more) If you arenít going into a lot of rocks I wouldnít get a long arm suspension (cost more if you donít use it for what it is designed for and those long arms can hang up on rocks anyways.)

I think I have covered everything. Have any more questions ask. I think you will be fine with 35ís since you are new to off roading.

Winch and bumpers should also be on the list. Doesnít matter what size tires you have you could always be stuck. Winches are nice.

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Old 05-16-2011, 02:14 AM   #32
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I'll help you some. First off I have a TJ but the same principles apply here.

Your rear axle is great and your front for 35 inch tires. You will have no problem.

Gears:
4.88 sounds like a good recommendation from everyone. You will also need a master rebuild kit that includes all new bearing and what not. You will need a shop to do all of this for you.

Lockers (traction aid)
Now traction is the most important thing in off roading. Without traction you will not be going anywhere. There are limited slips, fulltime lockers, air lockers, electronic lockers, and spools. Fist off this is a daily driver and you DO NOT want spools and ill explain why. This is basically how an axles works( we will be using the rear axle but the front is the same way). When you go down the road straight both tires will be getting 100% of the power. The power comes from the engine to transmission to transfercase through the drive shaft to the pinion that spins the ring gear that spins the axle shafts that are connected to the tires. Now lets say that you are going to make a left hand turn. Your body rolls to the right therefore all of Jeeps weight is going to the outside (right side) and there isnít as much weight on the inside (left side). All of the power will be going to the inside tire (left side) and very little to the outside (right side). Now if you think all the weight is on the outside and none on the inside therefore it will be easy for the axle to turn that inside tire because there is no weight. Now lets take this example to off roading. The ground is hardly level when wheeling. Now lets say that your wheeling and you come across some obstacle where the left tire goes up and right drops down. Now remember the body rolls and weight went to the right side. Now for this example you need traction on the right side thatís down low to make you move. Now from the street example the left tire it will get all of the power and none right. Well when we are off roading we want both tires to have traction. This is where a locker helps. It grabs both axle shafts and will give each the same power and you will move. Lockers can also be used on the street where you need the tires spinning at different speeds when making turns and off road they make them turn the same. Some lockers do this better than others. Air locker are the best and the most expensive. They allow you to run the tires at different speeds like there is no traction aid on the road and then when you get off road a button can be pushed and makes them work like a locker. They are the best of both worlds. Limited slips allow the tires to slip so much and then they grab the shafts. Spools are the cheapest but they lock the shafts together all the time and never let them go. Bad for street driving since your tires canít turn different speeds.

Lifts:
Most brands are great. They wouldnít be making them if not. Get whatever is recommended. Now you donít want the tallest lift there is because it is terrible for your center of gravity. The higher the center of gravity the easier it is to roll over since jeeps does not have full width axles. You can get a lift 1 inch smaller in suspension and get a 1 inch body lift. Body lift does not raise your center of gravity at all. 1 inch body lift do not look bad and are also help in other arrears (ill explain that). Now depending on how high of a suspension (not body) lift you go you will need a new rear drive shaft if you have drive line vibrations that are coming from the pinion being unhappy. You will need to do one of two things: 1. skid plate drop which is one inch will help or 2. new rear double carden drive shaft and an SYE (slip yoke eliminator kit). Now you really donít want a skid plate drop because you are trying to get things higher up to clear stuff and it will just hang on junk. Now when doing a new rear drive shaft it reduces the angle and gets rid of vibrations. You will also need new rear and upper control arms to rotate the rear axle upward. Go with either Currie or Rokmen Johnny Joints at both ends. If you do the body lift you will also want to do a Motor Mount Lift, keeps you from having to relocate the radiator. With a motor mount lift you might not have drive line vibrations (then again then depends on how much of a suspension lift you have).Since my internet is messing up so bad at work I would link you a few sites to read but since it is Iím typing this really long response to explain everything to you. A tummy tuck could also be done if you need a new rear drive shaft. A tummy tuck is a special skid plate that put the transmission and transfercase really high to make sure you clear thing easier (this requires new double cardin drive shaft and rear and upper control arms, Johnny joint control arms are a lot better than ones with rubber bushings. It will allow you to flex more) If you arenít going into a lot of rocks I wouldnít get a long arm suspension (cost more if you donít use it for what it is designed for and those long arms can hang up on rocks anyways.)

I think I have covered everything. Have any more questions ask. I think you will be fine with 35ís since you are new to off roading.

Winch and bumpers should also be on the list. Doesnít matter what size tires you have you could always be stuck. Winches are nice.
wow thank you very much for the long reply! I really appreciate you taking the time. You added a lot of points that are critical to understanding all this. And also I now have a lot more to consider... this is getting difficult to take all in lol.

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Old 05-16-2011, 02:44 AM   #33
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Yea do your homework before just go buy something. That way you are happy in the end.
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Old 05-16-2011, 12:44 PM   #34
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OK so I won't buy the spool kind. Air lockers sound awesome! I may try those... Now, I need:

1. lift (I'm thinking Rock Krawler for sure at this point)
2. shocks (Bilstein sound great dang their expensive)
3. air lockers (not sure on brand)
4. gears (4.88 yukons)
5. ? you say control arms... most kits come with these already don't they
6. ? you say motor mounts?? really?! man that will suck to install new motor mounts! even with a 3.5" lift i need those? I haven't heard anyone say that, i suppose the dealer can install those but maybe i can if it costs too much?
7. ?

Anything else I need to be aware of that needs changing? I heard that a 3" lift usually doesn't require a new drive shaft etc? I'm thinking 3.5" lift what do you know about that?

When you say don't go for the long arm is that saying go for like the lt kits as they are called or a mid arm kit instead as opposed to the long?

side note: swear to god when I am finished with this I am going to write up a complete guide to lifting a jeep and putting on new tires for this forum, which can be put in FAQ or something for everyone to reference. I can't find a lot of this information in one spot on the forum EVEN THOUGH I AM ASKING EVERYONE! it's hard to wade through all the other threads to find it, if it does exist.
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Old 05-16-2011, 12:52 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burr_83 View Post
OK so I won't buy the spool kind. Air lockers sound awesome! I may try those... Now, I need:

1. lift (I'm thinking Rock Krawler for sure at this point)
2. shocks (Bilstein sound great dang their expensive)
3. air lockers (not sure on brand)
4. gears (4.88 yukons)
5. ? you say control arms... most kits come with these already don't they
6. ? you say motor mounts?? really?! man that will suck to install new motor mounts! even with a 3.5" lift i need those? I haven't heard anyone say that, i suppose the dealer can install those but maybe i can if it costs too much?
7. ?

Anything else I need to be aware of that needs changing? I heard that a 3" lift usually doesn't require a new drive shaft etc? I'm thinking 3.5" lift what do you know about that?

When you say don't go for the long arm is that saying go for like the lt kits as they are called or a mid arm kit instead as opposed to the long?

side note: swear to god when I am finished with this I am going to write up a complete guide to lifting a jeep and putting on new tires for this forum, which can be put in FAQ or something for everyone to reference. I can't find a lot of this information in one spot on the forum EVEN THOUGH I AM ASKING EVERYONE! it's hard to wade through all the other threads to find it, if it does exist.
as far as air lockers, ARB is pretty much your only choice.
depending on which RK kit you get, depends on how many control arms you get the normal mid arm system comes with lower control arms, while the next step up, the x factor kit has both uppers and lowers.
at 3.5 inches, dont worry about long arm kits, stick with mid arms
since your not doing a body lift, you do not need the motor mount lift.
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Old 05-16-2011, 01:02 PM   #36
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as far as air lockers, ARB is pretty much your only choice.
depending on which RK kit you get, depends on how many control arms you get the normal mid arm system comes with lower control arms, while the next step up, the x factor kit has both uppers and lowers.
at 3.5 inches, dont worry about long arm kits, stick with mid arms
since your not doing a body lift, you do not need the motor mount lift.
Is a 1 inch body lift worth the time effort and money and good looks to put on the jeep with a 3.5 inch suspension? I sort of want to put one on, what do you think about it?
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Old 05-16-2011, 01:07 PM   #37
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im gonna put my 02 cents worth in on this,,
you say you have 6 speed lowest gearing with 35's would be 5.13.
as for a lift i have the teraflex 3 inch and it gave me just a tick over 4 inches
now your talking locking diff's. i have a OX locker made in the usa. and it is awesome, i wheel the piss outta my jeep. and have had zero issues with the lift or the locker
when you do your gears you will want to sleev your front axle. the D30 is the weak point and with 35's in may or may not break. mine did. i could have saved myself a lot of time and money if a spent 150 bucks to have it sleeved.




disclaimer---------- i only skimmed some of the post, dont beat me up if i said something there was all ready covered,, peace and GOD be with you.
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Old 05-16-2011, 01:07 PM   #38
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Is a 1 inch body lift worth the time effort and money and good looks to put on the jeep with a 3.5 inch suspension? I sort of want to put one on, what do you think about it?
i wouldnt mess with it. its just more money with no gain. if you dont need a body lift for tire clearance or high clearance skid plates, then there is no need to get one.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:08 PM   #39
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i wouldnt mess with it. its just more money with no gain. if you dont need a body lift for tire clearance or high clearance skid plates, then there is no need to get one.
Hey what do yall think about going with 37 inch tires instead of 35's?
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:10 PM   #40
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Hey what do yall think about going with 37 inch tires instead of 35's?
that is a whole other can of worms that makes things a lot more expensive.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:13 PM   #41
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that is a whole other can of worms that makes things a lot more expensive.
really? not really worth the extra headache then huh? what about 36's on a 3.5 inch lift?
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:14 PM   #42
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id just stick with 35s.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:18 PM   #43
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id just stick with 35s.
so 36's basically the same boat? there really isn't that many 36 inch tires out there anyways haha
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:20 PM   #44
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Something's very fishy with this thread, just sayin'.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:22 PM   #45
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hey schnutzy i know you were helping me with all this before so i have came a long ways in my list of parts i want. tell me what you think so far:

35 inch tires
3.5 inch lift (probably rock krawler or rusty's offroad)
4.88 gears
front trutrac lockers
rear arb lockers
axle sleeves
c gussets

anything else i missed? what do you think? would love your advice. Also I live in Northern Arizona and there is ice/snow/hills/mountains if that makes a difference in your opinion. thanks
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:23 PM   #46
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y the true tac up front, and arb in back?
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:23 PM   #47
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Something's very fishy with this thread, just sayin'.
What do you mean????
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:24 PM   #48
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y the true tac up front, and arb in back?
I don't know because I'm a noob lol
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:35 PM   #49
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Something's very fishy with this thread, just sayin'.
Actually now that you mention it, after I went back and read my own thread I was basically cracking up at myself... you all were probably laughing too! I was extreme noob, but I have already came a long ways in my understanding.
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Old 05-19-2011, 09:54 PM   #50
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y the true tac up front, and arb in back?
would front arb's and rear trutrac be a better setup?
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Old 05-19-2011, 10:20 PM   #51
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I went with Eaton ELockers up front and kept the stock tracloc in rear. The reason I went with the Eaton was the fact that I didn't plan on changing the rear. If your putting lockers in Both the ARB air is the best. But the on-board air system is pretty expensive, add that to the cost of ARB locker and it is quite expensive of a system but a great one.

Eaton ELockers make a very good locker for the Dana 30 and all you have to buy is the locker which is a little less expensive but you need no on board air system which cuts cost tremendously. Now the Elocker is not that great for the d44 axle because it is only a 2 pin lock, not sure why they have a weaker system for a beefier axle but they do. The ELocker for the D30 is a 4 pin.

For the short time I have had the Eaton lockers up front, I love them. Had to use them today moving a trailer in the mud. They are so quiet, I can't even tell they engage except for the fact that all of a sudden I have traction that I didn't have.
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Old 05-19-2011, 11:56 PM   #52
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would front arb's and rear trutrac be a better setup?
Best set up ARB F/R good sir
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Old 05-20-2011, 12:22 AM   #53
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Best set up ARB F/R good sir
yeah just trying to save a few bucks... what about for mudding and deep water etc... which lockers are best? will arb's still hold up in that kind of off roading?
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Old 05-20-2011, 01:04 AM   #54
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yeah just trying to save a few bucks... what about for mudding and deep water etc... which lockers are best? will arb's still hold up in that kind of off roading?
OK, I understand the save a few bucks thing.. yeah the arb's have been through the worst that you can put a locker through.. the only thing that will typically go wrong with them is the air line to the diff can sometimes get a leak or disconect from the diff.. But it's not to common given how manny are out there being used... to reconect the line is not a difficult challenge and if it does get a leak for some reason or another the line is not really all that expensive to replace..
Instead of ARB F/R to save a few bucks the majority of offroaders and I agree with this will Run a LS (Detroit True Trac) rear and ARB front.. It would your second best option to selectable locker F/R..
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Old 05-20-2011, 07:07 AM   #55
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burr, take a look at OX lockers, no air, no electronics , it uses a cable to engage and disengage, and god forbid the cable breaks while wheeling a 6 mm allen wrench will disengage it.
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Old 05-21-2011, 07:45 AM   #56
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yeah just trying to save a few bucks... what about for mudding and deep water etc... which lockers are best? will arb's still hold up in that kind of off roading?
Nothing stands up to "deep water". Gears, lockers, bearings of any type are damaged by water. If you run your jeep in water above the seals for any length of time you need to change fluids as soon as possible afterwards. If you want to go in deep water get a boat. "Mudding" is almost as bad.
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Old 05-21-2011, 06:08 PM   #57
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yeah just trying to save a few bucks... what about for mudding and deep water etc... which lockers are best? will arb's still hold up in that kind of off roading?
I asked that with the shop when I got my ELockers because like the air lockers there is a small hole drilled in the differential to run the air line or in my case electrical line. He said they are very well sealed if done correctly.

Also if you plan on water runs, get the Smilin' Bob's Breather Hose Extension Kit for JKs for peace of mind.

The kit completely seals all your breather lines to your air box, including the transfer case and transmission lines alone with both axles.
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Old 05-21-2011, 06:56 PM   #58
Jeeper
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Northern Arizona
Posts: 80
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excellent! thanks for the tips i don't want to take it through deep water per se, just want to do the normal mudding that im used to from the south where its all about the rain and mud! i also want to do the rocks but you know what i mean... i love that mud!

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