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Old 10-02-2013, 01:53 PM   #1
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Buying New vs. Used / Rubi vs. other trims

Hi all,

I am a former jeeper looking to buy again before the end of the year.

I ideally want a new (or 2012+ used) Rubicon 2 door manual, but I don't know if I can afford it.
I want to keep the Jeep I buy for a long time and eventually make it a trailer queen/weekend wheeling toy. I like the Rubi for the axles, lockers, and sway bar disco. Saves a lot of cost down the road, plus makes it much more capable off road for now.
I also really want that Pentastar engine. So I could go back to a 2012.

What I need advice on is this:
Since money will probably hold me back from the ideal jeep, do I sacrifice the axles/lockers of the Rubi or do I sacrifice the Pentastar and go for like an '08 Rubicon?

Anyone have any options I'm missing?

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Old 10-02-2013, 01:54 PM   #2
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Buy new. Buy Rubicon.

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Old 10-02-2013, 04:34 PM   #3
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Yes, that would be ideal. The question is if I have to choose EITHER the pentastar OR the Ribicon, which is the best bet?
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Old 10-02-2013, 04:45 PM   #4
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You can find a 07-08 w/ lower mileage for around 20k I bought my 07 two years ago and it's been great.
6 speed and the 4:10's will be the deal breaker. Esp buying preowned.
On road she's fine w/ 35's but off road crawl ratio is down.
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Old 10-02-2013, 05:03 PM   #5
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If you live in or near the mountains I would say get the better engine. I would also say save a little more and buy new what you want. Just my .02 buying a used jeep is hard because people don't know how to take care of them after offroading and you pay top dollar for a used one.
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Old 10-02-2013, 05:12 PM   #6
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From MY observations of wranglers, not even mentioning what trim just wranglers in general. They tend to hold onto some serious value anywhere and everywhere. i think your best bet is to get a new one... finance it and just do the monthly rather then pay it all off in full.
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Old 10-02-2013, 05:41 PM   #7
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Just recently traded my 2007 2 door X Wrangler in for a 2012 2 door Rubicon.

So far it's fine, I really wanted the D44 front and e lockers more than anything else.
The D30 front axle in the 07 always worrried me with the Truetracs and oversized tires.

Honestly I don't get the hype about the "new Penstar" motor.
Maybe in a 4 door with auto it makes a bigger difference.

My 2007 with the 3.8L pulled fine and had plenty of grunt off road. Ran 33 and 35" tires on it for 5 years.

The new Penstar motor has a little more pep up to about 3,500 RPM. It's not a huge difference really.
Shifting is still just as slow and clunky as it's been since the 80's so you're never going to win any races. A 50 cc scooter is faster off the line trust me.

The older 3.8L motor pulls all the way to reline at 6,000 RPM.
The new 3.6L pulls well up to about 4,000 RPM then flattens out kind of and hangs there until you shift. I've added a full high flow exhaust, intake and tuner. Still so-so on power. Better down low but pretty flat at higher rpm.

So far I'm at 6,000 miles on the 2012. Have an oil leak at the back of the engine and the drivers side head is starting to tick.
Have to wait and see how reliable this new motor is compared to the old 3.8L...Not sold on it just yet personally.

If they do introduce a diesel JK in the US in the next few years I might trade the Pstar in.

My 07 never had any mechanical issues. Gas milage has been exactly the same in both rigs so far. 225 miles between fill ups. 15.5 gallons per fill up.
Same commute, same amount lift, same oversized tires, etc.

Both of my JK's have 4.10 gears and manual 6 speed trans so very simliar feel.


Guess it boils down to what is important to you.
Off road ability out of the box or new motor.
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Old 10-02-2013, 07:17 PM   #8
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I bought my 10 sport with 29000 miles for $19500 full options, i could have got the same truck brand new for $24,000. if i had it to do all over id consider the newer jeep more now knowing how well i can afford the payments on my 10. and had i had the cash for a NICE unmolested rubi, id of pulled the trigger any day. hopefully mine will be all paid off in time for the diesel, ill be first in line for that truck
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Old 10-03-2013, 07:09 AM   #9
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Thanks, guys! This is some awesome input. TrueNorth, you were extremely helpful! It sounds like the power difference I've heard of in the Pstar isn't all it's cracked up to be overall, so I'll shop around and find the best deal I can on any 07-14 Rubi. I really do want those D44s and E-lockers...
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Old 10-03-2013, 07:57 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueNorth View Post
Just recently traded my 2007 2 door X Wrangler in for a 2012 2 door Rubicon.

So far it's fine, I really wanted the D44 front and e lockers more than anything else.
The D30 front axle in the 07 always worrried me with the Truetracs and oversized tires.

Honestly I don't get the hype about the "new Penstar" motor.
Maybe in a 4 door with auto it makes a bigger difference.

My 2007 with the 3.8L pulled fine and had plenty of grunt off road. Ran 33 and 35" tires on it for 5 years.

The new Penstar motor has a little more pep up to about 3,500 RPM. It's not a huge difference really.
Shifting is still just as slow and clunky as it's been since the 80's so you're never going to win any races. A 50 cc scooter is faster off the line trust me.

The older 3.8L motor pulls all the way to reline at 6,000 RPM.
The new 3.6L pulls well up to about 4,000 RPM then flattens out kind of and hangs there until you shift. I've added a full high flow exhaust, intake and tuner. Still so-so on power. Better down low but pretty flat at higher rpm.

So far I'm at 6,000 miles on the 2012. Have an oil leak at the back of the engine and the drivers side head is starting to tick.
Have to wait and see how reliable this new motor is compared to the old 3.8L...Not sold on it just yet personally.

If they do introduce a diesel JK in the US in the next few years I might trade the Pstar in.

My 07 never had any mechanical issues. Gas milage has been exactly the same in both rigs so far. 225 miles between fill ups. 15.5 gallons per fill up.
Same commute, same amount lift, same oversized tires, etc.

Both of my JK's have 4.10 gears and manual 6 speed trans so very simliar feel.


Guess it boils down to what is important to you.
Off road ability out of the box or new motor.
Huh. I drove an 11 and 12 stick 2 door Rubi back to back and was absolutely floored at how much faster the '12 was. I didn't think it was even close, the 3.6 kept making power up to the redline and it felt like the 3.8 gave up at 4000 RPM or so.
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Old 10-03-2013, 08:30 AM   #11
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Consider a 2013 and avoid the 3.6 head issue.
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Old 10-03-2013, 08:49 AM   #12
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Buy an older Rubicon and drop a new engine in it?
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Old 10-03-2013, 09:01 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theairhead View Post
Buy an older Rubicon and drop a new engine in it?
LS is becoming a popular option

OP .. Honesty it depends on location, highway/city and what you plan on doing with the jeep.

Off road, the difference most will be In the new auto trans. 6 speed is the same.

If you are mostly using the jeep as a DD and/or a lot of highway... The new motor would be the better option.

You can always regear the axles for more power/crawl ratio pre 12.
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Old 10-03-2013, 09:27 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueNorth View Post
Just recently traded my 2007 2 door X Wrangler in for a 2012 2 door Rubicon.

So far it's fine, I really wanted the D44 front and e lockers more than anything else.
The D30 front axle in the 07 always worrried me with the Truetracs and oversized tires.

Honestly I don't get the hype about the "new Penstar" motor.
Maybe in a 4 door with auto it makes a bigger difference.

My 2007 with the 3.8L pulled fine and had plenty of grunt off road. Ran 33 and 35" tires on it for 5 years.

The new Penstar motor has a little more pep up to about 3,500 RPM. It's not a huge difference really.
Shifting is still just as slow and clunky as it's been since the 80's so you're never going to win any races. A 50 cc scooter is faster off the line trust me.

The older 3.8L motor pulls all the way to reline at 6,000 RPM.
The new 3.6L pulls well up to about 4,000 RPM then flattens out kind of and hangs there until you shift. I've added a full high flow exhaust, intake and tuner. Still so-so on power. Better down low but pretty flat at higher rpm.

So far I'm at 6,000 miles on the 2012. Have an oil leak at the back of the engine and the drivers side head is starting to tick.
Have to wait and see how reliable this new motor is compared to the old 3.8L...Not sold on it just yet personally.

If they do introduce a diesel JK in the US in the next few years I might trade the Pstar in.

My 07 never had any mechanical issues. Gas milage has been exactly the same in both rigs so far. 225 miles between fill ups. 15.5 gallons per fill up.
Same commute, same amount lift, same oversized tires, etc.

Both of my JK's have 4.10 gears and manual 6 speed trans so very simliar feel.

Guess it boils down to what is important to you.
Off road ability out of the box or new motor.


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Something wrong if your flattening out at 4000. 2013 JKUR auto. Stock 32s", 4.10, 17.1 mpg avg
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Old 10-03-2013, 09:48 AM   #15
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I looked at 2 unlimited Sports before buying.

One was a brand new 2014 stock Sport for $30,000, which was the maximum I could spend.

They also had a certified pre-owned 2011, 40,000 miles with tires/lift , bumpers and alot of other add-ons for $26,000. I liked the look of it.

I test drove both of them back to back. The new one was a little bit smoother and had a little more power, but the used one felt OK to me too.

After going back and forth a few times, I decided on the 2011, since it was $4000 cheaper and had $5000 worth of aftermarket stuff on it.

I will keep it for 2-3 years then see what the 2017-2018 models look like.
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Old 10-03-2013, 11:44 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurkTTR View Post
Hi all,

I am a former jeeper looking to buy again before the end of the year.

I ideally want a new (or 2012+ used) Rubicon 2 door manual, but I don't know if I can afford it.
I want to keep the Jeep I buy for a long time and eventually make it a trailer queen/weekend wheeling toy. I like the Rubi for the axles, lockers, and sway bar disco. Saves a lot of cost down the road, plus makes it much more capable off road for now.
I also really want that Pentastar engine. So I could go back to a 2012.

What I need advice on is this:
Since money will probably hold me back from the ideal jeep, do I sacrifice the axles/lockers of the Rubi or do I sacrifice the Pentastar and go for like an '08 Rubicon?

Anyone have any options I'm missing?
I was in the same boat, i didn't want to buy new, but since these things retain value you like mad I was only spending a few grand more for brand new and no miles, so we went brand new...better to not worry about someone else issues.
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Old 10-03-2013, 11:50 AM   #17
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I'm with JimmyD

I'm with JIMMYD. Recent model used was wicked expensive. And I had trouble finding a sport with 3.73 and stick. So I ordered new.

It just didn't make sense to me to compromise when spending this much money. Had I had a greater discount on a used model, the compromise might have been a little easier.
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Old 10-03-2013, 11:54 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueNorth View Post
Just recently traded my 2007 2 door X Wrangler in for a 2012 2 door Rubicon.

So far it's fine, I really wanted the D44 front and e lockers more than anything else.
The D30 front axle in the 07 always worrried me with the Truetracs and oversized tires.

Honestly I don't get the hype about the "new Penstar" motor.
Maybe in a 4 door with auto it makes a bigger difference.

My 2007 with the 3.8L pulled fine and had plenty of grunt off road. Ran 33 and 35" tires on it for 5 years.

The new Penstar motor has a little more pep up to about 3,500 RPM. It's not a huge difference really.
Shifting is still just as slow and clunky as it's been since the 80's so you're never going to win any races. A 50 cc scooter is faster off the line trust me.

The older 3.8L motor pulls all the way to reline at 6,000 RPM.
The new 3.6L pulls well up to about 4,000 RPM then flattens out kind of and hangs there until you shift. I've added a full high flow exhaust, intake and tuner. Still so-so on power. Better down low but pretty flat at higher rpm.

So far I'm at 6,000 miles on the 2012. Have an oil leak at the back of the engine and the drivers side head is starting to tick.
Have to wait and see how reliable this new motor is compared to the old 3.8L...Not sold on it just yet personally.

If they do introduce a diesel JK in the US in the next few years I might trade the Pstar in.

My 07 never had any mechanical issues. Gas milage has been exactly the same in both rigs so far. 225 miles between fill ups. 15.5 gallons per fill up.
Same commute, same amount lift, same oversized tires, etc.

Both of my JK's have 4.10 gears and manual 6 speed trans so very simliar feel.


Guess it boils down to what is important to you.
Off road ability out of the box or new motor.
That sounds almost backwards.
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Old 10-03-2013, 11:57 AM   #19
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If they didn't have the 2011 with all the aftermarket stuff, I would have bought the new one. If it is a choice between a stock new one or a stock used one, I would get the new one.
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Old 10-03-2013, 12:11 PM   #20
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If they didn't have the 2011 with all the aftermarket stuff, I would have bought the new one. If it is a choice between a stock new one or a stock used one, I would get the new one.
You made a good decision. I don't love the old drivetrain, but nothing kills you on resale like mods. You let somebody else eat that cost, eat the depreciation, and now you can go beat on that Jeep and trade it in a few years later for a nicer one. Or keep it and keep beating on it!
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Old 10-03-2013, 01:10 PM   #21
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We are talking about a Rubi Here, there are older 07-08 models out there w/ low milage and not modded for a good amount less then new.

Yes a newer 10/11 is not worth buying when the cost new is not much more.
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Old 10-03-2013, 01:33 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurkTTR View Post
Hi all,

I am a former jeeper looking to buy again before the end of the year.

I ideally want a new (or 2012+ used) Rubicon 2 door manual, but I don't know if I can afford it.
I want to keep the Jeep I buy for a long time and eventually make it a trailer queen/weekend wheeling toy. I like the Rubi for the axles, lockers, and sway bar disco. Saves a lot of cost down the road, plus makes it much more capable off road for now.
I also really want that Pentastar engine. So I could go back to a 2012.

What I need advice on is this:
Since money will probably hold me back from the ideal jeep, do I sacrifice the axles/lockers of the Rubi or do I sacrifice the Pentastar and go for like an '08 Rubicon?

Anyone have any options I'm missing?
I think you areconsidering the 2 main factors and it really depends on how you use your Jeep and your tolerance for the venerable 3.8L.

If you do a lot of crawling and hard core off roading the Rubi is probably a better choice, but if the Jeep is your DD and your off roading is more casual the the Pentastar and new transmission are the way to go. They provide a vast, although not radical drivetrain improvement.
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Old 10-03-2013, 01:57 PM   #23
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You guys are awesome! I don't know that I am any closer to a firm decision, but at least I have a lot of good input on all options. It will probably come down to finding the best deal I can get.

I do drive a lot of highway miles, but I want to be able to romp around in the mud and go crawling whenever possible. I'm in northern Indiana, so there aren't any mountains here.

I'm still torn as to whether I should go for the Rubi right off or if I should look at a sport and plan on upgrading the axles and adding lockers once I have another DD and this becomes a toy.

How much of a pain in the ass/wallet is it to install lockers and do an axle swap?
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Old 10-03-2013, 02:25 PM   #24
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I have an 06 TJRubi with the 4.0, 6sp, 5.5 LA, 1" MML, 1.75 BL, 4.88 gears on 35's.
My wheeling buddy has a 2013, JKRU, auto, with only a 3" SA, on 35's.

We did the Dusy Ershim trail last month in 15 hours....2days. neither one of us had any problems. Although my TJ beat my wife to death, where on the final leg she got out and rode with my buddy in his JKRU. Both of these jeeps are also DD's for us.
Our other friend, has a 2010, JK sport. He has spent a ton of money getting his vehicle to the level that ours came stock. Going up hills the 2010 can't keep up with my TJ, and I can't keep up with the 2013.
I got my 06 3 1/2 years ago and I looked for about a year before I found it.
I am seriously thinking about selling mine and getting an 2012 or newer one with the penstar engine some time in the future.
Food for thought......the police here in our area have all switched to the chargers with the penstar 3.6 motor.

Just my .02 cts......I would wait, look around and get what u want. You don't want to regret your purchase
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Old 10-03-2013, 03:50 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sinbob View Post
I have an 06 TJRubi with the 4.0, 6sp, 5.5 LA, 1" MML, 1.75 BL, 4.88 gears on 35's. My wheeling buddy has a 2013, JKRU, auto, with only a 3" SA, on 35's. We did the Dusy Ershim trail last month in 15 hours....2days. neither one of us had any problems. Although my TJ beat my wife to death, where on the final leg she got out and rode with my buddy in his JKRU. Both of these jeeps are also DD's for us. Our other friend, has a 2010, JK sport. He has spent a ton of money getting his vehicle to the level that ours came stock. Going up hills the 2010 can't keep up with my TJ, and I can't keep up with the 2013. I got my 06 3 1/2 years ago and I looked for about a year before I found it. I am seriously thinking about selling mine and getting an 2012 or newer one with the penstar engine some time in the future. Food for thought......the police here in our area have all switched to the chargers with the penstar 3.6 motor. Just my .02 cts......I would wait, look around and get what u want. You don't want to regret your purchase
What gearing/tranny in these jeeps ?

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