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Old 11-13-2013, 03:42 PM   #31
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The dealer doing this doesn't really surprise me. I took mine in to have them check out an issue I had been having with the factory radio and they looked mine over top to bottom, inside and out, under the hood and noted every accessory I had added. This included everything from floor mats to cold air to hood latches and even some hood shocks. They made special notes of the new air filter and shocks for the hood. They even questioned the factory Rubi rock rails that I had added.

I will give you that mine is far from stock with a 4" lift on 37s but none of this should have any affect on a factory stereo.

Anyway I noticed that my service writer had made several comments on his clipboard that he tried to keep me from seeing. One of which was in bold capitol letters "COLD AIR!!! WARRANTY??". Needless to say this didn't sit well with me.

The clipboard and paper had "EXTENSIVE WATER DAMAGE. WARRANTY VOID" written on it when he came back to talk to me. Again he was holding the clipboard to his chest while we spoke but I caught a good look at it when he turned around. He told me the technician was unable to properly diagnose what was wrong with my stereo in the almost 4 hours they had been looking at it. He asked me to schedule a time where I could drop it off for 2-3 days where they could "tear the dash apart" to "look for issues".

I laughed and said I'll get right on that. Oh and the EXTENSIVE WATER DAMAGE is news to me.



As for you I have heard of several people in my area having their warranties voided for using aftermarket filters. I would also stay away from an oiled filter like K&N for use in a JK with the 3.6. I have again heard issues from both people and techs.

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Old 11-13-2013, 03:48 PM   #32
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Contact an attorney that deals with warranty auto claims. Let them handle it. It wont cost you a thing and you get your engine replaced - even then you can probably recover your attorney fee in he settlement.

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Old 11-13-2013, 04:02 PM   #33
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That really sucks Russ. Definitely post an update. If the intake was installed by the dealer, you will have a good legal case.

To clear up some confusion (US or Canada): I've wheeled with Russ. It is Ontario, CA. Small claims limit I believe is $10K currently.
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:03 PM   #34
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I wish some air intake systems used filters that filtered the same as stock. There are many of us who don't care at all for extra airflow, we just want the un-baffled growl under the hood.
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:11 PM   #35
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This is the problem when you start changing things from stock especially engine related parts. After market air intake stuff is really risky.

Fact is, they pulled off the intake parts and found dirt which means your engine has been eating it. With the oil consumption you stated, I would say it's terminal. And I'm guessing they won't warranty it. Why would they? Even though it's Mopar parts installed by the dealer, you chose to modify the stock air intake system.

Don't get romanced by all the fantastic claims of aftermarket stuff.
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:30 PM   #36
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That really sucks Russ. Definitely post an update. If the intake was installed by the dealer, you will have a good legal case.

To clear up some confusion (US or Canada): I've wheeled with Russ. It is Ontario, CA. Small claims limit I believe is $10K currently.
X2. Keep us posted Russ. I know you've invested a lot in that Jeep.
Adrian is asking- was the breather tube connected? From the intake manifold to the intake? That could cause oil to blow out through the PCV valve. Would also create entry for dirt into the intake. Happened on our truck.
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:32 PM   #37
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Keep us posted...
I does not sound good (CAI on a Jeep that you take off-roading), but if it was a Mopar part installed by a Chrysler tech.....you might have a bit of luck.

Modifying is always a risk vs reward scenario (which is why I'm pretty much stock).
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:46 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by ztman View Post
Read some of the OPs other posts about mods, repairs and trail adventures. I can see why there may be issues with the jeep and I would suspect it doesn't have to do anything with the air cleaner. Good luck with Chrysler
I checked out out some of the trails and video's and adventures the OP has taken this Jeep on. The warranty should be void, Desert runs with the jeep completly obsqured by dust and dirt. Some really hard off roading. Rock climbing and lots of broken brackets and mounts.

No doubt this engine has sucked in a lot of dirt, destroyed the rings and consumes oil like mad.

This jeep has been abused. If anything, it needed better filtration not a low restriction one.
Chrysler probably looked the jeep over, saw the abuse and the state of the engine.
This looks like a case of "Oh crap, I abused it and it broke, Oh but I will try to screw Chrysler, and make them fix it"
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:51 PM   #39
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In any event, this ought to be a sticky as to what can happen with regards to CAI and warranty coverage.
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Old 11-13-2013, 04:56 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Darnice View Post
I checked out out some of the trails and video's and adventures the OP has taken this Jeep on. The warranty should be void, Desert runs with the jeep completly obsqured by dust and dirt. Some really hard off roading. Rock climbing and lots of broken brackets and mounts.

No doubt this engine has sucked in a lot of dirt, destroyed the rings and consumes oil like mad.

This jeep has been abused. If anything, it needed better filtration not a low restriction one.
Chrysler probably looked the jeep over, saw the abuse and the state of the engine.
This looks like a case of "Oh crap, I abused it and it broke, Oh but I will try to screw Chrysler, and make them fix it"
Chrysler didn't look at anything. A dealer found a blown engine and dirt on the intake. The dealer claimed the damage was caused bt running the Jeep without an air filter (does anybody do that, run the Jeep without an air filter?) Anyway, because the damage yo the engine was the result of misuse (according to the dealer) there is no warranty coverage.

Russ is arguing the damage was caused by the CAI, and that should indeed be covered under warranty. It doesn't matter how dusty he trails he drove on were. The air filter should have clogged faster, not allow more dirt in.
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Old 11-13-2013, 05:10 PM   #41
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I learned on my 2008 Charger (when I bought their $2000 MOPAR ported performance heads and had the dealer install them) that they won't cover anything they sell that is performance-related on the engine. Best of luck brother. I had to do my own diagnosis and repairs when my head broke an intake spring. Nothing in the MOPAR performance catalog is covered in any financially helpful or meaningful way in relation to your vehicle. Defects in the manufacturing of the part itself are covered, but in practice, no damage that results from use of that part is actually covered. They are very polite when they explain that they won't help you.
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Old 11-13-2013, 05:13 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by Darnice View Post
I checked out out some of the trails and video's and adventures the OP has taken this Jeep on. The warranty should be void, Desert runs with the jeep completly obsqured by dust and dirt. Some really hard off roading. Rock climbing and lots of broken brackets and mounts.

No doubt this engine has sucked in a lot of dirt, destroyed the rings and consumes oil like mad.

This jeep has been abused. If anything, it needed better filtration not a low restriction one.
Chrysler probably looked the jeep over, saw the abuse and the state of the engine.
This looks like a case of "Oh crap, I abused it and it broke, Oh but I will try to screw Chrysler, and make them fix it"
You just described half the JK forum. The badge on my Rubicon says TRAIL RATED. Not Mall rated. Trails are dusty. The Rubicon they do their annual new model intro on is dusty. There is an implied warrant of merchantability in CA. If it won't work off road they have to tell you not to take it into dusty conditions. It's a friggen Jeep. It's suppose to get dirty.
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Old 11-13-2013, 05:21 PM   #43
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Oops...one more from my mechanic-
Here is an illustration from a Cherokee. Even if the breather tube is connected- if the PCV valve is not working right it can allow oil into the throttle body. Making it a mess. Seems to be a common problem on 2011+ Cherokees.
Did they tell you what code was thrown? Or show you cylinder compression numbers ? You may have been through all that; just asking. Anything is cheaper than an engine.....
Attached Files
File Type: pdf 2011_wk_parts_pcv.pdf (99.8 KB, 38 views)
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Old 11-13-2013, 05:25 PM   #44
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It would be nice if it was the PCV valve.

This thread is a good lesson on the dangers of a CAI. Not so much the CAI itself, but how some dealers can use it (and other possible mods) to really jam you up.
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Old 11-13-2013, 05:26 PM   #45
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Jen there should be an oil trail inside the filter housing. If the T/B is coated then it is coming in and will leave a trail. If they wiped it all off then they lost the damage path.
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Old 11-13-2013, 05:44 PM   #46
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The best advise that I can give you is to get an attorney involved ASAP. It is amazing what a letter from a lawyer (to both the dealership and Chrysler/Jeep) will get you in advancing a solution to the issue.

It probably will cost you $100 and you probably will need to go no further.

Squeaky doors get oiled....especially if there is an attorney behind the door.

Good Luck!

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Old 11-13-2013, 06:28 PM   #47
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Well that sucks. But what you have going for you is that it is an Mopar part and it was installed by the dealership. That would carry a 12 month/12,000 MILE (19K I think) warranty and any associated damage that it may cause. However, if the mopar catalog says something different since its an add on, then you may be up poop creek...

Also, the oil consumption is likely (95% the cause) due to the cylinders being wiped out. When you get dirt ingestion, it's basically sand blasting the internals of the cylinder. When I was with Ford (worked on warranty cancellations), we would see this if it was an aftermarket filter or they did not change the filter as needed.

Also, the laws were different for Canada and warranty was different a bit as well vs the US. I would believe that Chrysler wouldn't be too far different from Ford as far as warranty goes, but.... your warranty is not likely canceled at this time. However, the dealer isn't treating it as a warranty repair. If you agree to further tear down to determine further damage and the root cause, they will. Then if they cannot prove the filter was the cause, or if they say it is, but it is covered under the 12/12,000 coverage then it would be a warranty repair.

IF the dealer/Chrysler says it's not warranty and you don't have it repaired at the dealer (you remove the vehicle), then they would cancel the powertrain warranty. Then if you go to another dealer, they would see the warranty is canceled and tell you that any work to be done would be paid by you. If you were to replace the complete engine (this is based on my Ford background), the warranty would be reinstated and the engine would carry a pretty big warranty (2 year/unlimited mile (Ford diesels were this way)).

Would be happy to provide any insite if you have further questions (just pm me). While I was Ford, it's still warranty and I know my way around this stuff a bit

Good Luck!
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Old 11-13-2013, 06:28 PM   #48
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19,000 Km, not 19,000K
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Old 11-13-2013, 06:35 PM   #49
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OP is talking about a dealer in Ontario, CALIFORNIA.
Not Canada.
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Old 11-13-2013, 06:38 PM   #50
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OP is talking about a dealer in Ontario, CALIFORNIA. Not Canada.
Opps! Lol

Disregard the stuff about Canada and monkey meter conversions!
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Old 11-13-2013, 06:58 PM   #51
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That is just the most ignorant, uninformed, and poser BS I've ever heard in my life. If you want growl, buy a Mustang GT. Geebus.
Wow. Rude.

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Old 11-13-2013, 07:54 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Pancake House View Post
Cold air intakes are a the best way to void warranties.
You need to read this:

Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:05 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Darnice View Post

I checked out out some of the trails and video's and adventures the OP has taken this Jeep on. The warranty should be void, Desert runs with the jeep completly obsqured by dust and dirt. Some really hard off roading. Rock climbing and lots of broken brackets and mounts.

No doubt this engine has sucked in a lot of dirt, destroyed the rings and consumes oil like mad.

This jeep has been abused. If anything, it needed better filtration not a low restriction one.
Chrysler probably looked the jeep over, saw the abuse and the state of the engine.
This looks like a case of "Oh crap, I abused it and it broke, Oh but I will try to screw Chrysler, and make them fix it"
Strongly disagree. That's what Jeeps are for! I thrashed all my Jeeps but maintained them extremely well. I've also run a CAI of half of my vehicles. I've also had my air filter get knocked off halfway and drive 1000 miles through snow and sand storms (CO to AZ). The Jeep is completely fine after that. Something very weird is going on with this engine. We don't have all the information IMHO
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:14 PM   #54
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Play nice folks! This post brings up some very good points and don't want to see it deleted over a word war.
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:16 PM   #55
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You need to read this: Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act
Sorry, most warranties say you can't put on aftermarket parts because they impact the way a vehicle was designed to function and protect itself.

So saying you can't dis allow me to buy aftermarket vehicle MODIFICATIONS under moss magnisun because they are parts from other sources and are violating anti trust is ignoring that modification is still a warranty void issue. For the same reason they can void your cooling system warranty if you drain it and put pure water back in etc.
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:22 PM   #56
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Now I'm not saying this repair shouldn't be covered, I'm just saying moss magnisun as written is useless in the case of modifications which don't meet a specific articulable minimum quality standard (eg. Size of particles filtered).
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:22 PM   #57
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Sorry, most warranties say you can't put on aftermarket parts because they impact the way a vehicle was designed to function and protect itself.

So saying you can't dis allow me to buy aftermarket vehicle MODIFICATIONS under moss magnisun because they are parts from other sources and are violating anti trust is ignoring that modification is still a warranty void issue. For the same reason they can void your cooling system warranty if you drain it and put pure water back in etc.
Yep, you need to reread my link.

the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act stays you cannot void the warranty because of a modification that you cannot prove caused the warranteed failure....
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:38 PM   #58
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Yep, you need to reread my link. the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act stays you cannot void the warranty because of a modification that you cannot prove caused the warranteed failure....
The actual text states that proving the modification was IN PART responsible (not fully responsible) is the only standard they are held to, that's an easy hurdle to jump when those parts sacrifice protection for performance.
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:43 PM   #59
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Getting home guys, I will answer some questions and clarify some stuff in a bit. Thanks for all the replies and opinions. Except of course for the one saying I'm trying to screw Chrysler lol.
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Old 11-13-2013, 08:47 PM   #60
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The M-M act does nothing to protect consumers. It is worthless and I think the aftermarket industry knows it is worthless and still they throw it around so people will buy their products. 1 in 10,000 will end up going to court because GM, Ford, Chrysler etc have much deeper pockets then joe enthusiast does. I have been playing with and modifying motorcycles since the 70's and M-M has been flogged around so much it makes your head spin yet nobody is getting paid back for warranty denials.

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