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Old 05-17-2013, 07:48 AM   #91
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And what is it with people thinking theres a conspiracy to make your car break after the warranty is expired? If you would just sit back & think about that from a business stand point for a minute, maybe you will realize that what your saying is BS. Why would a car maker want their car to fail at 105k if the warranty is expired at 100k? Does that honestly sound like a good business practice? If every car you make breaks down at the end of warranty period, why would people keep buying them? They wouldn't. And to blow your theory out of the water all I have to say is " 4.0liter "

And like stated before me, multi-viscocity oil is the reason why you can use the same oil in Alaska & Arizona. And 5w-30 is like water when hot as well. If I put 5w-20 & 5w-30 in seperate glass bottles you can't tell me which one is which. Just run what the factory says & know they can't say you used the wrong oil if you ever have a failure, which I hope you don't. As a mechanic I prefer to do preventative maintenance on your ride then to search for a failure & repair it.
pretty much my thoughts too.

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Old 05-18-2013, 12:13 AM   #92
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And what is it with people thinking theres a conspiracy to make your car break after the warranty is expired? If you would just sit back & think about that from a business stand point for a minute, maybe you will realize that what your saying is BS. Why would a car maker want their car to fail at 105k if the warranty is expired at 100k? Does that honestly sound like a good business practice?
Mercedes made cars that could go 500k to 1 million miles in the 1960s. Today, a full half century later, they are one-fourth to one-third of that if you're lucky. I've watched this closely over the years and have no doubt that it was partially by design and partically by neglect. One of the things that manufacturers have learned over the last decade or so is that there are no real marketplace repercussions of major mechanical problems in the 75k to 125k range - because so many have had issues. The vast majority of new car buyers are concerned about the warranty period.

There are two major financial burdens of making long lived cars - the suppression of new car sales and the loss of major component parts sales (e.g. Ford transmissions at $6k per pop). If you think manufacturers are trying to make long lived cars today I have a bridge I'd to sell you. You are certifiably naive.

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Old 05-18-2013, 12:16 AM   #93
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And like stated before me, multi-viscocity oil is the reason why you can use the same oil in Alaska & Arizona. And 5w-30 is like water when hot as well. If I put 5w-20 & 5w-30 in seperate glass bottles you can't tell me which one is which. Just run what the factory says & know they can't say you used the wrong oil if you ever have a failure, which I hope you don't. As a mechanic I prefer to do preventative maintenance on your ride then to search for a failure & repair it.
Have you ever seen a viscosity / ambiant temperature chart? The relationship between the two undeniable.
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Old 05-18-2013, 01:20 PM   #94
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Mercedes made cars that could go 500k to 1 million miles in the 1960s. Today, a full half century later, they are one-fourth to one-third of that if you're lucky. I've watched this closely over the years and have no doubt that it was partially by design and partically by neglect. One of the things that manufacturers have learned over the last decade or so is that there are no real marketplace repercussions of major mechanical problems in the 75k to 125k range - because so many have had issues. The vast majority of new car buyers are concerned about the warranty period.

There are two major financial burdens of making long lived cars - the suppression of new car sales and the loss of major component parts sales (e.g. Ford transmissions at $6k per pop). If you think manufacturers are trying to make long lived cars today I have a bridge I'd to sell you. You are certifiably naive.
How many computers did cars in gthe 60s have on them? What were the emmission standards in the 60s? Theres no comparison of the 2.

Manufacturers want people to drive their cars for about 150k & enjoy it. Then around that time most people say it's time for a new car. Not because it's broke down, just because they want a new car. So if the car they have driven is a clunker & cost them $10k in repair bills do you think they will buy another? No they won't. They want the customeer to say " My last Jeep was a nice reliable ride & it's time for a new one. " Why do they want a new one? Because new features have come out like Bluetooth & GPS that their older Jeep didn't have. Your whole theory of how businesses operate is way off & would put you out of business in a year. If I am certifiable naive for my thinking, your certifiable paranoid for yours. And where is this bridge, the Gobi Desert? I'm interested in it, send me a brochure!
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Old 05-18-2013, 03:31 PM   #95
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Well, the debate goes on, 5W20 no 5W30 no 5w20 no 5W30 and it goes on an on and on. Why debate it, because they are both like water, destine to destroy your engine! ADIQUATE LUBERCATION, NO WAY IN HOT PHOENIX TOWN.
I don't have to be concerned about that water anymore, because I dumped my 30W and purchased the best oil known to man. It is a heavy duty truck oil called Shell Rottella T 15W40. Now, this is some real oil with a great viscosity base. I already changed it and instead of my engine rattling and banging at start up, it is smooth as silk, I can't even hear it run. Maybe that's because my hearing aid battery's are dead, I guess that I had better check them. Now this 3.6 should equal the longevity of the 4.0 best of the best!
Yes, Yes, this Shell oil costs a little bit more, but the 3.6 VVT lOVES IT!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-18-2013, 06:14 PM   #96
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^So are you suggesting that a higher viscosity oil with an additive package for Diesel engines is best for the gasoline 3.6?
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Old 05-18-2013, 07:17 PM   #97
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Wow! Isn't oil such an explosive subject. I am on the side of doing what the manufacturer recommends. If you are one that is concerned about warranties, then it would behoove you to use the recommended oil regularly. This is what it recommends:

Quote:
Engine Oil Viscosity – 3.6L Engine

SAE 5W-20 engine oil is recommended for all operating temperatures. This engine oil improves low temperature starting and vehicle fuel economy.
The engine oil filler cap also shows the recommended engine oil viscosity for your engine. For information on engine oil filler cap location, refer to the “Engine Compartment” illustration in this section.
NOTE: SAE 5W-30 engine oil approved to Fiat 9.55535-S1 or Fiat 9.55535-S3 may be used when SAE 5W-20 engine oil meeting MS- 6395 is not available.
Now, back to some real questions..

My JKUR 10A has 500 miles on it and I was wanting to do the first oil change at around 1500 miles and add Mobil 1 5W-20 Synthetic. What are your thoughts on making my first oil change at 1500 miles?

UPDATE

I just checked and according to this: MS-6395

basically it says that currently Mobil 1 5W-20 is not Chrysler MS-6395 approved. So, I guess I may need to call JEEP before I do this..huh?

Thanks.
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Old 05-18-2013, 07:38 PM   #98
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The guys over on "Bob Is The Oil Guy" will tell you that changing oil more often than the manual says is just pissing money away. Me? I use Pennzoil Platium in all my vehicles and change every 7500 to 8000 miles.
BTW -had a VW GTI for 4 years, that uses 0w40, and you damn well won't find that a Wally Mart, one reason I am enjoying my Toyota that runs on regular and uses 0w-20 - that is available at Wally.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:10 PM   #99
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Wow! Isn't oil such an explosive subject. I am on the side of doing what the manufacturer recommends. If you are one that is concerned about warranties, then it would behoove you to use the recommended oil regularly. This is what it recommends:

Now, back to some real questions..

My JKUR 10A has 500 miles on it and I was wanting to do the first oil change at around 1500 miles and add Mobil 1 5W-20 Synthetic. What are your thoughts on making my first oil change at 1500 miles?

UPDATE

I just checked and according to this: MS-6395

basically it says that currently Mobil 1 5W-20 is not Chrysler MS-6395 approved. So, I guess I may need to call JEEP before I do this..huh?

Thanks.
The Factory recommended for the 2013 is 5w20 conventional.
I finally back peddled and decided to run what they recommend.

I don't like this thin oil that is being recommended today, but because of the VVT engine design oil flow characteristics and orifice sizes, plus oil pump type, well I just don't think that we a have much of a choice.

If you will please take note, their terminology is recommended and not must use. To me that kind of leaves the window wide open to synthetics and other viscosities if you chose to use them.
Everybody has to make their own choice, but I am going to gamble on what they recommend! I hope that the gamble pays off.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:16 PM   #100
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The Factory recommended for the 2013 is 5w20 conventional.
I finally back peddled and decided to run what they recommend.

I don't like this thin oil that is being recommended today, but because of the VVT engine design oil flow characteristics and orifice sizes, plus oil pump type, well I just don't think that we a have much of a choice.

If you will please take note, their terminology is recommended and not must use. To me that kind of leaves the window wide open to synthetics and other viscosities if you chose to use them.
Everybody has to make their own choice, but I am going to gamble on what they recommend! I hope that the gamble pays off.
Keywords.

The owners manual states synthetic is ok to use.

The Pentastar has an engine oil cooler.
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:23 PM   #101
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my 2013 manual says it is ok to use synthetic as long as it meets the ms-6395 spec which pennzoil platinum meets
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:54 PM   #102
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^So are you suggesting that a higher viscosity oil with an additive package for Diesel engines is best for the gasoline 3.6?
Now SilverSport my good man, what are you referring too? My post never mentioned Diesel, THAT IS YOUR WORD OF CHOICE. There are many Heavy Duty Trucks running on the road, that are Gasoline powered. So yes, this is a great quality oil for gasoline engines. This product is heavily used in the trucking Industry, Construction Industry and Mining Industry and that is a fact!
Since I only have a third grade education, it would not be very valid for me OD, to judge as to what is the best and not the best. I like to just set back and enjoy a cold Bud and continue to learn from some of you with the high level PHD Educations.
We on the Forum are just so lucky and privileged to learn from you!
I hope that you have taken note that I am not laughing, but serious, you have earned and deserve a hand...........
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Old 05-18-2013, 08:54 PM   #103
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My owners manual says the same thing:

Quote:
Synthetic Engine Oils

You may use synthetic engine oils provided the recommended oil quality requirements are met, and the recommended maintenance intervals for oil and filter changes are followed.

I checked out SAE 5W-20 Pennzoil Ultra and it looks like I may go with this one in about 1000 miles. Now, the question is, it says that it has "Hyper Cleansing Technology". It does meet Chrysler MS-6395 standards so I assume this is a safe cleaning oil?
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:01 PM   #104
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Aren't these oil threads great?
I JUST LOVE THEM...................................
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:14 PM   #105
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Aren't these oil threads great?
I JUST LOVE THEM...................................
Besides auto vs. manual, 2dr vs 4dr, and the wave, oil is up there!
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:56 PM   #106
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Besides auto vs. manual, 2dr vs 4dr, and the wave, oil is up there!
At least I feel like I'm learning something from the oil threads. No closer to an answer, but lots of info! haha
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Old 05-18-2013, 10:59 PM   #107
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At least I feel like I'm learning something from the oil threads. No closer to an answer, but lots of info! haha
TOK, I apologize for toying around on your thread! Some of these guys are just so serious, that I just can't help but to toy around and play with them, but that's not fare to you when you are looking for a solution to your questions.

I know it's hard to believe, but I do have a very extensive background both in mechanical and a variety of oils and their applications. And no, I don't use Rottella T 15w40 in my 3.6. But in the correct application it is a very good oil.
O.K. you mentioned Mobile 1. currently it does not meet Chryslers MS 6395 GL-5 guideline. So I would not use it!
There are many synthetic and conventional oils that do meet their criteria.
Synthetic, or conventional either will work. If I planned on keeping my Wrangler and running it out say over 200,000 miles, then I would spend the extra money for synthetics. If the plan is to trade it off in a couple of years, or even run it up over 100,000 miles, then the quality of the current conventional oils will take you there just fine! but it's your choice.
As for viscosity, what Miser mentioned earlier in his post was right on target! The VVT Engines are designed for certain specific viscosities. I don't know if you have a 2012, or 2013, but use what your manual recommends.
Thinner oils are scary to many end users, but they do dissipate heat, both faster and better!
Mine is a 2013 and I use 5W20. THESE ARE THE FACTS, WITH NO B.S.
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Old 05-19-2013, 06:05 AM   #108
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TOK, I apologize for toying around on your thread! Some of these guys are just so serious, that I just can't help but to toy around and play with them, but that's not fare to you when you are looking for a solution to your questions.

I know it's hard to believe, but I do have a very extensive background both in mechanical and a variety of oils and their applications. And no, I don't use Rottella T 15w40 in my 3.6. But in the correct application it is a very good oil.
O.K. you mentioned Mobile 1. currently it does not meet Chryslers MS 6395 GL-5 guideline. So I would not use it!
There are many synthetic and conventional oils that do meet their criteria.
Synthetic, or conventional either will work. If I planned on keeping my Wrangler and running it out say over 200,000 miles, then I would spend the extra money for synthetics. If the plan is to trade it off in a couple of years, or even run it up over 100,000 miles, then the quality of the current conventional oils will take you there just fine! but it's your choice.
As for viscosity, what Miser mentioned earlier in his post was right on target! The VVT Engines are designed for certain specific viscosities. I don't know if you have a 2012, or 2013, but use what your manual recommends.
Thinner oils are scary to many end users, but they do dissipate heat, both faster and better!
Mine is a 2013 and I use 5W20. THESE ARE THE FACTS, WITH NO B.S.
funny fact about rotella 5-40 is I have used it in Harleys and KLR650's for years. I have also used mobil vtwin 20-50 and I send my oil in to blackstone labs and both oils spec out nearly the same in all important catagories the one that is suprising the most to me is after 3000 miles (could be earlier but I have not sent a sample in of either with less then 3ooo miles) the viscosity between the two is almost identical. the rotella stays in spec and the 20-50 loses viscosity. both still work extremely well for harsh oil enviroments ie air cooled harleys and motors that share gear/crankcase and both can go a long time between intervals in those harsh conditions.

I agree people get wrapped up in the 0-20 5-20W oils but they are outstanding at protecting modern engines.
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:21 AM   #109
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TOK, I apologize for toying around on your thread! Some of these guys are just so serious, that I just can't help but to toy around and play with them, but that's not fare to you when you are looking for a solution to your questions.

I know it's hard to believe, but I do have a very extensive background both in mechanical and a variety of oils and their applications. And no, I don't use Rottella T 15w40 in my 3.6. But in the correct application it is a very good oil.
O.K. you mentioned Mobile 1. currently it does not meet Chryslers MS 6395 GL-5 guideline. So I would not use it!
There are many synthetic and conventional oils that do meet their criteria.
Synthetic, or conventional either will work. If I planned on keeping my Wrangler and running it out say over 200,000 miles, then I would spend the extra money for synthetics. If the plan is to trade it off in a couple of years, or even run it up over 100,000 miles, then the quality of the current conventional oils will take you there just fine! but it's your choice.
As for viscosity, what Miser mentioned earlier in his post was right on target! The VVT Engines are designed for certain specific viscosities. I don't know if you have a 2012, or 2013, but use what your manual recommends.
Thinner oils are scary to many end users, but they do dissipate heat, both faster and better!
Mine is a 2013 and I use 5W20. THESE ARE THE FACTS, WITH NO B.S.
X2, Very well stated!
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:27 AM   #110
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funny fact about rotella 5-40 is I have used it in Harleys and KLR650's for years. I have also used mobil vtwin 20-50 and I send my oil in to blackstone labs and both oils spec out nearly the same in all important catagories the one that is suprising the most to me is after 3000 miles (could be earlier but I have not sent a sample in of either with less then 3ooo miles) the viscosity between the two is almost identical. the rotella stays in spec and the 20-50 loses viscosity. both still work extremely well for harsh oil enviroments ie air cooled harleys and motors that share gear/crankcase and both can go a long time between intervals in those harsh conditions.

I agree people get wrapped up in the 0-20 5-20W oils but they are outstanding at protecting modern engines.
I have used Shell 15w40 in some of my older vehicles and always thought it to be one of the premium oils.
The 5w20 belongs in the 3.6 VVT, 2013.
I ran Harley's for years, the old 45, 74 knuckle head and the 900 cc sportster. I always purchased the oil from the Harley Dealer for them.
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:48 AM   #111
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I have used Shell 15w40 in some of my older vehicles and always thought it to be one of the premium oils.
The 5w20 belongs in the 3.6 VVT, 2013.
I ran Harley's for years, the old 45, 74 knuckle head and the 900 cc sportster. I always purchased the oil from the Harley Dealer for them.
I can't use harley oil, as it is citgo which was owned by hugo chavez, but that is a whole other discussion lol..
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:53 AM   #112
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Now SilverSport my good man, what are you referring too? My post never mentioned Diesel, THAT IS YOUR WORD OF CHOICE. There are many Heavy Duty Trucks running on the road, that are Gasoline powered. So yes, this is a great quality oil for gasoline engines. This product is heavily used in the trucking Industry, Construction Industry and Mining Industry and that is a fact!
Since I only have a third grade education, it would not be very valid for me OD, to judge as to what is the best and not the best. I like to just set back and enjoy a cold Bud and continue to learn from some of you with the high level PHD Educations.
We on the Forum are just so lucky and privileged to learn from you!
I hope that you have taken note that I am not laughing, but serious, you have earned and deserve a hand...........
I threw in the word Diesel because according to Shell's website, Rotella T is designed for use in Diesel engines. I have no doubt folks use it for other applications.

There is a difference in the additives used in a motor oil designed for Diesel engine use versus one designed for a gasser.

Save the applause, I'm just here to learn a little something, maybe pass on some info once in a while, and swap stories.

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My owners manual says the same thing:

I checked out SAE 5W-20 Pennzoil Ultra and it looks like I may go with this one in about 1000 miles. Now, the question is, it says that it has "Hyper Cleansing Technology". It does meet Chrysler MS-6395 standards so I assume this is a safe cleaning oil?
Hyper Cleansing Technology sounds like a new name for the detergents Pennzoil uses. The name sounds exciting and makes it more better. LOL Makes me think of what happens when hydrogen peroxide is poured on a cut; it starts foaming and bubbling and cleaning. LOL
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:59 AM   #113
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Well, the debate goes on, 5W20 no 5W30 no 5w20 no 5W30 and it goes on an on and on. Why debate it, because they are both like water, destine to destroy your engine! ADIQUATE LUBERCATION, NO WAY IN HOT PHOENIX TOWN.
I don't have to be concerned about that water anymore, because I dumped my 30W and purchased the best oil known to man. It is a heavy duty truck oil called Shell Rottella T 15W40. Now, this is some real oil with a great viscosity base. I already changed it and instead of my engine rattling and banging at start up, it is smooth as silk, I can't even hear it run. Maybe that's because my hearing aid battery's are dead, I guess that I had better check them. Now this 3.6 should equal the longevity of the 4.0 best of the best!
Yes, Yes, this Shell oil costs a little bit more, but the 3.6 VVT lOVES IT!!!!!!!!!!!


So you were running straight 30W but dumped it so you could run 15W40 ?

And you are evaluating this based on sound at startup....

...and when the 15W40 can't be pumped into passages designed for lighter oil...
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Old 05-19-2013, 10:08 AM   #114
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i'm just here to learn a little something, maybe pass on some info once in a while, and swap stories.



. Lol
Now that is being a real team player, and your input is respected and appreciated!
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Old 05-19-2013, 10:28 AM   #115
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So you were running straight 30W but dumped it so you could run 15W40 ?

And you are evaluating this based on sound at startup....

...and when the 15W40 can't be pumped into passages designed for lighter oil...
But it makes for a smooth running engine! It just purrs like a kitten.
NOT RECOMMENDED FOR OTHER USERS!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:00 AM   #116
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The synth rotella 5w-40w is what I ran in my yamaha fz6. It is awesome stuff...
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:03 AM   #117
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I already put the Mobil 1 in before seeing it didn't meet Chryslers spec. Reading up, that seems to be a matter of politics, not an issue with the oil. If Mobil 1 gets the cert by my next oil change, I'll run it, if not I'll got to Castol or something.

My comments about Chrysler possibly spec'ing the 5w/20 over 10w/30 just to boost CAFE numbers were made before I realized they were using a dual pressure oil pump. Still doesn't change the fact that they have a truck heavy lineup and no popular hybrids to boost their numbers.

I still feel its the CAFE thing, but no real technical basis to substantiate it. I have no idea whats best, so I'll run what they recommend until I feel its a problem.
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:14 AM   #118
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Aren't these oil threads great?
I JUST LOVE THEM...................................
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Originally Posted by cmaggi2 View Post
Besides auto vs. manual, 2dr vs 4dr, and the wave, oil is up there!
And don't forget the soft top vs hard top threads. The wave discussion threads seem to be the only ones that get closed for some reason.

I know there's a wave thread sticky. Maybe there should be a sticky for each of these other topics, too. Then there would only be a handful of new threads for me to read each day, instead of several pages worth.
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Old 05-19-2013, 12:05 PM   #119
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Aren't these oil threads great?
I JUST LOVE THEM...................................
Yep. Fun to read. Some people are in the dino age with postings that are laughable.
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Old 05-19-2013, 12:10 PM   #120
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The term thinner does not even apply to syn oil.

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