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Old 12-09-2013, 08:05 AM   #1
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Head on accident

Saw this a thought it might be a good reference. Summary - There was a head on accident between a pick up and a two door JK. The driver of the pick up died, he was not wearing a seatbelt. The driver of the JK survived with trunk, upper and lower limb injuries but he is stable.

Sapulpa Man, 75, Killed In Head-On Crash On Highway 33 - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports |

SAPULPA, Oklahoma - A 75-year-old Sapulpa man has died after a head-on collision on State Highway 33 just west of Sapulpa on Sunday morning.

The collision was reported at about 9:20 a.m. A white pickup, driven by William Walkup, and a black Jeep Wrangler, driven by Michael Scalf, 42, of Bixby, collided near the John Christner Trucking facility, according to the Oklahoma Highway Patrol.

Walkup was pronounced dead at the scene.

OHP's collision report indicates that Walkup was westbound when he spun out, went left of center and was struck by the Jeep.

Scalf was taken to the hospital with trunk, upper and lower limb injuries and he is said to be stable.

Neither driver was transporting passengers.

The area received additional winter precipitation overnight with snow continuing to fall at the time of the wreck.

"We do believe the weather was involved in this deal," said Trooper Shiloh Hall, Oklahoma Highway Patrol.

Hall said roadways were refreezing faster than sand trucks could treat them.

"Just because roadways look clear doesn't mean they're safe to drive maximum speed," he said.

"We need to slow down as much as possible," he said. "I probably recommend 35 miles an hour is about as fast as we need to go out here."

Sapulpa police and fire departments also worked the fatality wreck.

Walkup was not wearing a seatbelt at the time of the crash, OHP said.
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Old 12-09-2013, 08:11 AM   #2
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Ouch! The pickup looks like it was attacked by a can opener! The Jeep is probably toast but looks like the passenger compartment held up fairly well at least from these angles unless the engine area broke thru on the inside. Or the Jeep engine is now inside the pickup!

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Old 12-09-2013, 10:34 AM   #3
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That's a nasty crash.
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Old 12-09-2013, 10:43 AM   #4
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I have been to many crashes and that looks like a great case for seat belt use. We will never now if seat belts would have saved his life but we know for 100% certainty that by not wearing them the driver died.
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Old 12-09-2013, 10:48 AM   #5
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And here we go. We'll get the "Wranglers are dangerous to everyone on the road!" knee-jerk reaction.

I'm actually amazed at how in-tact the cabin on that JK is, compared to that poor truck..
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Old 12-09-2013, 10:56 AM   #6
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And here we go. We'll get the "Wranglers are dangerous to everyone on the road!" knee-jerk reaction.
????
Why would someone say that?


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Originally Posted by ramp4ge View Post
I'm actually amazed at how in-tact the cabin on that JK is, compared to that poor truck..
Agreed, but I don't think it was really a "head to head" collision. It looks more like and offset or near t-bone collision. The truck is in the wrong lane....so I'm guessing it spun into oncoming traffic.

If the roles would have been reversed, I think it would have been just as bad for the Wrangler it's paper thin removable doors.
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Old 12-09-2013, 10:57 AM   #7
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That jeep looks modified...I wonder if he had a steel bumper....might have contributed to his survival.
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Old 12-09-2013, 11:16 AM   #8
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I expect that a steel bumper doesn't crumple as easily as the stock bumper and it would transmit more of the impact of the crash to the frame and therefore the driver and occupants are more likely to be injured. Lots of crumpling around the passenger compartment is better then less.

I still can't believe there are people who drive without seatbelts. Especially when conditions are bad. I grew up without them and they were a pain when they first came out but now days I don't even notice them on.
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Old 12-09-2013, 11:31 AM   #9
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I expect that a steel bumper doesn't crumple as easily as the stock bumper and it would transmit more of the impact of the crash to the frame and therefore the driver and occupants are more likely to be injured. Lots of crumpling around the passenger compartment is better then less.

I still can't believe there are people who drive without seatbelts. Especially when conditions are bad. I grew up without them and they were a pain when they first came out but now days I don't even notice them on.
Well, physics would dictate that if your bumper can't crush, it will transmit the forces elsewhere...in the instance of a tree or a concrete divider, that would be the rest of your vehicle and your spleen. In a car crash, the other vehicle will have to absorb double the force since your vehicle isn't absorbing it's "share."
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Old 12-09-2013, 12:19 PM   #10
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We had a near head on last year, LJR was destroyed. I was unconscious but my wife told me the Mustang that hit us was in pieces. I was lifted and had a Hanson front bumper. Seat belts saved our lives!
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Old 12-09-2013, 02:17 PM   #11
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Seat belts will help to some extent. I have taken belted dead people out of T-Bone collisions as well as direct head on collisions however I will also say that mass usually wins.
I am not great at the physics of it all but 6000# hitting 3000# head on same speed who wins? ><

Now smaller vehicles hitting larger at angles deflects the energy that's how a small car can t-bone you and kill you in a big pickup. There is also that crash that will twist your neck as you hit and if it breaks in the wrong place its time up.
The guy that died was 75 years old and who knows what shape he was in prior to the crash but as stated he greatly decreased his chance of survival by not being belted.
Its sad to see but it doesn't seem to change. People make their own decisions on what degree of risk to take. Its unfortunate that someone had to die. The guy in the Jeep was lucky to some extent as we don't know if he was belted but trunk injuries can be fatal too. They can just take a little longer to kill you.
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Old 12-09-2013, 02:50 PM   #12
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Like a fall from a building it's not the fall that kills you it is the sudden stop at the bottom that does it. The longer it takes to go from 60mph to a dead stop the easier it is on your body. The more your vehicle crumples the longer it takes to come to rest.

Now hit a dump truck travelling at 60mph the other way and not only do you come to a stop but you end up going from 60mph to 60mph in the other direction so pretty much fatal no matter how much your vehicle crumples.

A steel bumper that doesn't crumple doesn't transfer more energy to the other vehicle it just stops your vehicle faster and therefore increases the risk of injury. Each vehicle has a certain amount of energy and the velocity and mass of each determines how much kinetic energy they have. It all must be eliminated if the vehicle is to stop. Now if one has more than the other and it still retains some of its kinetic energy when the first vehicle stops it will start to transfer the remaining energy to the stopped vehicle until they both come to rest.

You can't change the energy transferred all you can do is change what it does. The more things crumple the more energy is absorbed. The longer the crumpling takes place the lower the gforces on your body.

So being seatbelted in place and stopping with your vehicle is much better then the vehicle stopping and you hitting the windshield and steering wheel at 60mph and stopping instantly.

I remember when steering wheels didn't collapse and you had death by impalement on the steering column.
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Old 12-09-2013, 03:27 PM   #13
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Damn, could have been me yesterday in Wichita. Was only going about 30-35 on a 55 and came up on drivers in both lanes only doing 20. When I hit the brakes I started to slide and it was either into the people in front of me or...no one was in oncoming traffic so I just gassed it over across the lanes and missed a mailbox by about a foot. It was pretty scary and I thought I was definitely getting into an accident and at the least $800 in damage, but I was very lucky in a 2010 Jeep Grand Cherokee. I guess some of us aren't so lucky although I did have a seatbelt and I doubt I would have died had I hit somebody, but better not to find out.
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Old 12-09-2013, 03:38 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Well, physics would dictate that if your bumper can't crush, it will transmit the forces elsewhere...in the instance of a tree or a concrete divider, that would be the rest of your vehicle and your spleen. In a car crash, the other vehicle will have to absorb double the force since your vehicle isn't absorbing it's "share."
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A steel bumper that doesn't crumple doesn't transfer more energy to the other vehicle it just stops your vehicle faster and therefore increases the risk of injury. Each vehicle has a certain amount of energy and the velocity and mass of each determines how much kinetic energy they have. It all must be eliminated if the vehicle is to stop. Now if one has more than the other and it still retains some of its kinetic energy when the first vehicle stops it will start to transfer the remaining energy to the stopped vehicle until they both come to rest.

You can't change the energy transferred all you can do is change what it does. The more things crumple the more energy is absorbed. The longer the crumpling takes place the lower the gforces on your body.
I have heard both of these arguments, and frankly, they both make sense on some level. But they can't both be right. I tend to think WorkingMan is right since that is how cars are engineered these days, it sounds right based on what little college physics I remember.
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Old 12-10-2013, 01:46 PM   #15
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BTW, here is what I meant...saw expedition ONE post this on their facebook page....

The Jeep...


The Corolla


The Jeep doesn't have a scratch on it, the corolla has more damage than it would have sustained if hit by a "regular vehicle."

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