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Hesitation when starting off in first gear.

33K views 77 replies 47 participants last post by  SerenaT 
#1 ·
While driving my Jeep today I noticed my 2012 hesitates when I start from a stop. I know how to drive manual so I don't think its my doing. Soon as I touch the gas and start letting off the clutch the rpms dip for a second then I gotta mash the gas to get it going before it dies. Its as if there is a dead space for about a half an inch or so in my gas pedal. I've killed this Jeep more than any manual I have ever owned. The problem with mashing the gas is its starting to get winter time here and the last thing I need is my tires spinning out of control because I have this dead space. Is there any way to fix this? Does anyone else have this issue? Do I just suck at the JK clutch?:hide:
 
#3 ·
Get a sprint booster, or remove one spring from the pedal, I did the former and it helped a lot (night and day), Wrangler's gas pedal (at least mine) is the worst I have used, it's heavy and laggy and not very communicative.
 
#5 ·
While driving my Jeep today I noticed my 2012 hesitates when I start from a stop. I know how to drive manual so I don't think its my doing. Soon as I touch the gas and start letting off the clutch the rpms dip for a second then I gotta mash the gas to get it going before it dies. Its as if there is a dead space for about a half an inch or so in my gas pedal. I've killed this Jeep more than any manual I have ever owned. The problem with mashing the gas is its starting to get winter time here and the last thing I need is my tires spinning out of control because I have this dead space. Is there any way to fix this? Does anyone else have this issue? Do I just suck at the JK clutch?:hide:
I'm experiencing the same issue, and I don't think it is my foot :whistling:
 
#6 ·
Were you on a hill? The JK's with manual tranny's have hill assist, which keeps the brake engaged when you release the brake pedal, giving you time to transition to the gas pedal without the Jeep rolling. I can't remember at what angle it kicks in. I have played with mine, and it doesn't matter how hard I press the brake pedal in. Some on here have stated that it is proportional to how hard you are depressing the brake pedal, but in my experimentation that hasn't been the case. Drive to where you have the Jeep pointing uphill and come to a stop. Then just release the brake pedal and you will see there is a pause of a second or two before it will start to roll backwards. Play with it a little bit, and get a feel for how ling it takes to disengage the brake.
 
#7 ·
It kicks in at a 3% hill grade with standard and an 8% grade with auto. The brakes will stay engaged for about 3 seconds.

I'm going to take mine off when I get it back from the shop. After a week of driving I hated it. Feel like I'm wearing my brakes faster.
 
#9 ·
HSA Off

If you wish to turn off the HSA system, follow this procedure:
1. Start with the engine off and vehicle in PARK (auto- matic transmission) or NEUTRAL with clutch out (manual transmission) with wheels straight. Apply park- ing brake on manual transmission vehicle.
2. Start the engine.
3. With the engine running, the brake applied, and the clutch out, rotate the steering wheel 180° counterclock- wise from center.
4. Press the ESC OFF switch four times within twenty seconds.
5. Rotate the steering wheel 360° clockwise (180° clock- wise from center).
6. Cycle ignition switch OFF then ON.
7. If the sequence was completed properly, the “ESC Activation/Malfunction Indicator Light” will blink sev- eral times to confirm HSA is off.
Steps 1-7 must be completed within 90 seconds to turn off HSA. Repeat steps 1-7 to re-enable HSA functionality.
 
#13 ·
Its not just you. Ive driven standard for 30 years. Started off in a land rover at all of 10 years old. This is the only vehicle ive had that frequently stalls. Hill start is disabled. Its left me hung out to dry a few times in a busy intersection. Quite a scary experience. Find it worse backing up. Especially on any incline. Oddly in reverse, if i dont touch the gas its no problem. Give it slight gas and it will stall easily. Its very weird. You can feel the engine start to struggle, put the clutch in immediately and it will still judder and die. Some fueling issue i guess. Or Hopefully an ignition timing upgrade will fix it at some point. Seems a bit useless that a jeep stalls easily at low speed. First time i wished id went auto.
 
#20 ·
I too have driven a stick since the late 70's including 5 Harley's and large trucks. I've never stalled a vehicle more than with this one. Backing up my driveway is useless. I think I'll disengage the hill assist and see what that does. I've read on here some folks start off in Second gear not sure what difference that makes but I've tried it a few times and it seems to work. I've got a Rubicon so the lower gears may make that possible.
 
#16 ·
Take you foot completely off the gas until the clutch is fully engaged. Then give it a little gas.

The JK electronic throttle will attempt to keep the engine running at idle speed at whatever torque requirement as long as your foot is completely off the gas.
Then, when you step on the gas, the "drive by wire" feature takes over.
At that time, if you are in the "transition", your engine will hesitate.

I have killed mine I don't know how many times while wheeling when I am just letting the electronics do their thing, and then try to just "feather" the gas pedal to get a little more wheel speed while negotiating a steep climb.

Hope all this helps you guys and gals out.

Maybe someone better at typing and all can give a better description of what is going on with the JK "drive by wire" throttle.:thumb:
 
#17 ·
Take you foot completely off the gas until the clutch is fully engaged. Then give it a little gas.

The JK electronic throttle will attempt to keep the engine running at idle speed at whatever torque requirement as long as your foot is completely off the gas.
Then, when you step on the gas, the "drive by wire" feature takes over.
At that time, if you are in the "transition", your engine will hesitate.

I have killed mine I don't know how many times while wheeling when I am just letting the electronics do their thing, and then try to just "feather" the gas pedal to get a little more wheel speed while negotiating a steep climb.

Hope all this helps you guys and gals out.

Maybe someone better at typing and all can give a better description of what is going on with the JK "drive by wire" throttle.:thumb:

I don't get what your saying?

Push clutch to floor
let it all the way out? (this would kill it)
then press gas?

I'm lost
 
#18 ·
Exact same thing here. Best I can figure is that the rpm dips to less than 1,000 where the torque and hp are low. If I cared enough, I'd do the math to figure out that torque applied at that time to the rear wheels was insufficient to overcome initial friction. I've learned that keeping the rpm up around 1200 works.
I'm hoping new rear gears keeps this from happening but we shall see.
 
#22 ·
Exact same thing here. Best I can figure is that the rpm dips to less than 1,000 where the torque and hp are low. If I cared enough, I'd do the math to figure out that torque applied at that time to the rear wheels was insufficient to overcome initial friction. I've learned that keeping the rpm up around 1200 works.
I'm hoping new rear gears keeps this from happening but we shall see.
I dont make a habit of it but with 5:38's and 37's my 3.8 will lug along at 500 rpm
 
#19 ·
i noticed recently, i have a tendency to release the clutch ..fully, and then apply the gas; after initial acceleration. am i still getting accustom to the high release/engagement point on the pedal? i don't know.. but i caught myself doing it with a conscious mind lol
 
#23 ·
With my superchips tune my 07 doesn't lug under under 2K even with 35's.
I can cruise at 1700 easily without lugging.
The sprintbooster/SC combo make drivability 10x better.

Driving a Tj for 10 years, the step up to a JK was a smack in the face.
First mod was the sprintbooster. The tune was more noticeable when I moved up to 35's.

I know the OP posted about his 12 but both the 3.8/3.6 suffer at lower rpms.
 
#24 ·
I know the OP posted about his 12 but both the 3.8/3.6 suffer at lower rpms.
That they do. The TJ guys look at me funny every time I stall, I just ask them if they have ever wheeled a stick shift JK before.
 
#25 ·
I thought it was me. I've been driving stick for 40yrs, yeah I'm an old fart, and never had a problem. The clutch engages early enough, but it doesn't do it gradually. It goes from light engagement to full engagement very quickly. I stalled out more in the 1st 2 weeks than I have in 40 yrs. takes some getting used to, but I finally have it down. Still wouldn't want an auto.
 
#32 ·
My 2012 6sp has had this same hesitation since new. It not only hesitate it will also stall, but it's slightly different than a typical stall. It will be hesitating & I will do the standard clutch slip to keep it going but then it will do start a erractic idle going from less than 100 rpm to around 500. It will do this for about 5-6 cycles then completly die. Usually this JK has been a quick start even when cold outside, but after one of these stalls it will take 2-3 tries to get it going. Needless to say his can be a pucker if it does it when pulling out to join traffic or cross a road. The hesitation ior stalls don't seem to have any consistency to it, warm, cold, dry or wet, on or off road. The hesistation does seem more noticable since putting on my 255/85r16 tires (3.21), but no change in the stalls (less than 1% of the time). I haven't brought this up to the dealership since it just doesn't happen very often & figure that they would equate the hesistation to the 33's with the 3.21's.
 
#33 ·
Are folks really advising to start off in 1st without giving the jeep any gas, and then once moving start giving it gas? That doesn't sound like it would go well. I can get my jeep moving with no gas, sure, by just letting the clutch get to the friction point but if I keep letting off the clutch and don't give it any gas I feel like the jeep will lurch forward and then stall. I know because I accidentally dropped the clutch while still in first in a parking spot one day after starting my jeep and I thought I was going to drive through a liquor store window. I'll give it a try tonight on my way home.

I've never had this much trouble with a manual either. 2012 w 3.73s. 5500 miles in and I still stall from time to time, but most of the times my starts from stop into 1st gear are far from smooth. That's my biggest gripe....I can't get a smooth take-off, and I've been trying feathering things differently every which way from sunday to no avail. And I usually pick up "feel" type things very easily.
 
#34 ·
Sorry to bump this thread but I have about 350 miles on a brand new 13 JKUR 6 speed. Never even drove the auto because for me it is all about feel and fun in driving. This drive by wire or at least the delay the computer has programmed into the throttle response curve has me steaming. You can not feather the throttle at the engagement point at all to fitness the vehicle. Half of the issue for me is also that revs will not drop so its hard in 1st 2hi to negotiate any obstacle from a standstill - popping over a curb for example.

I love manual vehicles and got the Rubi to replace a project 1984 FJ60 with a 4 speed and probably 50 horsepower at the rear wheels. Needless to say that engine will lug way down but because the throttle body does exactly what my damn foot tells it I can drive it anywhere over anything without so much as a hint of clutch burn. The Rubi in 4lo is amazing, I just wish I didn't have to go there to wheel.

Sorry for the long rant I just know what others are feeling with the vague numb throttle clutch feel. It's less than rewarding for a driving enthusiast...

Sprint booster going in tomorrow but I wish they could crack the code on the new computers to override all the horrible fuel efficiency programming.
 
#35 ·
Hey Fellas..... I have this same issue on my 2012 JKU Sport 6spd, w/3.73's and 33" tires. Try this an see if you see any difference in the feel of the gas pedal respons/clutch engage. Start your jeep then hold the TCS button down until the dash light goes out. This will take approx 15-20 seconds. I'm not sure what it does but it makes driving around town MUCH more enjoyable. I have not found anything in print that describes this procedure or what it actually does but it does something. I went out to some gravel roads to test a few things and this is what I found. With the TCS on (no light on dash) little to no wheel spin. with TCS off (2wd, TCS light on) wheel spin as much as you want with a bit better throttle response. Hold TCS button for 15-20 seconds (light on dash comes on then goes off) little to no wheel spin but much better throttle response. In the last scenario, it appears that all TCS functions are working but throttle response is vastly improved.

Let me know what you find on your ride......

Dave
 
#43 ·
Hey Cousing Eddie, Sorry for the delayed response. I tried your traction control hold technique this morning and it might be that I havent drivent he rig in 5 days but wow - Somehting has changed witht he throttle mapping and response... How did you think of trying this? I wonder if it gets rid of the torque monitiring that is built into the system? It must reset to the original setting everytime it is shut off?

Another thing I noticed when wheeling for the first time in this 13' rubi two weeks ago that when in 4hi the throttle response and ability to lug lower seemed improved as well. I was idling through some rough rutted out terrain where in 2 hi on pavement and a 1% slope it dies...

I have decided to hold off on installing the Sprintbooster until I have about 1500 miles on the odometer because there are some definite changes going on through the break in.

I spoke to Diablo sport last week and they have broken the code on the 11' and 12' computers but don't have a tune for the 13' (12' is out) yet so it is coming. I think this will be the best way to adjust the throttle response as it gets rid of the lag and torque monitoring in the computer itself where the sprintbooster simply "accelerates" the signal to the computer. I still feel this would have a great effect I would just rather nip the issue at the source... And they are the ones that mentioned there was some sort of torque monitoring in the computer which is the lag you feel when shifting take up ect. It must be designed to smooth out the power delivery but I also suspect it is designed to save the powertrain for the 5 year 100K warranty.

If all of this interference was out of the way I suspect this engine and jeep would be a rocket ship...
 
#36 ·
I also am glad to see that I'm not the only experienced manual trans driver stalling his new wrangler. The throttle response is designed to smooth out rough terrain driving, but I also have stalled this thing more than any other. You can see the intended behavior of this when you go down a smooth road at a steady speed and hit the throttle a couple of times fast and there is no reaction.
I think the hill holder makes it worse, I do better if I turn down the radio at stop lights so I can listen to the engine. Will stay tuned to this thread to hear if anyone else has the solution.
 
#37 ·
Well, I'll add to the "not just me" voices here. Three of my vehicles are manuals and I've mostly driven manuals for close to 50 years, including lotsa high performance and drag cars. This '13 JKUL Freedom w 3.73's takes the cake for crappy clutch take up and throttle response. I do love this Jeep, but after 10 weeks of ownership the drivability of this 6 spd is not what I wanted. What is the Sprint Booster. Guess I can search it and find out. A solution is def in order as I've killed it in intersections several times and feel like a fool.......which pisses me off.
 
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