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3K views 57 replies 20 participants last post by  mouse1 
#1 ·
Where do you think this brand is headed?
 
#2 ·
Multi-National, Multi-Generational, multi-gender - Appeal.
Translation: Watered down

Obviously just one man's opinion but it will not head in the direction most here would want to see it head IMO.
No way you can sell spicey food on a mass scale which is why store bought "Hot" usually ain't very hot.
It's all about the $$ and being hardcore and pandering to the off-road purist will be the arena of the after-market Mod money makers.
OEM will be a broad brush approach.
 
#3 ·
I can see truth to your statement. I feel it also. Even by some of the posts on this forum that the buyer nowadays is not the same as it once was. The jeep purists that keep this brand alive all these years is being ignored for leather and heated seats crowd. Sad.
 
#4 ·
I wish that these brands would make actual offroad versions of these vehicles seperate from the weeney crowd.

Call it what you want.

Jeep "trail rated" (fix it so it isn't stupid)
Actually trail rate your vehicles and offer trail rated and non trail rated versions.

The non trail rated would have heated seats, leather, heated steering wheel, open diff, Highway tires, etc etc.

The trail rated versions would have more offroad options and not offer the creature comforts.

The other brands could do something similar

GMC ORD (off road division) etc, etc, etc.
 
#7 ·
I wish that these brands would make actual offroad versions of these vehicles seperate from the weeney crowd. Call it what you want. Jeep "trail rated" (fix it so it isn't stupid) Actually trail rate your vehicles and offer trail rated and non trail rated versions. The non trail rated would have heated seats, leather, heated steering wheel, open diff, Highway tires, etc etc. The trail rated versions would have more offroad options and not offer the creature comforts. The other brands could do something similar GMC ORD (off road division) etc, etc, etc.
You know more than Chrysler's VP of marketing. I am not kidding either. I agree with you. I had a "trail rated" compass the other week (rental). It had the exact same badge as my Rubicon. Really!!? Wtf. I don't think so.

It did however have great headlights (low and high) and stock grille inserts that looked pretty tough.
 
#5 ·
Why do you think I call them "Just another SUV in JEEP's clothing"?
 
#14 ·
I don't think off road people will ever be happy with what comes out of the factory. Auto companies are going to build for the masses and hard core off roaders are a small percent. Look at the Ford Raptor great truck out of the box but 95% are driven by soccer moms. I had to order a wrangler just to get a manual with power windows in a Willys. Jeep should bring back the 2wd JKU for all the mall crawlers that will never use the 4wd. Just my opinion.
 
#15 ·
The market for "hard core" off-roaders is TINY. While I think that there should be an option to buy a Rubicon like vehicle with rubber floor mats, manual windows, no AC and other de-contenting, it isn't realistic.

Think about the AC for a minute... they would likely have to re-engineer the whole HVAC system to offer a version without AC. There would certainly have to be a completely engineered solution for roll-up windows. Would that add so much cost that it would overwhelm the savings from not having those systems?

Obviously carpet is a different matter...

But think for a minute. If you could save $2000 on a completely stripped out Rubicon, would it really be worth it? What about the resale?

What one might be able to make a business case (but not likely a profit case) would be a version with D60 axles, factory 37"+ tires, central tire inflation/deflation, a V8... think 6.4L here... and all sorts of other extreme performance goodies. It would be a "halo car" for the brand. It would likely be VERY limited in production, uber-expensive and perhaps even involve losing money on every one built, but it would define the brand. It would probably be subbed out to AEV or someone like that and cost closer to $100k. Think "off-road Viper" or ZR1.
 
#22 ·
Think about the AC for a minute... they would likely have to re-engineer the whole HVAC system to offer a version without AC.
Ummm... did you not realize that AC is an expensive ($1245, iirc) option that has to be ADDED to the Wrangler?

There would certainly have to be a completely engineered solution for roll-up windows.
You mean like the roll-up windows on my 2014 JK Willys Wheeler?

I feel like I must be missing something obvious here. Either that or you haven't looked at anything but loaded Rubis and Saharas in awhile. ;)
 
#17 ·
...wa....w-w-wait......you mean my 'trail rated off road roadster' will NOT be having the titanium suspension/carbon fiber-graphene frame-body/variable electronic cammed turbodiesel/4 wheel steerable/vertical lift/ducted ground effect floatation/submersible 2017 model year Wrangler???

Guess the current Wrangler-transformer model line will have to do for now.
 
#25 ·
Trail Rated should be one specific spec. The vehicle either meets it, or it doesn't. If it meets it, it gets the Trail Rated badge.

I don't like that Jeep adjusts and modifies what Trail Rated means for each of its vehicles so that they all pass. IMHO, that's downright cheating.

Hell, my MINI Cooper could be Trail Rated, if you just modify the requirements enough. Like, change 30" of water depth to 30mm of water.
 
#26 ·
Trail Rated should be one specific spec. The vehicle either meets it, or it doesn't. If it meets it, it gets the Trail Rated badge.
As far as I am concerned 'trail rated' simply means skid plates. The easiest way to see this is on the Grand Cherokee. When you research the specs of a 'trail rated' GC and one that is not (depending on upgrades) the only difference is the skidplates.
 
#28 ·
There was a time when the Jeep brand and the Wrangler were synonymous but things are changing and they are changing fast. The Wrangler continues to be the flagship of the brand since it represents its off-road heritage but if you pay attention to their commercials :jaw drop: you might notice off-road is rapidly turning into scenic views, carrying sports gear and very mild trails; similar to what generic SUV commercials look like.

No offense against those that don't drive off-road but they are the majority and growing and the question is "How long will Jeep need to build a highly capable off-road Wrangler that conflicts with CAFE to boost it's sales of the its other vehicles?" Part of the answer may be how many of us off road enthusiasts exist in the future.

It is likely that some features will start to disappear. IMO, the three features that are in most danger are the drop-down windshield, the front axle and the throwback boxy design (aerodynamics). They may survive in the upcoming 2016/2017 redesign but it's unlikely they will both survive in next design cycle. Many have stated they couldn't care less about the drop-down windshield but they fail to realize that feature virtually guarantees that the Wrangler will not convert to a unibody design.

It doesn't help that the Wrangler has no direct competition which validates the existence of the market. Hopefully the Ford Bronco concept makes it to market, Toyota brings back an improved version of the F40/FJ and even Hummer reintroduces passenger vehicles.

Harley's are in a very similar position.
 
#33 ·
It doesn't help that the Wrangler has no direct competition which validates the existence of the market. Hopefully the Ford Bronco concept makes it to market, Toyota brings back an improved version of the F40/FJ and even Hummer reintroduces passenger vehicles. Harley's are in a very similar position.[/QUOTE

So true. Competition will be the best thing for the Wrangler
 
#34 ·
I'm in Australia and bought my JK wrangler new from dealer. No trail rated badges on it or any of the other Jeeps I saw in the yard.

Must mean I have to stick to the pavement. Damn.

But seriously. It's a badge. No different to the Rubicon sticker. If you buy a sport, put lockers on it and quick disconnects and better Dana's on it - it'll do the same thing, regardless of the sticker.

Who really cares? Trail rated or not. The brand will do anything to sell themselves. And even if people never intend on going off road -- having the option is the biggest winner.

My JK is a daily driver. But I use it up the beach every chance I get and up the mountains every other chance I get. It goes off road - some of the places I go for work, you don't have the option of a paved road.

But I have only taken it to one "trail" once. I personally never saw point in buying a car just do a circuit. Its like buying a sports car with the intention of only doing track days. If it's meant for that purpose, awesome. But most people don't have money for that big of a toy.

That doesn't mean I don't want a car that can do both, though. And like I said, some places here, you need a car that can do both. Badge or otherwise.
 
#35 ·
#39 ·
But the thing is Jeep doesn't have a definition of Trail Rated either, they said that it varies from vehicle to vehicle. Which is why the Renegade and Cherokee can be trail rated.. and a Grand Cherokee with skid plates is trail rated, but remove the skid plates and the same GC is not.

Just as trails are rated 1 thru whatever, the trail ratings should follow the same suite. It would make more sense and would be easier to quantify.
 
#42 ·
Note at the Jeep 'trail rated' video there is Wrangler with WINDSHIELD DOWN @ :56 and 1:23. They don't linger on it so keep your eyes on the blue JK and ready to push the pause button.

I've never seen a JK in actual daily use with the wind screen down position before.
 
#53 ·
I am willing to bet that the most off-road prepared version, the Rubicon, is also one of the most heavily premium-ized versions. If tons of people were ordering bare bones Rubis or sports with only the "hard core" options, Jeep would extend their offerings in that direction. Instead, people paying $45G for a vehicle want AC and leather, so that is what gets offered.
 
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