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Old 11-27-2012, 12:22 AM   #1
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Jk fog lights

Anyone know how to keep the for lights on with the high beams on a 2010 JK?

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Old 11-27-2012, 12:27 AM   #2
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Anyone know how to keep the for lights on with the high beams on a 2010 JK?
err.. why?

If I understood correctly, the high beam illumination range works even in a fog; whereas the low beam, being aimed in a limited range, necessitates the fog lights.. Also, if it's thick fog, I'd sure go slow, at which point over-riding the low beam would no longer be a problem.

Also, I've been noticing lately, a lot of cars hereabouts where I live that keep the fog lights on, even though the fog hasn't even started thinking about showing it's face.. It's an eyesore looking at 'em cars; literally! But, I digress..

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Old 11-27-2012, 03:05 AM   #3
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USDOT regs won't allow it.

If you turn on high beam headlights in thick fog, you will get light backscatter from the fog and be effectively blind since the light will illuminate only the cloud in front of the vehicle. Never use high beams during a fog.

Fog lights are designed to be mounted low to illuminate the area directly in front of and to the sides of the vehicle. Rear fog brake lights on Euro spec vehicles do the same for the rear of the vehicle.
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Old 11-27-2012, 04:20 AM   #4
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I like the extra light when the fog lights are on when using the high beams. Would not use the high beams in fog anyway. Have not got to use the fog beams for their intended use yet. I do leave them on all the time during the day when on the highway along with the headlights.
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:24 PM   #5
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DOT regulations don't care about individual desires; they make regulations that the manufacturers WILL follow.

My state specifically has statute against allowing fogs on with high beam.
I had to look it up last year to prove it to myself.
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:31 PM   #6
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May not be helpful but I know on TJs in order to have the fogs on and the high beams you have to bend one of the prongs on the fog light relay under the hood to where it doesn't connect this allows the high beams to no recognize your fogs being on it may be similar with a JK
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:37 PM   #7
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My humble request:
Don't use fogs unless you're in a fog or you're offroad.. it's rude to the driver coming the other way, because it's s/he that suffers..

Pretty much like using high beams when you don't need them..
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:41 PM   #8
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2five22 is right. You are not supposed to have your fogs and brights on at the same time

BUT

There is a kit out there for the Liberty that ties a relay to the high beam as the controller circuit with direct power from the battery so when you hit the highs, the power to the fogs is cut off from the factory fog switch but the relay opens up and powers the fogs directly off the battery.

It won't work directly on the JK though due to the PWM issue. It will fry the relay. You would have to electricly isolate the relay with a capacitor / diode circuilt to achieve a "steady state" voltage the same as if you were converting to LED's

But it can be done
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:47 PM   #9
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and do not think you can power both the highs & fogs on the same circuit. Yes it will function initially, but you will eventually have problems with fuses blowing once the temps go up. The column switch may also have an issue with it.
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:58 PM   #10
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Just to comment on using fogs when there is no fog...sorry but my headlights are crap and I use my fogs to better illuminate the road in front of me at night. There are also a lot of deer in my area, so I figure the more light the better and it helps me see off to the side a little more. Does running with my fogs on actually bother other drivers? Seems to me, my eyes hurt the most when I pass someone with HIDs or similar type headlights way more than fog lights.
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Old 11-27-2012, 03:09 PM   #11
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x2. Fog lights, if aimed properly, are not going to be offensive to an oncoming driver. They are mounted low for a reason.
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Old 11-27-2012, 03:11 PM   #12
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Damn the OP was asking for help on something he wanted to do, I didnt read anything in the post asking for someone to tell him why he shouldnt do it.

Sorry if I knew how I would let you know, but this is one mod I have never looked into.
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Old 11-27-2012, 03:16 PM   #13
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Damn the OP was asking for help on something he wanted to do, I didnt read anything in the post asking for someone to tell him why he shouldnt do it.

Sorry if I knew how I would let you know, but this is one mod I have never looked into.
It worked really well on the KJ. Easy to install. But the JK electrical system is a completely different animal.
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Old 11-27-2012, 03:27 PM   #14
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I recall back in the early 80's a CJ I drove had the amber fogs. When or why did the ambers go away ?

I was always told to run fogs with low beams. I had KC fogs mounted to the windshield and in fog or low visibility operations the fogs would bounce off the hood and distract your vision.
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Old 11-27-2012, 05:54 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enjerhoo

It worked really well on the KJ. Easy to install. But the JK electrical system is a completely different animal.
That's not what I was ranting about.
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Old 11-27-2012, 06:00 PM   #16
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why not just disconnect the factor driving lights from the stock harness and wire it from the battery with a fuse and relay to a switch inside the cab?
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Old 11-27-2012, 07:15 PM   #17
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Could always run a light bar and some additional lights. Then wire seperate from headlights and have the switch only work with a relay when the Jeep is powered. That is what I did. I can run my PIAA lights regardless of headlights, highbeams or fogs. And yes only when on a backroad where there are NO people.

And agreed on not piggybacking on other circuits. CANBus system will not like that one bit!

Lights (Silverstar bulbs) + Fogs (Putco bulbs) + PIAA lights = sight.
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Old 11-27-2012, 07:22 PM   #18
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why not just disconnect the factor driving lights from the stock harness and wire it from the battery with a fuse and relay to a switch inside the cab?
Very easy to do this. KC has a wiring kit for $17 or something. It's a good kit
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Old 11-27-2012, 10:14 PM   #19
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I did this on my other car. I installed HID in the low beams and fogs. When you hit the high beams it would turn off the fogs and lows i think and back on after the highs were off, obviously that's not good for the HID ballasts so a lot of people did the mod to keep them from turning off. It was a simple bending or breaking off of a tab on the fog relay. Similar to what hagler123 said. I'm not sure why you're getting so much grief, I see tons of people driving with fog lights on normal days. Doesn't affect me, not blinding at all.

It might be similar on JK but I don't know for sure. I'm sure someone knows or is willing to find out
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Old 11-27-2012, 10:29 PM   #20
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I don't know why you want to do this, and the Canbuss would have fits. Taking the fog lights out of the factory wiring and using an overlay harness could work. IMHO a better solution would be to add a pair of driving lights with an overlay harness, with diode/capacitor protection wired to come on with the high beam. Another good solution, for better light, would be to replace the factory head lights with Hellas, Cibies, Trucklites etc and the appropriate overlay harness.
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:12 AM   #21
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why not just disconnect the factor driving lights from the stock harness and wire it from the battery with a fuse and relay to a switch inside the cab?
you will have to deal with the PWM issue to protect the relay.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:32 AM   #22
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Yes it is possible, just wether they will activate it or not is the question. Export vehicles like ours down under can come on with parking lights and stay on with normal headlights and with high beam.
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Old 11-30-2012, 09:13 PM   #23
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Dont think Im understanding what the big deal is -- Whats the big issue with fogs and High beam? For all practical purpose and if you are using your high beams the way you should be, who cares if you have both on at the same time, if having both high beams and fog lights on helps illuminate your way through the night safely then I say go for it....
Once again if your the only one on the road then how can it be a bad idea.?
I just recently replaced my stock fog light with the Pilot 203 driving lights and changed my crappy stock bulbs with the Phillips extreme 80+.....well let me tell ya for the combined $70 it was a BIG improvement over stock and I would recommend to all ... The install for both took maybe an hour..
Now I can see lots better at night..

And actually my next project is rewiring my fog ( now driving lights) to stay on when my high beams are lit...simply because the Phillips did add a small increase to the high beams but nothing compared to the improvement of the low beam.. and Im looking to get a better driving experiance when Im alone on the road... So no fear I will dim my high beams when I see you coming my way

No worries !
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:34 AM   #24
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damn the op was asking for help on something he wanted to do, i didnt read anything in the post asking for someone to tell him why he shouldnt do it.

Sorry if i knew how i would let you know, but this is one mod i have never looked into.

^^^^^^ x 37 ^^^^^^^^^
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:51 AM   #25
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I roll with the fogs on all the time because the factroy headlights suck soooo much

Interesting read on this:
http://www.danielsternlighting.com/t...fog_lamps.html
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Old 12-01-2012, 11:28 AM   #26
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I run PIAA Xtreme white bulbs in the factory headlight housings and they are a huge improvement over stock bulbs. For extra light to complement the factory HB I run a pair of LightForce 170s wired in to a relay using the HB power as a trigger wire. So when I shut down the HB the LightForce lights shut down as well. I also have a switch to shut them down independently for when HB is needed but too much traffic for the LightForce. These LightForce lights are uncomfortably bright for people 1/2 mile away, but awesome for spotting moose and deer in the ditches.
I suggest to anyone, before you do anything else, take you Jeep on a dark road and adjust your headlights and fogs properly. The factory HL have a very narrow beam, too high and they are crap, too low and they are crap. Lined up right and they are not too bad with a better bulb. I also found that moving the factory fogs out closer to the ends of the bumper makes them more effective.
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Old 12-03-2012, 12:22 PM   #27
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Excerpts from the article.. Some emphasis marked by me.

Quote:
In clear conditions, more foreground light is not a good thing, it's a bad thing. Some foreground light is necessary so you can use your peripheral vision to see where you are relative to the road edges, the lane markings and that pothole 10 feet in front of your left wheels. But foreground light is far less safety-critical than light cast well down the road into the distance, because at any significant speed (much above 30 mph), what's in the foreground is too close for you to do much about. If you increase the foreground light, your pupils react to the bright, wide pool of light by constricting, which in turn substantially reduces your distance vision—especially since there's no increase in down-the-road distance light to go along with the increased foreground light. It's insidious, because high levels of foreground light give the illusion, the subjective impression, of comfort and security and "good lighting".

US-DOT headlamps have historically tended to provide relatively low, arguably inadequate levels of light in the foreground and to the sides. Many US DOT headlamps have what seems to be a "black hole" in front of the car, with essentially the entire beam concentrated in a narrow band or ball of light thrown into the distance. With headlamps like these, a decent argument can be made for the use of fog lamps to fill the "black hole", that is, to add-back the missing foreground and lateral-spread light when driving at moderate speeds on dark and/or twisty roads. Of course, lamps to rectify inadequate foreground light must be thoughtfully and carefully selected, correctly aimed and properly used. Otherwise, they're useless at best and dangerous at worst.
Quote:
Their extra downward light can help compensate for the tendency of water to "soak up" the light on the road from your headlamps. But, this extra downward light hitting a road surface shiny with water or ice will also create high levels of reflected glare for other drivers. Since we're all "other drivers" to everybody else on the road, it's well to think of roadway safety as a cooperative effort. In most driving situations, fog lamps are neither useful nor necessary, but more people use their fog lamps when the prevailing conditions don't call for their use, than use them when the conditions do call for their use.
So


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Damn the OP was asking for help on something he wanted to do, I didnt read anything in the post asking for someone to tell him why he shouldnt do it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by n6hal View Post
^^^^^^ x 37 ^^^^^^^^^

haters can hate!

I was only trying to help; both the OP and everyone else.

In response to WatchThis, people often ask how to do "something" assuming that that "something" is what they want, when what they really wanted was something else entirely..
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Old 12-03-2012, 03:54 PM   #28
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Excerpts from the article..

Quote:
US-DOT headlamps have historically tended to provide relatively low, arguably inadequate levels of light in the foreground and to the sides. Many US DOT headlamps have what seems to be a "black hole" in front of the car, with essentially the entire beam concentrated in a narrow band or ball of light thrown into the distance. With headlamps like these, a decent argument can be made for the use of fog lamps to fill the "black hole", that is, to add-back the missing foreground and lateral-spread light when driving at moderate speeds on dark and/or twisty roads. Of course, lamps to rectify inadequate foreground light must be thoughtfully and carefully selected, correctly aimed and properly used. Otherwise, they're useless at best and dangerous at worst.
A minor issue with the quote is that it has a caveat for US Drivers.
This issue is what I fix running the fogs with the low beams.
I cannot see much of anything to the sides or right in front.

On the other hand, running with them with the highs at speed do nothing really as they are easy to out run. Better headlights would be a better cure. More lights when running slow in the back country is good too.
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Old 12-03-2012, 06:22 PM   #29
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A minor issue with the quote is that it has a caveat for US Drivers.
This issue is what I fix running the fogs with the low beams.
I cannot see much of anything to the sides or right in front.

On the other hand, running with them with the highs at speed do nothing really as they are easy to out run. Better headlights would be a better cure. More lights when running slow in the back country is good too.
Don't disagree.. But in that case, you're essentially using the fog light as an available option that can easily be converted to give the extra spread at low speed situations. (And not using a fog light as a fog light.) And you wouldn't need that in areas with street lights etc or where you can use the headlights of the vehicle in front of you (aka where there is traffic)..

My annoyance is with people that think more light is good/safe; and turn on the fog because it's another light that you can turn on!
Doesn't work that way; you see more with optimal light, than by trying to floodlight everything, because the pupil of your eye is a biological thing that adjusts according to the range of intensity and not just responds linearly to intensity..
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:24 PM   #30
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In electronics we call it the K&L factor.
People like knobs, shiny lights and switches...
Das blinkenlights sind gut!

I do believe that you are correct in your statements in regards to over use of lights.

However, I do believe the stock head light on low are atrocious and I think that Stern is correct with adding fog even in common everyday driving situations can aid and if setup correctly will not hinder other drivers. I use is as supplemental.

I live in the burbs and find that in many not so well lit areas, such as driving to my house, that if something darts out within 10' radius of the front of rig, I have no hope of seeing them at 30mph with just the stock headlights and normal traffic flow, but with the driving lights that changes dramatically. In these situation I cannot use High beams, but need something more. I also find this to be true on the freeway around here with light traffic, where there is not a lot of overhead lighting, the lows only are downright dangerous in these situations. I might check out the TruckLite to see if they have a better dispersion pattern so I wont have to use the fogs, but money is being spent elsewhere...

I have owned a CJ and now a JK and in both situations the stock lighting is pathetic. My Honda Fit the lighting is great and so was my lifted 97 Tacoma 4x4 and my ZR2 Blazer. The head lights in the JK reminds me of my 74 Jensen Healey, almost nonexistent really...

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