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Old 06-12-2013, 02:58 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by joeuncool View Post
Tell him to take the doors AND TOP off of an FJ (fake jeep?) and then you can begin the discussion.
Because being able to take the top and doors off equates to off road capability in what way? Makes it easier to drive a trail but does nothing to improve the capability of the truck.

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Old 06-12-2013, 03:06 AM   #62
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Are they still shipping every FJ from the factory with a white cane to help you with all the blind spots?
That's the main reason I went for my JKU over the FJ. Originally went for the FJ due to my experience with Wranglers from the 90's. Didn't even get off the lot with the FJ. Just sitting in it waiting for the salesman to get the keys was enough for me. I felt like I was sitting in an enclosed box.

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The JKU is just as bad.
The JKU is nowhere near as bad as the FJ on blind spots.

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Old 06-19-2013, 11:58 PM   #63
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My seven year old was always complaining about not being able to see outside in the FJ. So one day I rode around in the back and quickly understood what he meant. Back window is small and too far forward and out front was not much better. Bought a JKU and he loves it. If a seven year old can figure it out.......
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Old 06-20-2013, 02:05 AM   #64
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i've owned a 2007 (first year) 6-speed FJ Cruiser and it is a solid but quirky vehicle. It's all wheel drive, in the manual, and it locks the center when in 4-lo plus you lock the rear diff if you need to. I had a couple dangerous moments with the all wheel drive on pavement where one tire grabbed more than the other up front and literally almost ripped the steering wheel out of my hand. This was my fault mostly as I just kept at speed going over a raised railroad track.

It's just as capable as any other showroom floor off-roader. It has blind spots for sure but the little mirrors you stick on get around that. The rear quarter doors are annoying with the suicide opening position. I never like that the rear window wasn't powered to go down. With just the two windows you can open it sucked on the freeway or at fast speeds as you would get the helicopter effect and air was slamming into my left ear. Even though my 2-door only has the two windows that go down something about ti's size I'm guessing makes it so it doesn't do this. Other than that I really enjoyed my FJ and never had a problem with it, ever, just regular maintenance.

The reason I own a Jeep now is I wanted a smaller vehicle, Toyotas are just getting bigger and bigger, and I've never had anything convertible so why not get a JKR!

I've driven both, my FJ for 6 years and my JKR for almost 6 months now and they are apples and oranges but your basic off-road capability is almost identical. I'm not a brand loyalist but I have a spot in my heart for Toyotas simply because I have only used their vehicles to off-road over the past couple decades. The Jeep is just as fun if not more just because of it's size and all the configurations you can put it in to go topless!

Wranglers are a very unique experience and that's what it's really got going for it. The front locker on my Rubicon doesn't hurt either!
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Old 06-20-2013, 08:32 AM   #65
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To add insult to injury, the FJ is ugly as hell.
Haha, best point so far.
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Old 06-20-2013, 08:15 PM   #66
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Only one thing needs to be said about the FJ: not a jeep.
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Old 06-20-2013, 10:10 PM   #67
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Only one thing needs to be said about the FJ: not a jeep.

So FJ does stand for "FAKE JEEP", right?
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Old 06-22-2013, 09:42 AM   #68
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Ffj

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So FJ does stand for "FAKE JEEP", right?
Hahaha! Maybe they should have added another F for Fugly Fake Jeep. Maybe the F just stands for Fail.
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Old 06-22-2013, 09:50 AM   #69
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Buncha threads like this...they seem to crop up every summer. All I can say is, please.

FJ Cruiser is a wannabe. I know peeps mod em to do offroad stuff, but trying to compare them to a Wrangler is like comparing a Cruller to a standard doughnut.

With the Jeep being the Cruller, of course.

FJC peeps, you lose.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:18 AM   #70
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Toyota quality may be legendary, but not with manual transmissions. My buddies 5 year old FJ has less than 30,000 miles and they've had to replace clutch components 3 times. If it wasn't under warranty he would have to shelled out over $1200. Less than 10% of FJs are manuals and there is a design problem with the way the clutch and throwout bearing line up. FYI he spends way more time in that thing off road than on-road, and yes, he does know how to drive a stick.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:34 AM   #71
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:47 AM   #72
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I don't know if I should post this but, the reason I went with the JKU over the FJ is because I wanted something similar to what I used to go off roading in. I have always had older Ramchargers with the top off. The last year for that was 1980, seeing as that put the newest one at 33 years old and parts are really hard to find for them. I went with the JKUR, because it seem to be the most capable for off roading. By the way, my wife sells vehicles for Toyota.
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Old 08-21-2013, 11:52 AM   #73
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My wife and I actually had a 07' fj cruiser prior to our 2011 jku, we drove the fj for 136,000 miles before selling it. In all honesty I probably would have bought another one if I did not stumble across the jku deal, it was WAY WAY too good to pass up. Ended up less than $25k w double top, 10k miles, fully loaded sahara, remote start, heated leather, nav, and all the fancy crap. We like it, but there jack$hit for towing capacity compared to the fj, and the fj did ride nicer. All around the jku is much more fun to drive but the fj was much more practical for daily usage.
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:14 PM   #74
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I've wheeled with a dude and his FJ. It did well. I wouldn't knock it, but it aint for me. Now, if I couldn't have me Jeeps, the FJ be a contender.
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:40 PM   #75
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Tough guys don't go round telling people how tough they are.
Mmm, that's an over-generalization. The toughest guy I know tells all kinds of stories about guys he has beaten up, and isn't shy about sharing the fact that he hits hard. But, every one of his friends says he doesn't even remember the half of the stories, and that he hits harder than even he claims (including guys that have sparred with him).

Tangent, I know.
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Old 08-21-2013, 01:54 PM   #76
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The perspective of a mall crawler {comparing JK (not JKU) to an FJ}:

Traded my '10 JK in for an '11 FJ. Yep, I tend to buy new cars/trucks about once a year. I get bored. I also grew tired of my old interior. It scratched too easily and it just looked like cheap plastic.

Initially I enjoyed the FJ. Decent handling and performance (remember, I had the old 3.8 to compare it with) on paved roads. As soon as the novelty wore off, I soon noticed the excess wind noise emanating around the front windshield and the front side windows/rear view mirrors. The buffeting became an annoyance, especially on the highway.

The front windshield was extremely difficult to clean. At just over 5-11" I could never reach the center of the windshield. Very annoying, because the angle of the front windshield is similar to the JK's front windshield.

The FJ is essentially an SUV. I bought it because it's the only SUV with only two doors, notwithstanding the half doors. I actually like this feature.
I prefer the JK over the JKU, so the experience of going from a JK to an FJ for me, was like going from a sports car to a big sedan. The JK is short and sweet, the FJ is just another medium sized SUV. It's a lot longer than the JK...

The enormous blind spots at the rear side windows, to include to a lesser extent, the poor visibility to the rear, prompted me to trade it in after only two yrs. My wife hated driving it. She loved the JK.

I couldn't stand the skinny/non-leather steering wheel of the FJ. Hated it!

The turning radius of the FJ sucked compared to the JK.

The only thing I liked about the FJ over the JK was the solid roof/top.
I always feared my leaky HT.

I was hoping Jeep would bring back the single piece HT (at least make it an option), like I had on my '00 TJ, so that I could order me another Jeep.
Jeep are you listening???

From my perspective, the JK (remember, two doors folks) and the FJ could not be anymore different. The only thing these two vehicles have in common is four wheel drive. It's apples and oranges with these two vehicle.

My two cents...

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Old 08-21-2013, 03:26 PM   #77
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OK, so....

I bought a Toyota FJ in April of 2006, one of the first around and I just traded it in July for a 2 door Wrangler (not an Unlimited). I believe I can speak to this subject with some authority.

The FJC is a VERY CAPABLE off-roader but is NOT as capable as a Jeep in many cases. Much of this was already mentioned, but here are some differences....

1. The FJC has independent front suspension and NOT a solid front axle. This means a smoother ride but less articulation on the trail.

2. It takes lots of driving the FJC to feel comfortable based on the miserable sight lines all over the vehicle. Front, sides and rear views are all obscured in some way. Driving down the highway, it isn't too bad if you have blindspot mirrors attached to your sideviews (which I did), but on the trail this can be lethal. I took mine offroad enough to be very comfortable driving in tight spots and backing up/turning around but it was at time unnerving without a spotter along ledges. Driving the Wrangler is a revelation in that I can see all around me with the top/doors off and even with everything on it is so much easier to see.

3. I suspect that the FJC would be more reliable over the course of its lifetime. Even Jeep owners will attest to the fact that you're still "buying a Chrysler"... In seven years I never had a single issue with the FJ and performed only the standard oil changes, fluids, etc... My Jeep already clicks and squeals and rattles and the engine makes crazy sounds. The thing is that if you EXPECT it and know that "It's a Jeep thing", it won't drive you too crazy.

4. The FJC comes standard with a locking rear differential and Toyota's "ATRAC" control system, which is really an awesome system. The Jeep's "Command-Trac" system is just as good but to get a standard locker one must pony up for the Rubicon.

5. My FJ did not come with downhill assist (they might have that now?). My Jeep came with it as an option. I tested out this feature this past weekend and once again Jeep did not disappoint. I would feel confident using this on some of the steepest terrain around saving the breaks and keeping the vehicle under control. I would have to put my FJ in 4 Lo and use first gear to get a similar effect, but it did not function nearly as well as the Jeep system.

6. Modifications are much easier to perform and parts are very easy to come by for Jeeps. Toyota has a decent aftermarket network as well, but Jeeps have anything and everything and people know how to apply decades of knowledge working on Jeeps here in the US.

7. Believe it or not, the backseat is MUCH more cramped in the FJ than even the two door Wrangler. Additionally, there are only tiny boat-like windows in the backseat for any passengers to try to look out. I was never back there, so I didn't care but it you are toting anybody around it is bad.

8. The FJ comes standard with rubberized floor. This is something that I really wish Jeep would consider. This was VERY nice for simply hosing or wiping out after mudding it up.

9. The approach/breakaway angles are better on the Jeep, allowing for the ability to go more places and get over more rocks and inclines/declines on the trail.

10. I believe that the water fording specs are nearly identical at 30".

11. The Pentastar engine is more powerful than the standard FJ.

12. FJ has an inclinometer standard that comes in handy.

13. The FJ is much longer and wider than the 2-door Wrangler meaning the turning radius is much better on the Wrangler (this is very important off and on-road) and you can go more places in the Wrangler where the FJ just doesn't fit.

Overall, I wheeled the FJ all over and it basically went over everything that I pointed it at. It was a terrific vehicle. Its on-road manners compared to the Wrangler are far superior. So, why the Jeep for me? I was sick of seeing people driving around with tops/doors off and I was sick of the claustrophobic feeling of driving the FJ.

But, I've always wanted a Jeep and knew I'd get as good or better off-road capabilities right out of the box. I was able to add a lift and bigger tires and now the price of my Jeep is about the same as an equivalent FJ. I am about 4" higher in ground clearance, have better tires, far better field of vision, can remove doors/top, can articulate more and have better angles for about the same price. The only thing I wish I had (and it is a big whiff) are the rear lockers.

From strictly an intangible aspect, the Wrangler is 100% more fun to drive either on road or off. THIS, to me, is of colossal importance. I drive my Jeep every day with no purpose in mind...JUST FOR THE FUN OF IT. I rarely did that with the FJ. This is good for my state of mind. I'm a Jeep guy now (barring any massive quality issues) and I proudly wave to all fellow Jeepsters. I've already attended a local meet and greet and met some TREMENDOUS individuals. There is no fellowship within the FJ community. I would buy the Jeep 100 times out of 100 if I had it to do over again.

Just my $0.02...
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Old 08-21-2013, 05:27 PM   #78
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i wouldn't exactly knock the FJ, i was honestly thinking of jumping on one a few years back but just didn't have the heart to get rid of my Evo then. i even frequented an FJ forum for a few weeks. they have quite abit of aftermarket support and i seen alot pics and vids of these guys taking them off roading and through hell.

Now comparing to a jeep, i can't say its real competition but its definetly a decent off road vehicle. My father even suggested i should look into those as well but im just dead set at getting me a wrangler unlimited. you can't take the roof or doors off on those things and that is a big factor of choice for me.
Did u catch anything???
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Old 08-21-2013, 05:49 PM   #79
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Did u catch anything???
that makes no sense....
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Old 08-21-2013, 06:00 PM   #80
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BonesBrigade response is excellent. Most folks (even many on this forum) will likely never use the capability that a Rubicon has over an FJ. And I have wheeled with FJ's, they are quite capable. And Toyota quality (at least versus Jeep) is hard to argue with.

I don't like the way the FJ looks, and I pretty much like everything about the Wrangler. But is it a better vehicle? Stock for stock (Rubi) offroad, yes. For everything else, probably not. I still wouldn't trade my Wrangler for an FJ.
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Old 08-21-2013, 06:04 PM   #81
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Most folks (even many on this forum) will likely never use the capability that a Rubicon has over an FJ. And I have wheeled with FJ's, they are quite capable.
My sway bar discos make fire roads easier on my back. And my 4:1 transfer case helps me back up my trailer at the RV park.
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Old 08-21-2013, 06:19 PM   #82
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BonesBrigade response is excellent. Most folks (even many on this forum) will likely never use the capability that a Rubicon has over an FJ. And I have wheeled with FJ's, they are quite capable. And Toyota quality (at least versus Jeep) is hard to argue with.

I don't like the way the FJ looks, and I pretty much like everything about the Wrangler. But is it a better vehicle? Stock for stock (Rubi) offroad, yes. For everything else, probably not. I still wouldn't trade my Wrangler for an FJ.


Toyotas are top notch with quality and longivity. hell i see a burgundy colored FJ today while on lunch break, i told my father thats a nice looking vehicle, only reason im dead set with wrangler is its ability to remove the roof and doors. NO other off roading vehicle can do that.

i know some of you scoff and laugh when i bring this up. but since selling my 400 hp Evolution and my nice little del sol cruiser. my daily has been a 2012 toyota yaris, base model as can be. crank windows, no power locks and no keyless entry.... yet it still comes with a USB port for music devices standard i won't get into that whole debate again. but point blank toyotas are very well made and i have had ZERO problems with it.

this is a similar topic i seen on the evom.net for years its always been the Evo VS STI threads... both leading competitors both very well matched against each other. to each is own, and if someone likes one or the other then so be it.
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Old 08-21-2013, 06:39 PM   #83
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My wife loves her Rav4, and I think it is a pretty nice vehicle myself.

I looked at an FJ a few years ago after I was unimpressed with the Wrangler engine and interior (pre 2011-12). I really wanted 4 doors and hated the blind spot...plus the fuel economy really sucked....even for an "SUV". From an "off-roading" standpoint, the FJ was all that I needed.....and more. In the end, I purchased a very nice, super low milage, underpriced (at Carmax), 65th Annv Liberty over a new FJ.

I have nothing against FJ's....but I do laugh at people driving them on warm days and they can only roll down two windows.

One other thing that really bugged me. The lack of a moon roof. I'm 39 years old....and this Wrangler is the first vehicle I've owned in nearly 20 years that didn't have a moon roof. I even had my wife get a moon roof on her vehicle simply because I like them so much.

Of course, having the entire roof removable kinda makes up for it...and is also why I'm in Sunrider 90% of the time...which is something that can't be done in an FJ.
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:46 PM   #84
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My neighbor is the General Service Manager at Courtesy Toyota here in Orlando and there is a Rubi in his garage! Nuf said!
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:51 PM   #85
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FJs are another street car. Just like land rovers. They made their name as offroad cars with old models that had stout drivetrains and now its all about luxury and road comfort. Nothing wrong with that, independent front and rear suspension work great for the rare offroader, but honestly, the gold offroading era of toyota died with the series 80 and 70... The FJ is just a car made to honor the old series 40 aimed at city drivers which is where the money is at. Off roaders are just but a tiny population.

And... something similar is happening to wranglers. People think they are, I dont know, race cars just because they now got a 280 hp engine, but cry out loud because its not as comfortable as their old SUV. So they demand absurd comfort mods or better ride from the factory, just another push to convert the wrangler into an FJ and take out the solid axles, because people don't understand the vehicle is not made for them ;D
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:35 AM   #86
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Have your buddy get in and out of the "back" doors of an FJ a few times then out of JKU. and OH... the front doors must remain closed while you are doing this. When that is done, see which one holds the most cases of beer without folding down the backseat in the cargo area. Am thinking the FJ loses on both those counts.
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Old 08-22-2013, 07:51 AM   #87
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What an absolutely stupid question to ask on a Jeep forum. 3 pages of wasted effort and opinions just as subjective as your fictitious car salesman.

This is an excellent example of how a troll works

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