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Old 11-17-2010, 01:01 PM   #1
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Lift kits and warranty issues

I just installed a 4" suspension lift on my 2010 JKU. Called the dealer to pose a few questions and was told that four inches of lift was excessive and could void aspects of my power train warranty.

Is this common knowledge? Any experience in this area?

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Old 11-17-2010, 01:20 PM   #2
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Very common knowledge. Your experiences may differ from dealer to dealer. Legally they can only deny coverage on parts directly affected by the lift. However, that interpretation can be far reaching. For example, when your drive shaft goes (and it will with a 4" lift) it won't be covered.

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Old 11-17-2010, 01:25 PM   #3
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You can argue all day what will void your warranty and what won't, but if your dealer refuses the work, they refuse the work. You might find a different dealer who may do the work, you might not. There are "laws" in place to protect modifications, but they're gray at best.

The dealer and Chrysler will have the last say unfortunately, because they know most people are not going to get into a legal battle.

How it's SUPPOSED to work is any part you change or modify loses it's individual warranty. Change the springs, the springs are no longer under warranty. IF it can be determined a modification caused another part to fail, you're not going to be covered. Like if you use a programmer on your computer and blow the engine, you're going to be S outta luck.
In your particular case, if you do the lift and break something in the suspension or steering, you're not getting covered.
Dealers can be slippery bastards and many will find any way out of performing warranty work that they can.
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:28 PM   #4
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Thanks, that’s what I was afraid of. Any other suggestion to decrease my chances of this type of failure or is my best bet just to bite the bullet and replace the 4" lift with one that wouldn't affect my warranty? The service guy said that some lift is acceptable.
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:32 PM   #5
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You need to fill in the blanks if you want solid advice. What type of lift? What size tires? What size lift did you service tech recommend? Why did you do the lift? What do you want out of it?
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:33 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by daggo66 View Post
Very common knowledge. Your experiences may differ from dealer to dealer. Legally they can only deny coverage on parts directly affected by the lift. However, that interpretation can be far reaching. For example, when your drive shaft goes (and it will with a 4" lift) it won't be covered.
Sorry I was specifically referring to daggo’s statement that I will probably loose a drive shaft at some point.
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:34 PM   #7
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whatever lift the dealer is ok with, GET IT IN WRITING!!!!!

i'd hardly call 4" "excessive", but it will be hard on stock parts. so you'd want to upgrade them as well, which would void the warranty on those parts anyway. like daggo said, say your driveshaft blows and starts whipping around, tearing up the underside of your jeep. no warranty coverage for any of it.
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:39 PM   #8
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4" suspension lift, ZONE Off-road, stock 32" tires for now but thinking about 33s or possibly 35s, chose the lift for looks mainly, would have to verify the teck's recommendation but was somewhere between 2 & 3 inches
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:41 PM   #9
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Now that I look at your avatar and see that you have a 4 door, 4" isn't so bad. That's the type of information you need in your posts when asking questions. Here is some reference regarding the drive shaft situation.

Fatal Angle Tom Woods JK Wrangler Driveshafts - Jp Magazine
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:42 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by offshoretek View Post
4" suspension lift, ZONE Off-road, stock 32" tires for now but thinking about 33s or possibly 35s, chose the lift for looks mainly, would have to verify the teck's recommendation but was somewhere between 2 & 3 inches
2" for 33's and 3" for 35's.
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Old 11-17-2010, 02:13 PM   #11
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Unfortunately you can pretty much kiss all of your warranty coverage goodbye, hopefully you weren't conned into spending thousands of needless dollars on the "Extended Warranty".
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Old 11-17-2010, 02:16 PM   #12
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Jeep (Chrysler) has to be one of if not the absolutely worst companies in the world to deal with on warranty issues. I think they should make there warranty coverage optional, if it would lower the price of a jeep by $10,000 I would opt for no warranty at all.
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Old 11-17-2010, 02:30 PM   #13
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I'm new here, but not to the JK. My dealer will cover everything except the component I replaced. I installed my 3" lift and he installed the 513 gears, RCV & superior shafts. We are in AZ for the winter away from my dealer. I checked with 3 local dealers and one won't touch it after a lift and two said they will honor the warrantee if the lift is 3" or less. You should confirm what your dealers will honor and go with that. If it means switching coils to get lower, it might be worth it for the warrantee.
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Old 11-17-2010, 03:31 PM   #14
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Thanks for the Information

Man I Really wish I had found this site earlier. I have never used message boards before, perhaps because I've never taken up a hobby / project that drains the pocket book like this jeep does but given the wealth of information available and the rapid responses I'm sure I'll be around asking at times ignorant questions for a while. I tried posing these questions to the local mod shops but it's hard to get a nonbiased answer where money is involved.

Not sure what the next step will be. To be quite honest the 5 grand I have spent since I bought the Jeep in September has my girlfriend hiding my wallet these days but hey... there’s always Ebay. Who needs a wallet when there’s Paypal?
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Old 11-17-2010, 04:26 PM   #15
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Dealers can be slippery bastards and many will find any way out of performing warranty work that they can.[/QUOTE]

Actually most dealers try to push thru as much warranty work as possible. It helps if not totally pays all of the bills.

Now chrysler wants pictures of the broken part and then the part returned to them. It's all to keep slippery dealers from claiming warranty on everything that they can.

Like discussed above, talk to your dealer and see what they say, what they will and will not warranty.

If you go by the verbage in the manual it says

2. What's Covered Under
Chrysler Group LLC's
Warranties
2.1 Basic Limited Warranty
A. Who Is Covered?
You are covered by the Basic Limited Warranty if
you are a purchaser for use of the vehicle.
B. What’s Covered
The Basic Limited Warranty covers the cost of all
parts and labor needed to repair any item on your
vehicle when it left the manufacturing plant that is
defective in material, workmanship or factory
preparation. There is no list of covered parts since the
only exception are tires and Unwired headphones. You
pay nothing for these repairs. These warranty repairs or
adjustments — including all parts and labor connected
with them — will be made by your dealer at no charge,
using new or remanufactured parts.
C. Items Covered by Other Warranties
The following are covered by separate warranties
offered by their makers. They are not covered by the
Basic Limited Warranty:
• tires;
• Unwired headphones
2.4 Powertrain Limited Warranty
(EXCLUDES: Sprinter and Ram Chassis Cab)
A. Who Is Covered?
You are covered by the Powertrain Limited
Warranty if you are a purchaser for use of the
vehicle.
B. What's Covered
The Powertrain Limited Warranty covers the
cost of all parts and labor needed to repair a
powertrain component listed in section 2.4.F
below that is defective in workmanship and
materials.
C. How Long It Lasts
The Powertrain Limited Warranty lasts for up to
5 years or 100,000 miles on the odometer, whichever
occurs first, calculated from the start date of the
Basic Limited Warranty, as set forth in Section 2.1(E).
D. Towing Costs Are Covered
The Powertrain Limited Warranty covers the cost of
towing your vehicle to the nearest authorized
Chrysler, Dodge or Jeep dealer if your vehicle
cannot be driven because a covered part has failed

3. What's Not Covered
3.1 Modifications Not Covered
A. Some Modifications Don’t Void the
Warranties But Aren’t Covered
Certain changes that you might make to your
vehicle do not, by themselves, void the warranties
described in this booklet. Examples of some of
these changes are:
• installing non-Chrysler Group LLC ("Chrysler")
parts, components, or equipment (such as a non-
Chrysler radio or speed control); and
• using special non-Chrysler materials or
additives.
But your warranties don’t cover any part that was
not on your vehicle when it left the manufacturing
plant or is not certified for use on your vehicle. Nor
do they cover the costs of any repairs or adjustments
that might be caused or needed because of the
installation or use of non-Chrysler parts, components,
equipment, materials, or additives.
Performance or racing parts are considered to be
non-Chrysler parts. Repairs or adjustments caused
by their use are not covered under your warranties.
Examples of the types of alterations not covered are:
• installing accessories — except for genuine
Chrysler / MOPAR accessories installed by
an authorized Chrysler, Dodge or Jeep dealer;
• applying rustproofing or other protection
products• changing the vehicle's configuration or
dimensions, such as converting the vehicle into
a limousine or food service vehicle; or
• using any refrigerant that Chrysler has
not approved.
B. Modifications That WILL Void Your
Warranties
These actions will void your warranties:
• disconnecting, tampering with, or altering the
odometer will void your warranties, unless your
repairing technician follows the legal requirements
for repairing or replacing odometers; or
• attaching any device that disconnects the
odometer will also void your warranties.
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Old 11-18-2010, 08:31 AM   #16
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..But your warranties don’t cover any part that was
not on your vehicle when it left the manufacturing
plant or is not certified for use on your vehicle...
Would the dealer installed RE lift be covered then(when purchased through the dealer)? I know you can get Rubicon Express lifts installed at your local dealers and have been able to for some time now.
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Old 11-18-2010, 09:04 AM   #17
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Actually most dealers try to push thru as much warranty work as possible. It helps if not totally pays all of the bills.
Maybe for your dealership, but I know for a fact that service departments hate warranty work because it's not billed at the same flat rate as other work, so nobody wants to do it. techs get paid billable hours for non-warranty work, they get paid actual hours for warranty work. 40 hours of warranty work is 40 hours. 40 hours of billable work can be 60, 80 100 or even more hours earned.

i worked at an oldsmobile dealer before they went under and i can tell you, they would avoid any warranty work they could because none of the mechanics wanted to do it. sure, it's politics, but when all your sae certified mechanics say they won't do warranty work and to give it to the young guys, you can bet your butt the service writers are finding ways around doing it as much as possible.

dealerships don't make squat on service work. they have to pay their techs, give them benefits, training and so on. warranty work cuts into profits way more than it helps.
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Old 11-18-2010, 09:15 AM   #18
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If anyone doesn't understand how that works, I'll explain.
Dealerships bill their work based on times given in a book. Say the book says it takes 1 hour to replace an alternator on your Jeep. A good mechanic can get it done it 20 minutes. You are still getting billed for 1 hour of work. The mechanic can then do another 2 alternator jobs in that same hour, getting paid for 3 hours of work in one hour.
It's a great incentive for the mechanic, but it sucks for the customer.
Many chain shops do this as well.
You will find independent shops that will bill you for the actual time worked. They will tell you their hourly rate and charge you by how long they worked, regardless of what the book the dealerships use says.
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Old 11-18-2010, 01:17 PM   #19
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One thing I like about my dealer that I use for service work is they charge actual hours and not billable hours. They did it for my Town and Country that I bought from them and now for my Jeep even though I didn't get it through them.

They Quote billable rates upfront but I have had them do many jobs for me and if they do it under the billable they only charge me for the actual time. I rarely have paid quoted billable rate there and that is why I always use them. But I have to say the Dealer that I got my current Jeep doesn't work that way. They charge billable rate period.
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Old 11-18-2010, 01:38 PM   #20
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dealerships don't make squat on service work. they have to pay their techs, give them benefits, training and so on. warranty work cuts into profits way more than it helps.


Actually our service department pays all of the bills here. chrysler now has something called FFV (fixed first visit). So apprentices don't see alot of warranty work. The techs here love it because it pays the bills for them as well. It does work as you stated above, but the service department for any dealership makes money. If the dealership relied on car sales to make a profit there wouldn't be any dealerships.
Maybe years ago techs didn't want to do warranty but they do now. In this economy there aren't many people paying for repairs that aren't covered, nor are they doing a lot of the preventive maintenance. So to pay the bills you do what you have to.

for us as customers, if you find a dealer that doesn't want to do warranty work than you need to find another store. I wish I could expalin how everything is changing at the chrysler dealerships that are left and how Chrysler is very involved in the day to day operations but I just don't have the room. All I can tell you is every warranty repair gets quality checked and if it's not right it doesn't leave. The parts departments have to stock parts so the repair can be done that day.
I have to disagree Mr. Sinister, to be a successful dealership in todays market you have to do warranty work. And as you stated above about "book time" properly trained techs can do a warranty repair in less time than stated in the book. sure some repairs take more time, but generally speaking they can get it done faster. so they get it done and move on to another job. At my store the techs are not seeing the customer pay jobs and are still "booking" well over 40 hours, and half well over 80 hours.

I guess it really depends on the dealership and if the dealership is committed to giving you the best ownership experience they can based on trust respect honesty. That is as important as getting a great deal and worth more to some people. Like me, I shop at ABT Electronics, I have a guy that I trust completely, so if he comes in a little higher than another store, it's fine. I know what I am getting in the long run, great service, still a great deal, and peace of mind. That's what you all should be looking for when you are shopping best price. Make sure you are getting a deal and also make sure you are dealing with a dealership that wants you to use them for service, accommodates you, and truly appreciates your business and shows you that appreciation when you are there.
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Old 11-18-2010, 01:51 PM   #21
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But your warranties don’t cover any part that was not on your vehicle when it left the manufacturing plant or is not certified for use on your vehicle. Nor do they cover the costs of any repairs or adjustments that might be caused or needed because of the installation or use of non-Chrysler parts, components, equipment, materials, or additives. Performance or racing parts are considered to be non-Chrysler parts. Repairs or adjustments caused by their use are not covered under your warranties.
Bingo. I was scrolling down this thread waiting for somebody to just quote the warranty book. That's part of the contract you signed when you left the dealership, so there you go. If you've lost your copy, you can find this online and I suggest you download it and review it.
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Old 11-18-2010, 02:13 PM   #22
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pato: God bless the Midwest I suppose, because in the mid-Atlantic, good customer service is a rare thing anymore. So many people jammed in to a small space combined with all the small dealerships closing up when Chrysler took the bailout (like the top notch dealer I got my 05 Magnum from and did all my service, Sturgill's C/D/J in Conowingo, MD.) and people get treated like cattle. Get them in, move them out, take their money.

You are definitely right about dealer to dealer. Brand to brand as well. Most Olds drivers were fairly old and many of them had cars well past their warranty. Seeing as how the cost of living has always been very high here and the fact that book time is the same all over the country, techs want to make 60-100 hour weeks to keep up. Warranty work wasn't doing it for them.
So it's not to say you can't still find good dealers in the area, but they are definitely the minority.
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Old 11-18-2010, 03:12 PM   #23
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pato: God bless the Midwest I suppose, because in the mid-Atlantic, good customer service is a rare thing anymore. So many people jammed in to a small space combined with all the small dealerships closing up when Chrysler took the bailout (like the top notch dealer I got my 05 Magnum from and did all my service, Sturgill's C/D/J in Conowingo, MD.) and people get treated like cattle. Get them in, move them out, take their money.

You are definitely right about dealer to dealer. Brand to brand as well. Most Olds drivers were fairly old and many of them had cars well past their warranty. Seeing as how the cost of living has always been very high here and the fact that book time is the same all over the country, techs want to make 60-100 hour weeks to keep up. Warranty work wasn't doing it for them.
So it's not to say you can't still find good dealers in the area, but they are definitely the minority.
I agree, it is dealer to dealer, I have family in Fburg VA and all I can say is that customer service is definitely lacking there.
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Old 11-18-2010, 03:28 PM   #24
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For everyone that thinks Chrysler is difficult with warranty claims, try modifying a BMW. Everything has to be removed every dealer visit.
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Old 11-18-2010, 03:38 PM   #25
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For everyone that thinks Chrysler is difficult with warranty claims, try modifying a BMW. Everything has to be removed every dealer visit.
Never owned one, but I heard you can't change the oil on a BMW yourself? Same with Mercedes?
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Old 11-18-2010, 03:49 PM   #26
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Well that isn't true, you definitely can. But why? They do it for free.
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Old 11-24-2010, 05:55 PM   #27
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My Dealer here on the ILL/WI state line loves warranty work. The even told me they will install aftermarket parts, Lift, for actual hours worked not book hours. Good Dealer
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Old 11-25-2010, 12:42 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by pato1031 View Post
3. What's Not Covered
your warranties don’t cover any part that was
not on your vehicle when it left the manufacturing
plant or is not certified for use on your vehicle. Nor
do they cover the costs of any repairs or adjustments
that might be caused or needed because of the
installation or use of non-Chrysler parts, components,
equipment, materials, or additives.
Performance or racing parts are considered to be
non-Chrysler parts. Repairs or adjustments caused
by their use are not covered under your warranties.
Examples of the types of alterations not covered are:
• installing accessories — except for genuine
Chrysler / MOPAR accessories installed by
an authorized Chrysler, Dodge or Jeep dealer;
I happened to talk to my dealer today about a lift kit, and they told me that they would install any lift kit I bought for $570, and the parts I replaced would not be covered; but if I went with a Mopar Performance kit it would be covered.

My dealer give a lifetime powertrain warranty with all its vehicles so I am going to try and keep that intact and will probably go with a Mopar kit.

I think a lot of this varies dealer to dealer and what work they want to take. Ask yours and see what they say
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Old 11-25-2010, 03:12 AM   #29
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The dealer I use down here now doesn't make any calls on what's warrenty and what's not...they are required to photograph EVERYTHING and send it to their momma (chrysler) and that's where the decisions are made
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Old 11-27-2010, 10:18 AM   #30
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I just bought a 2011 Sahara. My Dealer said they quit taking pitchers for warranty. The use to have too but not anymore. The also will cover a Morpar lift kit in the 3 year 36,000 mile warranty, as long as they install it. The Dealer has been in business since 1955. Over all it's a great Dealer.

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