I have a 2015 JKU with a 430N head unit and the craptastic "base" audio system. I really wanted the Alpine system, but couldn't find a manual Rubicon with the upgraded system within 500 miles. I probably should have ordered my Jeep...but I suck at the whole delayed gratification thing, and I figured the audio would be the easiest thing to upgrade.
I've been talking to some local shops about how to fix the sound in the Jeep. I don't really want/need a lot of "thump" in the Jeep; I just want to be able to have good sound (which I know is subjective) while running topless. Right now, I turn the audio up and hear a bunch of crackle and distortion. I'll admit to being completely clueless when it comes to car audio, and I don't want to screw this up.
The shops have told me that since I'm happy with the features of the 430N, I should spend my money elsewhere instead of upgrading the head unit. What they've recommended is replacing all the speakers with JL M-Series speakers and putting a M-Series amp (400 watt / 4 channels) under the front seat.
I just wanted some input to see if anyone thinks I'm making a huge mistake by not replacing the head unit while I'm doing the upgrade, and if there is anything wrong with mounting the amp under the front seat.
Thanks for the help! I did try searching but had some trouble following some of the detailed conversations. From what I can tell, the stock HU in a "base" system limits the amount of bass that goes to the speakers. Some have talked about adding additional "parts" to offset this.
When you replaced the speakers & added the amp, did you keep the stock head unit. If so, did you have to add anything besides the amp to make sure the sound was "ok"?
I think you are fine sticking with the stock HU if you are content with the features.
As for speakers, I don't think you really need to go with marine speakers (those JL M's are pricey). The rear soundbar speakers would be hard to get wet even with the top off in a downpour. Same with the speakers in the lower dash. Only the ones up on the dash themselves are really in danger of getting wet.
Here's what I'm doing with my 2015 JKU in regards to speakers. I like to do things in stages so that I can see how each change affects the sound. This allows me to make an informed decision about where to go next instead of just replacing everything at once.
1. I replaced the upper dash speakers with a pair of JL Audio TR350-CXi's last week. Pretty much any 3.5" co-ax should fit up there and it will be a huge improvement and here's why. The stock speaker is an 8 ohm 2.5" full range speaker that has a 6dB/octave xover set at 9000Hz (2.2uF cap). What this means is that the stock speakers are only really giving you the last octave of human hearing at full volume. They are down 6db at 9K, 12db at 4.5K, etc.... Making matters worse is the fact that a 2.5" speaker is a poor choice for >9K to being with. Anyway, by going with a good 3.5" co-ax you are now going to have quality sound from about 400Hz on up. I say 400hz because I would highly recommend putting a bass blocker on any 3.5" speaker....it's just a 100uF cap on a 4 ohm speaker. You'll now hear vocals and the majority of music sounding as it is coming near the windshield as opposed to waist level.
2. This weekend I'll be replacing the speakers in the soundbar with a set of Alpine SPS-610c components. The Alpines come with adapter brackets for the woofers so you don't need to buy them separately. To mount the tweeters, simply butcher the crappy ones you remove so that you can use their frame (see pic). I'll also be lining the woofer enclosures with peel-n-seal (poor man's dynamat) and stuffing with polyfill. You can also harvest the molex connectors off the stock speakers to help avoid having to spice into factory wires.
3. I'll live with the above for a week or so before deciding what to do with the 6.5" speakers in the lower dash. They are a bit of a PIA to get to so I'm in no hurry . My initial idea is to put Tang Band 5.25" subs in them and take advantage of the fact that the wrangler actually has true enclosures (Tang Band W5-1138SMF 5-1/4" Paper Cone Subwoofer Speaker). My concern is if they will fit or not. Not just in terms of depth, but the TB's have a huge excursion and I'm worried the cone might actually hit the back of the dash.
Now that brings me to amplifiers. I doesn't sound like you really need some hugely powerful amp. There are a lot of super small quality ~50x4 class D amps on the market that you can easily fit behind the dash. Behind the dash is a better location than under the seat for Wranglers IMO. The Pioneer GM-D1004, Alpine KTP-445U, and my favorite the Kenwood KAC-M3004. I like the Kenwood because it has independent continuously variable lp/hp crossover points for the front/rear. I would actually use it to drive the 4 front speakers and just let the soundbar continue to be powered by the HU.
Stock tweeters butchered and ready to be used to mount the Alpine tweeters:
2. This weekend I'll be replacing the speakers in the soundbar with a set of Alpine SPS-610c components. The Alpines come with adapter brackets for the woofers so you don't need to buy them separately. To mount the tweeters, simply butcher the crappy ones you remove so that you can use their frame (see pic). I'll also be lining the woofer enclosures with peel-n-seal (poor man's dynamat) and stuffing with polyfill. You can also harvest the molex connectors off the stock speakers to help avoid having to spice into factory wires.
The tweeters in their swivel mounts along with their screw on mounting ring fit perfectly into the butchered stock tweeters. I JB welded the mounting ring to the butchered tweeter frames to insure that I would never have to worry about a loose tweeter (did this the night prior to install). I also left the wiring molex on the tweeter frame and simple soldered the tweeters' speaker wire to it (be sure to bypass the stock tweeters capacitor which is integrated into the molex). Once mounted, I took advantage of the swivel mounts and aimed the tweeters to point across the jeep to the opposite side rear passenger as best as possible
The Alpines come with speaker adapter brackets for the woofers that work with zero modifications. The only thing I added was a washer to the stock screws since they have small heads and the mounting rings have large openings. I did use closed cell weather stripping on the back of the adapter as well as on the woofers to prevent any possible rattles. I removed the molex from the stock woofers and hot glued them to the Alpines' baskets in order to make things more plug and play. I also filled the speaker cavities with Dacron.
One thing I like about the Alpines is that they don't have huge external xovers that I would have to worry about finding a place to mount them. The LP xover is glued to the woofers and the HP xover is a roughly 5" long 'stick' (consists of a cap and coil - 2nd order 12db/octave) that is in-line with the wiring that goes from a secondary pair of tabs on the woofer to the tweeters. There is a long narrow space within the sound bar speaker pods towards the front outside of each. I simply wrapped each HP xover in dacron and then shoved into these spaces. Fit really well and won't rattle.
Anyway, they sound great; especially on the high end. The stock 'tweeters' really are crap. The bass is much improved with the hollow sound gone now. Definitely worth with the $80 and time. It took me about 2 hours, but I'm a bit of a perfectionist and it does include some speaker butchering, hot glue, and soldering.
FWIW, the cheapest source of Dacron is a $2.38 pillow at Walmart. I still have a ton of it left over and it will be going in the lower dash pods when I get around to them.
I also took the time to go ahead and butcher the stock 6.5's so that I'll have mounting rings for the next step in this project: 5.25" subs for the lower dash locations. I just hope they will fit in the stock enclosures...they are monsters: Tang Band W5-1138SMF 5-1/4" Paper Cone Subwoofer Speaker
butchered 6.5's to use as mounting rings for subs:
I'm in the same boat as you-- 2015 JK with the basic stock sound system. Yesterday I stuffed the sound bar with the material from inside a pillow which brought some life to those speakers, but it's still not excellent. I ordered the Kicker replacements that are plug & play from Amazon for $62 shipped so when those get in I'll put them in the sound bar to see if they are a big improvement, if so I'll order another set for up front.
Our 2015's have 2 tweeters on the front dash and 2 in the sound bar as well. I'll probably replace those fairly soon as well. I really don't want to go through the trouble of replacing the head unit and adding an external amp for a number of reasons. I'm hoping that by replacing the speakers I'll be able to get adequate sound from it.
Thanks for all the feedback. My biggest concern in sticking with the 430N is that some sites I've read have said you lose a lot with the ability to dial in the sound. If I recall correctly, the 430N only gives you options to tweak bass, treble, and mid...whereas some of the Pioneer/Kenwod/Alpine units give you many more options.
Again, without being an audio guy, I'm afraid of dumping a bunch of money in speakers and an amp when I'm still getting sub-par sound because of the head unit. I can spend the extra if needed...I just don't want to if I don't really have to.
Again, without being an audio guy, I'm afraid of dumping a bunch of money in speakers and an amp when I'm still getting sub-par sound because of the head unit. I can spend the extra if needed...I just don't want to if I don't really have to.
And that's why it's best to replace your speakers first and then decided if you are happy or not. Say you replace all the speakers and are a perfectly content. Great, you just saved some money as you didn't need to buy a HU or an amp. Perhaps the speakers are plenty loud enough, the overall sound is good, but you just want more bass. You now know you should add sub. This is why I like to replace things one at a time and then assess where to go next.
Since it doesn't seem to have been mentioned, the easiest plug and play upgrade for speakers is to go with the Mopar Kicker 77Kick10 6.5" and 77Kick25 3.5" speakers. 2 sets of each would be needed to upgrade the dash and sound bar speakers (8 total).
Are these the correct 3.5" speakers? The part number is slightly different (77Kick25AB) and it doesn't say it'll fit the 2015 Wrangler JK, so I just wanted to make sure.
I wanted the upgraded Alpine systems b/c it was way better than the stock, and probably something I wouldn't have tinkered with. I just couldn't find a manual Rubicon within 500 miles of me that had it.
Unless you have plans to upgrade to an aftermarket system "no matter what", I'd go ahead and get the upgrade.
Why not start with the basics and see how you like it?
The Polk audios are reasonably priced and sound much better than stock. When you replace them, go ahead and fill the boxes with pollyfill. This will help tighten things up.
I think there are a fair number of guys on here who went with the Polk db651s.
In addition to the speakers, you would need the following:
Scosche SAC-656 Speaker Mounting Brackets
Metra 71-050 Speaker Wiring Adapters
Metra 72-6514 Speaker Wiring Harness (front and back speakers use different plugs)
From what I understand the 25ab's aren't tweeters. What affects does this have when applying with the factory HU if any? Does the head unit have the capability of deciphering how to handle this setup?
Yes, the 25ab's are not tweeters. They are simply a kicker 3.5" coax (woofer + tweeter) with a mopar specific mounting ring and molex connector to plug into the factory wiring.
If we are talking the base system here (not the Alpine), the factory HU doesn't do any sort of 'deciphering' other than sending out a full range signal to both Front L&R and Rear L&R. The 6.5" speakers are full range drivers without any sort of passive xover while the 3.5" speakers (actually a 2.5" in the body of a 3.5") are 8ohm with a 2.2uF cap that equates to a 9K Hz 1st order high pass xover.
The only real thing that matter in regards to what the factory HU sees is the fact that the load (in Ohms) goes down because you are replacing an 8ohm speaker with a 4ohm speaker (actual impedance the HU sees is actually less than this since the 3.5"s are in parallel with the 6.5"s...I haven't measured the 6.5"s so I'm not sure what the resulting impedance is). Anyway, this could be of a concern but so far many having been running their systems configured as such without issues.
It's amazing someone hasn't built a harness to simplify the cluster F Chrysler has put together under the dash for people that don't want the alpine upgrade.
I kept the 430n and installed the 8 Kicker speakers with 99uF caps on the 3.5's as bass blockers, Alpine KTP-445U 4 channel powerpack amp for the speakers and the Kicker Hideway 8 inch sub underneath the driver seat. I had Best Buy do the lower front dash speakers, bass blockers, Alpine amp and the Kicker Sub. All told I spent $270 on the 8 speakers, $125 on the Amp, $220 on the sub and $290 on the install - which would have been $180 if I felt like installing the dash speakers and 4 bass blockers myself.
After all of that it's really loud - anything past 15 on the volume is ear-splitting and clear.
Audio is subjective though, so I would do things piece by piece before deciding on whether or not you need to upgrade. Start with the speakers as they're the easiest things. If you find you need more - volume/clarity/low end - start looking for an amp and/or sub that will fit what you need.
Question: you installed the bass blockers on only the 3.5's? Or on the 6.5's? 99uF bass blockers I'm finding seem to be meant for 5.25 - 6.5" speakers. I'm looking to duplicate this setup in my JK, step by step, evaluating mods as I make them to see if I want to take the next step. Right now, got all the Kickers in, and quite like the improvement, but they do need some more power and clarity, so I'm thinking bass blockers wouldn't be a bad idea when I get the sub installed as well.
I think I'm clear. Thanks folks. When I make the move I will post a play by play with pics so everyone doesn't have to be annoyed with the car stereo threads.
This... this thread is EXACTLY what I've been researching all week, after taking delivery of my '15 Willys JK2D. Like the OP, there wasn't an Alpine-equipped Sport or Willys for 350 miles of me (and I'm only 40 miles from freakin' Toledo, where the things are MADE!). And I'm kicking myself for not holding out for the Alpine system, which was my fourth and final must-have option that I let slide. Oh well.
So I've ordered four of the Kicker 6.5" 77kick10 speakers, and am going to start with those. But seeing others that have built decent systems with powered under-seat subs, in-dash amps, and upgraded speakers gives me hope that I can create something as good as or better than the factory Alpine with a minimum of fuss!
You can easily do better. Just continue to look around, get ideas. Make your list of must have features. I have read several threads where people have upgraded from the "upgraded" Alpine system.
I'm working out the details on an upgrade myself. So far I upgraded the 4 6.5 inch speakers and removed the 3.5 inch speakers. Adding polyfill and removing the 3.5 factory base speakers made a huge difference in with the infinity 6.5 coax I used.
This weekend I'm adding an amp and a powered sub under the front passenger seat. I'm using a 4 channel POC to feed into a RF compact amp that will mount vertically under the passenger seat. I think the compact sub will also fit flat under that same seat. I'll need to implement some type of skirting for the side of the seat to conceal the view when the door is off, but i'm thinking some heavy duty velcro and black fabric should do the trick.
I just got in from adding the 6.5 kickers in the sound bar and dash. On a scale of 0-10, with 10 being the best, I would give the faactory system a 1.5. With the addition of the four kickers, I'd give it a 4. I then put pullyfill in the both front and back and did notice a slight improvement...mostly in the bass. This said, Id give the final result a 4.5
Did Kickers in my dash and bar as well, and I agree with your upgrade assessment. I'm not sure I need to replace the HU yet though... I may try for an in-dash Alpine KTP amplifier first, and then add a powered low-rise subwoofer under the passenger seat, to see how that works.
Only if you also have an Alpine aftermarket head unit, apparently. They make two versions of the KTP-445: the 445U (universal) and the 445A (Alpine-specific). The U can be used in any vehicle (like our Jeeps) but requires you to wire it all in yourself. The A is for people who've purchased an Alpine aftermarket HU, and does include a simple plug and play connector.
I'm thinking the KTP-445U may be my next step, along with the Kicker sub. Gonna stop by the Best Buy later today with some Amazon.com price comparisons in tow... the parts are all in stock at my local BB, but their parts prices are more expensive -- thankfully, they have a price-match guarantee with Amazon.
If it hasn't been mentioned yet, I installed the Kicker powered under seat subwoofer under the passenger seat. Not bad, upgraded the head unit, all speakers with an amp and not enough low end. This does the trick. Deeper bass but doesn't boom. Has a remote volume knob to raise/lower sub level independant of everything else.
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Related Threads
?
?
?
?
?
Ask a question
Ask a question
Jeep Wrangler Forum
9M posts
468K members
Since 2005
A forum community dedicated to Jeep Wrangler owners and enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about reviews, performance, trail riding, gear, suspension, tires, classifieds, troubleshooting, maintenance, for all JL, JT, JK, TJ, YJ, and CJ models!