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Old 10-25-2011, 03:13 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panthermark View Post
"Stop thinking about this right now, get the Pro4X!! As previously mentioned: rear locker, ascent/descent control and Nissan durability.
(begin rant...) I know it doesn't relate directly to the quality of the vehicle but I hate the generic, corporate direction Jeep is going. I see Jeep commercials on TV all the time and there is not a shred of any sort of off-pavement driving shown and the voiceovers only talk about highway fuel economy and cabin features."
That's because Chrysler is trying to expand their market share, like any car company that took the kind of beating they did the last few years. Folks who take their Jeeps off-road don't need to be convinced what Jeeps will do...

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Originally Posted by flyinion View Post
One thing that was brought up in that other thread which surprised me and I'm not sure if the guy is accurate or not is that the Wrangler is better at rock crawling (obvious) but the Xterra was better for things like snow, slippery conditions, etc.? Not knowing any better I'm tempted to call BS, but I'm definitely curious about the validity of his statement.
I've lived in Wisconsin for the last 12 years; in 2003 I traded my car in for a Jeep cuz it was hard getting around in winter, even though they use salt and plow the roads here pretty well. I was a photographer for Gannett, and often had to get to assignments, disasters, etc whether the roads were cleared or not. I've driven my Jeep in foot-deep snowstorms where the only way I could tell where I was on the road was by watching the roadside signs, mailboxes, rural driveway reflectors, etc.

Two years ago I visited my family in Richmond. They got about 18" of snow dumped on them the day after I arrived. They had the Natl Guard out helping get vehicles out of the road. I took my peeps to the grocery store, shopping. We went out to dinner. My niece and nephew had a blast looking at all the vehicles in ditches and on medians.

My brother has a RAV 4, and couldn't get it out of his driveway for 3 days.


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Originally Posted by daggo66 View Post
Can you take the top and doors off the Nissan?
Nothing more need be said, IMO.

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Old 10-25-2011, 03:53 PM   #32
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I have a friend with a ProX4; it does fine offroad until you get to the gnarly stuff. The IFS limits it there.
But it's quicker than JKs and easier to live with.

If you see yourself wanting the top off, get a JK. If you see youself wanting to do some serious wheeling, get a Rubicon or build a JK. If you see yourself really wanting to build an offroader in an affordable way, get a JK.
For semi-serious offroading, some camping, and mostly DD duty, I really think you'll like the X better. You're already familiar with Nissans anyhow.

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Old 10-25-2011, 04:45 PM   #33
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Speaking of winter and snow. The Jeep heater is legendary. I have never had a car or truck with anything that could heat up the cabin and get the windows ice free as quick as my Jeep.
I never had a Nissan so I have no comparison, but ...

As for the rest, I had my assortment of SUVs, Ford, Acura etc. They can't compare with a Jeep.
I have a JKU as a daily driver. Most XTerra, FJ etc drivers look at it with "Oh man I should have gotten one of these". And I haven't even done anything to it yet. :-)

Go on an extended test drive with either one. Rent one for a day of each. It really depends on what YOU like better driving.
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Old 10-25-2011, 06:16 PM   #34
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On a personal note I have leased my last 4 vehicles. Jeep Cherokee, Dodge Dakota, Dodge Ram, Jeep Wrangler. I just purchased a 2012 Dozer Wrangler Unlimited I liked the last one I leased that much.

Live in Buffalo and JKU was great in the snow, ran well and as people have stated it was great during the summer with the top down. My only issues with it were a crappy defroster that didn't cover the whole front window (sides would ice up), no heated mirrors and a lack of power. All of which have been addressed in the 2012. The interior is nicer than the 2008 I had but I do miss the MyGig radio already!
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:56 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Hilldweller View Post
I have a friend with a ProX4; it does fine offroad until you get to the gnarly stuff. The IFS limits it there.
But it's quicker than JKs and easier to live with.

If you see yourself wanting the top off, get a JK. If you see youself wanting to do some serious wheeling, get a Rubicon or build a JK. If you see yourself really wanting to build an offroader in an affordable way, get a JK.
For semi-serious offroading, some camping, and mostly DD duty, I really think you'll like the X better. You're already familiar with Nissans anyhow.

Thanks again for the advice all. As far as "see yourself wanting to do some serious wheeling" well we'll see what happens in a couple weeks. A friend from my Z club has a Jeep and is taking me for some offroading in a couple weeks. That just might seal the deal (one way or the other at least lol).
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Old 10-27-2011, 03:38 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by flyinion View Post
Thanks again for the advice all. As far as "see yourself wanting to do some serious wheeling" well we'll see what happens in a couple weeks. A friend from my Z club has a Jeep and is taking me for some offroading in a couple weeks. That just might seal the deal (one way or the other at least lol).
It is so much easier to build a Jeep than an X --- and more affordable.

But they are different animals at heart and you need to be honest with yourself. An X will take you to most of the places that a JK can go.
But it isn't remotely the same experience.
Jeeps have a huge following, a culture. The X will never match that.
OTOH, the Jeep can't approach the level of refinement that the X has ---- which is important to some folks. It's a better tow-pig, the doors slam shut with more umph and thud, and the motor has some cojones.

Only you know where your priorities are.
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Old 11-01-2011, 03:40 PM   #37
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So, I'm still in the middle of figuring out which I like better, but this upcoming weekend might help with that. Found a Jeep and "the other guy" dealer within about 40 miles that have a MT version of both vehicles that I'm interested in. I'm going to take a trip down there on Saturday to test them out since I'm interested in the MT over the auto, especially for the "other guys" model due to what I view as a serious engineering defect in their auto setup.

If I wasn't trying to get the best price for a new vehicle and thoroughly research what I want, I'd probably just go with my gut and get the Wrangler if I said right here and now I'm buying today. I guess I'm just trying to make sure I'm fully happy with my choice. My last two car purchases were a bit impulsive (not as much research as I should have) so I'm trying to be a bit more "responsible" again this time around. Oh and of course I'm supposed to be taking that off road trip with my friend the weekend of the 12th so that may help push me one way or the other of three ways. Those being Jeep, the other guys, or "hell no I'm keeping my 350Z" lol.
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Old 11-01-2011, 04:34 PM   #38
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I just bought a JK Unlimited Sahara '12. I wanted a four door convertible. In the US, there is only 1. I looked into a number of SUVs, I compared MPG and sticker $. The Jeep won.

If you get the hard top, you can buy a after market soft top probably cheaper than buying the dual top. The interior in the '12 JK is minimal, but just what I need. The ride is great and the seats are comfortable. I have alot more fun driving to work. Curb crawling is underrated.

I have 3 kids, they all fit in the back seat comforatably. All their "stuff" fits in back as well. We get high marks from their friends when we roll up with the top down.

After 2 months of putting the soft top up and down as often as possible, no leaks. Wife and kids have learned how to get in and out using the side rails. Go for it.
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:06 PM   #39
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Well, got back from my test drives of manual transmission versions. Things didn't quite go according to plan. The "other guys" website was wrong so I took a nice 90 mile one way drive instead to test drive a MT version (had to be sure about my choices). Also the Jeep dealer on the way had sold the Unlimited manual according to their website (no longer showed in inventory) so I went to a more local dealer and test drove a 2 door Sport in manual since I just needed a feel for the setup and not the handling of the vehicle itself.

I can say now I'm 95% sure that if I do trade my car and get a new vehicle it's going to be a Wrangler The Nissan was just not a good setup. If I put the seat where my legs were comfortable, it was hard to reach the shifter (which also felt pretty mushy). If I got the seat close enough to feel like I wasn't reaching for the shifter then my legs felt cramped. It was also hard to tell the clutch engagement point on it. I also realized the Xterra brakes feel like a wet sponge when you push on them. I nearly overshot a turn on the test drive.

Test driving the Wrangler basically back to back (minus the 90 mile drive back lol) really put it into perspective. Braking was good and no positioning problems like on the Nissan. Even though the ride was different and possibly a bit stiffer, coming from a Z it was still an improvement and I think I wouldn't mind it on a DD (which I already DD my Z). The driving felt more solid as well, especially the steering.

EDIT: Oh and just to note, I'm not comparing directly a 2 door Wrangler to the Nissan, I'm comparing 2 and 4 because I test drove a 2 door Sport MT and an AT 4 door Rubicon both today. I didn't pick the Rubicon, pushy sales guy wanted me to test it and it just so happened he picked the 37K Rubi. I figured out why later when he started wanting to run numbers on it even though I told him before I was looking in the Sport S range for price.
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Old 11-05-2011, 08:46 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by flyinion View Post
Well, got back from my test drives of manual transmission versions. Things didn't quite go according to plan. The "other guys" website was wrong so I took a nice 90 mile one way drive instead to test drive a MT version (had to be sure about my choices). Also the Jeep dealer on the way had sold the Unlimited manual according to their website (no longer showed in inventory) so I went to a more local dealer and test drove a 2 door Sport in manual since I just needed a feel for the setup and not the handling of the vehicle itself.

I can say now I'm 95% sure that if I do trade my car and get a new vehicle it's going to be a Wrangler The Nissan was just not a good setup. If I put the seat where my legs were comfortable, it was hard to reach the shifter (which also felt pretty mushy). If I got the seat close enough to feel like I wasn't reaching for the shifter then my legs felt cramped. It was also hard to tell the clutch engagement point on it. I also realized the Xterra brakes feel like a wet sponge when you push on them. I nearly overshot a turn on the test drive.

Test driving the Wrangler basically back to back (minus the 90 mile drive back lol) really put it into perspective. Braking was good and no positioning problems like on the Nissan. Even though the ride was different and possibly a bit stiffer, coming from a Z it was still an improvement and I think I wouldn't mind it on a DD (which I already DD my Z). The driving felt more solid as well, especially the steering.

EDIT: Oh and just to note, I'm not comparing directly a 2 door Wrangler to the Nissan, I'm comparing 2 and 4 because I test drove a 2 door Sport MT and an AT 4 door Rubicon both today. I didn't pick the Rubicon, pushy sales guy wanted me to test it and it just so happened he picked the 37K Rubi. I figured out why later when he started wanting to run numbers on it even though I told him before I was looking in the Sport S range for price.
+ the top and doors come off
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Old 11-06-2011, 02:36 AM   #41
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+ the top and doors come off
So true I think I kinda knew the first time I saw then test drove one back in September that it's what I'd choose. I guess I just wanted to make sure I was careful and really researched/etc. this time instead of giving in to temptation and being impulsive lol.
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Old 11-06-2011, 04:57 AM   #42
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While not a new xterra, I did drive an 03 xterra for a year. It was pretty much like a windsail on the highway and easily felt all breezes while driving. I loved driving it in the winter and in the snow. Didn't do many trails or anything in it but did take it through a few really easy rated ones. I also have a 2010 wrangler and it is much more fun driving around. Again hasn't seen much trail time (looking to change that if anyone is local in CO and has some suggestions) but the wrangler is a ton of fun.
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Old 11-06-2011, 06:17 AM   #43
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After 4 or 5 months of comparing different vehicles I ended up getting a 2011 jku. I wouldn't trade it for anything else out there. I use it as a DD and only have about a 5 mile drive to work. The Wrangler is one of the very few vehicles left that really can't be compared to anything else. It isn't for everyone and that is what I like the best about it. What you do with it or how you build it up later is only limited by your imagination and your wallet.
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Old 11-06-2011, 10:42 AM   #44
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I just went through the same decision process. I owned an '05 Xterra with the offroad package. I enjoyed it but had a few issues. The vehicle was unstable in extremely high crosswinds (like 50 mph or so which were common in my area). The diff locker got stuck engaged once and needed to be towed to the dealership. There was a fuel delivery problem that I believe has since been debugged in the newer motors.

As for price, for the JKU you are looking at, your cash price would probably be about 29-30K or so after haggling -with the options you want. For the Xterra, I think this is gonna hurt: using the American Express Auto purchasing Program, I got quoted a very steep discount at about 25-26K for the 2011 (same as 2012) with the Pro-4x (or whatever it's called) package in a manual. To use the AmEx program, everyone is eligible and you don't even need a card. Dealers DO honor it if they are participating in the program.

That being said, every day I drive my new 2012 Wrangler, I am extremely happy I chose it over the Xterra for all the reasons listed in this thread.
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Old 11-06-2011, 11:18 PM   #45
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I just went through the same decision process. I owned an '05 Xterra with the offroad package. I enjoyed it but had a few issues. The vehicle was unstable in extremely high crosswinds (like 50 mph or so which were common in my area). The diff locker got stuck engaged once and needed to be towed to the dealership. There was a fuel delivery problem that I believe has since been debugged in the newer motors.

As for price, for the JKU you are looking at, your cash price would probably be about 29-30K or so after haggling -with the options you want. For the Xterra, I think this is gonna hurt: using the American Express Auto purchasing Program, I got quoted a very steep discount at about 25-26K for the 2011 (same as 2012) with the Pro-4x (or whatever it's called) package in a manual. To use the AmEx program, everyone is eligible and you don't even need a card. Dealers DO honor it if they are participating in the program.

That being said, every day I drive my new 2012 Wrangler, I am extremely happy I chose it over the Xterra for all the reasons listed in this thread.

Yeah but anything 2011 is going to get deeply discounted because it's the end of the model year. I'm not too worried about that as I'm not planning on buying really until either end of year sales or maybe even Memorial Day sales in May. Right now has been all research and "what do I really want to buy" kind of stuff Well, there's also the issue of do I really want to trade my 350Z for it. However every day I get more and more comfortable with saying yes to that.

I have a car buying service as a benefit through GEICO my car insurance. It looks like it's run by something called Zag and it seems to be about the 1% below MSRP that I've heard about on the Tread Lightly discount. I'm debating joining TL anyway just to see if I can get a better deal through them. Geico is more like .9 or .95% below and TL's program being converted to a Chrysler "affiliate" thing sounds like it might allow for a more solid chance at the best price.
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Old 11-07-2011, 07:56 AM   #46
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I have a car buying service as a benefit through GEICO my car insurance. It looks like it's run by something called Zag and it seems to be about the 1% below MSRP that I've heard about on the Tread Lightly discount. I'm debating joining TL anyway just to see if I can get a better deal through them. Geico is more like .9 or .95% below and TL's program being converted to a Chrysler "affiliate" thing sounds like it might allow for a more solid chance at the best price.

FYI: The TL discount is 1% below INVOICE, not MSRP. Big difference
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Old 11-07-2011, 09:40 AM   #47
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FYI: The TL discount is 1% below INVOICE, not MSRP. Big difference
Right. The AmEx program is run through Zag as well. So, probably the deals are the same as the Geico program's. Prices do end up below "invoice". This is how I purchased my 2012 Wrangler as well.
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Old 11-07-2011, 09:47 AM   #48
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Jeep All The Way!!! I have a soft top with a slight tear by the window and it still doesnt leak..... if youre worried about leaks, youre wasting you thinking cells!!
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Old 11-07-2011, 01:21 PM   #49
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FYI: The TL discount is 1% below INVOICE, not MSRP. Big difference

Oops, must have been tired when I typed that. It's "1%" below invoice for the Geico/Zag thing, not msrp. Of course, doing the math, it's more like .9 or .95% instead of a full 1%.

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