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Old 09-05-2014, 08:47 AM   #1
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OK so it the Wrangler gets a diesel...

What model year, and which one? Will they go with the 3.0 which powers the GC, or will they go with a 4 cylinder diesel?

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Old 09-05-2014, 08:51 AM   #2
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I foresee a 10 page thread filled with nothing but speculation that eventually gets locked because of arguing and bickering...

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Old 09-05-2014, 08:52 AM   #3
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A 200 hp , 4500 lb vehicle does not sound very appealing to me no matter how much low end it has, so I hope it is the latter.
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Old 09-05-2014, 08:53 AM   #4
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I foresee a 10 page thread filled with nothing but speculation that eventually gets locked because of arguing and bickering...
Hey that is the fun part. If I want solid information I would go do my own research from reputable sources. Screw that.
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Old 09-05-2014, 09:03 AM   #5
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I foresee a 10 page thread filled with nothing but speculation that eventually gets locked because of arguing and bickering...
Geez I hope not.


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Hey that is the fun part. If I want solid information I would go do my own research from reputable sources. Screw that.
I thought this was as good a place as any. I read AllPar, thought I'd give this place a try.
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Old 09-05-2014, 09:20 AM   #6
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We'll know when Chrysler makes up their mind and decides to let the world know. Until then it's nothing but useless speculations.

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Old 09-05-2014, 11:50 AM   #7
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As much as I'd love a diesel, I'm not sure that i could justify the added up front cost or maintenance costs. I feel as though proper gearing can get a gas motor to perform similar to a diesel off road at low speeds however this comes at the price of higher rpm on at highway speeds. Diesels also have one major drawback for people in cold climates being that they require significantly more time to warm to operating temperatures. I'll continue to enjoy my 3.6l and wait and see if or when a diesel becomes available here
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Old 09-05-2014, 12:37 PM   #8
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Bah on the deisels

Too heck with the diesels..... I'm waiting on the new HYBRID so I can get better MPG.
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Old 09-05-2014, 12:43 PM   #9
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I think the 3.0 V6D with an 8 speed AT like the GC has would be awesome.
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Old 09-05-2014, 12:57 PM   #10
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Geez I hope not.




I thought this was as good a place as any. I read AllPar, thought I'd give this place a try.
If you want to know how to fix death wobble, which winch will fit in which winch bumper, or whether you can fit 33's without a lift, this is the place. If you want to know what Jeep is going to do next, you may as well ask a magic 8 ball as come here and ask that question.
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:05 PM   #11
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Chrysler gets the V6 diesel from a company called VM. Even though its a Fiat subsidiary, I read an article that said they were at capacity on engine production doing engines for just the Grand Cherokee and Ram.

The Promaster van has an available 4 banger turbo diesel. Not sure if its ever going to happen, but I predict that'd be the one the Wrangler gets.
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:42 PM   #12
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My dad priced the new GC with the diesel and it was an additional $3000. It would take a long time to get that back just based on mpg's.

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Too heck with the diesels..... I'm waiting on the new HYBRID so I can get better MPG.
You'll have to save all your mod money to replace the batteries lol
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:45 PM   #13
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I thought the exec from Chrysler (Jeep) said that sales in the US for the diesel in the Grand Cherokee would need to double, before he would entertain offering a diesel in any other US market Jeep.
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:50 PM   #14
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I think if they where to option the wrangler here with a diesel then it would be the same 4 cylinder they use on Europe now. There is also more benefits to a diesel then just fuel mileage (which could be 10+ mpg better), the torque output and curve is a lot better, sure it's only 200hp but 400lbs or torque, you also get the longevity of the engine itself, if a gas motor is good for 300,000km then the diesel is good for an easy 600,000km. If they were to put one in then I would find it hard to not trade up
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:51 PM   #15
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My dad priced the new GC with the diesel and it was an additional $3000. It would take a long time to get that back just based on mpg's.



You'll have to save all your mod money to replace the batteries lol
You have to consider the resale too though, if you get $2k back for it when you sell it, the diesel really cost you a grand. Of course, maintenance, diesel fuel costs, a lot of factors at play. It's really hard to know for sure you are saving a buck or not by going diesel ... especially when we don't even know it's coming! But it is fun to talk about.
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:52 PM   #16
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Too heck with the diesels..... I'm waiting on the new HYBRID so I can get better MPG.
Something like this?




Coming from a hybrid AWD SUV, that got 32-33mpg around town, I wouldn't mind seeing a hybrid Wrangler going into production. Those electric motors develop lots of low-end torque.
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Old 09-05-2014, 01:56 PM   #17
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Something like this?




Coming from a hybrid AWD SUV, that got 32-33mpg around town, I wouldn't mind seeing a hybrid Wrangler going into production. Those electric motors develop lots of low-end torque.
Lol please no that just takes about 90% of the fun with a wrangler if it's a hybrid
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Old 09-05-2014, 02:13 PM   #18
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You have to consider the resale too though, if you get $2k back for it when you sell it, the diesel really cost you a grand. Of course, maintenance, diesel fuel costs, a lot of factors at play. It's really hard to know for sure you are saving a buck or not by going diesel ... especially when we don't even know it's coming! But it is fun to talk about.
That is basically correct - actually, when I sold my 2012 BMW X5 35d (BMW's 3.0 liter diesel version with 425 Ft Lbs of torque), I got about $4,000 more than the comparable 3.6 liter gas X5 went for.

But that's beside the point. No one buys a diesel today to save money. Opting for a diesel is like when someone pays thousands more for a Rubicon vs. a Sport. They feel they are getting more performance for their money.

Anyone that has owned a modern diesel knows they dramatically outperform a gas engine and get great fuel economy while doing it. It is like having your cake and eating it too. Sure, diesel fuel costs more than regular gas, but with the better mileage, the cost per mile is no more and is usually less.

As for maintenance - my experience was that diesels have next to no maintenance - certainly no more than a gas engine.

Based on the posts above, there are still a lot of misconceptions and belief in 1970's folklore about diesels among Jeep Wrangler owners. That would be the more likely impediment to Jeep offering a diesel package in a Wrangler.
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Old 09-05-2014, 02:24 PM   #19
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But that's beside the point. No one buys a diesel today to save money.
I don't know about that. I see a lot of people's eyes getting real wide when they see the 2wd Ram or GC getting 30 on the highway and thinking they are going to save a bunch of money getting a diesel.
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Old 09-05-2014, 02:25 PM   #20
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Anyone that has owned a modern diesel knows they dramatically outperform a gas engine ...
In first gear before the power peak of the gas engine, yes. Thereafter, no. You floor a 285 HP Pentastar at 30 MPH and it will walk a 200 HP diesel pulling an equal load, I don't care how much weight you have behind them.
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Old 09-05-2014, 02:46 PM   #21
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I think if they where to option the wrangler here with a diesel then it would be the same 4 cylinder they use on Europe now. There is also more benefits to a diesel then just fuel mileage (which could be 10+ mpg better), the torque output and curve is a lot better, sure it's only 200hp but 400lbs or torque, you also get the longevity of the engine itself, if a gas motor is good for 300,000km then the diesel is good for an easy 600,000km. If they were to put one in then I would find it hard to not trade up
I'd pass then, if they followed through and used the same engine platform as they're using in the GC and Ram I'd be interested. If a 4 cyl was the only choice i'm out

Interesting topic. Maybe someone who knows how corps operate could chime in with their 2 cents. Is it more efficient to use the US platform, or go with what's working in Europe?
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Old 09-05-2014, 02:55 PM   #22
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Something like this?




Coming from a hybrid AWD SUV, that got 32-33mpg around town, I wouldn't mind seeing a hybrid Wrangler going into production. Those electric motors develop lots of low-end torque.
A hybrid Jeep could be an interesting vehicle. I would worry about reliability. But great low end torque, great city MPG, and maneuverability would make the hybrid a great trail/urban vehicle. Now back to reality.
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Old 09-05-2014, 03:03 PM   #23
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In first gear before the power peak of the gas engine, yes. Thereafter, no. You floor a 285 HP Pentastar at 30 MPH and it will walk a 200 HP diesel pulling an equal load, I don't care how much weight you have behind them.
I would disagree. The diesel, especially with a load, will handily outrun a gasser. The gas motor may surge ahead for a second, but will quickly lose steam when (and every time) it downshifts and works back to the redline where it produced the most HP and torque. As any Motörhead will tell you, people buy horsepower but drive torque.
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Old 09-05-2014, 03:06 PM   #24
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I would disagree. The diesel, especially with a load, will handily outrun a gasser. The gas motor may surge ahead for a second, but will quickly lose steam when (and every time) it downshifts and works back to the redline where it produced the most HP and torque. As any Motörhead will tell you, people buy horsepower but drive torque.
Negative ghostrider. The rate at which work is accomplished is a function of power. With a three speed transmission or maybe with a 3.21 axle, yeah you could get into trouble. As long as you have enough gear, more power always wins. Physics says so.
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Old 09-05-2014, 03:51 PM   #25
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In first gear before the power peak of the gas engine, yes. Thereafter, no. You floor a 285 HP Pentastar at 30 MPH and it will walk a 200 HP diesel pulling an equal load, I don't care how much weight you have behind them.
I think you are referring to myth and folklore about diesels from the 70's. My BMW X5 35d had a 0 - 60 mph time at 7.2 seconds - very fast for a 5,500 lbs machine and just as fast as a gas engine.
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Old 09-05-2014, 04:07 PM   #26
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By design, gas engines rev faster and are able to reach higher rpm peaks than diesels. This allows them to attain greater horsepower numbers and quicker 0-60-mph times. However, if towing capacity and brute pulling force are your game, a diesel is for you. The torque advantage of diesels is perfectly suited for pulling heavy loads up steep grades.

Good read . http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/en...ine-vs-diesel/
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Old 09-05-2014, 04:17 PM   #27
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I think you are referring to myth and folklore about diesels from the 70's. My BMW X5 35d had a 0 - 60 mph time at 7.2 seconds - very fast for a 5,500 lbs machine and just as fast as a gas engine.
No, I am referring to the current 2.8 export diesel. If a diesel is within about 10% of the horsepower rating of a corresponding gas engine, I'd expect the diesel to about equal the gas engine's performance in all-out acceleration of a load.

FWIW, a 285 HP gas engine with a theoretically perfect CVT (steady state running the engine at the power peak) would out-accelerate a 284 HP diesel under all circumstances.
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Old 09-05-2014, 05:27 PM   #28
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By design, gas engines rev faster and are able to reach higher rpm peaks than diesels. This allows them to attain greater horsepower numbers and quicker 0-60-mph times. However, if towing capacity and brute pulling force are your game, a diesel is for you. The torque advantage of diesels is perfectly suited for pulling heavy loads up steep grades.

Good read . Power Grab - Gasoline Vs. Diesel - Four Wheeler Magazine

They'll outlast a gas engine too.
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:02 PM   #29
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My dad priced the new GC with the diesel and it was an additional $3000. It would take a long time to get that back just based on mpg's.
The other problem with the diesel GC is that I don't think you can get a base model. You have to buy a couple grand in options to get to the tier that then allows you to spend another 3 large.

I can see them doing that with the Wrangler too, only offering it as an option on the Rubicon. I love JKs, but I'm not spending 45 grand on one.
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Old 09-05-2014, 06:33 PM   #30
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Negative ghostrider. The rate at which work is accomplished is a function of power. With a three speed transmission or maybe with a 3.21 axle, yeah you could get into trouble. As long as you have enough gear, more power always wins. Physics says so.
If the theoretical perfect cvt existed, you'd be right. But the real world gasser is well out of its peak power (torque and hp) every time it downshifts. The diesel spends more pulling time in the meat of the power curve in the real world. Not to mention the advantages of a turbo diesel at altitude and under varying atmospheric conditions for which the naturally aspired 3.6 can't compensate. IMO anyway.

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