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Old 02-27-2013, 07:57 AM   #391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
I already have enough frustration trying to fit my Zeon winch on this beast, don't feel like playing around with the light mount
What's the issue with fitting a Zeon winch on the Rampage bumper? Just curious...think I've seen other, similar comments, but I'm wondering about specifics.

Looks like it has the same 10" x 4.5" mounting bolt pattern as WARN's other winches.

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Old 02-27-2013, 04:28 PM   #392
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It hits before the bolts fully tighten.

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Old 02-27-2013, 05:16 PM   #393
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bolt holes same

Doesnt matter it is a clearance issue. Why I ended up with Superwinch cause i wanted something covered more .
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Old 02-27-2013, 05:19 PM   #394
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Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
It hits before the bolts fully tighten.

Attachment 215307


Didn't realize the Zeons were that long...
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Old 02-27-2013, 05:24 PM   #395
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Ah, just checked out the schematics on WARN's site. Looks like the Zeon is symmetrical, as opposed to the left-side-heavy 9.5cti-s, which I've got sitting in my garage.

Why can't Jeeps be like Legos?
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Old 02-27-2013, 11:22 PM   #396
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Originally Posted by kbwwolf View Post
Ah, just checked out the schematics on WARN's site. Looks like the Zeon is symmetrical, as opposed to the left-side-heavy 9.5cti-s, which I've got sitting in my garage.

Why can't Jeeps be like Legos?
If you install the winch the way Rampage intended (winch plate resting on the bolt heads) I think you will gain enough height to clear it. The way I did it (drilled new holes and flushmounted the winch) it didn't quite clear (I'd say 3 threads worth.

Still the best damn looking winch money can buy.



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Old 02-27-2013, 11:37 PM   #397
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Nice looking Jeep. ^^^
What skid plate are you guys running with this bumper if any??
Thanks.
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Old 02-28-2013, 12:28 AM   #398
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Nice looking Jeep. ^^^
What skid plate are you guys running with this bumper if any??
Thanks.
Not running any. I don't see the need honestly.
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:32 AM   #399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC

If you install the winch the way Rampage intended (winch plate resting on the bolt heads) I think you will gain enough height to clear it. The way I did it (drilled new holes and flushmounted the winch) it didn't quite clear (I'd say 3 threads worth.

Still the best damn looking winch money can buy.
Rampage did not intend for the mount to be placed on the bolts. They had a batch that were countersunk on the wrong side. They sent me a new plate with it done correctly.
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:42 AM   #400
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Rampage did not intend for the mount to be placed on the bolts. They had a batch that were countersunk on the wrong side. They sent me a new plate with it done correctly.
Doesn't look like either side of my winch plate is prepped for countersunk bolts; just straight-through holes, no flange for bolt heads.
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Old 02-28-2013, 12:41 PM   #401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbwwolf

Doesn't look like either side of my winch plate is prepped for countersunk bolts; just straight-through holes, no flange for bolt heads.
If you go to page 15 of this thread you will see the pic of the incorrect plate. I contacted Rampage and they sent me a new plate that was countersunk from the bottom up and the bolts to bolt the plate to the bumper. Now fits flush with bumper. I had to order the countersunk bolts through the web. I have no pics of it installed because I haven't installed it yet. Still thinking of how to fuse and cut off the winch. Read many stories of direct connected winches and mishaps. This is what I ended up buying. M10 1.5 x 25 stainless.

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Old 02-28-2013, 02:12 PM   #402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubear7 View Post
If you go to page 15 of this thread you will see the pic of the incorrect plate. I contacted Rampage and they sent me a new plate that was countersunk from the bottom up and the bolts to bolt the plate to the bumper. Now fits flush with bumper. I had to order the countersunk bolts through the web. I have no pics of it installed because I haven't installed it yet. Still thinking of how to fuse and cut off the winch. Read many stories of direct connected winches and mishaps. This is what I ended up buying. M10 1.5 x 25 stainless.

Attachment 215620
Those are NOT to be used for winches. That was the problem. Even with the countersunk plate, no one makes decent grade countersunk bolts. As a result, I had to get more drastic with the install. I would not trust those bolts on a 5000lb JKU.
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:47 PM   #403
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubear7 View Post
If you go to page 15 of this thread you will see the pic of the incorrect plate.
Which thread? This one's only got 14 pages...

Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Those are NOT to be used for winches. That was the problem. Even with the countersunk plate, no one makes decent grade countersunk bolts. As a result, I had to get more drastic with the install. I would not trust those bolts on a 5000lb JKU.
What are peeps using then? I've seen a bunch of these bumpers with winches mounted, and it seems like most have been able to mount via the countersunk method.

There's a place right down the street from me that can get just about any nut/bolt combo for any purpose, it seems like...it's where I ended up buying my replacement bolts for control arms / track bars.
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:47 PM   #404
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Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Those are NOT to be used for winches. That was the problem. Even with the countersunk plate, no one makes decent grade countersunk bolts. As a result, I had to get more drastic with the install. I would not trust those bolts on a 5000lb JKU.
Yeah that is bad news. Grade 8 bolts have shear strength of something like 120000 psi, stainless have something like 40000, psi. I'll see if I can find the chart somewhere but I think SS bolts are around grade 2. I could see a pretty bad issue if your bolts shear under load.

Edit: I'd have more concern about the Stainless bolts strength then the fact it is countersunk.

On a lighter note my Rampage Recovery bumper is sitting on my front porch!
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Old 02-28-2013, 03:21 PM   #405
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Originally Posted by termite

Yeah that is bad news. Grade 8 bolts have shear strength of something like 120000 psi, stainless have something like 40000, psi. I'll see if I can find the chart somewhere but I think SS bolts are around grade 2. I could see a pretty bad issue if your bolts shear under load.

Edit: I'd have more concern about the Stainless bolts strength then the fact it is countersunk.

On a lighter note my Rampage Recovery bumper is sitting on my front porch!
That's what I meant. They are simply not strong enough. I wouldn't trust them personally. The last thing I need is for my 100lb winch to go flying.

If you go back like 7 pages you will see I was in the same boat and rampage even sent me the correct plate. However, I spent days trying to source grade 8 or even close to that countersunk m10s and found nothing. In the end, I had to drill the bumper. It is a poor design and there is no getting around it. Rumor has it rampage is modifying the new bumpers but obviously that's irrelevant to all of us that already have the bumper. It's either buy a new bumper or modify this one to make it work.
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Old 02-28-2013, 04:57 PM   #406
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rampage

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Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
That's what I meant. They are simply not strong enough. I wouldn't trust them personally. The last thing I need is for my 100lb winch to go flying.

If you go back like 7 pages you will see I was in the same boat and rampage even sent me the correct plate. However, I spent days trying to source grade 8 or even close to that countersunk m10s and found nothing. In the end, I had to drill the bumper. It is a poor design and there is no getting around it. Rumor has it rampage is modifying the new bumpers but obviously that's irrelevant to all of us that already have the bumper. It's either buy a new bumper or modify this one to make it work.
X2 did the same thing worked fine. Sits flat and is strong enough
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:16 PM   #407
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kb sorry page 15 was on my Ipad. Guess it format different.
Thank You NFR and termite as I have yet to mount it. I did find these though, what do you guys think. Here are the specs:

System of Measurement: Metric
Diameter: M10
Drive: Hex
Drive Size: 6mm
Finish: Black Oxide
Grade: 12.9
Length: 25mm
Material: Steel
Thread: Coarse
Thread Size: 1.50
Type: Flat Socket Cap Screw
Product Weight: 3.93 lbs.
Notes: Flat Head Socket Cap Screws are used for flush mounting of sections, usually where one part slides over another part or one part is mounted on another. Flat head screws are limited by configuration in their tensile strength capability. Thermal Black Oxide finish features a standard heat treatment finish which includes light drying oil; Chemical Black Oxide is a chemical treatment plus rust resistant with no drying oil. Class 10.9 has a minimum tensile strength of 1040 MPa, or approximately equivalent to SAE Grade 8.

HK M10-1.5 x 25mm Flat Head Socket Cap Screw | Fastenal

or this

http://www.fastenal.com/web/products...ex?sku=0141412
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:21 PM   #408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubear7 View Post
kb sorry page 15 was on my Ipad. Guess it format different.
Thank You NFR and termite as I have yet to mount it. I did find these though, what do you guys think. Here are the specs:

System of Measurement: Metric
Diameter: M10
Drive: Hex
Drive Size: 6mm
Finish: Black Oxide
Grade: 12.9
Length: 25mm
Material: Steel
Thread: Coarse
Thread Size: 1.50
Type: Flat Socket Cap Screw
Product Weight: 3.93 lbs.
Notes: Flat Head Socket Cap Screws are used for flush mounting of sections, usually where one part slides over another part or one part is mounted on another. Flat head screws are limited by configuration in their tensile strength capability. Thermal Black Oxide finish features a standard heat treatment finish which includes light drying oil; Chemical Black Oxide is a chemical treatment plus rust resistant with no drying oil. Class 10.9 has a minimum tensile strength of 1040 MPa, or approximately equivalent to SAE Grade 8.

HK M10-1.5 x 25mm Flat Head Socket Cap Screw | Fastenal
Interesting....these seem to be better. If the grade is legit, I think these could work.
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:25 PM   #409
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Oh....forgot to mention this earlier because I just said "the Zeon won't fit" so I figured it will not be an issue for anyone, but since you are hunting these countersunk bolts, you need to know...

This applies to the ZEON WINCH LINE ONLY.....

As you know, the rampage plate is a two bolt system....one set of holes is used to bolt the plate to the winch, the other set of holes is to bolt the plate to the bumper. Now, obviously you need to mount the winch you the plate first. The problem is, the Zeon is so wide, once you attach the winch to the plate, you will NOT be able to bolt the plate to the bumper. There will not be enough room for you to get the bolts in. Go do a dry run and you will quickly see what I mean.
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:33 PM   #410
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I realize that. I don't have a clearance problem but don't want the winch to shear off either. Thanks again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NFRs2000NYC View Post
Oh....forgot to mention this earlier because I just said "the Zeon won't fit" so I figured it will not be an issue for anyone, but since you are hunting these countersunk bolts, you need to know...

This applies to the ZEON WINCH LINE ONLY.....

As you know, the rampage plate is a two bolt system....one set of holes is used to bolt the plate to the winch, the other set of holes is to bolt the plate to the bumper. Now, obviously you need to mount the winch you the plate first. The problem is, the Zeon is so wide, once you attach the winch to the plate, you will NOT be able to bolt the plate to the bumper. There will not be enough room for you to get the bolts in. Go do a dry run and you will quickly see what I mean.
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Old 02-28-2013, 07:20 PM   #411
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Somebody may have answered this already, but I haven't seen it. I have a 2013 Sport, and am interested in getting the Rampage bumper (88510). Almost every site I see says it fits up to the 2011. I've seen only one site say it fits a 2013, so I just want to make sure I don't regret my purchase.
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Old 02-28-2013, 07:36 PM   #412
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Originally Posted by Chewbone
Somebody may have answered this already, but I haven't seen it. I have a 2013 Sport, and am interested in getting the Rampage bumper (88510). Almost every site I see says it fits up to the 2011. I've seen only one site say it fits a 2013, so I just want to make sure I don't regret my purchase.
It fits. I have a 2012 and it went on like a glove.
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Old 02-28-2013, 10:09 PM   #413
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It hits before the bolts fully tighten.

Attachment 215307
Thanks! Went ahead and placed my order.

What do you think of placing a 1/8" or 1/4" plate between the winch plate and the bumper? This would lift the assembly up a tad, and hopefully clear the ends.
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Old 02-28-2013, 10:36 PM   #414
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Try an industrial hardware store for countersunk Grade 8 bolts. Ie: we have Mc Faddendale. Grainger, Fastenal are some others.
Finally got my Body Armor front skid cut to fit. Pretty simple with a reciprocating saw and bi-metal blade. Just need to find the time to get it bolted on....hopefully this weekend.
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Old 03-01-2013, 01:00 AM   #415
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Thanks! Went ahead and placed my order.

What do you think of placing a 1/8" or 1/4" plate between the winch plate and the bumper? This would lift the assembly up a tad, and hopefully clear the ends.
That might be enough. I'd use grade 8 washers as the spacer. Stack as many as you need.
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Old 03-01-2013, 08:00 AM   #416
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Originally Posted by Ubear7 View Post
kb sorry page 15 was on my Ipad. Guess it format different.
Thank You NFR and termite as I have yet to mount it. I did find these though, what do you guys think. Here are the specs:

System of Measurement: Metric
Diameter: M10
Drive: Hex
Drive Size: 6mm
Finish: Black Oxide
Grade: 12.9
Length: 25mm
Material: Steel
Thread: Coarse
Thread Size: 1.50
Type: Flat Socket Cap Screw
Product Weight: 3.93 lbs.
Notes: Flat Head Socket Cap Screws are used for flush mounting of sections, usually where one part slides over another part or one part is mounted on another. Flat head screws are limited by configuration in their tensile strength capability. Thermal Black Oxide finish features a standard heat treatment finish which includes light drying oil; Chemical Black Oxide is a chemical treatment plus rust resistant with no drying oil. Class 10.9 has a minimum tensile strength of 1040 MPa, or approximately equivalent to SAE Grade 8.

HK M10-1.5 x 25mm Flat Head Socket Cap Screw | Fastenal

or this

M10-1.50 x 25mm DIN 7991 Class 10.9 Zinc Flat Head Socket Cap Screw | Fastenal

Yeah those would work, the 12.9 grade ones especially. If you end up buying those and get stuck buying a pack of them let me know I'll buy 4 off you.
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Old 03-01-2013, 08:31 AM   #417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ubear7 View Post
kb sorry page 15 was on my Ipad. Guess it format different.
Thank You NFR and termite as I have yet to mount it. I did find these though, what do you guys think. Here are the specs:

System of Measurement: Metric
Diameter: M10
Drive: Hex
Drive Size: 6mm
Finish: Black Oxide
Grade: 12.9
Length: 25mm
Material: Steel
Thread: Coarse
Thread Size: 1.50
Type: Flat Socket Cap Screw
Product Weight: 3.93 lbs.
Notes: Flat Head Socket Cap Screws are used for flush mounting of sections, usually where one part slides over another part or one part is mounted on another. Flat head screws are limited by configuration in their tensile strength capability. Thermal Black Oxide finish features a standard heat treatment finish which includes light drying oil; Chemical Black Oxide is a chemical treatment plus rust resistant with no drying oil. Class 10.9 has a minimum tensile strength of 1040 MPa, or approximately equivalent to SAE Grade 8.

HK M10-1.5 x 25mm Flat Head Socket Cap Screw | Fastenal

or this

M10-1.50 x 25mm DIN 7991 Class 10.9 Zinc Flat Head Socket Cap Screw | Fastenal
Quote:
Originally Posted by termite View Post
Yeah those would work, the 12.9 grade ones especially. If you end up buying those and get stuck buying a pack of them let me know I'll buy 4 off you.
You're talking about using these to mount the winch plate to the bumper, right? The threads in my bumper are fine, not coarse...
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Old 03-01-2013, 08:44 AM   #418
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You're talking about using these to mount the winch plate to the bumper, right? The threads in my bumper are fine, not coarse...
Sorry I was referring to the tapered head ones needed to mount the wench to the plate. The first ones that were linked.

The ones needed to mount the plate to the bumper do not need to be tapered. You should be able to source those from a local hardware store.
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Old 03-21-2013, 07:06 AM   #419
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UPDATE. I got the bumper in on Monday, put it on yesterday, and all I have to say is HOT DAMN. That thing looks like its just ready to eat up the trail! I don't have any initial sag yet, but I'm doing the front coil swap soon anyway. I feel having the front as high as the rear would really make a difference in looks and feel.
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Old 03-22-2013, 12:49 AM   #420
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UPDATE. I got the bumper in on Monday, put it on yesterday, and all I have to say is HOT DAMN. That thing looks like its just ready to eat up the trail! I don't have any initial sag yet, but I'm doing the front coil swap soon anyway. I feel having the front as high as the rear would really make a difference in looks and feel.
How was the install? Mine's on order, will have it next week. Never messed with bumpers before and gonna try it myself.

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