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Old 03-25-2013, 07:38 PM   #1
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Response from Jeep regarding 50lb weight limit on rear tailgate

I noticed recently that the factory spare tire for my 2013 2-Door Wrangler Rubicon weighs in at about ~80lbs.

The instruction manual on page 542 states:
Quote:
NOTE:If you have added aftermarket accessories to the spare tire mounted carrier, it cannot exceed a gross weight of 50 lbs (23 kg) including the weight of the spare tire.
I found a few links discussing this, but no real resolution...
http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/tai...lbs-61897.html
Tailgate weight capacity 200 lbs.?? - JeepForum.com
Stock Tire Carrier Weight Limit

I even found one vendor that says in a video for one of their products that the tailgate weight limit is 200lbs. Notice how the JK spare mounts directly to the rear tailgate. (Watch the video starting at 1m 29 seconds in)


I called Bestop last week, and they told me that their opinion of the 200lb weight limit was based on "real world testing", and not any documentation put out by Jeep. The Bestop rep I spoke with did not know exactly what this testing involved.

I contacted Jeep corporate with a question regarding this discrepancy as I am a bit worried about the factory 33" spare causing damage to my brand-new Jeep's tailgate.

It took them about 1/2 a week to respond.

Their CS rep said that their system does not have the ability for them to email it to me, so I had her read it to me over the phone and I copied it down word for word. The formatting may be different then what they originally had.

Here is the response:
Quote:
The spare tire carrier and gate are designed for the factory equipped size and type wheel/tire combination. Now this vehicle was built with 255/75r17 BF Goodrich on/off road tires mounted on Rubicon style factory aluminum 17x8 wheels. If the owner does operate in a spirited off-road manner they may wish to remove the tire to prevent damage as extreme driving may cause damage to components, not just limited to the spare tire and tailgate.

We recommend operating the vehicle in a safe manner. Tread lightly.
The response is kind of a non-answer.

I'm not sure what they mean by "extreme" driving, but it probably falls under what I'm planning on doing.

Has anyone had any trouble with the factory 33" tire on the tailgate? The Teraflex carrier is looking quite attractive right now, but it's so much $$$$.

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Old 03-25-2013, 09:34 PM   #2
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I haven't seen anyone have issues with 33's, mine are only 5lbs heavier a wheel than the sports 17 and sra that was replaced and lighter than the Rubi ones. I have seen pictures on here where people with 35's have had the spot welds on the inside break loose and start to deform the gate.

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Old 03-25-2013, 09:36 PM   #3
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The "factory" tire is 32". If you get a wider 33" tire you should add an extended rubber tire bumper thing. If you go to 35's I would advise a different tire carrier.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:25 PM   #4
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The diameter (top to bottom) of my factory BF Goodrich Mud Terrian tires that came with the Jeep is 32.75 inches, according to my tape measure. Does that not mean they are 33s? Am I just a newb and I'm measuring it incorrectly?

The issue is one of weight though... I'm not planning on swapping tires anytime soon, but at the same time I don't want to break my tailgate with the 30lbs of weight more then is recommended.

Jeep's response leads me to believe that Jeep's engineers know they are shipping a spare that is too heavy so they recommend removing it for "spirited" off-road use. ???
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:36 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unusedusername View Post
The diameter (top to bottom) of my factory BF Goodrich Mud Terrian tires that came with the Jeep is 32.75 inches, according to my tape measure. Does that not mean they are 33s? Am I just a newb and I'm measuring it incorrectly?

The issue is one of weight though... I'm not planning on swapping tires anytime soon, but at the same time I don't want to break my tailgate with the 30lbs of weight more then is recommended.

Jeep's response leads me to believe that Jeep's engineers know they are shipping a spare that is too heavy so they recommend removing it for "spirited" off-road use. ???
yet they do not mention removing it in the owners manual which is bs in itself.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:54 PM   #6
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Quote:
NOTE:If you have added aftermarket accessories to the spare tire mounted carrier, it cannot exceed a gross weight of 50 lbs (23 kg) including the weight of the spare tire.
I think this statement means that you cannot add anything more than 50 lbs to the stock setup.

So let's say the stock tire is 80 lbs. You upgrade to a different tire weighing 110 pounds. You are ok because 110-80 = 30lbs. Say you add 2 gas cans at 20 lbs each. You now have 30lbs + 20lbs + 20lbs = 70lbs. This is a problem because you have exceeded the 50lbs additional weight limit (including the spare).

that's my interpretation anyway. I guess they recommend removing the spare because they know the welds are weak on the tailgate. Any significant bump can cause a force on the spare that well exceeds the extra 50lbs.
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Old 03-25-2013, 10:57 PM   #7
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^ Recheck your math. LOL
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Old 03-25-2013, 11:10 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by SilverSport View Post
^ Recheck your math. LOL
I think it's correct. Unless i'm really dumb, which is known to happen more often than not.

[Weight aftermarket (incl. spare) - Weight stock (incl. spare)] <= 50lbs

(110lbs + 20lbs + 20lbs) - 80lbs = 70 lbs

70 > 50 bad.

This is the only interpretation of the manual that can make sense, considering that 50lbs is more than the stock tire and wheel weight. Otherwise the manual is wrong.
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Old 03-25-2013, 11:12 PM   #9
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A gallon of gasoline weighs about 7 pounds. Filling one 5 gallon gas can add nearly 35 pounds to the base weight of the can itself.

Keep this in mind.
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Old 03-25-2013, 11:12 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by SilverSport View Post
^ Recheck your math. LOL
I don't get what's wrong?
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Old 03-25-2013, 11:14 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastek View Post
I think it's correct. Unless i'm really dumb, which is known to happen more often than not.

[Weight aftermarket (incl. spare) - Weight stock (incl. spare)] <= 50lbs

(110lbs + 20lbs + 20lbs) - 80lbs = 70 lbs

70 > 50 bad.

This is the only interpretation of the manual that can make sense, considering that 50lbs is more than the stock tire and wheel weight. Otherwise the manual is wrong.
Ok. My interpretation was wrong. LOL
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Old 03-25-2013, 11:49 PM   #12
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I come from an engineering background (software, not cars)....

When I called Jeep with the issue that caused them to open a help ticket I told them the following:
* The book says that the tailgate can not hold more then 50lbs including the weight of the spare in that 50lbs
* The factory spare weighs more then 50lbs

This means either:
1) The book is in error
or
2) They are shipping a spare tire that could damage the Jeep in some suituations
or both

Given their response "If the owner does operate in a spirited off-road manner they may wish to remove the tire to prevent damage"

I'm guessing it is #2....

Another fun factiod: The dealer called me back this evening and told me that the factory spare on the non-Rubicon models all weigh less then 50lbs. I can't verify this as I don't have one...
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:06 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unusedusername View Post
I come from an engineering background (software, not cars)....

When I called Jeep with the issue that caused them to open a help ticket I told them the following:
* The book says that the tailgate can not hold more then 50lbs including the weight of the spare in that 50lbs
* The factory spare weighs more then 50lbs

This means either:
1) The book is in error
or
2) They are shipping a spare tire that could damage the Jeep in some suituations
or both

Given their response "If the owner does operate in a spirited off-road manner they may wish to remove the tire to prevent damage"

I'm guessing it is #2....

Another fun factiod: The dealer called me back this evening and told me that the factory spare on the non-Rubicon models all weigh less then 50lbs. I can't verify this as I don't have one...
As a fellow engineer (the better kind of course ), I noted the wording here:

Quote:
NOTE:If you have added aftermarket accessories to the spare tire mounted carrier, it cannot exceed a gross weight of 50 lbs (23 kg) including the weight of the spare tire.
Their scapegoat is it. Is it the spare tire carrier, or the aftermarket accessory?

I have written a couple of emails to Chrysler with regards to specifications on unrelated items. I can tell you that the engineers are not the people that write back.
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Old 03-26-2013, 12:34 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastek View Post
Their scapegoat is it. Is it the spare tire carrier, or the aftermarket accessory?
Whatever "it" is, "it" seems to be including the weight of the spare tire.

ST (spare tire) + IT (undefined "it") < 50lbs ?

If ST alone weighs more then 50lbs then IT must have weight < 0lbs.

My accessories must be made of a substance with negitive weight

Is there any other way to read this?

If I try to read it like this:
"If you have added aftermarket accessories to the spare tire mounted carrier, it cannot exceed a gross weight of 50 lbs (23 kg)."

Then I wind up with a disconnected proposition on the end of the sentence: "including the weight of the spare tire." I can't find any way to put this part back in without it meaning what I said above...

I agree that the respose seems to smell of the legal and/or marketing departments...
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Old 03-26-2013, 01:10 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unusedusername View Post
Whatever "it" is, "it" seems to be including the weight of the spare tire.

ST (spare tire) + IT (undefined "it") < 50lbs ?

If ST alone weighs more then 50lbs then IT must have weight < 0lbs.

My accessories must be made of a substance with negitive weight

Is there any other way to read this?

If I try to read it like this:
"If you have added aftermarket accessories to the spare tire mounted carrier, it cannot exceed a gross weight of 50 lbs (23 kg)."

Then I wind up with a disconnected proposition on the end of the sentence: "including the weight of the spare tire." I can't find any way to put this part back in without it meaning what I said above...

I agree that the respose seems to smell of the legal and/or marketing departments...
Sounds like legal and Marketing BS to me.

Maybe if you filled your spare with Helium you would be OK.
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Old 03-26-2013, 02:03 AM   #16
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Question

[QUOTE=unusedusername;3551672
Has anyone had any trouble with the factory 33" tire on the tailgate? The Teraflex carrier is looking quite attractive right now, but it's so much $$$$.[/QUOTE]

EVEN so, That's still cheaper than a New Tail Gate + the Labor and Paint to go with it, Not to mention the
DOWN TIME involved. (seems like the lessor of two evils to me is a Carrier)
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Old 03-26-2013, 02:57 AM   #17
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The manual says 50lbs gross weight INCLUDING the spare tire. That doesn't mean 50lbs additional over the weight of the spare, it means the spare tire itself is overweight for the factory rating.
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Old 03-26-2013, 03:37 AM   #18
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Cool Hmmmmm

Sounds like a good excuse to get one of those fancy integrated bumper/tire carrier things to me.
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Old 03-26-2013, 05:44 AM   #19
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Just my two cents ...i have a 2010 and i put bfg mud km2 33" on mine and my tailgate started to flex .every time i hit a bump i could hear a knocking noise .sounded like the tailgate wasnt closed all the way.i messed with the adjustment and still nothing.so i bit the bullet and bought the teraflex hinge carrier and it solved all my problems. Its a little pricey but its aluminum and very well made it lookes stock and im very happy with it
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:00 AM   #20
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Here's another thread good thread on this subject: http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/35-...ing-90002.html


A post from that thread by Member Joe002:

Quote from the Owners Manual:
NOTE: If you have added aftermarket accessories to the spare tire mounted carrier, it cannot exceed a gross weight of 50 lbs (23 kg) including the weight of the spare tire.

My stock spare tire/wheel weighed 71 pounds.


I had an opportunity to question a Jeep Engineer:

Q: I have not been able to find the weight restriction for the spare tire and wheel on the tailgate. Do you know the maximum weight that can be safely added to the spare tire tailgate bracket without having to worry about damaging the tailgate?

Jeep Engineer: No more weight than the largest stock tire - and a mopar bike carrier. The length of life on the sheetmetal is directly proportinal to the weight you might add. The only weight we certify for the tailgate is a stock size. We do not recommend heavier tires. However, we know some do it, we don't know the long term effects. We run 100,000 mile durability tests...

Q: OK, thanks. I just did a quick look on-line and it appears the bike carrier shipping weight is 37 pounds. Is that about right? If so, then I should be able to put on a spare that is up to 37 pounds more than my stock Rubicon wheel/tire, correct?

Jeep Engineer: The bike carrier is only used every once in a while. if you do go up the 37lbs, tailgate life will depend on use - rough roads, gate slam - 1once a week or 5 times a day? ETC. Thanks
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Old 03-26-2013, 10:46 AM   #21
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Another fun factiod: The dealer called me back this evening and told me that the factory spare on the non-Rubicon models all weigh less then 50lbs. I can't verify this as I don't have one...
This is a stock 2013 Sahara spare. Your dealer is a bit off.
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Old 03-26-2013, 11:00 AM   #22
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This is a stock 2013 Sahara spare. Your dealer is a bit off.
Sweet to the point photo!
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Old 03-26-2013, 11:03 AM   #23
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I think the only one that comes in at 50lb is the 225/75-16 combo. Besides the Rubicon does not come with any additional support for the spare so it makes no sense at all why they can limit it too 50lbs at least without some kind of warning about removing the spare from the carrier for off road use. It is obvious that these are not in fact trail rated....as they come from the factory. Hmm someone sued Subway for selling footlongs that were only 11.5 inches long maybe we should sue jeep for false advertising lol.
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Old 03-26-2013, 06:39 PM   #24
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This is a stock 2013 Sahara spare. Your dealer is a bit off.
Yikes! I guess I'm not going to do any maintenance with that dealer.

Maybe the older ones are lighter? They didn't tell me which model year they measured?

I don't think a lawsuit is in order personally, as many, many cars are sold partially-baked.

New BMWs don't come with spare tires, it's a separate purchase. Apparently new Jeeps require you to purchase a spare tire holder.
I would have appreciated if they just admitted it though...
Anyways I think I've beaten this topic to death. Back to Jeepin...
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:04 PM   #25
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Quote:
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I think the only one that comes in at 50lb is the 225/75-16 combo.
Even that comes in at 52 pounds. Not much over but technically it would be over that "50lb limit"
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Old 03-26-2013, 07:48 PM   #26
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Just seems written incorrectly. Sensible interpretation seems to be the 50 pound over heaviest spare argument. I would interpret the engineer's comment of "...going over and abuse could cause damage..." seems like a reasonable and logical comment. A big spare or extra rack on the tailgate will take its toll, especially offroad, so use it sparingly...
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Old 03-26-2013, 09:01 PM   #27
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The way I read the manual and the above dialogue I am not real comfortable with my 80 lb combo. I don't do heavy duty off roading tho so I doubt my tail gate will fall off. Still not a real warm and fuzzy feeling.
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Old 03-26-2013, 10:36 PM   #28
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Here is my dilemma, it just snowed over 16 inches in one day and the roads were partially plowed. Alaska is like an urban jungle! Maybe I will have to remove the spare and mount it on the inside? Thoughts? Concerns? This is the stock tire I am referring to. If the tailgate is tested at 100k miles I wonder if that's flat road and not rougher terrain.
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Old 03-26-2013, 11:27 PM   #29
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Stock spare? On road? Even with a little snow that is fine. The concern would be additional weight...
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Old 03-26-2013, 11:56 PM   #30
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Meh..

Run it until it breaks then replace it with something better.

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