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Old 09-17-2011, 09:49 PM   #1
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Selling / Trading 2011 Rubicon for 2012 - Stupid? Worth it?

Last year when I kept reading on forums like this that every year it's rumored the wrangler will have a new more powerful engine this year it comes and goes and no new engine, so with the new redesigned interior, I decided not to wait, bit the bullet and bought one. I ordered it from the factory with every option available (4 door rubi). The only option I didn't get was the smokers group. Paid $37,000.

And then of course, my luck the very next year we go from a 202HP motor to a 285HP motor...figures.

Now I'm *considering* a 2012 configured the same (but the one they found is 250 miles away, so they have to have someone drive it here) for $39K but in addition to all options my 2011 had, it also has the color keyed fenders and hard top.

Couple things...They will only give me $29k for my 2011, kbb.com shows a 2010 rubi with my miles (20,000) trade in value at $32k (they don't list 2011 yet), private party $34k. If I really can get $34k selling the 2011 myself then this is a no brainer, I'm definetely getting the 2012...If however I end up trading it in for $29k, is it worth it? My total cost difference over the term of the loan is $5,300 because I do have some equity in the 2011 (which by the way would be entirely lost in this deal on the 2012).

I LOVE my 2011 Rubi, the only thing I hate (and I really do hate it) is the total absence of power under the hood and the gas mileage (lucky to get 15mpg on a tank, averaging 14 - but I do have 33's on it), plus I think the new motor can also tow more too(?).

If the new motor would squeek out an extra 2-3 mpg's then this difference in cost, even getting only $29k for my 2011, would be recovered in 6 years owning it and I plan to keep this thing for a lot longer than that as a family toy down the road.

Last but not least, when I bought my 2011 I drove it from the dealer to a tire shop and had duratrac 33's put on it. Now those have 20,000 miles on them, tire shop says well over half their life left on them now...I was going to have them put on the new 2012 and put the 2012 new tires on my 2011 which of course will be traded or sold...should I?

Thanks in advance for any and all comments!

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Old 09-17-2011, 09:53 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by sdgmcdon View Post
If the new motor would squeek out an extra 2-3 mpg's then this difference in cost, even getting only $29k for my 2011, would be recovered in 6 years owning it and I plan to keep this thing for a lot longer than that as a family toy down the road.
Your 2011 wouldn't be getting the MPG it is without the mods you've done. As soon as you start changing your 2012 then round you go.

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Old 09-17-2011, 10:05 PM   #3
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Unless you don't mind losing $10K, right off the bat--


Quote:
Originally Posted by sdgmcdon View Post
Last year when I kept reading on forums like this that every year it's rumored the wrangler will have a new more powerful engine this year it comes and goes and no new engine, so with the new redesigned interior, I decided not to wait, bit the bullet and bought one. I ordered it from the factory with every option available (4 door rubi). The only option I didn't get was the smokers group. Paid $37,000.

And then of course, my luck the very next year we go from a 202HP motor to a 285HP motor...figures.

Now I'm *considering* a 2012 configured the same (but the one they found is 250 miles away, so they have to have someone drive it here) for $39K but in addition to all options my 2011 had, it also has the color keyed fenders and hard top.

Couple things...They will only give me $29k for my 2011, kbb.com shows a 2010 rubi with my miles (20,000) trade in value at $32k (they don't list 2011 yet), private party $34k. If I really can get $34k selling the 2011 myself then this is a no brainer, I'm definetely getting the 2012...If however I end up trading it in for $29k, is it worth it? My total cost difference over the term of the loan is $5,300 because I do have some equity in the 2011 (which by the way would be entirely lost in this deal on the 2012).

I LOVE my 2011 Rubi, the only thing I hate (and I really do hate it) is the total absence of power under the hood and the gas mileage (lucky to get 15mpg on a tank, averaging 14 - but I do have 33's on it), plus I think the new motor can also tow more too(?).

If the new motor would squeek out an extra 2-3 mpg's then this difference in cost, even getting only $29k for my 2011, would be recovered in 6 years owning it and I plan to keep this thing for a lot longer than that as a family toy down the road.

Last but not least, when I bought my 2011 I drove it from the dealer to a tire shop and had duratrac 33's put on it. Now those have 20,000 miles on them, tire shop says well over half their life left on them now...I was going to have them put on the new 2012 and put the 2012 new tires on my 2011 which of course will be traded or sold...should I?

Thanks in advance for any and all comments!
Just regear for $1200 to 1800 bucks and you're back in the power game/w good mileage--

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Old 09-17-2011, 10:12 PM   #4
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thats no money for a big hitter-just buy what you want!
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Old 09-17-2011, 10:37 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
Unless you don't mind losing $10K, right off the bat--




Just regear for $1200 to 1800 bucks and you're back in the power game/w good mileage--

JIMBO
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I was thinking of doing the same thing.. Here is my story- When I ordered my 2011 unlimited sport last year, I really wanted a 2010 but waited too long. So I just ordered a 2011 the way I wanted it. MSRP was around $32+K

Went to my local Jeep dealer last week to build a replica in a 2012 model at about the same price $32-33K
They only were going to give me $23,500 for mine ( I have about 9000 miles on it ) ... and would be a $8500 difference to upgrade... No Way... I will be keeping my 2011 for a while. Over $8K for that motor is not worth it to me.... I just ordered my lift and wheels will be coming soon too

I also was just recently told, the Auto trans could change again very soon to a 8-speed Auto with the new V6
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Old 09-17-2011, 10:45 PM   #6
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Heh Heh, I've got nothing against buying a new "ANYTHING", I've done it with Dodges/Corvettes, but


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^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I was thinking of doing the same thing.. Here is my story- When I ordered my 2011 unlimited sport last year, I really wanted a 2010 but waited too long. So I just ordered a 2011 the way I wanted it. MSRP was around $32+K

Went to my local Jeep dealer last week to build a replica in a 2012 model at about the same price $32-33K
They only were going to give me $23,500 for mine ( I have about 9000 miles on it ) ... and would be a $8500 difference to upgrade... No Way... I will be keeping my 2011 for a while. Over $8K for that motor is not worth it to me.... I just ordered my lift and wheels will be coming soon too

I also was just recently told, the Auto trans could change again very soon to a 8-speed Auto with the new V6
I was pretty hesitant with this new jeep and the whole auto industry/w gov't pressure is going CRAZY-

I've got more than a little $$$ in my '08 JKUR and by regearing, I've quelled any fantasies, of buying a new one-----untill at least 2014--

Ya gotta be true to yourself and be happy, you don't really wanna constantly gripe about your toy/DD/overlander--give it some thought

Losing $10K like I said above, actually means very little--if you're happy/content/pleased--RIGHT ??

Keepyerpowderdry

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Old 09-17-2011, 11:01 PM   #7
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$10k buys a lot of gas.
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Old 09-17-2011, 11:04 PM   #8
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Ok- too simple an answer.

1- You're already taken the worst hit on depreciation percentage-wise.. Proportionately, you could wait until 2013 and you will have gotten more use out of your ride for the hit you'll take.

B- As has been mentioned, when you mod your ride you'll lose mileage. The 2012 isn't a hybrid.

Tres- No.
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Old 09-18-2011, 06:54 AM   #9
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It sounds like you've already talked yourself into it. No way in hell would I trade it in. Trading it in is a complete waste of money, as you can no doubt tell by the offer you received. Put it on Craigslist for the price you want and let it sit. Might take a while, but it will eventually sell. If I had to guess, it'll probably sell in about 6-8 weeks, after all the 2011's are gone, and after the 2011 rebates are gone. Once it sells, scour the Internet for the 2012 you want. But you'll need to be patient for your 2011 to sell. You'll also need to find an interested party that's not aware of the 2012 changes, or that doesn't care about the 2012 changes. Also, as for mods, you'll never get that money back on resell, unfortunately.
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:10 AM   #10
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For me, no.

1) for TEN THOUSAND dollars, I could more than half way pay off my 2011 JKU, whether it has power or not, add in another 7k along with that depreciation hit and mine would be paid off. No go for me, I like paid off.

2) Mileage: I suggest going to the mileage thread and looking at what some of the new ones get. Not much (if any) better than the 2011 does. May be a little improvement, but no earth shattering like some of the new owners make it sound. I laugh as I read it actually as I continually get ~ 17.5-18 avg all day long, and 20-21 mpg highway....hand calculated.

3) This lack of fuel mileage you speak of doesn't exist on my ride for some reason. I have 285/70/17's on mine, comes out to 32.7" according to manufacture. For some odd reason, mine seems to be blessed in the FE department. I took a trip to Beaumont, TX on 09/17/11 and back on 09/19/11, 325 round trip miles, and the mileage was 20.97 with these tires, and that is with a JKU. Now, I was facing a head wind and using 5th gear to go over the ship channel bridge and bridges similar in height. Two grown men, loaded with suitcases and fire gear for fire school.... 20.97 MPG on the highway @ 72 mph most of the way, these figures are hand calculated. Why is this? I really think some of these people drive it like a sports car, and expect great mileage since it is a V6. My Jeep weighs 4600 lbs with no one in it currently, it takes a certain amount of energy to move it, no matter the engine.


Just really strange how some think it is sooo weak, and gets bad mileage. Mine seems to be opposite on mileage and so-so on power. .... I tow with it pretty regularly (16 ft lowboy) and get ~ 16-17 towing with it, right at the 3500 lb limit on towing lots of the time...
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:13 AM   #11
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The never-ending world of making car payments

If you can afford it....go for it!!!!

But that money could be used towards mods...Wranglers are bricks on wheels,if you are looking for a better gas mileageautomobile.

There are better ones that fit the bill,especially if it's never going to see offroad.
Snow...pretty good SUV's with AWD that get good gas mileage.
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:39 AM   #12
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Trading for 2012 Rubicon

If money is no object and you don't mind taking the hit trade up. I will tell you that if your Jeep is a two door, the trade they are offer isn't to bad. especially if you are buying the new one at invoice not retail. I saw a two door 2011 loaded with 6speed for sale at 27440.00 at a dealer albeit with 38000 miles on it. The first year is when you take the biggest hit on depreciation. If money is an issue. Craigslist the thing and you may be able to recoup a couple more thousand than doing the trade. I have driven both the 2011 and the 2012 and there is a noticible difference in the power, but not 5000 dollars worth. It all boils down to how much you are willing to pay for 80 odd horsepower and not much more in the way of torque.
Do what you feel you need to do, but I would go test drive a 2012 for a very long test drive with same powertrain configuration you currently have. That will really be what help you decide if it is really worth it to you if the cost is worth the power.
Hope that helps in your decision making.

Oh and for 5000.00 you could probably add a few mods to your ride and add power and fuel effeciency just food for thought!!
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Old 09-18-2011, 08:25 AM   #13
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I have thought long and hard about trading my 11 with 9k on her off on a 12. But I think I will just regear to 4.88 ratio from my 3.73 which I am running with the factory 32 in rubber on the factory 18 inch wheels. I will never go any bigger tire size so 4.88 should fit the bill pretty good. I couldn't get the sahara tan now anyway, so it would have to be the arctic chill color if I was to order new. If I regear I can drive this thing for another 5 or 10 years easy. They will have something better then this new mini van engine anyway, which wouldn't take much, in the near future. I knew the Jesus jeep was coming when I ordered my 11, on dec 31-2010. But I am glad I didn't wait for another 6 months to order.
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Old 09-18-2011, 11:42 AM   #14
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. I took a trip to Beaumont, TX on 09/17/11 and back on 09/19/11
My mistake, 09/07/11- and back on 09/09/11. Typos...
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Old 09-18-2011, 02:55 PM   #15
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I have thought long and hard about trading my 11 with 9k on her off on a 12. But I think I will just regear to 4.88 ratio from my 3.73 which I am running with the factory 32 in rubber on the factory 18 inch wheels. I will never go any bigger tire size so 4.88 should fit the bill pretty good. I couldn't get the sahara tan now anyway, so it would have to be the arctic chill color if I was to order new. If I regear I can drive this thing for another 5 or 10 years easy. They will have something better then this new mini van engine anyway, which wouldn't take much, in the near future. I knew the Jesus jeep was coming when I ordered my 11, on dec 31-2010. But I am glad I didn't wait for another 6 months to order.
^ I thought the 3.73 in my 2011 was good compared to the 3.23, but maybe a 4.88 would be the way to go for myself too.. ( i am putting a 2" lift this week, and soon to put 33's or 34's ) on it..

When I had my mustang, it was a 5-speed and most came with 2.73 or 3.23 rearends, I changed it to a 4.10 and it was really night and day and made overdrive 5th gear into an actual gear...
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Old 09-18-2011, 03:02 PM   #16
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There is a BOAT LOAD of info on regearing the JK/JKU and it is TOTALLY DIFFERENT, than any other vehicle in the past-


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^ I thought the 3.73 in my 2011 was good compared to the 3.23, but maybe a 4.88 would be the way to go for myself too.. ( i am putting a 2" lift this week, and soon to put 33's or 34's ) on it..

When I had my mustang, it was a 5-speed and most came with 2.73 or 3.23 rearends, I changed it to a 4.10 and it was really night and day and made overdrive 5th gear into an actual gear...
There is no comparison in the regearing of a v8, or even v6 SEDANS, to the heavy brick design of the jeep, with a no-torgue at low rpm 3.8L v6-

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Old 09-18-2011, 03:22 PM   #17
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There is a BOAT LOAD of info on regearing the JK/JKU and it is TOTALLY DIFFERENT, than any other vehicle in the past-




There is no comparison in the regearing of a v8, or even v6 SEDANS, to the heavy brick design of the jeep, with a no-torgue at low rpm 3.8L v6-

JIMBO
Thanks- I will do some searching, ( I cannot help to think back to my 5.0 )
it was fun...

maybe a 4.88 or 5.13 will bring some life to the 3.8 (AUTO) ( without coughing up 8-10K for a 2012 )
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Old 09-18-2011, 03:26 PM   #18
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Yeah, you're pretty well stuck with 5.13s, but


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Thanks- I will do some searching, ( I cannot help to think back to my 5.0 )
it was fun...

maybe a 4.88 or 5.13 will bring some life to the 3.8 (AUTO) ( without coughing up 8-10K for a 2012 )
--google " 4.88/5.13 regearing the JK/JKU" and there are pages of good info/opinions from ALL OVER-

That'll give you some background info-

Good luck

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Old 09-18-2011, 04:33 PM   #19
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One thing I should add to this, when I bought the jeep I knew it was gutless and I accounted for this knowing I would end up doing a HEMI conversion on it after a few years. Given the new V6 doesn't even remotely compare to a HEMI, but it provides enough of a power improvement that I no longer feel the need to do the HEMI later.

Makes a bit of a difference in cost comparison on the long term view.
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Old 09-18-2011, 04:43 PM   #20
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I guess the comments don't really mean anything !


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Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
Unless you don't mind losing $10K, right off the bat--




Just regear for $1200 to 1800 bucks and you're back in the power game/w good mileage--

JIMBO
Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
Heh Heh, I've got nothing against buying a new "ANYTHING", I've done it with Dodges/Corvettes, but




I was pretty hesitant with this new jeep and the whole auto industry/w gov't pressure is going CRAZY-

I've got more than a little $$$ in my '08 JKUR and by regearing, I've quelled any fantasies, of buying a new one-----untill at least 2014--

Ya gotta be true to yourself and be happy, you don't really wanna constantly gripe about your toy/DD/overlander--give it some thought

Losing $10K like I said above, actually means very little--if you're happy/content/pleased--RIGHT ??

Keepyerpowderdry

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
There is a BOAT LOAD of info on regearing the JK/JKU and it is TOTALLY DIFFERENT, than any other vehicle in the past-




There is no comparison in the regearing of a v8, or even v6 SEDANS, to the heavy brick design of the jeep, with a no-torgue at low rpm 3.8L v6-

JIMBO
Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
Yeah, you're pretty well stuck with 5.13s, but




--google " 4.88/5.13 regearing the JK/JKU" and there are pages of good info/opinions from ALL OVER-

That'll give you some background info-

Good luck

JIMBO
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdgmcdon View Post
One thing I should add to this, when I bought the jeep I knew it was gutless and I accounted for this knowing I would end up doing a HEMI conversion on it after a few years. Given the new V6 doesn't even remotely compare to a HEMI, but it provides enough of a power improvement that I no longer feel the need to do the HEMI later.

Makes a bit of a difference in cost comparison on the long term view.
YUP, the difference between $1500 bucks and 10K----in the long run

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Old 09-18-2011, 04:54 PM   #21
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Personally I'd just get the 2012....
I didn't take that big of a hit trading the 2010 2rd sport in on the 2012 4dr sport though.... I got to drive it for 2 years and 15k miles for $5500....
I buy what I want so i don't look at it as a loss but rather a more pleasurable experience on a daily basis.... get the 2012 you obviously want it....
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Old 09-18-2011, 05:04 PM   #22
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thats no money for a big hitter-just buy what you want!
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:33 PM   #23
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In a word - Stupid.

New cars depreciate quickly. They can be a good investment ONLY if they are kept for a while. You'll empty your bank account in a hurry if you buy new and sell / trade quickly. Worse yet, is to do it on credit. Bad. I know, I've done it.

Knowing it is a bad idea, do it carefully. Avoid it if you can and trade quickly only rarely.

I was lucky enough to learn of the new engine just before I bought a new 2011. Instead I bought a used 2008. I can sell or trade in 2 or even 1 year without getting hurt badly at all.

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Old 09-18-2011, 07:37 PM   #24
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I am likely going with the Re-gear / thanks Jimbox...
$10K - then Mopar will improve it a bit for 2013, and you will have to have it, bam another $8-10K, then in 2014 it will have a hemi or deisel option... and another $10K loss.....
2 or 3 trade ins and you could own 2 Wranglers...

I would bet you or I could get about the same amount in a trade-in for a new 2012, when the 13's come out...

I really never even gave re-gearing a second thought, until now..
thanks again..
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:49 PM   #25
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Thank-you, but be sure you don't try to be TOO CONSERVATIVE-


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I am likely going with the Re-gear / thanks Jimbox...
$10K - then Mopar will improve it a bit for 2013, and you will have to have it, bam another $8-10K, then in 2014 it will have a hemi or deisel option... and another $10K loss.....
2 or 3 trade ins and you could own 2 Wranglers...

I would bet you or I could get about the same amount in a trade-in for a new 2012, when the 13's come out...

I really never even gave re-gearing a second thought, until now..
thanks again..
I mean bare minimum, is 4.88--remember even the drastic 5.38 is still a long way from the limit for practicality--

With todays freeways, I'd say something in the low 6.xx would be a little hard to manage, but anything in the 5.xxs is splendid !!

Good luck

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Old 09-18-2011, 08:06 PM   #26
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Old 09-19-2011, 01:49 PM   #27
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You paid retail for your 2011,,,

You didnt do your homework,,,

Your going to get hosed getting outta your '11 and into a '12.

Live and learn buddy!!

And or do your homework late now,, and shop 3-4 dealers. You should be able to come down several , several thousands from your starting point.

I feel for ya thou.
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Old 09-19-2011, 04:22 PM   #28
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You paid retail for your 2011,,,

You didnt do your homework,,,

Your going to get hosed getting outta your '11 and into a '12.

Live and learn buddy!!

And or do your homework late now,, and shop 3-4 dealers. You should be able to come down several , several thousands from your starting point.

I feel for ya thou.
Uhhh...I got a GREAT deal on my 2011 and it's the only reason why money wise it *almost* makes sense to get the 2012. My 2011 sticker was over $42,000, I ordered it from the factory for $37,000, that's over $5,000 under sticker on a factory ordered high demand vehicle.

Paid $37,000, I can get $33,000 for it now, maybe $32,000 worst case (unless I trade it for $29k which IMO is a rip off). So worst case it cost me $5,000 to drive a new decked out rubi for 20,000 miles and one year. Then I'm buying the new one with the tread lightly discount for 1% under invoice; not as good of a deal as I got on the 2011 (as it was something like $1,500 under invoice - I worked the deal then introduced the tread lightly discount, they took that off in addition to what I had it at already, under invoice and I think they screwed up doing it), but close.

I've decided I am getting the 2012. With the 11 I knew it was gutless so I had planned to do the HEMI conversion on it in a few years, obviously the new V6 in 12 isn't a HEMI, but it's enough added power that I no longer see the need to do the conversion later and that's a $15,000 pop that now won't be spent. And, I know it's enough added power, I drove a 2012 Rubicon Unlimited the other day - BIG DIFFERENCE.

Only question is, leave the Duratrac 33's and spidertrax on the 11 or move them over to the 12 (they have 20,000 miles on them)...Hmmm
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Old 09-19-2011, 04:36 PM   #29
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Another reason I hate the JK...people with YJ's (112 HP), TJ's (190 HP), bought them to keep them for a long time and make them part of the family.

Now the Jeep is a fashion accessory that can be traded in every year or two when it gets some slick new gadget, color, or upgrade. That's not Jeep culture!
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Old 09-19-2011, 04:46 PM   #30
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Thats very interesting-


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilgrim_Jeep View Post
Another reason I hate the JK...people with YJ's (112 HP), TJ's (190 HP), bought them to keep them for a long time and make them part of the family.

Now the Jeep is a fashion accessory that can be traded in every year or two when it gets some slick new gadget, color, or upgrade. That's not Jeep culture!
You must have some HATEFUL, "other reasons" !

What might they be ????

JIMBO

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