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Old 01-03-2012, 12:38 AM   #1
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Shocks or lift ?

2012 2dr Wrangler...16x8 w/4.25 bs.....285/75/16 AT tires......should I get Bilstein (Yellow) Heavy Duty Gas Shock Set for 290.00 or go with Daystar 1-3/4" Comfort Ride Lift Kit in Black with Scorpion Shocks at about the same price. Not offroad very much...but when I need to I want it to work...



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Old 01-03-2012, 12:40 AM   #2
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Sub'd interested in this as well. I would like to think just changing shocks would do something great. Lets see what the pro's here say.

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Old 01-03-2012, 12:50 AM   #3
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I'd tell you Bilsteins, without hesitation, except for one thing:

If you get the 5100's, they're 27.5" long, which means your '12's driveshaft will contact your exhaust pipe if you disconnect your swaybars. No ifs and or buts. You'll tear the boot on your stock ds, it will fling grease all over your undercarriage, and eventually your ds will seize. Might take awhile, but it will happen.

So, since you don't offroad much, I'd recommend the Daystar, as long as the Scorpion shocks are LESS THAN 27.5".

One of the quirks of owning a '12.
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Old 01-03-2012, 07:55 AM   #4
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The shocks he mentioned are not the 5100's. 5100's are meant for lifted JK's while the HD's (yellow body) and meant for 0" lift.

There will be a ride difference between the choices. The Scorpion shocks are hydro shocks so the ride will be similar to stock. Soft and mushy. The Bilstein HD's are self adjusting gas monotube shocks.

The Bilstein HD shocls will give you a much firmer ride and will reduce/eliminate body roll in turns.

I have them along with the stiffest coils and am very pleased with the ride.
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Old 01-03-2012, 08:07 AM   #5
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Daggo, HD's are what I would need then. I have the soft rear springs, would shocks help with acceleration squat?
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Old 01-03-2012, 08:16 AM   #6
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I believe they would. The stock shocks can easily be compressed with barely any resistance by hand. The Bilstein HD's are nearly impossible to compress by hand. I made the mistake of jack from the axle instead of the frame and letting the axle drop when I first instralled mine. It was a battle to compress them in order to line up the bottom bolt. After I figured out my mistake, I did this.
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Old 01-03-2012, 09:34 AM   #7
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I believe they would. The stock shocks can easily be compressed with barely any resistance by hand. The Bilstein HD's are nearly impossible to compress by hand. I made the mistake of jack from the axle instead of the frame and letting the axle drop when I first instralled mine. It was a battle to compress them in order to line up the bottom bolt. After I figured out my mistake, I did this.

Wow, thanks for that heads up! Did you need two jacks to get it back the axle back up? I have had that happen on a car before, let strut out too soon. That made a 30 minute job, a 6 hour job.

I will be purchasing These Bilstein HD's. I don't accelerate fast, but I have noticeable squat from leaving red lights. Stiffer Ride would be nice too. MTH said those 55 springs would be fine, what do you think? Should I have it all replaced? or maybe just do a 1" lift to be part of the club here?
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:00 AM   #8
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If you replace the front and rear springs with 19/60's you'll get up to a 2" lift. I first changed the shocks, then the coils. I didn't use 2 jacks, I just muscled them in. When I did the coils, I lowered the axle and the shocks were a piece of cake to re-attach.
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:02 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by New2012JEEP View Post

I will be purchasing These Bilstein HD's. I don't accelerate fast, but I have noticeable squat from leaving red lights. Stiffer Ride would be nice too. MTH said those 55 springs would be fine, what do you think? Should I have it all replaced? or maybe just do a 1" lift to be part of the club here?
To be clear . . . your 55s are of course fine. BUT, going to Mopar 19s/60s would give you a little lift on your two door and a firmer ride. They would compliment the Bilsteins nicely. But you don't NEED new coils. And if you don't want to lift then you SHOULDN'T get them.
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:58 AM   #10
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Honestly, I wouldn't mind a small lift, seems 2inch is minimum. So I should shoot for rubi springs, then 5100s, or is that still considered stock 0 lift?

Thank you btw, I do plan on doing this this month
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Old 01-03-2012, 11:03 AM   #11
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It wopuld still be considered stock. There is no such thing as Rubi springs. Order the 19 front and 60 rear directly from a Mopar dealer and get the HD's. They will fit fine.
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Old 01-03-2012, 01:06 PM   #12
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Old 01-03-2012, 01:09 PM   #13
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Lift it, always lift it.
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Old 01-03-2012, 01:17 PM   #14
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Old 01-03-2012, 05:27 PM   #15
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Thanks........I'll get the shocks..........

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Old 01-03-2012, 05:30 PM   #16
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The shocks he mentioned are not the 5100's. 5100's are meant for lifted JK's while the HD's (yellow body) and meant for 0" lift.
Another case of not thoroughly reading the op's post. Thanks for the fix.
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Old 01-03-2012, 05:40 PM   #17
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Another case of not thoroughly reading the op's post. Thanks for the fix.

I changed it after ..........
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Old 01-03-2012, 08:58 PM   #18
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Tom, again! Many thanks, you are making this transition easier, that is for sure.

My father was a tractor mechanic, so I have the ability to do the mechanical stuff. It's the ordering, does it fit, will it work, type of stuff that gets me.

I am probably going to buy a camera and do a pic tutorial. Found the 4 springs for 167 shipped. I will order shocks next month, then get it all done.

So Bilstein HD's and those OEM springs will give a stock 2" lift...Me likes.
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Old 01-03-2012, 09:46 PM   #19
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My newb is showing...I had no idea you could order a factory spring for a 2" lift from Mopar. I have been looking at all kinds of aftermarket lifts. Good info!
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Old 01-03-2012, 09:50 PM   #20
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My newb is showing...I had no idea you could order a factory spring for a 2" lift from Mopar. I have been looking at all kinds of aftermarket lifts. Good info!
Hey Snail, I am right there with you, I am kind of stoked by that as well.

You are not too far up the road from me.
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:08 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snailpower
My newb is showing...I had no idea you could order a factory spring for a 2" lift from Mopar. I have been looking at all kinds of aftermarket lifts. Good info!
Quote:
Originally Posted by New2012JEEP

Hey Snail, I am right there with you, I am kind of stoked by that as well.

You are not too far up the road from me.
That's not quite the way to think about it.

Mopar makes various spring stiffnesses to account for the differing weights of stock wranglers--4 doors versus 2 doors, hard tops versus soft tops, and now COD wranglers with stock steel bumper options.

They should all sit similarly on the lot, so some need stiffer springs than others. What you're doing is ordering the stiffest springs (19 front, 60 rears) for the lightest jeep (2 doors). The result is--usually--a 1" to 2" lift. I say "usually" because Chrysler's spring allocation can often be a bit random--kjeeper10 for example has 19s and 60s on his 2 door Rubi stock, whereas another 2 door rubi I know on the forum came with 15s and 55s.

What that means is that IF you have a 2 door with weaker spring rates, you'll get a boost from going to 19/60 spring rates. If you have a 4 door, you probably already have spring rates close to 19/60 and won't get much boost at all. Even if you have a 2 door however, you should check to see what your current springs are first.

So it's not as if you're getting a "Mopar 2" lift". You're simply getting stiffer/taller springs that are "over engineered" for the weight of your vehicle and, therefore, will as a side effect give you a lift. Make sense?
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:12 PM   #22
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That's not quite the way to think about it.

Mopar makes various spring stiffnesses to account for the differing weights of stock wranglers--4 doors versus 2 doors, hard tops versus soft tops, and now COD wranglers with stock steel bumper options.

They should all sit similarly on the lot, so some need stiffer springs than others. What you're doing is ordering the stiffest springs (19 front, 60 rears) for the lightest jeep (2 doors). The result is--usually--a 1" to 2" lift. I say "usually" because Chrysler's spring allocation can often be a bit random--kjeeper10 for example has 19s and 60s on his 2 door Rubi stock, whereas another 2 door rubi I know on the forum came with 15s and 55s.

What that means is that IF you have a 2 door with weaker spring rates, you'll get a boost from going to 19/60 spring rates. If you have a 4 door, you probably already have spring rates close to 19/60 and won't get much boost at all. Even if you have a 2 door however, you should check to see what your current springs are first.

So it's not as if you're getting a "Mopar 2" lift". You're simply getting stiffer/taller springs that are "over engineered" for the weight of your vehicle and, therefore, will as a side effect give you a lift. Make sense?
Thanks MTH, makes perfect Sense. I wonder if the shocks upgraded will push the Jeep up any as well. Ahh, I think I am doing it regardless as I plan on towing and would prefer as few issues as possible.

I will also take the bonus 0-2" lift possibility that may come with the better ride quality
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:18 PM   #23
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When I first read up on it, I didn't beleive you could get the lift. After much consideration and research, I decided to do it so that I would have the best possible suspension. The 2" of lift turned out to be a bonus. Here is the original thread I started. http://www.wranglerforum.com/f33/con...+a+spring+swap
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:27 PM   #24
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Well, the shocks won't add any lift to your jeep-At ALL, but


Quote:
Originally Posted by New2012JEEP View Post
Thanks MTH, makes perfect Sense. I wonder if the shocks upgraded will push the Jeep up any as well. Ahh, I think I am doing it regardless as I plan on towing and would prefer as few issues as possible.

I will also take the bonus 0-2" lift possibility that may come with the better ride quality
If you like to tow--take a look at reviews, for RS9000XL adj, shocks for 2" lift and higher--thay're a "HOOT"

I spend most of my time off-road, so I've been keeping them set at about #7-which is pretty stiff along with my Ruby springs-

I set them to #9 when towing and I control the trailer--it doesn't control me !

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Old 01-03-2012, 10:51 PM   #25
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Sorry about the hijacking. I appreciate everyones input, this is when these forums are great.

I see Tom did a ton of work on this almost 2 years ago and I am going to do same thing. I have towed a bit in my time, and tow a bit now. I know these soft springs have got to go, I guess that is why this has almost taken over all other mods I wanted to do.

When they were new, 13 miles to be exact, the ride was nice and firm(er). Now with 2200 miles on the Jeep and some hard bumps and moderate full shock extending, the stock springs/shocks have seemed to settle, not to my pleasure.
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Old 01-03-2012, 11:08 PM   #26
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I wonder if the shocks upgraded will push the Jeep up any as well.
Nope.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:55 AM   #27
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[QUOTE=New2012JEEP;1885527]. I wonder if the shocks upgraded will push the Jeep up any as well.

The only shocks that can give any lift are coil over shocks. For a Jeep I don't think that is even an option. Go Coils for lift.
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Old 01-04-2012, 01:08 PM   #28
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Hey New - I spent many a good night at or near Neptune. I am from north central FL originally.

Thanks for the info Mike (MTH) that clarifies some things. I do not know what springs my Jeep came stock with - 2012 Sport Unlimited with Max Tow. Mine is about as basic as you get. My goal is pretty simple really: 2" lift with 33x12.50/15s. I just want to do it so the ride is a little stiffer and it can still handle mild to moderate off road. No rocks around these parts to crawl on!
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Old 01-04-2012, 01:35 PM   #29
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I do not know what springs my Jeep came stock with - 2012 Sport Unlimited with Max Tow. Mine is about as basic as you get. My goal is pretty simple really: 2" lift with 33x12.50/15s. I just want to do it so the ride is a little stiffer and it can still handle mild to moderate off road. No rocks around these parts to crawl on!
Daggo66 identified the part numbers for the stiffest factory springs as follows:

68004460AA - rear
52126319AB - front

See the LAST TWO NUMBERS (not letters) in each part number? They're "60" and "19," right? That's what folks mean when they say they have "19s and 60s" or "Mopar HD springs."

Now go look at the coil springs on your jeep. You can easily see them by crouching down near each wheel--they're the big springs that will be right in front of you. You'll see tags hanging off them that very clearly have numbers that look similar to the part numbers above. Read the last two numbers (not letters).

They probably won't be "19" and "60." With a 4 door, they'll probably be something like "17" and "58." If so, then going to "19" and "60" is unlikely to give you much boost and this is probably not a good option for you.

If, however, your existing numbers are something like "15" and "55" (numbers that are more common for 2 doors) then going to "19" and "60" will likely give you some boost.

How much boost? Well, click on this link. That's my 4 door on 19s and 60s--AND .75" spacers front and rear--sitting on the same 33x12.5R15 tire size you're considering. In other words, if you were to LOWER my jeep .75", you would see the results of having 19 and 60 springs in a 4 door with 33x12.5R15 tires. Here's how those springs (and, again, .75" spacers) looked over stock tires.

In my opinion, that's not enough lift and, in fact, I'm adding a bigger lift in the near future. So my view is that the 19/60 spring swap is better left to the 2 doors.
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Old 01-04-2012, 02:43 PM   #30
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[QUOTE=kenb1023;1886955]
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. I wonder if the shocks upgraded will push the Jeep up any as well.

The only shocks that can give any lift are coil over shocks. For a Jeep I don't think that is even an option. Go Coils for lift.
Coil overs are definitely available for Wranglers.

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