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Old 07-11-2012, 09:03 AM   #1
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Stock or Lift?

Here is what I got. 2012 JKU Rubi. First Jeep. I will off road not just commute. But commute I do.

Thoughts, what am I not getting by keeping it stock suspension but possibly larger tires that fit stock suspension?

If I lift it what am I potentially losing in the stock benefits if any?

Warranty issues do come to mind also. Of course I want it to be on a 3" lift 35s, custom bumpers, etc... But can I get what I will need by keeping stock suspension and customizing the other stuff?

Comments and thoughts please...

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Old 07-11-2012, 09:12 AM   #2
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Well look at the huge lift thread.

Lifting you gain ground clearance and the ability to fit larger tires which are both benefits off road. Doing this you may see some MPG decrease but since you have a ’12, you have 4.10 gears so you wouldn’t need to re gear.

Adding armor/bumpers to the stock suspension, even a Rubi, may sag the springs. You can fit 35’s with a 2” - 2.5” lift. Going 3” you may run into drive shaft issues.

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Old 07-11-2012, 09:19 AM   #3
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if youre worried about retaining your warranty, don't do any mods at all. thats how i look at it
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:30 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by pluke the 2 View Post
if youre worried about retaining your warranty, don't do any mods at all. thats how i look at it
+1

You would be surprised at how well a Jeep, let alone a Rubicon, will do stock. Just last night I took my Rubi for a walk around our property. Literally. We have 17 acres of farm land that is a 4x4 trail in and of it self. I put it in 4lo and as a joke, I just walked along side of it, as it climbed up and over stumps, small rocks, and the likes. Christy came out and looked at me like I was nuts, but the kids dug it!!
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:48 AM   #5
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One can easily fit 35's on a JK with no lift whatsoever, but you will need to change some other things to avoid rubbing. Ten Ways to Fit 35s on Your Jeep Wrangler JK - Jp Magazine

There are even some brave souls that are running 37's with no lift.

Now, the real question that we can not answer for you is: Do I NEED a lift at all? The answer to that will depend largely on the type of 'wheeling you do, and the compromises you are willing to make.

Certainly lifting does increase the ground clearance, but only for a portion of the Jeep. Common lifts do nothing to improve your clearance to the differentials or some of the suspension linkage points. Maybe improved armor underneath would be a better choice for you than a lift; but we need more information to determine that.

A properly set up suspension lift can improve your flex/articulation, and this may be a benefit on certain trails. But do you need that?

A lift, any lift, will increase your center of gravity (however minor that may be), and WILL negatively affect your Jeep's rollover angle.

We could web-wheel all day long about the pro's and con's of lift vs. no lift, but in the end we can not tell YOU which route is right for you. Having some more info on the trails you frequent may help.

I've said this many times before (and certainly will again) that there was a time in Jeeping history that lifts were not as ubiquitous as they are now. I've driven stock CJ5's and CJ's with little 1" shackle lift, new shocks, and 31's (and remember, LEAF SPRINGS), and have tackled some of the most challenging trails in the US (The Rubicon and the Dusy-Ershim trails come to mind).

For me at this time in my life, and for the type of 'wheeling I do, a lift is simply not necessary, and indeed could prove a liability.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:57 AM   #6
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I say lower it and put it on airbags. The dealership won't know what to do with a lowered Jeep.
Something like this
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:01 AM   #7
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I say lower it and put it on airbags. The dealership won't know what to do with a lowered Jeep.
Something like this
I just threw up in my mouth.

To each his/her own, I guess.

EDIT: maybe that's one of those extreme "low center of gravity" builds?
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:02 AM   #8
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Renaissance_Redneck View Post
One can easily fit 35's on a JK with no lift whatsoever, but you will need to change some other things to avoid rubbing. Ten Ways to Fit 35s on Your Jeep Wrangler JK - Jp Magazine

There are even some brave souls that are running 37's with no lift.

Now, the real question that we can not answer for you is: Do I NEED a lift at all? The answer to that will depend largely on the type of 'wheeling you do, and the compromises you are willing to make.

Certainly lifting does increase the ground clearance, but only for a portion of the Jeep. Common lifts do nothing to improve your clearance to the differentials or some of the suspension linkage points. Maybe improved armor underneath would be a better choice for you than a lift; but we need more information to determine that.

A properly set up suspension lift can improve your flex/articulation, and this may be a benefit on certain trails. But do you need that?

A lift, any lift, will increase your center of gravity (however minor that may be), and WILL negatively affect your Jeep's rollover angle.

We could web-wheel all day long about the pro's and con's of lift vs. no lift, but in the end we can not tell YOU which route is right for you. Having some more info on the trails you frequent may help.

I've said this many times before (and certainly will again) that there was a time in Jeeping history that lifts were not as ubiquitous as they are now. I've driven stock CJ5's and CJ's with little 1" shackle lift, new shocks, and 31's (and remember, LEAF SPRINGS), and have tackled some of the most challenging trails in the US (The Rubicon and the Dusy-Ershim trails come to mind).

For me at this time in my life, and for the type of 'wheeling I do, a lift is simply not necessary, and indeed could prove a liability.
This is some good points and I appreciate it. I fully understand that this is a ME choice but getting some input from the forum does help drive my thoughts.

In my dreams I would be out rock crawling and 4-wheeling from sun up to sun down but reality tends to spoil that. With my work schedule and family schedule I probably won't be conquering Rubicon anytime soon. Most trails I have done so far have 6-8 inch rocks and a few boulders (1-2 foot Diameter). My stock Rubi took them just fine.

I do have 4.10s and it is a MT. So I don't see a re-gear needed at all. The points made on a 3" giving some potential drivetrain issues is a great point and thanks. So if any lift maybe a 2". The other modifications sagging the stock suspension is also a good point to have the lift.

Thanks for the input so far.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:03 AM   #9
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I just threw up in my mouth.

To each his/her own, I guess.

EDIT: maybe that's one of those extreme "low center of gravity" builds?
LOL!!!

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Old 07-11-2012, 10:07 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by cdbarreras View Post
This is some good points and I appreciate it. I fully understand that this is a ME choice but getting some input from the forum does help drive my thoughts.
Given this information, what I'd do if I were in your shoes is no lift at all, and concentrate on body/undercarriage protection (skids, armor, etc.), and recovery equipment. If you want 35's, I'd do a fender chop and call it a day.

Your Rubicon, and mine, is so much more capable than the CJ5 I 'wheeled with 30 years ago (I still have it); and we took that CJ to some pretty crazy places. I'd say you'll be fine.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:18 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Renaissance_Redneck View Post
I just threw up in my mouth.

To each his/her own, I guess.

EDIT: maybe that's one of those extreme "low center of gravity" builds?

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Old 07-11-2012, 10:24 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Renaissance_Redneck View Post
Given this information, what I'd do if I were in your shoes is no lift at all, and concentrate on body/undercarriage protection (skids, armor, etc.), and recovery equipment. If you want 35's, I'd do a fender chop and call it a day.

Your Rubicon, and mine, is so much more capable than the CJ5 I 'wheeled with 30 years ago (I still have it); and we took that CJ to some pretty crazy places. I'd say you'll be fine.
More and more I am thinking the same thing. The only problem that I am seeing is adding any weight to the stock suspension and potentially getting some unwanted sagging.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:27 AM   #13
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More and more I am thinking the same thing. The only problem that I am seeing is adding any weight to the stock suspension and potentially getting some unwanted sagging.
If you're going to add weight, like bumpers and winches and the like, and it results in some sag, then certainly a lift (even a budget boost if not a full out suspension lift) would be in order to correct that.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:48 AM   #14
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My opinion is that unless you just want it... just because... Don't lift until you know for sure you need it. They drive great on the street stock. You can do minor mods at the stock height to help on the trails. Most folks (like me) really don't do the radical crawling, and as stated earlier, the stock setup is good enough for all but the more insane paths. If you get out there and see you really need a lift, then go for it!!! But you will give up some street goodness. At the very least, center of gravity / rollover physics.
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Old 07-11-2012, 12:54 PM   #15
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^^^ x2
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:12 AM   #16
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My opinion is that unless you just want it... just because... Don't lift until you know for sure you need it. They drive great on the street stock. You can do minor mods at the stock height to help on the trails. Most folks (like me) really don't do the radical crawling, and as stated earlier, the stock setup is good enough for all but the more insane paths. If you get out there and see you really need a lift, then go for it!!! But you will give up some street goodness. At the very least, center of gravity / rollover physics.
Good points, I appreciate the feedback.

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Old 07-12-2012, 10:56 AM   #17
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I think most people that lift Jeeps do it for looks, not necessity. A stock Wrangler can go anywhere the vast majority of people take them.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:13 AM   #18
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Why do you want to lift it? If you are hitting things under the Jeep, that is a great reason. If not and if for vanity, I'm sure others will have great advice. My 2012 Rubi is stock. I will lift it as I go to tougher and tougher trails, though I do not intend to go to trails needing "heavily modified" 4x4s. If "body carnage is inevitable" that is not the trail for me. I like exploring, hanging out with other off-roaders on trail runs, and getting away. I do not care about how tough or badass my Jeep looks. I leave that to others, though I do care about not adding things that make it look/sound tacky (exhaust, chrome, etc.).

I do realize that some moderate trails will require more axle clearance. I think a 2.5" lift and 35s in the future, are more than enough for me. For no, no lift and 32s work well and I get good mileage.
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:22 AM   #19
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my whole thing with this is if i put a winch on and a new front bumper it WILL sag..no?
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:38 AM   #20
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my whole thing with this is if i put a winch on and a new front bumper it WILL sag..no?
YES. it will sag...
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Old 07-12-2012, 11:39 AM   #21
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so a lift is inevitable unless you ALSO plan on no winch and stock bumpers forever
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Old 07-12-2012, 01:09 PM   #22
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YES. it will sag...
^^^ This.

Whether you lift at all is up to you. You can simply put a spacer lift to level out the rake, if you wish, or do a full suspension lift. No NET lift will result, IF you lift just to counteract the sag.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:25 PM   #23
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YES. it will sag...
I don't know pluke, my 10 Rubi w/ off road front & rear bumpers and Warn winch has no sag. I thought about a 2" lift but since I haven't needed it I'm leaving it stock. It would look good but for looks I'd rather not spend the $.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:32 PM   #24
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I don't know pluke, my 10 Rubi w/ off road front & rear bumpers and Warn winch has no sag. I thought about a 2" lift but since I haven't needed it I'm leaving it stock. It would look good but for looks I'd rather not spend the $.
it may not be right away but you give it some time and everyones stock oem bump stops will end up touching their axles. been around a few years now and I have never heard anyone say this.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:32 PM   #25
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steel bumpers?
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:44 PM   #26
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it may not be right away but you give it some time and everyones stock oem bump stops will end up touching their axles. been around a few years now and I have never heard anyone say this.
Mopar off road bumpers and ok so far (2yrs). I have heard on the forum about some Rubi owners not complaining of sag but, they were less than 2yrs old I believe. I guess time will tell. If it starts, I'll address it then.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:49 PM   #27
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that's the best way to address most situations.
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Old 07-12-2012, 06:40 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by ferninAZ
I say lower it and put it on airbags. The dealership won't know what to do with a lowered Jeep.
Something like this
I found this. Thought it might be more what your wanting.
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