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Old 01-28-2014, 06:57 PM   #31
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Difference is that Wrangler is taller, it needs to be some large truck to hit JK hood same way, regular road cars as CRV will get their rear upper door or trunk destroyed by Wrangler. Most important difference - people who drives Jeep are better drivers in compare to CRV's as one who hit me that morning. I would take their license out and send for tougher drivers test. Dry, no ice or snow, morning not as dark, why would anyone drive like this?
I think you need to dig around the forum and search for accident photos of a wrangler. It crumples up like a tin can without steel bumpers. Everything is thin sheetmetal and plastic. Yes, you got very lucky to suffer no damage, but there have been plenty of members here with relatively minor accidents with pretty substantial damage (which is why I always tell people to get steel on all 4 sides to make it much MUCH harder to damage.)

By federal regulations, all factory vehicles have their bumpers generally line up. The wrangler isn't "taller" in that respect. The CRV bumper is still on the same level as the wrangler (stock height) bumper. The sole reason his damage is severe is that he hit a very weak part of ANY vehicle (hood and grill) and the only reason you have minimal damage is because you have a big tire hanging off the back. Furthermore, since you claim that you have zero damage, the accident must have been around 5-10mph, no more. Your spotwelds would be toast if it was any harder than that. You basically had the perfect storm of favorable circumstances that let you off without damage. Generally, I've seen spotwelds and rear glass on a wrangler bust from a parking bump.

One last thing...the goal of the vehicle (in a crash) is to keep the occupants alive. Most of the time, this requires giving up its own life to do it (crumple into a tin can.) A stock wrangler is WORSE at keeping the occupants alive than Hondas, Toyotas, etc etc etc as evidenced by crash test results. Now, I would definitely prefer to be inside MY wrangler over a CRV (not to mention a CRV getting hit by my wrangler) but stock for stock? I'll take the 5 star crash test vehicle to keep my ass alive.

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Old 01-28-2014, 07:15 PM   #32
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I think you need to dig around the forum and search for accident photos of a wrangler. It crumples up like a tin can without steel bumpers. Everything is thin sheetmetal and plastic. Yes, you got very lucky to suffer no damage, but there have been plenty of members here with relatively minor accidents with pretty substantial damage (which is why I always tell people to get steel on all 4 sides to make it much MUCH harder to damage.)

By federal regulations, all factory vehicles have their bumpers generally line up. The wrangler isn't "taller" in that respect. The CRV bumper is still on the same level as the wrangler (stock height) bumper. The sole reason his damage is severe is that he hit a very weak part of ANY vehicle (hood and grill) and the only reason you have minimal damage is because you have a big tire hanging off the back. Furthermore, since you claim that you have zero damage, the accident must have been around 5-10mph, no more. Your spotwelds would be toast if it was any harder than that. You basically had the perfect storm of favorable circumstances that let you off without damage. Generally, I've seen spotwelds and rear glass on a wrangler bust from a parking bump.

One last thing...the goal of the vehicle (in a crash) is to keep the occupants alive. Most of the time, this requires giving up its own life to do it (crumple into a tin can.) A stock wrangler is WORSE at keeping the occupants alive than Hondas, Toyotas, etc etc etc as evidenced by crash test results. Now, I would definitely prefer to be inside MY wrangler over a CRV (not to mention a CRV getting hit by my wrangler) but stock for stock? I'll take the 5 star crash test vehicle to keep my ass alive.

I was stooped on red light with front car bit far, i do stop like this all the time after rear-end #55 Hood on Wrangler is way taller, my point is to hit JK same way is not easy, needs to be something much larger/taller to hit JK hood first.
I am just happy I didn't took my MB that morning and that God watched this is happening and said - no way he deserve damage this time, enough! Literally last 4 years i been rear ended 4 times on 4 different cars and all 4 times by females

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Old 01-28-2014, 07:48 PM   #33
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And another thing to remember, these vehicles today are designed to crumple like the Honda that hit you. That force is going somewhere. Either absorbed into the driver's neck/spine or the crumple zones of the car. Honestly, an expensive f-up by the driver, but it did it's job and protected both of you. If she had an iron front end, I guarantee the rear of your Jeep wouldn't look unscathed and you'd be in a neck brace.
I would argue on this, CRV didn't absorb anything. It become bag of crashed cheapo plastic parts in one sec. Sure it is good on gas, it is light all made of plastic toy materials. Heavy truck on frame is way safer over such protection, sure Wrangler is not perfect but much better place in my opinion. Crash tests? Fiat with Smarts are high on these crash tests, how about real life test? How about large loaded garbage truck will hit Fiat or Smart on highway with speed over 50mpg? Would anyone survive inside?
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Old 01-28-2014, 10:04 PM   #34
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Got rear ended this morning by Honda CRV, honda got towed because of radiator leaked and other damage. But was nothing on my JKU, not even scratch. Lady got into spare tire, wow that is what I am calling great american tank I need metal bumpers!!!
And yet if you barely touch the sheet metal it will dent!!
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Old 01-28-2014, 10:29 PM   #35
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I would argue on this, CRV didn't absorb anything. It become bag of crashed cheapo plastic parts in one sec. Sure it is good on gas, it is light all made of plastic toy materials. Heavy truck on frame is way safer over such protection, sure Wrangler is not perfect but much better place in my opinion. Crash tests? Fiat with Smarts are high on these crash tests, how about real life test? How about large loaded garbage truck will hit Fiat or Smart on highway with speed over 50mpg? Would anyone survive inside?
Its amazing, that you are able to write so many sentences, and almost all of them are incorrect.

Size has only a limited amount of safety. Look at American cars from the 80s...they were massive, and they were deathtraps.

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Old 01-28-2014, 11:02 PM   #36
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Its amazing, that you are able to write so many sentences, and almost all of them are incorrect.
Lol. Funny but true!
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Old 01-28-2014, 11:05 PM   #37
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true on the 80s and even older vehicles i have seen cars in wrecks that you knew the people would be ok but they werent alot of deaths in those now yous see a car after a wreck and you know theres know way anyone survived that but in reality they walked away

to the op, happy noone was ihjured but like said above remove tire cover check ur spare and rim and everything else before u let it slide,,
thats another reason i like my little yj tank u can actually sit on the hood and not worry about denting it not to mention my home made basher rear bumper..
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Old 01-29-2014, 05:25 AM   #38
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[QUOTE=NFRs2000NYC;7813385]Its amazing, that you are able to write so many sentences, and almost all of them are incorrect.

Size has only a limited amount of safety. Look at American cars from the 80s...they were massive, and they were deathtraps.[quote]



Why do we need to look on 80? Look on cars without ABS and airbags etc? Who is wrong? American cars are still mostly large, but much safer than 80s made.
Point of this post is that CRV is junk plastic toy, become towed away after small speed impact to the rear of JKU. You are paid for this junk large $, for what? Enjoy it if you think it is safe and protect you somehow. Wrong!!!
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Old 01-29-2014, 06:09 AM   #39
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This is head on with a F250 going about 30mph. My passenger and I walked away without a scratch.
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Old 01-29-2014, 06:43 AM   #40
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This is head on with a F250 going about 30mph. My passenger and I walked away without a scratch.
Can you post F250 damage photo? I am glad you are fine...
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Old 01-29-2014, 06:57 AM   #41
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Can you post F250 damage photo? I am glad you are fine...
I didn't get a pic of the truck, I was too busy crying over the jeep. Here is another shot of the damage. The front end crumpled, just like it should.

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Old 01-29-2014, 07:06 AM   #42
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That sucks dude
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Old 01-29-2014, 07:22 AM   #43
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I would argue on this, CRV didn't absorb anything. It become bag of crashed cheapo plastic parts in one sec. Sure it is good on gas, it is light all made of plastic toy materials. Heavy truck on frame is way safer over such protection, sure Wrangler is not perfect but much better place in my opinion. Crash tests? Fiat with Smarts are high on these crash tests, how about real life test? How about large loaded garbage truck will hit Fiat or Smart on highway with speed over 50mpg? Would anyone survive inside?
I'll give you a fighting chance. Take a few engineering and physics classes and then get back to me with your original statement above and see if you would back anything you claim above other than "it is good on gas". For me to respond further simply wouldn't be fair.
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Old 01-29-2014, 07:23 AM   #44
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Its amazing, that you are able to write so many sentences, and almost all of them are incorrect.

I think he's concussed.
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Old 01-29-2014, 07:39 AM   #45
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A similar thing happened to me on NYE this year. Some guy in a CRV backed into my steel front bumper and the tow hooks went through his back hatch and destroyed the back of his car. He had snow on his back window or something and it was really dark. Anyway I saw his car and was like OMG my jeep must be wrecked. But we could barely find a scratch. One of the aftermarket fog lights got pushed to the side a bit, which I bent back by hand (the brackets were thin)

I felt bad for the guy though (a little).
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Old 01-29-2014, 10:21 AM   #46
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I'll give you a fighting chance. Take a few engineering and physics classes and then get back to me with your original statement above and see if you would back anything you claim above other than "it is good on gas". For me to respond further simply wouldn't be fair.
There is no point. He's been pretty clueless on almost all subjects that he posts about. Cheap plastic toy he says...nevermind the fact that it has the same amount of metal and plastic as the wrangler, with mirror to mirror parts on both vehicles (all plastic things are the same and all metal panels are the same. He doesn't realize that the only reason why he has no damage is the spare tire.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:05 AM   #47
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There is no point. He's been pretty clueless on almost all subjects that he posts about. Cheap plastic toy he says...nevermind the fact that it has the same amount of metal and plastic as the wrangler, with mirror to mirror parts on both vehicles (all plastic things are the same and all metal panels are the same. He doesn't realize that the only reason why he has no damage is the spare tire.
It's the nature of the beast now a days. All passenger vehicles are meant to collapse in on themselves to absorb the impact( everything from a CRV, Wrangler to a F250). It may not be good for the wallet but it is good for driver and passengers' health.
My bet is the OP's JKU is damaged in some way also. He just seams to be in denial.
He also seems to hate CRVs and women drivers.
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Old 01-29-2014, 01:02 PM   #48
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Check out my thread Opel station wagon vs jkur. (Don't know how to link on app) I was rear ended on autobahn by someone going about 120-130 mph. I had minimal damage too but my stock tire carrier was cracked so I would look at that. I could see the bottom of the tire carrier closer to the back tail gate ever so slightly. So I would def check that out I would want you to lose a spare driving one day when you hit a bump
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Old 01-29-2014, 01:10 PM   #49
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It's the nature of the beast now a days. All passenger vehicles are meant to collapse in on themselves to absorb the impact( everything from a CRV, Wrangler to a F250). It may not be good for the wallet but it is good for driver and passengers' health.
My bet is the OP's JKU is damaged in some way also. He just seams to be in denial.
He also seems to hate CRVs and women drivers.
Thats my point. The crashworthiness of a vehicle is to save the driver, not minimize the dents. His posts are simply fanboyish (zomg wrangler is invincible) by calling other vehicles plasticky junk. Those pasticky vehicles save the lives of a lot of people. I don't give a rats ass about my ride in a crash, thats why I have full coverage. I care about walking away. He argued with me about steel bumpers before as well. He's in for a big surprise if he rear ends someone with a stock wrangler front end.
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Old 01-29-2014, 01:39 PM   #50
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Good thing you have a lowrider.
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:48 PM   #51
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Thats my point. The crashworthiness of a vehicle is to save the driver, not minimize the dents. His posts are simply fanboyish (zomg wrangler is invincible) by calling other vehicles plasticky junk. Those pasticky vehicles save the lives of a lot of people. I don't give a rats ass about my ride in a crash, thats why I have full coverage. I care about walking away. He argued with me about steel bumpers before as well. He's in for a big surprise if he rear ends someone with a stock wrangler front end.

"Plasticky, tin can" vehicles save a TON of lives unless the occupant spaces becomes part of the crumple zone. Not saying this to disagree with you, I concur with your perspective but there are certainly times where crumpling can become a big issue. Thing is, if the accident is that bad, usually the shock and trauma from the impact will kill the occupants regardless. What it all comes down to is people need to pay attention when they're behind the wheel.
Frames can help reduce that risk of crumpling into occupant space, I'd still take a frame even though unibody has come a tremendous way. Funny thing about all of these posts is the focus on the external skin, this has virtually nothing to do with the actual strength of the vehicle in an accident. Let me rephrase that... It has NO impact on safety.
I do still think you're a Honda Toyota fanboy though... jk
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:56 PM   #52
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"Plasticky, tin can" vehicles save a TON of lives unless the occupant spaces becomes part of the crumple zone. Not saying this to disagree with you, I concur with your perspective but there are certainly times where crumpling can become a big issue. Thing is, if the accident is that bad, usually the shock and trauma from the impact will kill the occupants regardless. What it all comes down to is people need to pay attention when they're behind the wheel.
Frames can help reduce that risk of crumpling into occupant space, I'd still take a frame even though unibody has come a tremendous way. Funny thing about all of these posts is the focus on the external skin, this has virtually nothing to do with the actual strength of the vehicle in an accident. Let me rephrase that... It has NO impact on safety.
I do still think you're a Honda Toyota fanboy though... jk
Im a fanboy of anything that deserves a fan, be it a jeep, a honda, a suzuki, a ferarri, etc. When it comes to crashing, there is no "being a fan." Facts are facts. Unibodies have superseded frames a LONG time ago in strength. Look at supercars, micro cars (like the smart, etc.) A smart car and a Fiat 500 have better crash results than a Chevy Silverado. Im all for robust debate, but facts are facts. A Wrangler is no safer to the occupant than "these plasticky junk cars" and most of the time, more dangerous...in stock form that is. Add a bunch of steel everywhere and things change. I agree with your comment that sometimes (rarely) size helps, but properly engineered crumple zones have proven to save more lives than any other measure. My first car was a 1984 oldsmobile delta 88 (brougham edition bitches ) and that thing was 450 yards long. I guarantee, that if I slam into a 2012 accord with it, the accord driver will walk away, but I'll be in a hospital.
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Old 01-29-2014, 04:01 PM   #53
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Im a fanboy of anything that deserves a fan, be it a jeep, a honda, a suzuki, a ferarri, etc. When it comes to crashing, there is no "being a fan." Facts are facts. Unibodies have superseded frames a LONG time ago in strength. Look at supercars, micro cars (like the smart, etc.) A smart car and a Fiat 500 have better crash results than a Chevy Silverado. Im all for robust debate, but facts are facts. A Wrangler is no safer to the occupant than "these plasticky junk cars" and most of the time, more dangerous...in stock form that is. Add a bunch of steel everywhere and things change.
Not always black and white my friend. For the MOST part, I agree with crumple being an advantageous feature. Read my post, I agree with 90% if what you have reiterated, but there are times where frames will save a life where unibody wouldn't. The wrangler is a good sturdy vehicle, but by no means the safest. I haven't stated that nor will I ever. Would you rather be in a smart car when my Wrangler nails you or a Chevy silverado at 60 mph? Facts are facts but common sense is also common sense.

One other thing to consider.... Our jeeps have a ton of external plastics. Not sure I'd bash "plasticky" vehicles OP...
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Old 01-29-2014, 04:04 PM   #54
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I agree with your comment that sometimes (rarely) size helps, but properly engineered crumple zones have proven to save more lives than any other measure. My first car was a 1984 oldsmobile delta 88 (brougham edition bitches ) and that thing was 450 yards long. I guarantee, that if I slam into a 2012 accord with it, the accord driver will walk away, but I'll be in a hospital.
Agree 100%. Also known as better engineering, better materials and cad/cam. That has made such a tremendous difference, airbags don't hurt either. What still boggles my mind are those that refuse to wear seatbelts. Can't always help or change stupid.
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Old 01-29-2014, 05:00 PM   #55
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Add a bunch of steel everywhere and things change.
This is an interesting statement coming from one who proposes strength through engineered failing or crumpling. What happens when you add "steel" to your Jeep? It is generally bolted to...wait for it.... the frame. So essentially you are changing nothing except that you have now elongated the depth of impact damage before crumpling takes effect, thereby reducing the effectiveness of the crumpling. If you were to have a serious impact, the force of the impact would be directly translated to your frame almost instantly as aftermarket components do not contribute to the flexural strength of compressive zones. This equates to a more jarring accident less contingent on crumples zones. You are basically stating that heavy steel is making things safer, yet you propose that steel can hinder safety as evidenced by the "massive 80s American" cars phenomenon.
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Old 01-29-2014, 06:46 PM   #56
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OP hasn't posted again...

He he, no one was even mean to him.
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Old 01-29-2014, 07:21 PM   #57
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Not always black and white my friend. For the MOST part, I agree with crumple being an advantageous feature. Read my post, I agree with 90% if what you have reiterated, but there are times where frames will save a life where unibody wouldn't. The wrangler is a good sturdy vehicle, but by no means the safest. I haven't stated that nor will I ever. Would you rather be in a smart car when my Wrangler nails you or a Chevy silverado at 60 mph? Facts are facts but common sense is also common sense.

One other thing to consider.... Our jeeps have a ton of external plastics. Not sure I'd bash "plasticky" vehicles OP...
Well, ideally, I'd like to be in MY jeep when your jeep hits me, however, I see your point. Although my logic tells me that I'd be better off in the silverado, tests show that I am safer in a subaru or a smart car. It's a tough pill to swallow.
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Old 01-29-2014, 07:26 PM   #58
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This is an interesting statement coming from one who proposes strength through engineered failing or crumpling. What happens when you add "steel" to your Jeep? It is generally bolted to...wait for it.... the frame. So essentially you are changing nothing except that you have now elongated the depth of impact damage before crumpling takes effect, thereby reducing the effectiveness of the crumpling. If you were to have a serious impact, the force of the impact would be directly translated to your frame almost instantly as aftermarket components do not contribute to the flexural strength of compressive zones. This equates to a more jarring accident less contingent on crumples zones. You are basically stating that heavy steel is making things safer, yet you propose that steel can hinder safety as evidenced by the "massive 80s American" cars phenomenon.
Steel on a jeep is slightly different than steel on the old boats in their form (stingers, pre-runners, etc.) Generally speaking, steel on a jeep will transfer more total energy (the energy produced by both vehicles striking each other) to the other car...similar to striking an animal. You may experience larger G forces, but unless you get into an 80mph accident, they will be survivable. I agree, there are scenarios where having steel all around will hurt (like hitting a solid object ie spinning out and slamming a tree) but on the road, below 30mph (the average speed of car accidents) against a typical road car, you will be better off with a steel bumper. I also agree that there isn't one "this is the best formula." Its a game of probability. Two jeeps hitting each other with a steel bumpers will DEFINITELY hurt the occupants more than two stock jeeps...but if one is steel and one is stock, the steel peeps will fair better.
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Old 01-29-2014, 08:40 PM   #59
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Steel on a jeep is slightly different than steel on the old boats in their form (stingers, pre-runners, etc.) Generally speaking, steel on a jeep will transfer more total energy (the energy produced by both vehicles striking each other) to the other car...similar to striking an animal. You may experience larger G forces, but unless you get into an 80mph accident, they will be survivable. I agree, there are scenarios where having steel all around will hurt (like hitting a solid object ie spinning out and slamming a tree) but on the road, below 30mph (the average speed of car accidents) against a typical road car, you will be better off with a steel bumper. I also agree that there isn't one "this is the best formula." Its a game of probability. Two jeeps hitting each other with a steel bumpers will DEFINITELY hurt the occupants more than two stock jeeps...but if one is steel and one is stock, the steel peeps will fair better.
Good points. Was just wondering your rationale with your statement of having extra steel, I happen to agree. Well stated.
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Old 01-29-2014, 10:29 PM   #60
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I rear ended a ford torus about 2 months ago going atleast 65 on the highway
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