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Old 11-12-2012, 09:45 PM   #3421
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Right, that's what I've read and learned from this thread (I actually did my homework before asking). But, similar to the 2062 number between AB and AC, is there one between AA and AB?
well no one really knows. Chysler said the new "robust" AB head entered production around the end of june. So just to throw around a wild guess, I'd say the AB would be julian 1722-2052. Its life was short.

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Old 11-12-2012, 09:53 PM   #3422
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I know Chrysler won't "spill the beans" but aren't there any expert theories on what the problem was with the heads, why it happened in only some circumstances, why it resulted in ticking and what changes were made from Rev. A to B to C?

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Old 11-12-2012, 09:59 PM   #3423
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Bad News - Mine is 0902 so I am guessing the AA head.

Good News - I went to a different Jeep Dealership today (Manassas Jeep) and they actually acknowledged the situation with the ticking and the cause unlike the folks at Lustin Jeep in Woodbridge.

The guys at Manassas Jeep were very informative and checked everyone out on my Jeep. The Master Tech said my engine is good to go. He also said that they were having more issues with the vans than the jeeps.

I guess I just have a better warm and fuzzing now that a tech who actually knowledges the situation has looked things over.

I guess time will tell.
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Old 11-12-2012, 10:13 PM   #3424
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well no one really knows. Chysler said the new "robust" AB head entered production around the end of june. So just to throw around a wild guess, I'd say the AB would be julian 1722-2052. Its life was short.
Interesting.

If the Jeep has an AA I think I will pass on it
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Old 11-12-2012, 10:17 PM   #3425
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For some reason Chrysler didn't trust the AB head, not sure I would either.
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:12 PM   #3426
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For some reason Chrysler didn't trust the AB head, not sure I would either.

I'm with you!
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:06 AM   #3427
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Interesting.

If the Jeep has an AA I think I will pass on it
I'd pass on AA and AB too.
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:10 AM   #3428
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wow, ok
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:44 AM   #3429
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For some reason Chrysler didn't trust the AB head, not sure I would either.
This isn't necessarily true. If the AB head had a more robust design, they may have made a manufacturing process update to manufacture the new head more cheaply/efficiently after AB was proven to work ok. Going from AB to AC doesn't necessarily mean there is a design change.
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:49 AM   #3430
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This isn't necessarily true. If the AB head had a more robust design, they may have made a manufacturing process update to manufacture the new head more cheaply/efficiently after AB was proven to work ok. Going from AB to AC doesn't necessarily mean there is a design change.
True but still speculation on both sides of the discussion. Until Chrysler comes clean, all we can do is speculate. Our resident insiders are still quiet so that leaves me wondering. Any 2013's having the issue?

As a side note I'm bringing my Liberty in for a 5 year check to keep the so called Lifetime Warranty in effect tomorrow. I'm going to see if I can get any info from the shop, although I really doubt they'll be willing to say anything.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:16 AM   #3431
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True but still speculation on both sides of the discussion. Until Chrysler comes clean, all we can do is speculate. Our resident insiders are still quiet so that leaves me wondering. Any 2013's having the issue?

As a side note I'm bringing my Liberty in for a 5 year check to keep the so called Lifetime Warranty in effect tomorrow. I'm going to see if I can get any info from the shop, although I really doubt they'll be willing to say anything.
I don't think there have been any cases of confirmed valve issues with the AB heads yet, so until anything pops up we can't speculate.
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Old 11-13-2012, 03:22 PM   #3432
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I don't think there have been any cases of confirmed valve issues with the AB heads yet, so until anything pops up we can't speculate.

Then why an AC head? Without confirmation from Chrysler all we can do is speculate.
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:12 PM   #3433
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Then why an AC head? Without confirmation from Chrysler all we can do is speculate.
This could be anything from a design change to a simple documentation, specification or packaging change... or possibly an additional manufacturing site so there's traceability to control FG inventory.

Finished goods distribution isn't always controlled by revison...

We use the same PN rev system ... AA is a new released part and subsequent revisons are typical drawing changes with MRP releases.

It can be a multitude of reasons.

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Old 11-13-2012, 06:22 PM   #3434
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It can be a multitude of reasons.

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My point exactly, it could be a multitude of reasons, no one knows for sure. So all we can do is speculate. Those who do know aren't saying a word.
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:38 PM   #3435
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......Those who do know aren't saying a word.
Those bastages!
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:41 PM   #3436
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Those bastages!
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Old 11-13-2012, 06:43 PM   #3437
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Those fargin sneaky bastages!
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Old 11-13-2012, 07:55 PM   #3438
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Well I checked mine and I've got 0742A and 0742B. So, I'm gessing those are the first generation heads.

I've got 7,500 miles now, and I have towed with the Jeep, been offroad, and a few times I've really lit into the throttle to see what the Pentastar really has. I've filled up at multiple fuel stations with 87 octane, so I'm sure I've gotten some good fuel and some poor fuel along the way. And, as of today I have zero ticking and zero engine problems.

That doesn't mean that mine won't throw codes one day in the future...but I don't guess having AA heads is necessarily a death sentence.
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:18 PM   #3439
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Those fargin sneaky bastages!

Fargin Iceholes! All kidding as long as they're silent the speculating will continue. LOL
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Old 11-13-2012, 11:35 PM   #3440
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Then why an AC head? Without confirmation from Chrysler all we can do is speculate.
For everyone here who doesn't work for the auto industry I will try to explain.

When a manufacturer changes parts in an assembly during a model year, I.E. heads on an engine, there are two types of part changes.

These two types are interchangeable and forward only changes.

In interchangeable changes, you can continue to use head AA in the assembly until you run out, or conversely if you're already out of the AA head and are resupplied with AB before the changeover date, you can run the AB heads before the official changeover.

Forward only changes are a different animal all together. Forward changes say that on x date, you can no longer use the AA head for any reason and must start using the AB head, no matter how many AA heads you have left, no matter if you don't have AB head yet, you CAN NOT run the AA head anymore after that date.

AB to AC were interchangeable from what I've been able to figure, leading me to believe that there may have been a simple revision like a surface finish modification or something in the documentation, drawings, etc.

I wouldn't worry about it for those of you with 2013's or late 2012s.
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Old 11-13-2012, 11:58 PM   #3441
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So while sitting in the drive through tonight I heard it! The ticking its not crazy loud but its a constant tick tick tick tick. So I plan on taking it into my dealer tomorrow that did a crazy amount of warranty work on my 300 even though it was obviously in an accident . Is there anything I should have or prepare for? I replaced my stock wheels with slightly bigger ones they wont try to give me bullshit for that will they?
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Old 11-13-2012, 11:59 PM   #3442
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my '12 is a late dec build date....purchased late March. up to 10,800 miles now. 2 oil changes using castrol gtx 5w30 and wix filters. no issues with ticking. honestly, I haven't had a single issue with the entire JK. haven't seen the dealer since I bought it. my motor runs quite and smooth. 87 octane only from the normal spots like 76, mobil, chevron....no am/pm or arco fuel. mileage varies from 16.5-18.5 depending on several factors. hopefully it stays this way. if not, they can swap the head and give me a rental for a couple days....no biggie imo.
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:01 AM   #3443
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So while sitting in the drive through tonight I heard it! The ticking its not crazy loud but its a constant tick tick tick tick. So I plan on taking it into my dealer tomorrow that did a crazy amount of warranty work on my 300 even though it was obviously in an accident . Is there anything I should have or prepare for? I replaced my stock wheels with slightly bigger ones they wont try to give me bullshit for that will they?
if u do have the head problem it is completely unrelated to mods to suspension and tires, etc. they will fix it. I have not heard of anyone with a confirmed head problem/CEL that had issues with the warranty coverage being voided do to mods.
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Old 11-14-2012, 12:05 AM   #3444
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if u do have the head problem it is completely unrelated to mods to suspension and tires, etc. they will fix it. I have not heard of anyone with a confirmed head problem/CEL that had issues with the warranty coverage being voided do to mods.
Do I just go in and say I think I have the head problem? Will they know what I'm talking about or think I'm talking about my mental health?
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Old 11-14-2012, 01:49 AM   #3445
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For everyone here who doesn't work for the auto industry I will try to explain.

When a manufacturer changes parts in an assembly during a model year, I.E. heads on an engine, there are two types of part changes.

These two types are interchangeable and forward only changes.

In interchangeable changes, you can continue to use head AA in the assembly until you run out, or conversely if you're already out of the AA head and are resupplied with AB before the changeover date, you can run the AB heads before the official changeover.

Forward only changes are a different animal all together. Forward changes say that on x date, you can no longer use the AA head for any reason and must start using the AB head, no matter how many AA heads you have left, no matter if you don't have AB head yet, you CAN NOT run the AA head anymore after that date.

AB to AC were interchangeable from what I've been able to figure, leading me to believe that there may have been a simple revision like a surface finish modification or something in the documentation, drawings, etc.

I wouldn't worry about it for those of you with 2013's or late 2012s.
Why not? I would... The 3.6L fiasco is the reason I haven't bought another Jeep.

I'm a Senior Manager over an engineering and document control function for a large manufacturer in the medical device industry.. includes CAD, change control, issuing new pn's and releasing global sales groups in systems like Oracle or SAP.

What you're referring to is a phase-in and phase-out change vs. a mandatory change that requires disposition of existing inventory, commonly known as scrap or rework. I'm not familiar with your term interchangable... either the component has changed or not.

The design change happened from AA to AB... that's a given.

The change from AB to AC wasn't packaging... the spec control drawing could have been updated to change tolerances for manufacturing or like I said in my prior post, to include an additional point of manufacture. What they can't have is one PN and two different revisions released at the same time in the MRP/ERP system.. just not possible because the MRP system doesn't work that way.

The engineering change order (ECO) needs to have instructions for materials, planning and manufacturing on what to do with the previous revision and associated inventory, not to mention the newly released revision. The top level orderable PN will typically have multiple components with their own PN's that makes this an assembly - commonly known as the bill of materials (BOM) that's orderable for manufacturing, as well as service parts for finished goods distribution.

I've said it once and I will say it again... Chrysler is chasing this problem and using their customers to validate the design change. Again why? Because they didn't do it right to begin with. This could go on for years if not successful or until they decide to obsolete and discontinue the design through product corrective actions, recalls or simply a new model change.. did someone say 3.2L turbo?

If your curious about my inside knowledge, just go visit the FDA website and review all the medical device product recalls you don't hear about. It may make you worry the next time you or a family member needs to go to the hospital.

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Old 11-14-2012, 04:26 AM   #3446
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For everyone here who doesn't work for the auto industry I will try to explain.

When a manufacturer changes parts in an assembly during a model year, I.E. heads on an engine, there are two types of part changes.

These two types are interchangeable and forward only changes.

In interchangeable changes, you can continue to use head AA in the assembly until you run out, or conversely if you're already out of the AA head and are resupplied with AB before the changeover date, you can run the AB heads before the official changeover.

Forward only changes are a different animal all together. Forward changes say that on x date, you can no longer use the AA head for any reason and must start using the AB head, no matter how many AA heads you have left, no matter if you don't have AB head yet, you CAN NOT run the AA head anymore after that date.

AB to AC were interchangeable from what I've been able to figure, leading me to believe that there may have been a simple revision like a surface finish modification or something in the documentation, drawings, etc.

I wouldn't worry about it for those of you with 2013's or late 2012s.
I worked for the auto industry too and have friends that still do. While what you say is true, you still don't know for a fact what is going on with these heads, so like everyone else you're speculating too. No disrespect intended, but phrases like "leading me to believe," is nothing more than your opinion. There are several opinions here, and very little facts. The only facts we know is there is a problem with the left cylinder head, and they are up to revision AC, they originally started with cylinder head AA. That's really all anyone knows for a fact. Hopefully when a little time goes by and vehicles with head AB and AC don't have the tick return it will be safe to assume they nailed it. We're still months away from knowing that, which is JMO.
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Old 11-14-2012, 04:31 AM   #3447
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I worked for the auto industry too and have friends that still do. While what you say is true, you still don't know for a fact what is going on with these heads, so like everyone else you're speculating too. No disrespect intended, but phrases like "leading me to believe," is nothing more than your opinion. There are several opinions here, and very little facts. The only facts we know is there is a problem with the left cylinder head, and they are up to revision AC, they originally started with cylinder head AA. That's really all anyone knows for a fact. Hopefully when a little time goes by and vehicles with head AB and AC don't have the tick return it will be safe to assume they nailed it. We're still months away from knowing that, which is JMO.
I'm not sure we are months away. When was this problem first discovered in the 2012? You have to figure there are people, plenty from this forum, who have had their 2013 since September. Either they are all incredibly lucky, or the problem likely isn't there.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:03 AM   #3448
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I'm not sure we are months away. When was this problem first discovered in the 2012? You have to figure there are people, plenty from this forum, who have had their 2013 since September. Either they are all incredibly lucky, or the problem likely isn't there.
I was referring to the AB heads, I should have been a little more clear, sorry. With any luck the 2013's are fine and the problem soon will he history.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:11 AM   #3449
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I was referring to the AB heads, I should have been a little more clear, sorry. With any luck the 2013's are fine and the problem soon will he history.
I know what you meant. And I still think that by now, if there were issues with the AB heads in a 2013, we would have heard about it.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:17 AM   #3450
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I know what you meant. And I still think that by now, if there were issues with the AB heads in a 2013, we would have heard about it.
Maybe so, certainly the more time that goes by w/o complaints the greater the likelihood the problem has been fixed. So far so good! Any idea at what point the 2013's changed over to the AC head? Aren't there a few complaints of 2012's with the AB head swap still having the tick?

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