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Old 03-15-2013, 05:49 PM   #4381
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Dropped off. The service rep that took my information said he was definitely aware of the issue in general. He listened to the engine for about 10 seconds, shook his head and wrote some notes. When I asked if they had performed any head replacements he said he had only been on the job for a couple of weeks but he's already seen two heads come through their shop for replacement in that time. So, even though I don't have the CEL, I'm not expecting any push back, but we'll see.

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Old 03-15-2013, 07:11 PM   #4382
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So, the latest (and if you guys are bored with this, just say so - I know my friends and family are sick of hearing about it, that's for sure). I've called my 'case manager' 4 times in the last 12 hours. I also left a message at the general number (not his direct extension) with my case number. I'm definitely getting blown off.

What should I do? Have any of you been through this before? It's not a lemon in the legal sense due to the mileage. The repairs they are doing are obviously not the right ones, but I'm seriously done with this vehicle. I could feed them the information (AA vs AC cylinder head) but I shouldn't have to. Thoughts?
My thought is simple, it is this type of crap from American auto manufactures the has the industry barely above of water if at all. No wonder Detroit is struggling, the public is wary of problems associated poor quality and reliability so the look at Toyota, Nissan and Honda.

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Old 03-15-2013, 07:50 PM   #4383
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Umm......Detroit isn't struggling and the Japanese car makers have had their share of reliability issues. Honda just recalled a quarter of a million cars for a defect.
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Old 03-15-2013, 08:23 PM   #4384
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Hate to instigate, but we are NOT struggling. We were, I'll give you that, but it seems that the "reliable" companies like Toyota are having much more recalls then the "unreliable" companies like Ford or Chrysler now a days and due to increase demand on vehicles such as our new and improved Wranglers and cost effective fuel efficient American vehicles, our motor companies are on the road back to great success. On a completely unrelated note, The jeep factory in Toledo is currently hiring more AMERICANS due to the high rise of sales for Wranglers in foreign countries.
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Old 03-15-2013, 10:19 PM   #4385
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Ok, I need a second opinion. Is this or is this not a Pentastar tick?

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Old 03-15-2013, 10:26 PM   #4386
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Ok, I need a second opinion. Is this or is this not a Pentastar tick?

PentaTick 1 - YouTube
Naaaaa.
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Old 03-15-2013, 11:23 PM   #4387
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Umm......Detroit isn't struggling and the Japanese car makers have had their share of reliability issues. Honda just recalled a quarter of a million cars for a defect.

So you support the quality of service ekdigdirt has reported for this defect? Prior to the Jeep, I had a couple of Lexus cars and my wife has Toyo, the service ekdigdirt reported is foreign to me and completely unacceptable. It is also something domestic dealerships are known for, and consumers are afraid of when they are shopping for a $40K + vehicle.

At this point in my life I would not put up with it at all. 1 CEL for the head fine, I can live with a brand new engine that was constructed in a clean room being opened up in an dealership garage but 2 or more and the jeep would be gone.

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Hate to instigate, but we are NOT struggling. We were, I'll give you that, but it seems that the "reliable" companies like Toyota are having much more recalls then the "unreliable" companies like Ford or Chrysler now a days and due to increase demand on vehicles such as our new and improved Wranglers and cost effective fuel efficient American vehicles, our motor companies are on the road back to great success. On a completely unrelated note, The jeep factory in Toledo is currently hiring more AMERICANS due to the high rise of sales for Wranglers in foreign countries.

I know folks who sale vehicles at both Japanese and Domestic dealerships. Would you like to know which ones sale more cars/trucks etc.?

I love my Jeep, but as I said, I would not put up with what ekdigdirt has had to endure for a minute. The Jeep would be gone and I would give the FJ or Raptor a shot.
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Old 03-16-2013, 09:06 AM   #4388
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So you support the quality of service ekdigdirt has reported for this defect? Prior to the Jeep, I had a couple of Lexus cars and my wife has Toyo, the service ekdigdirt reported is foreign to me and completely unacceptable. It is also something domestic dealerships are known for, and consumers are afraid of when they are shopping for a $40K + vehicle.

At this point in my life I would not put up with it at all. 1 CEL for the head fine, I can live with a brand new engine that was constructed in a clean room being opened up in an dealership garage but 2 or more and the jeep would be gone.

I know folks who sale vehicles at both Japanese and Domestic dealerships. Would you like to know which ones sale more cars/trucks etc.?

I love my Jeep, but as I said, I would not put up with what ekdigdirt has had to endure for a minute. The Jeep would be gone and I would give the FJ or Raptor a shot.
I never said I support the quality of service that ekdigdirt's dealer has been giving her. And if I were in her shoes I would be totally pissed. And yes, Chrysler should have sent a bulletin to all dealers at the start of this explaining to replace the head without question for any customer experiencing a tick or CEL. But they didn't. But it wasn't to long ago that Toyota denied a problem with some of their vehicles experiencing runaway acceleration issues. Sound familiar?

My point which you seem to have missed is every automaker including your beloved Japanese brands, have quality/reliability issues. And spend time on the Toyota forums and you will read about members being treated like crap at Toyota dealers. You can praise Toyota, Honda, and Nissan all you want but in reality they are no different.

Regardless of the vehicle brand, there are dealers who care and dealers who don't. If she decides to ditch her Jeep, I would totally understand.
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Old 03-16-2013, 11:21 AM   #4389
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Update: (although it's not much of one..). My case manager at ISG won't call me back. Jeep says they can't help me because they are no longer in charge of my case. Dealership won't allow me to make an appointment because the last repair was supposed to be the "final repair." I even called the bank who financed my loan to ask what my options were: she suggested I bring the vehicle to AutoZone and have them turn off the CEL so I can more money on a trade than I would if the CEL was on.

I have a contact person at the attorney general's office, thanks to my job. I'll give them a call on Monday and see what they say, and then I guess make an appointment with my own personal attorney to see what my options are.

As a side-note: my ex-husband had an FJ - yes, it has the Toyo quality and probably will run forever. But it's nowhere near as fun as a wrangler and the visibility in that thing was terrible due to window placement. I wouldn't recommend. I'll probably just go all "soccer mom" and get an Outback. My dogs will like it at least.
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Old 03-16-2013, 12:01 PM   #4390
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Update: (although it's not much of one..). My case manager at ISG won't call me back. Jeep says they can't help me because they are no longer in charge of my case. Dealership won't allow me to make an appointment because the last repair was supposed to be the "final repair." I even called the bank who financed my loan to ask what my options were: she suggested I bring the vehicle to AutoZone and have them turn off the CEL so I can more money on a trade than I would if the CEL was on.

I have a contact person at the attorney general's office, thanks to my job. I'll give them a call on Monday and see what they say, and then I guess make an appointment with my own personal attorney to see what my options are.

As a side-note: my ex-husband had an FJ - yes, it has the Toyo quality and probably will run forever. But it's nowhere near as fun as a wrangler and the visibility in that thing was terrible due to window placement. I wouldn't recommend. I'll probably just go all "soccer mom" and get an Outback. My dogs will like it at least.
Who or what is ISG?

Consulting with your attorney is a good idea. As is contacting your state attorney general. Sometimes, they are able to get answers.

And if you decide to trade to get rid of the Jeep, then definitely have the CEL turned off just prior to trade-in. Too bad you couldn't trade it back in at your current dealer. Then once they owned it they would have to deal with it. LOL
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Old 03-16-2013, 12:41 PM   #4391
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ISG - Impartial Service Group. Impartial Services Group Apparently they negotiate on behalf of Chrysler/Jeep (or anyone who contracts for their services, I suppose). When I call the main number and listen to the options (trying to see if I could reach someone without putting in my case manager's extension), they are things such as "for recall information, press 1", "if you are a dealership, press 2" and the like - that's not it, exactly, but something like that.
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Old 03-16-2013, 12:54 PM   #4392
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I never said I support the quality of service that ekdigdirt's dealer has been giving her. And if I were in her shoes I would be totally pissed. And yes, Chrysler should have sent a bulletin to all dealers at the start of this explaining to replace the head without question for any customer experiencing a tick or CEL. But they didn't. But it wasn't to long ago that Toyota denied a problem with some of their vehicles experiencing runaway acceleration issues. Sound familiar?

My point which you seem to have missed is every automaker including your beloved Japanese brands, have quality/reliability issues. And spend time on the Toyota forums and you will read about members being treated like crap at Toyota dealers. You can praise Toyota, Honda, and Nissan all you want but in reality they are no different.

Regardless of the vehicle brand, there are dealers who care and dealers who don't. If she decides to ditch her Jeep, I would totally understand.
I have no consumer loyalty hence changing from Lexus to Jeep and from Corvette to Lexus prior to that. "My point which you seem to have missed" is that domestic automotive manufactures have had poor reliability and service ratings from JD Powers and CR for sometime though for Ford it is changing for the better. So when you see it happening first hand in this case to a forum member it perpetuates the stereotype, and is not a winning formula.

If domestic manufactures want to lead they need to fix the perception of reliability and poor service. I can only speak for myself, I have had good to excellent service from the Lexus and Toyota dealerships fair to good with the Vette and fair to good with the Jeep. As for reliability, it is obvious to an unbiased observer that Chrysler did a poor job of R&D on this engine not something that is common to the manufactures I "praise" and not something that will change consumer perception of the brand.

Top Rated Cars - Car, Truck, SUV Rankings - 2012 Initial Quality Study

Top Rated Cars, SUVs & Trucks - Car Reliability Ratings - 2013 Vehicle Dependability Study

It is all about perception.

Best Car Brand Perception survey - 2013 (Consumer Reports) | Ranking The Brands
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Old 03-17-2013, 10:05 AM   #4393
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What should I do? Have any of you been through this before? It's not a lemon in the legal sense due to the mileage. The repairs they are doing are obviously not the right ones, but I'm seriously done with this vehicle. I could feed them the information (AA vs AC cylinder head) but I shouldn't have to. Thoughts?
Where are you located? And how many miles are on the Jeep now? They should be able to help you with a new cylinder head at the dealership level, what are they telling you? I assume you spoke to the Service Manager?
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Old 03-17-2013, 06:29 PM   #4394
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Originally Posted by hwy1rubi View Post
I have no consumer loyalty hence changing from Lexus to Jeep and from Corvette to Lexus prior to that. "My point which you seem to have missed" is that domestic automotive manufactures have had poor reliability and service ratings from JD Powers and CR for sometime though for Ford it is changing for the better. So when you see it happening first hand in this case to a forum member it perpetuates the stereotype, and is not a winning formula.

If domestic manufactures want to lead they need to fix the perception of reliability and poor service. I can only speak for myself, I have had good to excellent service from the Lexus and Toyota dealerships fair to good with the Vette and fair to good with the Jeep. As for reliability, it is obvious to an unbiased observer that Chrysler did a poor job of R&D on this engine not something that is common to the manufactures I "praise" and not something that will change consumer perception of the brand.

Top Rated Cars - Car, Truck, SUV Rankings - 2012 Initial Quality Study

Top Rated Cars, SUVs & Trucks - Car Reliability Ratings - 2013 Vehicle Dependability Study

It is all about perception.

Best Car Brand Perception survey - 2013 (Consumer Reports) | Ranking The Brands

I am happy that your experiences at Lexus and Toyota dealerships were positive. I have had positive experiences at my Jeep dealer.

But perception and reality are not the same.

While the Japanese brands have a perceived higher quality/reliability rating and may have slightly better long term ratings, when you get right down to it, Toyota is infamous for stonewalling customers on major issues.

Remember about a decade ago when Toyota was forced to buy back thousands of Tacomas because of frame rot? Do you think Toyota willingly decided to do that out of the goodness of their corporate heart? It took lawsuits and threats from state attorney general's to make it happen.

How about just recently with the episode of unintended acceleration on Toyota vehicles? Even after law enforcement officials and news media exposed the issue, Toyota continued to deny the problem. Even when they settled in court, they never admitted any problems. Chrysler has nothing on Toyota when it comes to poor customer service.

I am not strictly brand loyal, but after knowing Toyota owners who got treated poorly by their dealer and the corporation over legitimate warranty claims, I know better than to buy their vehicles.

Which leads me back to my original statement: regardless of the automaker they all have issues with quality and reliability. Some have more, some have less, but it happens to all.
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Old 03-17-2013, 06:33 PM   #4395
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Originally Posted by ekdigdirt View Post
ISG - Impartial Service Group. Impartial Services Group Apparently they negotiate on behalf of Chrysler/Jeep (or anyone who contracts for their services, I suppose). When I call the main number and listen to the options (trying to see if I could reach someone without putting in my case manager's extension), they are things such as "for recall information, press 1", "if you are a dealership, press 2" and the like - that's not it, exactly, but something like that.
Then I agree its time to consult your attorney and the state attorney general's office.
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Old 03-17-2013, 06:50 PM   #4396
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The American auto manufacturers will stay in business and conduct business as they always have as long as the federal govt has the stomach to bail them out. We missed a wonderful opportunity to fix what was ailing them this last time through. But no, nobody had the stomach to fix what caused their problems and instead opted to erase their debt on the backs of the stockholders and tax payers. Nothing has changed at the big three except that their debt is gone. They still lose money on every vehicle they sell when you consider the balance sheet and not the p&l. The problems will all be back quite soon. You cannot build cars paying those labor and benefit costs and turn a profit, period.

Our government had two options, erase the debt with tax dollars and eliminate all stockholder equity or reorganize under federal bankruptcy laws and get away from the horrible contracts/agreements that caused the problem in the first place while never missing a day of production. You know what they chose.

You know what the difference is between a Big Three car and an import built in the USA or overseas? A power window quits on an import after one year and the customer raises hell with the service department. A power window quits on a Big Three car after a year and the owner drives in the service department to gloat that three windows still work! It's all about expectations.
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Old 03-17-2013, 07:36 PM   #4397
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Old 03-17-2013, 07:48 PM   #4398
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I am happy that your experiences at Lexus and Toyota dealerships were positive. I have had positive experiences at my Jeep dealer.

But perception and reality are not the same.

While the Japanese brands have a perceived higher quality/reliability rating and may have slightly better long term ratings, when you get right down to it, Toyota is infamous for stonewalling customers on major issues.

Remember about a decade ago when Toyota was forced to buy back thousands of Tacomas because of frame rot? Do you think Toyota willingly decided to do that out of the goodness of their corporate heart? It took lawsuits and threats from state attorney general's to make it happen.

How about just recently with the episode of unintended acceleration on Toyota vehicles? Even after law enforcement officials and news media exposed the issue, Toyota continued to deny the problem. Even when they settled in court, they never admitted any problems. Chrysler has nothing on Toyota when it comes to poor customer service.

I am not strictly brand loyal, but after knowing Toyota owners who got treated poorly by their dealer and the corporation over legitimate warranty claims, I know better than to buy their vehicles.

Which leads me back to my original statement: regardless of the automaker they all have issues with quality and reliability. Some have more, some have less, but it happens to all.

It is the perception that creates the reality of sales and profits.

BTW, research is your friend.

Did the settlement conclude that Toyota vehicles had accelerated unexpectedly due to flaws in the cars?
Lawyers for both sides state that investigators from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) and the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) were unable to link allegations of unintended acceleration to flaws in the electronic throttle. Instead, investigators blamed driver error or floor mat entrapment. "Reliable scientific evidence and multiple independent evaluations have confirmed the safety of Toyota's electronic throttle control systems," Christopher P. Reynolds, general counsel for Toyota Motor Sales USA, said in a statement. In a news release on his firm's Web site, Steve Berman, attorney for the plaintiffs, said, "We are eager to move the process forward so we can ultimately distribute funds to Toyota owners as well as install brake-override systems in more than 3 million vehicles."

http://www.edmunds.com/car-safety/fo...ettlement.html

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Originally Posted by Silverton34 View Post
The American auto manufacturers will stay in business and conduct business as they always have as long as the federal govt has the stomach to bail them out. We missed a wonderful opportunity to fix what was ailing them this last time through. But no, nobody had the stomach to fix what caused their problems and instead opted to erase their debt on the backs of the stockholders and tax payers. Nothing has changed at the big three except that their debt is gone. They still lose money on every vehicle they sell when you consider the balance sheet and not the p&l. The problems will all be back quite soon. You cannot build cars paying those labor and benefit costs and turn a profit, period.

Our government had two options, erase the debt with tax dollars and eliminate all stockholder equity or reorganize under federal bankruptcy laws and get away from the horrible contracts/agreements that caused the problem in the first place while never missing a day of production. You know what they chose.

You know what the difference is between a Big Three car and an import built in the USA or overseas? A power window quits on an import after one year and the customer raises hell with the service department. A power window quits on a Big Three car after a year and the owner drives in the service department to gloat that three windows still work! It's all about expectations.
As long as consumers will blindly accept that quality along with poor service they have no reason to change. I would hope that next time around Uncle Sam will not bail them out. For Chrysler they have had 2 in recent memory, that's enough.
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Old 03-17-2013, 08:24 PM   #4399
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Floor mat entrapment. Hmm.....floor mats made for Toyota to Toyota specs and used in Toyota vehicles. So Toyota wasn't at fault and the evidence wasn't conclusive yet Toyota decides to provide monetary compensation and 3 million brake overrides?
Of course, Toyota's attorney will make a statement like that. And the counsel for the plaintiffs accepts the offer to keep the process from dragging on. At least customers get something

In the video with the cop standing on the brake and the Toyota continuing to accelerate, the cop must have been stepping on the throttle. LOL Driver error.

Research is indeed my friend as is experience. Doesn't matter how many links you provide proposing to support Toyota's supposed superiority in quality/reliability, the fact remains that they have issues just like the Big Three or any other automaker.

You don't have to accept that fact or believe it, but it is true none the less.

You are correct on one point. As long as consumers blindly accept any automakers quality along with poor service, automakers have no reason to change. At this point in time there are no automakers who have excellent quality and excellent customer service.
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Old 03-17-2013, 10:18 PM   #4400
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Floor mat entrapment. Hmm.....floor mats made for Toyota to Toyota specs and used in Toyota vehicles. So Toyota wasn't at fault and the evidence wasn't conclusive yet Toyota decides to provide monetary compensation and 3 million brake overrides?
Of course, Toyota's attorney will make a statement like that. And the counsel for the plaintiffs accepts the offer to keep the process from dragging on. At least customers get something

In the video with the cop standing on the brake and the Toyota continuing to accelerate, the cop must have been stepping on the throttle. LOL Driver error.

Research is indeed my friend as is experience. Doesn't matter how many links you provide proposing to support Toyota's supposed superiority in quality/reliability, the fact remains that they have issues just like the Big Three or any other automaker.

You don't have to accept that fact or believe it, but it is true none the less.

You are correct on one point. As long as consumers blindly accept any automakers quality along with poor service, automakers have no reason to change. At this point in time there are no automakers who have excellent quality and excellent customer service.
I sure hope you understand that just because you say something that does not make it true. Hence the reason I provide some links to help educate, though I realize that it is most likely a waste of time.

I am very happy with my Jeep so far but unlike your statements I acknowledge the fact that there are more reliable vehicles from manufactures who provide superior service quality on said vehicles. I for one chose Jeep for its off road capabilities not for reliability. So consequently at the time of purchase I added an extended warranty. Not something that research indicated I needed with any of the 3 vehicles I owned prior to the Jeep.

However my other vehicles did not put as big a smile on my face as the Jeep has done by simply putting this old timer back in the dirt where I belong.

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Old 03-17-2013, 11:12 PM   #4401
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Hi all
Might be a strange Q, But do you think the RHD (Australia) version would have this problem too. I have a 2012 4 door JK, - build is around June 2012>. Only has 7000klms (abt 4300 miles)
Thanks
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Old 03-17-2013, 11:15 PM   #4402
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It is a waste of time since I am already aware of Toyota's mythical quality. I have seen through the hype and false perception. The fact that Toyota has quality problems like ANY other automaker isn't true because I said it. It's a known fact. Again, you don't have to admit that or accept it. At least the Pentastar design glitch didn't result in deaths or a refusal by Chrysler that it doesn't exist.

Maybe this will help you understand my point: Google

Toyota Recall: How A Hiccup Became A Big Headache





Image via Wikipedia


Things have been getting better for Toyota Motor after a few really bad years. So the last thing the Japanese carmaker needed was another headline-grabbing recall. On Wednesday, the company said it was recalling almost 682,000 Camry, Venza and Tacoma models to fix issues with brake lights and airbags.
While the number of affected vehicles is large, the problems don’t appear to be anything like the claims of unintended acceleration that dogged Toyota through much of 2009 and 2010.
More Proof That Toyota Faces A Tough Climb Back Micheline Maynard Contributor
Has Toyota's Image Recovered From The Brand's Recall Crisis? Anne Marie Kelly Contributor
Leadfoot, Not Electronics, To Blame For Most Runaway Toyotas, Government Finds Joann Muller Forbes Staff
In certain 2009 Camry and 2009 to 2011 Venza cars, silicon grease may have gotten into the stop-lamp switch at the factory, which Toyota said could cause increased electrical resistance. That in turn could trigger warning lights on the dashboard, keep the engine from starting or prevent the transmission from being shifted out of park. In some cases the stop lights may stop working.
Toyota is also recalling certain 2005 to early 2009 Tacoma pickups to replace the steering wheel spiral cable assembly. In some cases, the cable can rub against its retainer, possibly disabling the airbag.
Toyota is gathering the necessary replacement parts to fix the vehicles and will notify Camry and Venza owners when they should make a service appointment.
Toyota has replaced management and invested more in quality testing since the 2009-2010 unintended acceleration crisis that resulted in the recall of millions of vehicles after several severe accidents, some including fatalities. The suspicion was that software glitches were to blame, but both Toyota and the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration concluded that electronics were not at fault. They blamed thick floor mats, sticky accelerator pedals and, in some cases, driver error. The National Academy of Sciences National Research Council later agreed with NHTSA’s decision to close the investigation.
But Toyota hasn’t been able to fully shake the issue. Earlier this month, CNN aired a story suggesting that an internal memo showed engineers had concerns about unintended acceleration during pre-production testing.
Toyota angrily responded, “In the face of overwhelming scientific evidence to the contrary, CNN has irresponsibly aired a grossly inaccurate segment on Anderson Cooper 360 that attempts to resurrect the discredited, scientifically unproven allegation that there is a hidden defect in Toyota’s electronic throttle control system that can cause unintended acceleration.”
As Forbes contributor Anne Marie Kelly wrote recently, consumer research shows that Toyota still has a long way to go before recovering its quality image.
This latest recall surely won’t help.
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Old 03-17-2013, 11:30 PM   #4403
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The American auto manufacturers will stay in business and conduct business as they always have as long as the federal govt has the stomach to bail them out. We missed a wonderful opportunity to fix what was ailing them this last time through. But no, nobody had the stomach to fix what caused their problems and instead opted to erase their debt on the backs of the stockholders and tax payers. Nothing has changed at the big three except that their debt is gone. They still lose money on every vehicle they sell when you consider the balance sheet and not the p&l. The problems will all be back quite soon. You cannot build cars paying those labor and benefit costs and turn a profit, period.

Our government had two options, erase the debt with tax dollars and eliminate all stockholder equity or reorganize under federal bankruptcy laws and get away from the horrible contracts/agreements that caused the problem in the first place while never missing a day of production. You know what they chose.

You know what the difference is between a Big Three car and an import built in the USA or overseas? A power window quits on an import after one year and the customer raises hell with the service department. A power window quits on a Big Three car after a year and the owner drives in the service department to gloat that three windows still work! It's all about expectations.

If they lose money on every vehicle they sell where are all the big profits they have been reporting coming from? I really don't think you know what your talking about, it seems you have just picked up on the talking points that have been put out there by some. So you understand auto companies need large amounts of money to operate to pay the suppliers buy materials and so on and so forth. If they would have gone through bankruptcy as you suggest they would have no money to operate on. They needed a large infusion of cash to keep operating. Its funny because almost all the money has been paid back in fact Chrysler owes them nothing now. You talk about the wages and benefits the new hires are something like 15 dollars and hour with no benefits to start. So what do you think they should be working for free?? And no I don't work for any auto companies and I really don't agree with alot of what the UAW has done over the years, but I understand that you won't have much of economy if everyone is working for 8 dollars an hour as some would like to see.
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Old 03-17-2013, 11:35 PM   #4404
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I am new to this forum but have been reading for a while as I had a 2012 Grand Cherokee with what I thought was the pentastar tick. I had 2 different dealers tell me it was the injectors and I decided I didn't want a vehicle with injectors that were that loud so I drove out of service to the front of the building and traded it for a hemi model. Problem resolved. So anyhow I am going to be replacing a second vehicle later on this year or early next and I think I might go with a wrangler. Does it seem like the issue of the loud injectors has been resolved?
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Old 03-17-2013, 11:38 PM   #4405
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Yes, it appears the "loud injector" issue, LOL, has been resolved with the AC head.
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Old 03-18-2013, 12:40 AM   #4406
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It is a waste of time since I am already aware of Toyota's mythical quality. I have seen through the hype and false perception. The fact that Toyota has quality problems like ANY other automaker isn't true because I said it. It's a known fact. Again, you don't have to admit that or accept it. At least the Pentastar design glitch didn't result in deaths or a refusal by Chrysler that it doesn't exist.

Maybe this will help you understand my point: Google

Toyota Recall: How A Hiccup Became A Big Headache





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Things have been getting better for Toyota Motor after a few really bad years. So the last thing the Japanese carmaker needed was another headline-grabbing recall. On Wednesday, the company said it was recalling almost 682,000 Camry, Venza and Tacoma models to fix issues with brake lights and airbags.
While the number of affected vehicles is large, the problems don’t appear to be anything like the claims of unintended acceleration that dogged Toyota through much of 2009 and 2010.
More Proof That Toyota Faces A Tough Climb Back Micheline Maynard Contributor
Has Toyota's Image Recovered From The Brand's Recall Crisis? Anne Marie Kelly Contributor
Leadfoot, Not Electronics, To Blame For Most Runaway Toyotas, Government Finds Joann Muller Forbes Staff
In certain 2009 Camry and 2009 to 2011 Venza cars, silicon grease may have gotten into the stop-lamp switch at the factory, which Toyota said could cause increased electrical resistance. That in turn could trigger warning lights on the dashboard, keep the engine from starting or prevent the transmission from being shifted out of park. In some cases the stop lights may stop working.
Toyota is also recalling certain 2005 to early 2009 Tacoma pickups to replace the steering wheel spiral cable assembly. In some cases, the cable can rub against its retainer, possibly disabling the airbag.
Toyota is gathering the necessary replacement parts to fix the vehicles and will notify Camry and Venza owners when they should make a service appointment.
Toyota has replaced management and invested more in quality testing since the 2009-2010 unintended acceleration crisis that resulted in the recall of millions of vehicles after several severe accidents, some including fatalities. The suspicion was that software glitches were to blame, but both Toyota and the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration concluded that electronics were not at fault. They blamed thick floor mats, sticky accelerator pedals and, in some cases, driver error. The National Academy of Sciences National Research Council later agreed with NHTSA’s decision to close the investigation.
But Toyota hasn’t been able to fully shake the issue. Earlier this month, CNN aired a story suggesting that an internal memo showed engineers had concerns about unintended acceleration during pre-production testing.
Toyota angrily responded, “In the face of overwhelming scientific evidence to the contrary, CNN has irresponsibly aired a grossly inaccurate segment on Anderson Cooper 360 that attempts to resurrect the discredited, scientifically unproven allegation that there is a hidden defect in Toyota’s electronic throttle control system that can cause unintended acceleration.”
As Forbes contributor Anne Marie Kelly wrote recently, consumer research shows that Toyota still has a long way to go before recovering its quality image.
This latest recall surely won’t help.
An awful lot of mental gymnastics to defend domestic auto manufactures and criticizing foreign isn't it? And what is your problem with Toyota is it that I owned a couple of Lexus and a toyo here in this debate? As I said I have no brand loyalty but do read consumer reports. BTW I did not write the CR evaluations . In other words don't hate the messenger.

So you do not buy the investigation by the NHTSB or NASA that the acceleration was operator error. Funny or is it a toyo floor mat that was the problem like you said before. Which is ridiculous if the mats are installed correctly.

You spent a good deal of time researching toyo recalls while I'm happy to see you doing that now how about taking a look at the recalls from the domestic manufactures and share what you find.

In reading the recalls I notice toyo contacting the consumers. Wonder why Chrysler did not contact us regarding the head failure?

This sounds like you have a horse in this race?
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Old 03-18-2013, 05:01 AM   #4407
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Yes, it appears the "loud injector" issue, LOL, has been resolved with the AC head.
The injectors are STILL loud.
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Old 03-18-2013, 06:38 AM   #4408
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All car makers have their issues... Let's just worry about the heads for Chrysler....

Are AC heads still tick free? That is all care about.
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Old 03-18-2013, 06:50 AM   #4409
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Erin, I'm not sure what the mileage was when your problems started but I would think your Jeep would still qualify for the Lemon Law if your problems started before your vehicle reached the 15,000 mile limit. If they tried to fix it while it was still covered by the Lemon Law and the fix did not work then the current mileage should be irrelevant. I would talk to your attorney or find an attorney who specializes in Lemon Law.

Good luck with your problem. I hope you are able to get it resolved.
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Old 03-18-2013, 07:55 AM   #4410
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Quote:
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The injectors are STILL loud.
I believe rb544 was referring to the tick passed off as loud injectors. The AC head is supposed to have fixed this.

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All car makers have their issues... Let's just worry about the heads for Chrysler..........
Thank you! That's my point exactly! Every automaker worldwide has issues. Some folks think its confined only to the Big 3.

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