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Old 06-26-2012, 06:22 AM   #1321
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Originally Posted by rtguy View Post
i/m sure they had these new heads in production a while back. they were using them to supply dealers doing repairs but continued to sell motors with defective heads. I'm sure the replaced heads are all good to go. they must have a sgood supply of them now and that is why they are finally talking about the issue....they would still be silent if they were just beginning to fix these.

good to know they are admitting the problem.

Tomster: you bailed a week too early brother!!!
Oh, well, maybe I will own a Jeep again someday. It really wasn't a practical daily driver, which I should have know going in. I owned one for 11 years but didn't use it as my daily driver. That one was sure fun to play with on the trails, though.

I'm really happy for you guys who have hung in there and kept your Jeeps. This must be a HUGE relief to you guys.

Tomster

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Old 06-26-2012, 11:45 AM   #1322
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Update for y'all:
1. Noticed Ticking on driver side at about 5000 miles. Dealer changed oil, no effect. 2. 9700 miles took to dealer with ticking complaint. "Could not duplicate" (I was told this is "Normal injector noise")
3. At 10500 miles the check engine light comes on. Dealer notes p304 failure in exhaust valve on Cyl#4 and replaced head.

Apparently dealer does not take this seriously until you blow a code. Also, I did not note any loss of power or gas mileage. I was still getting 20.5 average mixed driving/ half freeway 70-75 mph.
PS- Tick is gone. I had words with the 'know-it-all' 30 year old service desk guy that still stands by his previous "normal noise" statement. Now I can continue to add mod to my Jeep. I really love to drive this thing - I get lots of looks -good for my ego.

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Old 06-26-2012, 03:05 PM   #1323
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I'm getting rid of my jeep because of it.
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:23 PM   #1324
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While this is at least "news" from Chrysler, my first question would be:
Does this mean every jeep sold before the "new" heads has defective heads that will only be replaced if it fails before the warranty??? Or will there be a recall for every vehicle with the "problem" heads? The article seems to imply that every jeep before the fixed heads has a "problem". Warranty helps, but 100K miles is not even the half way point for service life these days for most folks. I finally gave away my last vehicle at 260K. If they don't handle it right, it is still going to be a potentially big long term resale value issue for the '12 model. Any educated potential buyer will ask "Have the heads been replaced?" The Edmond's review type publications would also mark it if it gets to be a chronic problem. A total recall is needed to make this go away and that would cost them a mint. But at least Chrysler has admitted the defect. That's a start.
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:06 AM   #1325
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I still don't understand the big freak out here. If it ticks, it's covered! Covered to 100K! Just bring it in before 100K and say you hear the tick. Get it documented. Now, knowing this is a well known issue, you will have no problem getting this fixed even if it hits at 130K or 150K. Seriously, it's not a safety issue either, which is good. Go drive your Jeep and enjoy it, and know that u don't need to worry about this issue ONE BIT cause it will be a FREE FIX. Then, you can either trade it in down the road if it bothers u that much, or maybe even save in the meantime for a Hemi swap later . This seriously seems like a very simple issue to deal with for us owners. It's more an issue for Chrysler/Jeep than us!
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:29 AM   #1326
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If jeep wants to put their money where there mouth is give us lifetime on these heads for early 2012 builds...in writing of course.

I had a Subaru forester which blew head gaskets often. It was a widely known problem.(interestingly enough this thing always ticked some but got worse after they "fixed" the blown head gasket the first time. They told me it was normal.)

Anyway they did first replacement gasket at 56,000 miles and was covered under warranty. My next Gasket blew at 96,000 and was not covered. Two head gaskets should not blow before 100,000... Heck not even one. Subaru did nothing for me on the second gasket ( despite the service dept saying my engine got a special longer warranty after the first one.)

Long story short I don't trust most manufacturers to stand behind their stuff when it isn't required!

I hope I'm wrong here.

It didn't end all bad. I sold the forester before the next gasket could blow and so I got my current jeep!
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:30 AM   #1327
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I still don't understand the big freak out here. If it ticks, it's covered! Covered to 100K! Just bring it in before 100K and say you hear the tick. Get it documented. Now, knowing this is a well known issue, you will have no problem getting this fixed even if it hits at 130K or 150K. Seriously, it's not a safety issue either, which is good. Go drive your Jeep and enjoy it, and know that u don't need to worry about this issue ONE BIT cause it will be a FREE FIX. Then, you can either trade it in down the road if it bothers u that much, or maybe even save in the meantime for a Hemi swap later . This seriously seems like a very simple issue to deal with for us owners. It's more an issue for Chrysler/Jeep than us!
X2. I don't sit around with a stethoscope listening for every little tick or tock my engine makes. Just go out and enjoy the damned thing.
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:34 AM   #1328
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Originally Posted by Con Artist

X2. I don't sit around with a stethoscope listening for every little tick or tock my engine makes. Just go out and enjoy the damned thing.
That's the way to go. Life's too short not to enjoy one of our favorite things, Jeepin' around!
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:44 AM   #1329
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That's the way to go. Life's too short not to enjoy one of our favorite things, Jeepin' around!
Am I gonna be happy if I wind up with a ticking head and have to deal with that garbage? Of course not. Am I gonna be happy that my vehicle is sidetracked for weeks while I drive around in what'll probably be some really crappy rental car? Of course not. Regardless, it isn't gonna stop me from enjoying my Jeep until it happens. I'm not gonna sit around and dread something happening if I drive it.

Secondly, I understand the whole concern with resale and all that, and it's justifiable, but how many of you are going to sell the vehicle outright? I dunno about most of you but I trade in because I don't want the hassle of worrying about something going wrong five days after someone buys my vehicle, and then have him/her hunting me down with a shotgun, or suing my ass for not disclosing something (even if there really wasn't an issue at the time of sale...).

If I wind up with engine issues, I will undoubtedly trade my Jeep in on a newer one, simple as that.
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:47 AM   #1330
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Originally Posted by Con Artist

Am I gonna be happy if I wind up with a ticking head and have to deal with that garbage? Of course not. Am I gonna be happy that my vehicle is sidetracked for weeks while I drive around in what'll probably be some really crappy rental car? Of course not. Regardless, it isn't gonna stop me from enjoying my Jeep until it happens. I'm not gonna sit around and dread something happening if I drive it.

Secondly, I understand the whole concern with resale and all that, and it's justifiable, but how many of you are going to sell the vehicle outright? I dunno about most of you but I trade in because I don't want the hassle of worrying about something going wrong five days after someone buys my vehicle, and then have him/her hunting me down with a shotgun, or suing my ass for not disclosing something (even if there really wasn't an issue at the time of sale...).

If I wind up with engine issues, I will undoubtedly trade my Jeep in on a newer one, simple as that.
Agreed! And I'll add, if u do get stuck with a crappy rental car while your Jeep is fixed, get the insurance in it and go crazy. Dukes of Hazzard that car!! Think about it. You can be worry free for a week or two about theft, dents, scratches from car doors, carriages at the mall, etc! Lol
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:59 AM   #1331
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Agreed! And I'll add, if u do get stuck with a crappy rental car while your Jeep is fixed, get the insurance in it and go crazy. Dukes of Hazzard that car!! Think about it. You can be worry free for a week or two about theft, dents, scratches from car doors, carriages at the mall, etc! Lol
Most of the dealers around here just go through Enterprise, and they're absolute toolbags to deal with. They were adding "options" on to my wife's account when the insurance company paid for her rental after someone hit her last December; bs fees like that "insurance" they offer. We had to call them and then they tried to argue with her over it. They did wind up reimbursing her for the scam they tried to pull. Then, about two months later they contacted us again asking when we were going to return the rental car we'd gotten from them.
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Old 06-28-2012, 07:25 AM   #1332
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tick tock tick tock

I just got mine back from the dealer, new drivers side cylnder head, tick is gone, but best part of all is I can hear the passenger side ticking, not as bad as the driver side, but its there..... I think I can claim lemon law if I take it back to dealer a third time...
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Old 06-28-2012, 11:28 AM   #1333
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Most of the dealers around here just go through Enterprise, and they're absolute toolbags to deal with. They were adding "options" on to my wife's account when the insurance company paid for her rental after someone hit her last December; bs fees like that "insurance" they offer. We had to call them and then they tried to argue with her over it. They did wind up reimbursing her for the scam they tried to pull. Then, about two months later they contacted us again asking when we were going to return the rental car we'd gotten from them.
X2. Enterprise pulled the same thing with me in a similiar situation. My Ins agent said that I was already covered, and that I should cancel their added policy. Enterprise was cool about removing the fees.
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Old 06-28-2012, 11:35 AM   #1334
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Yes, it costs money but i always get the insurance. your insurance/CC probably covers you, but it's a huge hassle if anything happens. you dont have to worry about someone dinging it with the insurance.

and you have to be careful, although you may be covered for the damage, you may not be covered for vehicle loss costs. every day the rental is being repaired, you get the bill.
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:44 PM   #1335
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X2. Enterprise pulled the same thing with me in a similiar situation. My Ins agent said that I was already covered, and that I should cancel their added policy. Enterprise was cool about removing the fees.
About a month after the rental, my wife noticed some strange charge on the bill for something like $27 and that's how she found out she was scammed into her insurance. She told the "agent" she NEVER opts for that insurance and specifically told them our insurance covers rentals. They gave her a hard time about it but did remove their falsified fees.

If I had it my way, I wouldn't do business with them at all, whether it's personally or through the use of one of their vehicles in the case of a vehicle warranty issue.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:37 PM   #1336
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THAT is an immensely important question! I bailed out and sold my less than three month old Jeep out of fear that the replacement heads would be no better than the originals.

Tomster
From what I understand (from mostly searching the internet) there was a machining error in a certain lot of heads, in the valve (seat/guide?) area on Cyl #4 on one side only. I had a misfire that threw p0304 code at 10,500 miles. All I know is was there was a tick on one cylinder only on the driver side louder than the other normal valve noise. The Youtube examples here on this thread have it nailed perfectly.
After the CEL came on the service people retrieved the code, did a compression test and immediately replaced the head. I dropped my Jeep off at 8:00AM Monday, and it was done and ready to go by noon. It took them a little longer than it takes for my oil change and 5 tire rotation. With that quick of service for a head replacement, it tells me that:
1. There is already a Service Memo out from Chrysler regarding this issue. They didn't have to troubleshoot this problem.
2. Chrysler is well aware of this problem and has already supplied dealers with replacement heads. Try going to the service desk and asking for a head on any other motor, and see if it is in stock.
3. There has been a management decision made not to issue a recall, as by now they have identified exactly which VINs have the defective head installed. They are trying to keep this as quiet as possible.

My advice, if your engine sounds like the YouTube examples, go to dealer and have them check for tick. Get "tick" documented, just in case.
I am happy with my dealer that he fixed it so quickly (once the Check Engine Light came on...). No more tick. This defect was corrected so quickly and smoothly for me, it was as if this was a minor defect (but I know better).

Having been in management for many years now I know how sometimes quality issues pop up, and how important good customer service is. Major recalls can put a car company under, so I can understand Chrysler's handling of this issue. Good "Fire Control" Chrysler! Keep selling them Jeeps!

I still love my Jeep.
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Old 06-28-2012, 02:06 PM   #1337
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Well, as you folks know, at 1300-mi my engine died twice (towed in both times) and a died a 3rd time during dealer test-drive after repair two! (11000 on her now)

They claimed I was burning out coil-packs due to a short

Was goin to sell it due to a complete lack of confidence in the vehicle! But heck, I have the Life Time Warranty, so Chrysler has to pay for the repair/labor and furnish me a Loaner On the other-hand I may go 300K miles with no further problems

I am always getting compliments on my Jeep, so guess I am going to keep her
--------------------------------

Well today she started running like S^#t, rough as hell and missing I look down and the "CEL" was blinking like a Christmas Tree After about 3-min it all went away

Watch & wait
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Old 06-28-2012, 03:07 PM   #1338
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--------------------------------

Well today she started running like S^#t, rough as hell and missing I look down and the "CEL" was blinking like a Christmas Tree After about 3-min it all went away

Watch & wait
Sorry to hear that.....

Is this your 3rd tow? (4th if you count the time it died with the dealer).

That is pretty close to the L word....and I'm not talking about girl on girl action.....
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Old 06-28-2012, 03:44 PM   #1339
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The build date for the Cosmos JKUR I traded off was 8-19-12.

Do you mean 8-19-2011? We aren't to 8-19-2012 yet...
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:16 PM   #1340
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Wow. How far have Jeeps and Jeep owners come? We now expect our engines not to tick? Are you kidding me? This is my 5th Jeep in 24 years (2 CJ5's, 1 YJ, 1 TJ and this KJ) and I can't believe my only real concern here is whether my engine will start ticking.

I think we've all gotten a little soft and spoiled (me included). Of course, I also never paid 30 grand for any of my other Jeeps!
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:20 PM   #1341
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Wow. How far have Jeeps and Jeep owners come? We now expect our engines not to tick? Are you kidding me? This is my 5th Jeep in 24 years (2 CJ5's, 1 YJ, 1 TJ and this KJ) and I can't believe my only real concern here is whether my engine will start ticking.

I think we've all gotten a little soft and spoiled (me included). Of course, I also never paid 30 grand for any of my other Jeeps!
There is a large difference between normal ticking of an engine and a serious issue that is causing CELs to glow and heads to be replaced.
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:42 PM   #1342
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You're right. Because back then we could care less if the CEL came on. And there was no warranty work. We did all the work our selves. It was expected. The only people that bought Jeeps were people that were probably going to be swapping axles and gears while they were doing they're first oil change...in their driveway.

Like I said..we've come a long way, baby.
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:46 PM   #1343
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You're right. Because back then we could care less if the CEL came on. And there was no warranty work. We did all the work our selves. It was expected. The only people that bought Jeeps were people that were probably going to be swapping axles and gears while they were doing they're first oil change...in their driveway.

Like I said..we've come a long way, baby.
I'm sure a lot of people still do their own work. Go purchase a $40k Jeep and let us know how happy you would have to be with replacing an engine at 1k miles. I doubt you'll want to do it out of pocket.
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:51 PM   #1344
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Who's has to deal with this ticking noise out of pocket?
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Old 06-28-2012, 04:54 PM   #1345
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Who's has to deal with this ticking noise out of pocket?
You were mentioning about no warranties before and seemed to imply we were babies for caring about the ticking issues Sorry if I misread it, but that was the vibe I grabbed from you.
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Old 06-28-2012, 05:02 PM   #1346
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Yeah, that's not the intent at all. It's more that now we expect the same out of our Jeeps build quality wise as we do any of our other cars. Mostly, because we're paying the same or in many cases more. Back then, we knew we were going to get beat to death with the ride, rained on and pissed on with water leaks, fires from electrical issues, they were going to leak oil...and we still lined up to buy them.
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Old 06-28-2012, 06:47 PM   #1347
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From what I understand (from mostly searching the internet) there was a machining error in a certain lot of heads, in the valve (seat/guide?) area on Cyl #4 on one side only. I had a misfire that threw p0304 code at 10,500 miles. All I know is was there was a tick on one cylinder only on the driver side louder than the other normal valve noise. The Youtube examples here on this thread have it nailed perfectly.
After the CEL came on the service people retrieved the code, did a compression test and immediately replaced the head. I dropped my Jeep off at 8:00AM Monday, and it was done and ready to go by noon. It took them a little longer than it takes for my oil change and 5 tire rotation. With that quick of service for a head replacement, it tells me that:
1. There is already a Service Memo out from Chrysler regarding this issue. They didn't have to troubleshoot this problem.
2. Chrysler is well aware of this problem and has already supplied dealers with replacement heads. Try going to the service desk and asking for a head on any other motor, and see if it is in stock.
3. There has been a management decision made not to issue a recall, as by now they have identified exactly which VINs have the defective head installed. They are trying to keep this as quiet as possible.

My advice, if your engine sounds like the YouTube examples, go to dealer and have them check for tick. Get "tick" documented, just in case.
I am happy with my dealer that he fixed it so quickly (once the Check Engine Light came on...). No more tick. This defect was corrected so quickly and smoothly for me, it was as if this was a minor defect (but I know better).

Having been in management for many years now I know how sometimes quality issues pop up, and how important good customer service is. Major recalls can put a car company under, so I can understand Chrysler's handling of this issue. Good "Fire Control" Chrysler! Keep selling them Jeeps!

I still love my Jeep.
Do you think they fixed the problem going forward? We blew through the January build dates.
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Old 06-28-2012, 10:00 PM   #1348
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How do you find the build date?
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Old 06-28-2012, 10:30 PM   #1349
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I dropped my Jeep off at 8:00AM Monday, and it was done and ready to go by noon.
That's almost scary. Chrysler allows 8 hours warranty for a head replacement...
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Old 06-28-2012, 10:37 PM   #1350
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Got my heep back today after a drivers side head replacement. Funny side story, cashier was like, $21 please. I was like, "uh no. This was all warranty." She called (I think) the service manager and all the sudden there was no problem/charge.

Engine does sound better. Not sure I've gotten the "small power increase" that others have seen, but my misfires were bad enough I could sometimes feel them, so now its smooth. Much like when it was brand new.

I tried to ask the service writer whether they repaired the problem in the replacement heads, and all he offered was they were on restriction for almost 3 months, so he assumes that's because they were figuring it out, so I should be fine. Time will tell of course.

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Head Unit Jacked!!! TJChris27 TJ General Discussion Forum 15 03-25-2011 03:20 PM


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