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Old 07-07-2012, 10:13 AM   #1411
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Originally Posted by Braveheart12JK View Post
It's great to keep up with what's happening with this situation, but there still is NO reason to worry or stress in the least. Drive em, enjoy em and relax. They are WARRANTIED to 100K!!! I seriously do not understand the big "freak out" with some people.....not all, but some. It's a faulty head design on SOME. They will be fixed as necessary and that's it's. Its supposed to be a Jeep thing to relax and drive.....not stress and worry

Btw: I have the dreaded tick, but I'm not worried on the least. Just driving and enjoying knowing that it is going to be fixed for FREE should it get bad or throw a code.
I opinions vary. I would not want a new vehicle I paid over $30,000 for with a "V" type engine only having one head replaced, especially if it has logged some miles. If the problem occurs early that's fine, if it logs some miles that engine will never be right with one head swapped out. Ask any good engine builder or mechanic what he thinks of swapping one head on an engine that has accumulated several thousand miles on it. JMO

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Old 07-07-2012, 10:22 AM   #1412
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Originally Posted by Braveheart12JK View Post
It's great to keep up with what's happening with this situation, but there still is NO reason to worry or stress in the least. Drive em, enjoy em and relax. They are WARRANTIED to 100K!!! I seriously do not understand the big "freak out" with some people.....not all, but some. It's a faulty head design on SOME. They will be fixed as necessary and that's it's. Its supposed to be a Jeep thing to relax and drive.....not stress and worry

Btw: I have the dreaded tick, but I'm not worried on the least. Just driving and enjoying knowing that it is going to be fixed for FREE should it get bad or throw a code.
I'm not worried about it. Yeah, it'll be an inconvenience, but it will be covered.

- Should I worry that I feel like the Pentastar is a seriously weak engine, despite everyone else claiming 0-60 times in the low 7s in JKUs? My JKU wouldn't see the light of a 0-60 in 7 seconds...more like high 8s or low 9s.

- Should I worry that when I mash my foot down without downshifting, the vehicle very slowly, if at all accelerates? How'about when I downshift into 5th and it STILL goes "nowhere?"

- Should I worry about how everyone says how great the passing power is when I'd be hard-pressed to pass a Prius?

The Pentastar is a serious dog of a motor in a JKU. Maybe things are different with the JK, but in the JKU, they're absolute pigs. It's without a doubt one of the slowest vehicles I've EVER driven. EVER.

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Old 07-07-2012, 10:39 AM   #1413
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I'm not worried about it. Yeah, it'll be an inconvenience, but it will be covered.

- Should I worry that I feel like the Pentastar is a seriously weak engine, despite everyone else claiming 0-60 times in the low 7s in JKUs? My JKU wouldn't see the light of a 0-60 in 7 seconds...more like high 8s or low 9s.

- Should I worry that when I mash my foot down without downshifting, the vehicle very slowly, if at all accelerates? How'about when I downshift into 5th and it STILL goes "nowhere?"

- Should I worry about how everyone says how great the passing power is when I'd be hard-pressed to pass a Prius?

The Pentastar is a serious dog of a motor in a JKU. Maybe things are different with the JK, but in the JKU, they're absolute pigs. It's without a doubt one of the slowest vehicles I've EVER driven. EVER.
Man, Dan, I don't know what the weight difference is between the JK and the JKU, but that Pentastar was a VERY peppy engine in my JK. I traded-in my Jeep because I wasn't really happy with it as a daily driver and the cylinder head thing just kind of helped me decide to get rid of it. But, I thought the acceleration was great with that 3.6 L Pentastar engine and the six speed tranny. There must be something wrong with you engine.

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Old 07-07-2012, 10:43 AM   #1414
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I'm not worried about it. Yeah, it'll be an inconvenience, but it will be covered.

- Should I worry that I feel like the Pentastar is a seriously weak engine, despite everyone else claiming 0-60 times in the low 7s in JKUs? My JKU wouldn't see the light of a 0-60 in 7 seconds...more like high 8s or low 9s.

- Should I worry that when I mash my foot down without downshifting, the vehicle very slowly, if at all accelerates? How'about when I downshift into 5th and it STILL goes "nowhere?"

- Should I worry about how everyone says how great the passing power is when I'd be hard-pressed to pass a Prius?

The Pentastar is a serious dog of a motor in a JKU. Maybe things are different with the JK, but in the JKU, they're absolute pigs. It's without a doubt one of the slowest vehicles I've EVER driven. EVER.
I totally agree
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Old 07-07-2012, 10:48 AM   #1415
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Mine only ticks when its first started. But as for the power...Runs like a champ, and Ive been driving it like I stold it, put over 2k miles in 2 weeks.
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Old 07-07-2012, 10:54 AM   #1416
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Originally Posted by Braveheart12JK View Post
It's great to keep up with what's happening with this situation, but there still is NO reason to worry or stress in the least. Drive em, enjoy em and relax. They are WARRANTIED to 100K!!! I seriously do not understand the big "freak out" with some people.....not all, but some. It's a faulty head design on SOME. They will be fixed as necessary and that's it's. Its supposed to be a Jeep thing to relax and drive.....not stress and worry

Btw: I have the dreaded tick, but I'm not worried on the least. Just driving and enjoying knowing that it is going to be fixed for FREE should it get bad or throw a code.
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Old 07-07-2012, 02:36 PM   #1417
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- Should I worry that I feel like the Pentastar is a seriously weak engine, despite everyone else claiming 0-60 times in the low 7s in JKUs? My JKU wouldn't see the light of a 0-60 in 7 seconds...more like high 8s or low 9s.

- Should I worry that when I mash my foot down without downshifting, the vehicle very slowly, if at all accelerates? How'about when I downshift into 5th and it STILL goes "nowhere?"

- Should I worry about how everyone says how great the passing power is when I'd be hard-pressed to pass a Prius?

The Pentastar is a serious dog of a motor in a JKU. Maybe things are different with the JK, but in the JKU, they're absolute pigs. It's without a doubt one of the slowest vehicles I've EVER driven. EVER.
Something must really be wrong with yours because mine is a beast. I stomp the pedal and this thing disappears into the night. I don't worry AT ALL pulling out into traffic.
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Old 07-07-2012, 02:37 PM   #1418
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Originally Posted by Con Artist

I'm not worried about it. Yeah, it'll be an inconvenience, but it will be covered.

- Should I worry that I feel like the Pentastar is a seriously weak engine, despite everyone else claiming 0-60 times in the low 7s in JKUs? My JKU wouldn't see the light of a 0-60 in 7 seconds...more like high 8s or low 9s.

- Should I worry that when I mash my foot down without downshifting, the vehicle very slowly, if at all accelerates? How'about when I downshift into 5th and it STILL goes "nowhere?"

- Should I worry about how everyone says how great the passing power is when I'd be hard-pressed to pass a Prius?

The Pentastar is a serious dog of a motor in a JKU. Maybe things are different with the JK, but in the JKU, they're absolute pigs. It's without a doubt one of the slowest vehicles I've EVER driven. EVER.
Wow. Too much sarcasm here. Really? That's your opinion and unfortunate experience. The engine is amazingly powerful and accelerates better than any other year jeep. If you go join any other forum, both domestic or import you will be amazed at what you read! You cannot condemn an engine based on a percentage of them having an issue. You again having a bad experience does not constitute this engine being a dog. Move on!
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Old 07-07-2012, 05:13 PM   #1419
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Getting a new head

My 2012 Wrangler with 12,100 miles on it has always had a slight tick. It was built in 8/11 Right after 12,000 miles, the check engine light came on and it started running really rough. I took it to the dealer and they said these engines have had head problems but it is rare on a Wrangler - but that they had seen tons of problems with mini-vans with the Pentastar and quite a few on the Grand Cherokee. There was a P0300 trouble code - random multiple misfires. They performed a software upgrade on the computer and that seemed to fix it. I talked to the mechanic and asked if they had done a compression check, he said no, Chrysler would not cover that unless they did the software upgrade first. Well, I took it out for a drive and about 20 miles later the check engine light came back on and it began running really rough again. I took it back and they ran more tests and found that the compression in cylinder #2 was way too high and needed a new head. This seems to be different than the #4 cylinder problem I have read about but it is the same head on the drivers side. The dealer has had it about a week and the head came in yesterday so they are going to fix it next week. When I called in to check on it they said that they have another Wrangler that also needs a new head that had been there before me and was still waiting on the head - and so I was lucky to get a new head so fast. Hmmm, I wonder why they did not inform me they had another Wrangler already there. I am beginning to wonder of their is a cover-up going on. I also wonder about the longevity of the engine. In my opinon, once they have opened up the engine and replaced the head, it is no longer as good as a new factory engine that has not been worked on by a dealer mechanic. I hope I can get them to extend the warranty past the 5/100,000 because I'm not sure I trust that they can restore the engine to what it would have been if it had not had this problem.
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Old 07-08-2012, 03:55 AM   #1420
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I totally agree
How can anyone not agree [/i]unless[/i] his/her vehicle was previously EXTREMELY slow?

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Something must really be wrong with yours because mine is a beast. I stomp the pedal and this thing disappears into the night. I don't worry AT ALL pulling out into traffic.
"Disappears into the night?" It's a 285hp engine powering a 4300lb+ vehicle. I really don't think "disappears into the night" would be an accurate description unless you're coming from a 3 cylinder Geo Metro.

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Wow. Too much sarcasm here. Really? That's your opinion and unfortunate experience. The engine is amazingly powerful and accelerates better than any other year jeep. If you go join any other forum, both domestic or import you will be amazed at what you read! You cannot condemn an engine based on a percentage of them having an issue. You again having a bad experience does not constitute this engine being a dog. Move on!
"Amazingly powerful." Umm, no. "Amazingly powerful" is the only sarcasm I'm seeing here. Apparently it's not only my opinion if you scan the posts above in reference to my post. There's no sarcasm. That's the way it is.

There's no problem with the engine, and I never said I'm having a "bad experience" with it, you did. Up to about 40-50 mph, there's power when I get into it, but it is far from "amazingly powerful." "OL Sarge" apparently agrees with me, so there must also be a problem with his Pentastar.

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Man, Dan, I don't know what the weight difference is between the JK and the JKU, but that Pentastar was a VERY peppy engine in my JK. I traded-in my Jeep because I wasn't really happy with it as a daily driver and the cylinder head thing just kind of helped me decide to get rid of it. But, I thought the acceleration was great with that 3.6 L Pentastar engine and the six speed tranny. There must be something wrong with you engine.

Tomster
Tom, the JK weighs around 3800 lbs, while the JKU weighs over 4300 lbs. 500 lbs is a big difference. I find it comical how people talk about how powerful and fast their JKUs are. I could walk faster than these things. My 3.6L Rubicon is not the first 3.6L-powered JKU I've ever driven. If there's something wrong with mine, there's most certainly something wrong with the other one I'd driven, too. The ONLY way I get any passing power out of this thing is by downshifting at least two gears, and even then, passing power is negligible.
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Old 07-08-2012, 08:33 AM   #1421
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From the people I spoke with driving the 3.6 Pentastar they said power wise it blows the 3.8, 3.7 and any of the other Chrysler V6 engines away off the line. I guess opinions vary, and what you compare it to matters too. The 2012 I test drove was head and shoulders above my 08 3.7 Liberty. I think once the ticking head is history the 3.6 is going to prove to be a very good engine. Although I wish they'd offer a diesel Wrangler.
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Old 07-08-2012, 09:13 AM   #1422
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From the people I spoke with driving the 3.6 Pentastar they said power wise it blows the 3.8, 3.7 and any of the other Chrysler V6 engines away off the line. I guess opinions vary, and what you compare it to matters too. The 2012 I test drove was head and shoulders above my 08 3.7 Liberty. I think once the ticking head is history the 3.6 is going to prove to be a very good engine. Although I wish they'd offer a diesel Wrangler.
The Pentastar is quick by JK standards. I've driven the 3.8 and it was very slow. Compared to the 3.8, the 3.6 is quick, but it's still not quick. Maybe it's quicker than it feels, I dunno, but it still feels very slow to me.

Coming from behind the wheel of an STi with an engine that winds up quick and has closely-spaced gears, the Pentastar is expected to feel different, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to recognize power. Whether something is wrong remains to be seen but there aren't any ticks, tocks, rough idling, etc. to indicate any type of problem.
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Old 07-08-2012, 10:23 AM   #1423
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The Pentastar is quick by JK standards. I've driven the 3.8 and it was very slow. Compared to the 3.8, the 3.6 is quick, but it's still not quick. Maybe it's quicker than it feels, I dunno, but it still feels very slow to me.

Coming from behind the wheel of an STi with an engine that winds up quick and has closely-spaced gears, the Pentastar is expected to feel different, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to recognize power. Whether something is wrong remains to be seen but there aren't any ticks, tocks, rough idling, etc. to indicate any type of problem.

I hear ya, just to make it clear about what I'm comparing it to. I drive a 3.0 Aerostar, 4.9L E-150 with a 5 speed stick, and a 3.7 Liberty. To me it felt like a Dragster. LOL
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Old 07-08-2012, 10:51 AM   #1424
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Of course coming from a STI JKU feels slow! Now go drive a corvette and see what the STI feels like! The JK does under 7 sec 0-60, that is is pretty quick compared to almost all cars on the road. I dont know what a JKU feels like but the JK is quick in my mind. Did you not test drive before you bought. Also beleive it or not my JK sport seems to handle like a sports car to me...of course I am coming from a crew cab pick up...everything is relative.
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Old 07-08-2012, 11:58 AM   #1425
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wow, sounds like a bunch of negativity, the likes i haven't seen in quite awhile. yea, the jeep is not the fastest vehicle around and there have been some problems....i got my head replaced.....but i still love the jeep. i don't think i bought it for the speed. i bought it because i like jeeps.....wranglers, libertys, grand cherokees....pretty much all of them. Also, i needed something that could get me to work 24/7 no matter what the weather was like. i like them because i can take them WHERE i want WHEN i want. don't think i could do that with some of the "quicker" vehicles on the road. yea.....i too complain about the gas mileage it gets or it sometimes is a little slow off the line but i like knowing i can get there in all kinds of weather and conditions.
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Old 07-08-2012, 12:11 PM   #1426
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wow, sounds like a bunch of negativity, the likes i haven't seen in quite awhile. ....
Kinda like jannikt?


And, here's something constructive...

I've found that the perception of throttle responsiveness is very different when I have my foot fully on the pedal with my toe up high on the pedal, than when I am lazy-footin' it with the toe of my shoe low on the pedal. It actually makes a BIG difference, IMO.

But, i don't think ya' want a highly sensitive throttle in an off-road vehicle.
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Old 07-08-2012, 12:17 PM   #1427
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I have a 600hp Roush Mustang and it of course blows away the Rubi we just bought but I love the speed the Jeep has. We just got back from a baseball tournament and when I wanted to pass people it was extremely easy even passing several at one time and that was with a family of 4 and loaded cargo area. Maybe you all need to reset your computers and see if that changes anything.
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Old 07-08-2012, 12:18 PM   #1428
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yup, guess the thrill is gone for some.....i had a marriage like that once

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Old 07-08-2012, 12:24 PM   #1429
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The Wrangler is a one of a kind vehicle. It is a ton of fun to drive and it will go just about anywhere. The 3.6 had way more power than did that old 4.0 L I-6. The handling is better BY FAR on the 2012s than it was on my 2001. The interior is MUCH nicer on the 2012s.

For me, though, it just wasn't working out as a daily driver. That is NO FAULT of the Jeep. I would love to have one as a second vehicle like I used to before I made the mistake of selling my 2001 Sport.

I hope to have a Wrangler again someday.

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Old 07-08-2012, 12:47 PM   #1430
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The Wrangler is a one of a kind vehicle..........For me, though, it just wasn't working out as a daily driver.........I hope to have a Wrangler again someday.
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I feel your pain. i use mine as a daily too @ 110 miles a day. I can supplement it though with riding my motorcycles at more than 1/2 the cost when its favorable weather and not so danged hot. Hope you get back in one some day. They're a hoot thats for sure.

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Old 07-08-2012, 01:16 PM   #1431
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This thread has me a little paranoid. My jeep was made 10-11 and does seem to be pretty loud for a new engine in terms of ticking. It doesn't sound as bad as some of the other vehicles I've heard in the youtube videos earlier in the post.

What has me worried is I used to have a mustang and an xj. When one had problems I drove the other, now I get stuck with some dealer loaner lol.

As for the back and forth with "is it powerful or is it not". I believe it's a sufficient motor for the vehicle and has enough extra power to pass or tow when needed.
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:25 PM   #1432
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wow, sounds like a bunch of negativity, the likes i haven't seen in quite awhile. yea, the jeep is not the fastest vehicle around and there have been some problems....i got my head replaced.....but i still love the jeep. i don't think i bought it for the speed. i bought it because i like jeeps.....wranglers, libertys, grand cherokees....pretty much all of them. Also, i needed something that could get me to work 24/7 no matter what the weather was like. i like them because i can take them WHERE i want WHEN i want. don't think i could do that with some of the "quicker" vehicles on the road. yea.....i too complain about the gas mileage it gets or it sometimes is a little slow off the line but i like knowing i can get there in all kinds of weather and conditions.
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Of course coming from a STI JKU feels slow! Now go drive a corvette and see what the STI feels like! The JK does under 7 sec 0-60, that is is pretty quick compared to almost all cars on the road. I dont know what a JKU feels like but the JK is quick in my mind. Did you not test drive before you bought. Also beleive it or not my JK sport seems to handle like a sports car to me...of course I am coming from a crew cab pick up...everything is relative.
I have a Camaro putting out well over 400 hp. Take my word for it, I know what an STi feels like compared to a Corvette.

As for a JK running 0-60 in 7.0, maybe they do, but I can tell you straight up it ain't happening in a JKU.

Did I test drive before I bought? Of course! That being said, I didn't buy a Jeep to race, as I was well aware of how slow they are, or at least how slow the JKU is.

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I hear ya, just to make it clear about what I'm comparing it to. I drive a 3.0 Aerostar, 4.9L E-150 with a 5 speed stick, and a 3.7 Liberty. To me it felt like a Dragster. LOL
If you have a JK, it may feel like a dragster, but if you had a JKU, I'm convinced you'd feel differently.
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Kinda like jannikt?


And, here's something constructive...

I've found that the perception of throttle responsiveness is very different when I have my foot fully on the pedal with my toe up high on the pedal, than when I am lazy-footin' it with the toe of my shoe low on the pedal. It actually makes a BIG difference, IMO.

But, i don't think ya' want a highly sensitive throttle in an off-road vehicle.
When I mash my foot into the gas, pedal to the metal, there aren't any fireworks. Even if I'm on a level surface, I could mash my foot in 6th gear without downshifting from highway speeds and the acceleration is...nonexistent. If I downshift into 5th, I get a little bit more action, and still more if I downshift into 4th, but it's still not ample enough to try any passing on a "broken yellow" unless the old codger in the Buick ahead of me is traveling at 20 mph. I have actually found that I get more response out of a "sweet spot" about halfway down on the pedal than putting my foot to the floor.

That being said, There is plenty of power down low in the first 3 gears, but once the needle swings to around 45-50 mph, things just don't happen very quickly.
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:34 PM   #1433
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The exact problem has not been officially identified (afaik), but from what I gather reading these threads it seems to be one of the #2 cylinder valve guides getting sloppy.

What the heck would cause that on a bunch of new engines? It would be useful information, because then maybe we would know how likely it is to show up on other cylinders.
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Old 07-08-2012, 02:57 PM   #1434
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I read a link somewhere that had an old story about the Trenton engine plant and gave details about the manufacturing procedures. There are two production lines for heads, one for left side heads and the other for rights. Now this is totally speculation on my part but you could see how something could go wrong on one line and still be OK on the other line with the end result being a defect limited to only left side heads. It would imply a machining error or fixture setup error or maybe even an operator error (except the line was almost totally automated).

My 2012 Wrangler has been OK with only 5,000 miles but I still worry. I might trade it in for a new one after I know for sure new models are OK.
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Old 07-08-2012, 04:16 PM   #1435
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Kinda like jannikt?


And, here's something constructive...

I've found that the perception of throttle responsiveness is very different when I have my foot fully on the pedal with my toe up high on the pedal, than when I am lazy-footin' it with the toe of my shoe low on the pedal. It actually makes a BIG difference, IMO.

But, i don't think ya' want a highly sensitive throttle in an off-road vehicle.

Bill, that's very agreable. The oversprung pedal makes it feel like the Jeep is low on power. The normal amount of pressure to get the Jeep rolling is almost double that of a cable operated system. So if your used to exerting 2-3ft.lbs of force to get going then in the Jeep you will still be at idle. Most folks need time to adjust to the heavy pedal. I say don't be afraid to be a lead foot in the 2012, you will be pleasntly suprised at how quick it moves.
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Old 07-08-2012, 04:43 PM   #1436
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Originally Posted by Con Artist
If you have a JK, it may feel like a dragster, but if you had a JKU, I'm convinced you'd feel differently.

That being said, There is plenty of power down low in the first 3 gears, but once the needle swings to around 45-50 mph, things just don't happen very quickly.
I think the definition of "quick" everyone is using does not seem to match.

There seems to be plenty of power for my JKU to move in and around traffic in town. Is it a dog compared to sports cars- of course. Is it loads better than the 3.8? Of course. Is there enough power to pass a tractor trailer in a short stretch of highway- it depends, especially for a JKU.
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Old 07-08-2012, 04:55 PM   #1437
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I read a link somewhere that had an old story about the Trenton engine plant and gave details about the manufacturing procedures. There are two production lines for heads, one for left side heads and the other for rights. Now this is totally speculation on my part but you could see how something could go wrong on one line and still be OK on the other line with the end result being a defect limited to only left side heads. It would imply a machining error or fixture setup error or maybe even an operator error (except the line was almost totally automated).

My 2012 Wrangler has been OK with only 5,000 miles but I still worry. I might trade it in for a new one after I know for sure new models are OK.
It is happening with both sides but the driver side is more likey to have the problem. Now my question is, are there only 2 machines in the world that make these heads? If that is so then every pentastar at some point will have this ticking problem the way I see it.
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Old 07-08-2012, 05:25 PM   #1438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chim-chim7 View Post
Bill, that's very agreable. The oversprung pedal makes it feel like the Jeep is low on power. The normal amount of pressure to get the Jeep rolling is almost double that of a cable operated system. So if your used to exerting 2-3ft.lbs of force to get going then in the Jeep you will still be at idle. Most folks need time to adjust to the heavy pedal. I say don't be afraid to be a lead foot in the 2012, you will be pleasntly suprised at how quick it moves.
Totally agree with this statement. I thought the JK was kind of a dog, but found that I needed to put my foot higher on the pedal and use more force than i was used to. It moves right along when I do that. Much better than my 98 4.0L.
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:24 AM   #1439
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I can't speak for the manual tranny with the 3.6 or the JKU....but the JK with the 5 speed auto and the 3.6 is fast for your average suv. I just got rid of my 2010 Camaro SS 6 speed with 426HP, plus I've owned a few other seriously quick vehicles...and two Wranglers, a Cherokee and Liberty prior to my 2012 JK. I had 3:21's stock, and it felt quick...more like 8 sec 0-60 than 7, but that's quick for your average suv. I now have 33's and a lift so I went to 4:10's with an LSD and my Jeep now feels seriously quick for an suv. Seat of the pants has me estimating it between 6.8 and 7.5. That's good for some average sedans let alone a Jeep. That being said, it's not a muscle car, nor will every iteration(JKU, manual, 3:21's) feel the same.
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Old 07-09-2012, 01:49 AM   #1440
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I have never owned a Jeep however am planning to order my 2013 very soon. After much research here I am pretty sure I am educated enough to know what I am wanting and what to expect.

I have yet to figure out why so many want to make the JK a dragster or so it seems that many get hung up on horsepower figures. From what I have learned on this forum the Jeep has never been a speed demon nor has it ever tried to be.

It is a simple brick of a vehicle and designed to do a few things very well and speed has never been one of them.....nor should it be I believe.

I know now that when I do get my Jeep it will most likely be slower than most other vehicles I have driven. I also know my gas mileage will be horrible and I will get a cracked windshield at some point. I also may have to track down a leak from somewhere and I will also most likely spend much money on various mods I really do not need.

Honestly I am a little worried about spending close to 40k on a vehicle and having to wonder about that damn ticking motor thing. In the end I have decided my facination with this Jeep is worth the concern and I simply want to have one in spite of it all. Slower than most means little to me and if anything else it will make me slow down as I drive crazy now anyway. Going in to this purchase I think we all know full well the JK is never going to be anything other than what it is......simple and rugged off road fun and not a sports car by any means.

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