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Old 08-25-2010, 03:26 PM   #1
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weird electrical problem/gremlin-advice needed

so here is my deal. (2007 4dr sahara w/ 37K, auto)

day1 EVAP emissions leak code pops up for no reason, havent been offroad in weeks, just got back from a weekend trip without the jeep and i get in it to drive and the engine light comes on, get it cleared at Advance Auto.

day2 EVAP code comes back on, oh well, ill check into later... go to pick up pizza, while im waiting i work on my front bumper alittle in the parking lot (currently chopping it up, only added some bolts to the top at this point) but the tailgate was open and shut open and shut... so the interior light was on for a little bit... wont start when i get my pizza, get jumped drive it home, try and restart it when i get home, starts up fine.

day3 EVAP code was cleared due to battery dieing, but it starts up and runs on my way to work, no problems... code does not come back. after work i crank it up pull it around the back of the shop and use a cutter/grinder to get my crush cans off the metal bumper. (jeep is not turned on at this point) get done, get in, cant crank... get jumped... check battery water, its low so i fill them up evenly with a bottle of water from inside. drive it home, cranks up after i get home just fine (about a ten minute drive) worry but no problems, evap code never came back on...

day4 (today) cranks in the morning but sounds like its trying too hard to get it done. come to work fine, go home for lunch and it cranks hard again, and this time bad things happen. RPM wont go over 2200, gas pedal has no response, transmission doesnt shift down properly, cant get over 47 mph, SUPER sluggish like a limp mode or something....have lunch, ready to call the dealer at this point (under warranty) get in after lunch and cranks up hard again but my throttle and rpm and transmission is working fine...



so there we have it. i searched on here and couldnt find any thread with a similar problem, im wondering if i dont just need a new battery and have the computer flashed... what do you guys think? i plan on getting it tested and checked out tonight or tomorrow, even if its Advance Auto doing a battery/charging system test then take it to the dealer tomorrow....

battery terminals are in prestine condition, no acid or anything, cant seem to find any evap leaks or cables obviously laying about...

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Old 08-25-2010, 04:09 PM   #2
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If you've got the warranty ?????

Why even ask, maybe your evap can has a leak, maybe your gas cap has a leak, maybe your battery is bad--the dealer should checkit for FREE !!

n JIMBO

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Old 08-25-2010, 04:13 PM   #3
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i plan on taking it in tomorrow but wanted to propose the question to any other JK owners that might have had the same deal go on, what should i expect, etc. never hurts to know more.
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Old 08-25-2010, 04:18 PM   #4
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Have you relocated your evap can, added a Ecan skid plate, changed the gas cap for a lockable ???

Are you using Distilled water for the battery ??

Does the gas always squirt a tiny bit after filling up ??

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Old 08-25-2010, 04:25 PM   #5
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Thinking about this a bit I have this:

On a computer system, when the power supply is either taxed by a large load near its regulation capability or if there is something wrong in the power supply choking down its capabilities, strange things do begin happening on the computer. Here is one of the reasons why: when the power supply begins to come out of regulation, things loading the system will cause hash on the power supply line. Circuits depending on a clean power supply line end up with voltage fluctuation on lines that carry data. The voltage fluctuations may cause errors in the data. Before you know it the system is in a funk and there is no clear evidence for why it got the way it is. These things usually show up like memory page errors, or system hangups. That is on a computer system. In a car, there may be protections for the PC that prevent things like over acceleration and such but may not protect against false error codes. Replacing the battery may cause the system to go back to normal operation if that was the cause. If not, the problems will persist.
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Old 08-25-2010, 04:31 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
Have you relocated your evap can, added a Ecan skid plate, changed the gas cap for a lockable ???

Are you using Distilled water for the battery ??

Does the gas always squirt a tiny bit after filling up ??

JIMBO

dang it, i didnt use distilled water, it was the spring/filtered water from the office

i installed an evap skid (two months ago), poison spyder evap skid

gas cap isnt lockable

gas did spill about a week or two ago at a fill up, hasnt done that in like 4 months, thought it was weird that it all of a sudden did it....and it wasnt a tiny bit either, all down the side and bumper...


JK'N: this sounds like my conclusion, something is up with the charging system or battery and could be causing this... that or something is drawing WAY too much for no reason...
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Old 08-25-2010, 04:36 PM   #7
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Yea, I don't know how the dealer will treat the Ecan skid plate, but-with gas not being shut off at the entry point, kinda point's to the Evap can tubing !!


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dang it, i didnt use distilled water, it was the spring/filtered water from the office

i installed an evap skid (two months ago), poison spyder evap skid

gas cap isnt lockable

gas did spill about a week or two ago at a fill up, hasnt done that in like 4 months, thought it was weird that it all of a sudden did it....and it wasnt a tiny bit either, all down the side and bumper...


JK'N: this sounds like my conclusion, something is up with the charging system or battery and could be causing this... that or something is drawing WAY too much for no reason...
I'm afraid you'll have to fess-up to the service manager and let the cards fall-

Good luck

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Old 08-25-2010, 05:06 PM   #8
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just checked everything on the evap can, nothing is out of place or even loose. and that was 2 months ago and hasnt been a problem... that could have been the problem with the evap code but what about all my electrical problems and weirdness?

a bad O2 sensor wouldnt cause all this problems would it? i know the JK is all about the computer and i havent had much experience with all computer controlled vehicles...
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Old 08-25-2010, 05:15 PM   #9
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Well, don't feel like the Lone Ranger, Chrysler has outdone itself on this JK ECM, there's not much the average joe can do without the programming data and equipment

There's a Supercharger Co. Avenger, that has a "Roots" SC for the JK, but

Even though they have success with most of their other models,GM/Nissan/Ford, they can't get this SC to operate trouble free on the JK, no matter what "maps: they've introduced--now

RIPP has total success with their Centrifugal SC on the JK--

It's a real nightmare once you start messing with that OB11--leaveit to the dealer, they have the 100k machine that'll tell them "what to replace"

Good luck

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Old 08-25-2010, 05:22 PM   #10
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what happened to the days when you had something go wrong and then there were a list a possibilities and checks to do to narrow it down and finally come to a conclusion... WITHOUT a 100K computer...

im headed to advance to have the charging system checked, will update, tomorrow the dealer...
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Old 08-25-2010, 05:27 PM   #11
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Heh Heh, yea the good ol'days

I can remember years ago when the emission program started in Ca. we used to "RETARD" ignition to pass some of out "Warmed over" Dodges and then, when done, just jackit back up tp 14/16 adv--can't dodat NOMO !!

JIMBO

PS, where I have my jeep registered in NV,--NO SMOG EVER !!
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Old 08-25-2010, 05:34 PM   #12
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no smog in my county here either. go south east!
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:01 PM   #13
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well, battery tested "almost dead", there is a .1 A drain in the system somewhere, and as he could tell the altinator is charging, but couldnt say %100 because of the dead battery.

have it on a trickle charger for the night, taking it in to the dealer after work tomorrow. we will see.
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:07 PM   #14
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Can't wait to hear--


Quote:
Originally Posted by yj-genral View Post
well, battery tested "almost dead", there is a .1 A drain in the system somewhere, and as he could tell the altinator is charging, but couldnt say %100 because of the dead battery.

have it on a trickle charger for the night, taking it in to the dealer after work tomorrow. we will see.
Although you're gonna have a .xx milliamp draw from the ECM/clock/security-etc, but

Your Alternater is supposed to cure that

My Jeep will sit for sometimes over two weeks before I get to fireit up--so I always have a battery maintainer plugged in, just because of those light draws !!

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Old 08-25-2010, 09:36 PM   #15
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According to my calculations a 75 amp-hour battery will supply .1 amps for 750 hours. I can't imagine that .1 amps would drain down a battery even in 3 days to the point that it wouldn't start the jeep.
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:46 PM   #16
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I have a ham radio that is wired directly to the battery. I sometimes leave it on for days at a time. It has a .5 amp draw in receive. Even after sitting for days, the jeep still starts.
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:20 PM   #17
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Yes but the altenator was undetermined so if that stopped working last week and it sat for two days then I drove it sunday and Monday before it died... I don't know, we might find out tomorrow night or Friday at the latest. I'll keep you guys posted and hopefully help out a fellow jeeper in the future
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:21 PM   #18
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Why does the jk not come with a voltmeter...
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Old 08-25-2010, 10:29 PM   #19
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YOU MEAN "Why doesn't the JK, come with a voltmeter" ??


Quote:
Originally Posted by yj-genral View Post
Why does the jk not come with a voltmeter...
Because 90% of the owners would only look for a 12VDC indication and that would make them happy--NOT !!

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Old 08-25-2010, 11:11 PM   #20
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If my alternator was questionable, I would expect that in a couple days the jeep wouldn't start. My money is on the alternator or regulator (now usually part of the alternator) if that is what they measured.
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Old 08-26-2010, 01:46 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jk'n View Post
If my alternator was questionable, I would expect that in a couple days the jeep wouldn't start. My money is on the alternator or regulator (now usually part of the alternator) if that is what they measured.

wasnt that it was questionable, but more along the lines of they couldnt determine if it was bad due to the already bad battery.


SOOOOOO... conclusion:

alittle history, my dad owns a shop about 30 mins from me but only works on imports (honda, toyota, etc.) told me to drop by during lunch today and he would check the battery himself and replace it if need be and then check the charging system after that, all before i took it to the dealer to have checked. just to see if that would fix the problems.

also the engine light came back on (presumably the EVAP code), so i went by and the battery is literally on its last toe, not even leg worthy, and we replaced it and checked the charging system. its perfectly fine. went for a test run around town (start up/ crank, stop n go, stomp the gas while in higher gear, high speed test, rpm checks etc...) all the problems that i had and funny things that where going on disappeared. computer seems to respond correctly to every input i can throw at it, works just like it did and should work. best bet is that the low voltage was causing the computer and other things to act funny. the engine light has yet to come back on.


SO the end conclusion is that if you have some funky stuff happening with your wrangler and cant get it to crank, run properly, or seems possessed by a demon... then check your battery and replace if necessary, do this and check the charging system to make sure it wont happen again.


as for the .1 amp draw, security and the like are completely normal for newer vehicles, the guy at advance shouldnt be working on cars...(he was the only one available at the time, but i never like to talk to him, doesnt seem like hes all there or knows much more than what the AAP training test has told him...)

i will not be taking the jeep into the dealer unless anything that was going on re-presents itself even with the new battery.

and i will keep an eye out to see if the EVAP code comes back up, might have been throwing false codes from the computer or i might actually have a leak or something somewhere. only time will tell.
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Old 08-26-2010, 05:44 PM   #22
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I suspect that all of your problems are now solved. I should have added weak battery to the above because it is basically the same situation, it messes with the voltage applied to the computer under heavy load while the vehicle is running. Glad to hear that it has been worked out. The jeep is probably old enough that the battery wouldn't be covered under warranty anyway...right?
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Old 08-27-2010, 09:22 AM   #23
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i bought it used at 32k from a dealer and added another 36k 3yr warranty to it for JIC. so it is out of original warranty but i got a second one, might have been a waste of money but only time will tell.
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Old 08-27-2010, 09:47 AM   #24
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I have a dealer sold after market extended warranty on mine. I've done this on my last three vehicle purchases. I didn't use it once on the 2000 Caravan. I used it so often on the PT Cruiser that it is practically a new vehicle mechanically. So far with the Jeep, no issues. I don't baby vehicles under warranty but don't intentionally beat on them either. I use them hard you could say. The dealer has done well by me on any warranty issue including extended warranty. I consider it a good value.
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Old 08-28-2010, 09:20 PM   #25
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well the engine light came back on so i apparently have a code, need to get it read, im assuming its the EVAP emissions leak... dont know how im going to fix that...

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