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Old 06-29-2013, 06:50 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by WannaV8JK View Post
You should have bought a CJ5 because compared to a JK is like comparing a H1 Hummer to H3 Hummer.
If they would have offered a new version of the CJ5, I would have it. I bought my JEEP for what it is supposed to be..... An off road vehicle.... But I did not want something that someone thought was submarine capable, then drug it out of the water and made it look good and sell it. I don't need AC when the doors are off all summer long. I don't need the radio to listen to a bunch of rock stars with cowboy hats or rappers. I don't need nav, I have never seen so many lost people since the advent of the GPS. ( We used to need directions, and have to read the road signs). Besides, it is more fun to just find your way IMHO!!!
So, with all this, I would have loved it if I could have gotten a bare bones basic JEEP without any plastic fascia, just basic instrumentation, with the electronics being weather proof (not weather resistant). All the frills could be optional for those that want them. And THAT is exactly my point, those that want it could have it; and those that don't want it wouldn't have to buy it and could option out their JEEP the way they want it.

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Old 06-29-2013, 06:52 AM   #32
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Man, some of you guys sound like you should have bought a Grand Cherokee instead of a wrangler.

The wrangler is _intended_ to break out of the cute-ute/SUV mold that's swallowing up all useful vehicles on the road today. You implement some of the changes you guys are suggesting, and you end up with a wrangler looking kia sportage.

Ive seen some images from some chinese or japanse auto show where they had a wrangler with a pretty ugly front-clip redesign, with speculation that this was going to be the next wrangler. I gotta say, if that POS comes out in 2016, i'm trading my 2013 sport for a 2015 rubicon before Fiat ruins the wrangler.

Be careful what you're asking for, The wrangler is right on the edge of being ruined forever. There's a proud legacy accompanying the wrangler right now, sissify it too much, and we end up with just another cute-ute.

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Old 06-29-2013, 07:59 AM   #33
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Man, some of you guys sound like you should have bought a Grand Cherokee instead of a wrangler.

The wrangler is _intended_ to break out of the cute-ute/SUV mold that's swallowing up all useful vehicles on the road today. You implement some of the changes you guys are suggesting, and you end up with a wrangler looking kia sportage.

Ive seen some images from some chinese or japanse auto show where they had a wrangler with a pretty ugly front-clip redesign, with speculation that this was going to be the next wrangler. I gotta say, if that POS comes out in 2016, i'm trading my 2013 sport for a 2015 rubicon before Fiat ruins the wrangler.

Be careful what you're asking for, The wrangler is right on the edge of being ruined forever. There's a proud legacy accompanying the wrangler right now, sissify it too much, and we end up with just another cute-ute.
^^^^^^^^ Yup!!!!!! X 1000.... But I won't be trading mine... too close to what I really wanted now!!!!!!!
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:07 AM   #34
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No nav
No radio
No heated seats
No auto lamps
No electric windows
No auto connect
No air conditioning
No plastic fascia's nor valance's
No plastic fender flares
Of course this stuff could all be optional for the hummer drivers that now want a JEEP; But then the options below would be worth having!
Dana 44's standard; D 60's option
35" tires standard; 37's optional
A real roll cage
A real choice of gearing options from 3.73 all the way thru 5.38
Selectable lockers optional on all trim levels
4:1 Transfer case optional on all trim levels
Manual tranny with a true low gear.
Just a damn JEEP with out all the lace and frills!!

Honestly, how many of these do you think they'd sell each year?
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:09 AM   #35
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Man, some of you guys sound like you should have bought a Grand Cherokee instead of a wrangler.

The wrangler is _intended_ to break out of the cute-ute/SUV mold that's swallowing up all useful vehicles on the road today. You implement some of the changes you guys are suggesting, and you end up with a wrangler looking kia sportage.

Ive seen some images from some chinese or japanse auto show where they had a wrangler with a pretty ugly front-clip redesign, with speculation that this was going to be the next wrangler. I gotta say, if that POS comes out in 2016, i'm trading my 2013 sport for a 2015 rubicon before Fiat ruins the wrangler.

Be careful what you're asking for, The wrangler is right on the edge of being ruined forever. There's a proud legacy accompanying the wrangler right now, sissify it too much, and we end up with just another cute-ute.
This is what the CJ owners said when they introduced the YJ, which ended up being a better off road vehicle.

This is what the YJ owners said when they introduced the TJ, which ended up being a better off road vehicle.

This is what the TJ owners said when they introduced the JK, which ended up being a better off road vehicle.

This is what the JK owners will say when they introduced the next Wrangler, which will end up being a better of road vehicle.
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:11 AM   #36
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Just a bit of a reality check, but you guys realize that the mass majority of buyers aren't anything like the folks that post in this forum, right? They don't care about water proofing, want amenities, and are buying the vehicle for the image. No manufacturer is going to make a vehicle that appeals to less than 1% of the buyers. The stripped down model? Just isn't going to happen, no way, no how. They are going to build models that are competitive to other brands/models that they compete with. To say there is no competition for the Wrangler is flat out wrong. Like it or not, most Wranglers probably will see nothing more than some beach sand at best. That's the reality of it. It's time to realize that this is 2013, not 1985 anymore. People want nice things in their 30k - 40k+ vehicles, regardless of what it's 'supposed' to do.
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Old 06-29-2013, 08:46 AM   #37
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Just a bit of a reality check, but you guys realize that the mass majority of buyers aren't anything like the folks that post in this forum, right? They don't care about water proofing, want amenities, and are buying the vehicle for the image. No manufacturer is going to make a vehicle that appeals to less than 1% of the buyers. The stripped down model? Just isn't going to happen, no way, no how. They are going to build models that are competitive to other brands/models that they compete with. To say there is no competition for the Wrangler is flat out wrong. Like it or not, most Wranglers probably will see nothing more than some beach sand at best. That's the reality of it. It's time to realize that this is 2013, not 1985 anymore. People want nice things in their 30k - 40k+ vehicles, regardless of what it's 'supposed' to do.
Agreed.

I wonder if all the people that want stripped models jumped on the Samurai bandwagon. They did cheap and few options. Wranglers are still here because they had models most people wanted to buy.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:00 AM   #38
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The only change I would want is to get rid of the idiotic swing out tailgate. A drop down pickup style tailgate makes more sense, is more practical and would make for better use of the cargo area.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:02 AM   #39
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Yup! And the Wrangler is no longer a niche vehicle. Jeep has made the Wrangler much more livable on a day to day basis for the average person, and has tried to make the ownership experience much better. Like it or not, the overwhelming majority of owners (including myself) aren't going to look at poor build quality and quirks and shrug it off as "Oh, it's a Jeep thing."

That just doesn't work anymore, and should never be used as a cop-out for the manufacturer's poor quality control. People demand perfection out of their new vehicles, and rightfully so. Chrysler is stepping it up and improving quality and reliability across the board, as much as they can with the budget given anyway.

As such, sales are up and profits are starting to climb. The loaded out Wranglers you see today are what people want. For those wanting a bargain, the Sport models exist. Remember, companies exist to turn a profit, not make every person on an internet forum happy. The only way to turn a profit is to build to what people actually want. A stripped down off-roader isn't what the people want.

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Agreed.

I wonder if all the people that want stripped models jumped on the Samurai bandwagon. They did cheap and few options. Wranglers are still here because they had models most people wanted to buy.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:16 AM   #40
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And eventually; the JEEP as we know it will go away. As I stated, all the niceties could be options for the people that want them. If enough people bitch about the leaky roof, a non removeable roof will take its place eventually. If enough people bitch about the aerodynamics, it will get more streamlined, if enough people bitch about the solid front axle, it will be replaced with IFS. Just simple marketing. I didn't say a word about the capabilities of JK vs TJ vs YJ vs CJ. The JK in stock form is a VERY capable unit. I Just don't need nor want all the frills and it would be nice if it were available that way. All the plastic fascia's that aren't necessary, along with sound bars, sub-woofer and all other un-necessary stuff will eventually go away on mine, so why did I need to pay for it? I just wanted a JEEP! A new version of the CJ5 with JK suspension and EFI. The plain sport still has too much non weather proof electronics for this type of vehicle IMHO.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:20 AM   #41
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You must be super tall. I'm 6'3" and the headroom in my JK is fine- and I have headroom issues with most vehicles.

I'm also not sure I understand the "no carpet option" issue. It takes like 10 minutes the pull your carpets out...
I'm only 6'2, but have a taller sitting height than most people my height. My head is within a 1/4" of the cross beam that the speakers are mounted tom so if I'm on a bumpy road or move my head back at all, it hits.

Yes, you can strip your carpet out, but it looks like crap underneath unless you do some work.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:24 AM   #42
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The only change I would want is to get rid of the idiotic swing out tailgate. A drop down pickup style tailgate makes more sense, is more practical and would make for better use of the cargo area.
Where does the full sized spare tire go on a stock Jeep? After market bumper/tire carriers would need to be fully open to get into a fold down tail gate.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:42 AM   #43
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I would like to see the Jeep go back to its previous size, prior to the JK. The CJ, YJ, and TJ fit down the trail better than the 4" wider JK does, so they weren't immediately covered with brush scratches quite so bad.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:51 AM   #44
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Where does the full sized spare tire go on a stock Jeep? After market bumper/tire carriers would need to be fully open to get into a fold down tail gate.
Getting rid of the spare tire is a viable option. Before you protest, lets think it through:

1. Most mall crawlers out there don't know how or won't change a tire, they'll call AAA.
2. Eliminating a spare tire and wheel eliminates ~60 pounds, increasing mileage and performance ratings, although slightly.
3. Eliminating a spare tire and wheel probably saves Jeep ~$70 per vehicle. Reducing weight usually costs money, in this instance it saves money.
4. If you have larger tires, you have to use an aftermarket spare carrier anyway, so you don't care if the Wrangler doesn't have one from the factory.
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:14 AM   #45
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I would like to see at least a hint of effort on Chryslers part to get rid of the water leaks. It isnt like this is something new. It isnt like they dont know about it. How about they act like they actually give a damn.
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:24 AM   #46
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An aluminum or plastic body to save weight and no more rust. Levi's interior
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:26 AM   #47
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Getting rid of the spare tire is a viable option. Before you protest, lets think it through:

1. Most mall crawlers out there don't know how or won't change a tire, they'll call AAA.
2. Eliminating a spare tire and wheel eliminates ~60 pounds, increasing mileage and performance ratings, although slightly.
3. Eliminating a spare tire and wheel probably saves Jeep ~$70 per vehicle. Reducing weight usually costs money, in this instance it saves money.
4. If you have larger tires, you have to use an aftermarket spare carrier anyway, so you don't care if the Wrangler doesn't have one from the factory.
Those are valid points in that they are some likely scenarios. I would want the spare tire in that location until I had the money for modification.

I would be fine with the ability to switch from side open to top open. I think I've seen that a long time ago on a station wagon. Designed right, all you would need to do is move a pin from the vertical hinge to a horizontal hinge.

I don't see them putting the R&D into that. An aftermarket company, maybe.
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:31 AM   #48
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No toothpaste. Line x interior option. Windshield that folds down easily. Seats that recline all the way for naps.

Move the front rollbar back a couple inches. Make the rollbar padding not look like ass.

Smaller fenders for models that come with small wheels.

Stop using plastic that looks like shitocki mushrooms after 4 years.

Better transfer case linkage.

Drop down tailgate.

Bigger glove box

Gun holder

Cup holders that are designed by someone who has arms.

Go back to the 08 style door panels, new ones are going too far in attempting to look like a car.

Paint the floor pans and roll bars.

More headroom so my head doesnt rub the soundbar.

Optional soft doors

Steel doors that dont make it look like a retarded pickup truck with top down.

Mirrors that dont suck

Dealerships that dont suck.

Factory kenwood or pioneer stereo system with rockford fosgate speakers.

Speakers that are easier to change

Dash with all gauges in the center more like the cj7 dash but with a modern touch

Heater vents that dont blow out and hit me in the chest

Different door latch design so i stop ripping my pants getting out of the jeep

Seats that are softer than concrete

2 door unlimited option

Better trackbar

Dana 60 option

Engine options like the corvette. Would be cool to have a choice between a 3.6, mild hemi, crazy way too much power hemis....
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:33 AM   #49
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I would like to see at least a hint of effort on Chryslers part to get rid of the water leaks. It isnt like this is something new. It isnt like they dont know about it. How about they act like they actually give a damn.
Its designed that way to show you how waterproof the interior is.
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:40 AM   #50
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1. better headlights
2. Uconnect that doesn't skip or lose signal from my iphone
3. Eliminate the "screw knob thingies" that hold the freedom panels down.
4. doors that stay open
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:49 AM   #51
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I think that Jeep should focus on what makes the Wrangler unique, not try to blend it in with all the other vehicles out there.

1. Water:
  • Dash/steering wheel should be truly waterproof. No real reason not to use marine grade stereos and speakers.
  • Engine compartment electronics should be already prepared for full submersion - it seems the TIPM and battery are the main cuplrits here.
  • Factory option for water fording - so breathers, snorkel, airbox - and warantee provisions for this.
  • Factory option for totally waterproof interior - i.e seats and carpet

2. Communication/sound:

Everyone else tries to be 'all integrated' factory solution. Forget that. Forget tying the stereo display in as general vehicle control/display. That doesn't mean that Jeep shouldn't offer a couple of stereos from the factory, but they should also embrace 3rd party upgrades of both sound and communications in general - CB, Ham, scanners:
  • 3 or 4 proper DIN slots (not the crappy brand lockin '2 DIN face but fractionally less than 2DIN back support)
  • Second OBD/CANBUS port somewhere
  • Firewall penetration location that is both clearly accessible from both sides of the firewall and designed to properly secure back to a correct barrier once additional wires are run
3. Customization:

In my experience of buying vehicles, one of the great strengths of American auto companies over foreign is 'factory order'. Take that further, go beyond what anyone else offers and make the Wrangler more configurable from the factory order sheet than any other.
  • (maybe) Crate model stripped down to the point where it can't be legally registered
  • Base model stripped down to the bare minimum to be legal to register to drive on public roads. This doesn't include doors or top at all. No air handling, no heat, no AC.
  • Sport, Sahara, Rubicon are not models but package options that pretty much bring a Base up to where the models are now, i.e. Sport is 'simple' but including the options that bring it roughly on par with 'comfort level' of a enconobox. Sahara is the 'luxury' model. Rubicon is 'king of the offroad'.
What should change is this: every factory option can be added to any model. I understand that there will always be some options that require other options (for example, USB port in the console requires certain stereo levels, or backup camera requires Nav capable stereo). It should be possible to order a Base model with cheap steel wheels, D60s w/lockers, the Rubicon transfer case, a Nav stereo unit, heated seats and no doors or top.

Every item from the Mopar catalog should be available as a line item on factory order sheet. Make it all mix-and-match as much as possible. Commit to the quality control and logistics at the factory to make this work.
4. General wishlist items
  • Visibility improvement - particularly rearward. Lower the default spare tire mounting position slightly, get the wiper motor smaller/out of the view a bit more, workable way to have rear headrests go down when the rear seats are not occupied.
  • Rear seat comfort improvement - center support, small degree of recline available.
  • Mirrors on the body not on the door
I like your din slot idea. I have a bigrig that has 7 of em. two are used for factory switches though......
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:02 AM   #52
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Where does the full sized spare tire go on a stock Jeep? After market bumper/tire carriers would need to be fully open to get into a fold down tail gate.
Stock body mounted swing out tire carriers are nothing new. It wouldn't even take much of a redesign.
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:12 AM   #53
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Just Fine

Hi, Leave the wrangler be. It is fine the way it is!!
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:18 AM   #54
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The diesel at the same cost as the gas motor.

Or less than the gas motor, like it is in Europe.
Hi from Sweden

Here the diesel engine cost 5600 dollars more than the Pentastar engine. And here the road tax is twice for a diesel engine.

I have a 2012 2 door sahara pentastar with 3.21 and I test drove (only on a parking lot) a 2013 Rubicon unlimited 3.73 with a diesel. What a dog, so no diesel for me and I would not pay 5600 dollares more for that. I find diesel boring slow and noisy.

Every american Jeepers want diesel, I understand the tourqe thing, but have You ever driven a wrangler diesel, so boring. If You like tractor than a diesel is for You.

Maybe the diesel the have in the Grand Cherokee could be something???

Best regards from sunny Sweden
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:28 AM   #55
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[QUOTE=Standard locking hood like Europe has now.

Bob[/QUOTE]

Hi from sweden (Europe) we dont have standard locking hood in Sweden but we do have the hella H4 lights as standard and a switch to lower or to raise the lights depending if You have something heavy in the back like a camper.




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Old 06-29-2013, 11:30 AM   #56
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The next version will be more road friendly, more family friendly. At the same time they can't destroy the iconic look,removable door/tops, and offroad capability. the rear seat sucks for adults to get in and out of. At the same time the jeep is too tall, hard to climb into. These are things that detract customers, if they can't get in they won't buy it. Yes it sells well now, but this new model needs to sell just as well for the next 10 years. if hardcore enthusiasts were jeeps target market the cj would still be rolling off the assembly line. jeep makes vehicles to SELL them to the average idiot consumer. it needs to be easier to drive, quieter, more efficient, carry more people stuff. i think the tops could use the most improvement. make it easier to have fun. all these bolts and knobs and crap is too much for the average idiot consumer. once the new model is released we will all say how stupid it looks and how hardcore the JK is compared to it. the new model should be better in most aspects except hardcore simplicity. Look at CJ - YJ -TJ - JK.
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:33 AM   #57
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Stock body mounted swing out tire carriers are nothing new. It wouldn't even take much of a redesign.
With a redesigned muffler it could pretty much go under the jeep with no ground clearance change unless you put big tires on it like we have. Heheh.

Cj5 had one on the side anyway
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Old 06-29-2013, 11:53 AM   #58
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My short list of things I'd like to see addressed.

1) Body mounted mirrors (Why is Chrysler still selling a vehicle with a removable door feature, and never contemplated that once the doors are off, so are the mirrors?)

2) A hardtop without removable Freedom panels. That's not to say I'm not a fan of them, but why make them 2 individual pieces that are nearly impossible to store inside your Jeep without losing nearly all your cargo space? A single panel across the top with a fold-able (yet still removable if you unscrewed the soundbar bolts) hinge like the sunrider option on a soft top would be so much more convenient.

2-B) A hardtop with removable side windows. Honestly, how hard would this be?

2-C) A hardtop without a rear wiper. Just stop making them please. Its already damn near impossible to see out of the back window with the rear seat headrests constantly in the way (see item #3) and once you've added the wiper motor cover that's comparable in size to most winches the visibility becomes nearly nil anyway. Why would anyone need a wiper to help them see out of a window they couldn't see out of in the first place?

3) Integrate the rear headrests INTO the rear seat. Make them so they fit flush with the top of the seat when not in use. When needed, pull them up and away you go.

4) A neoprene seat covering factory option. This is an idea that's looooooooong since past due.

5) A factory bed-lined finished tub interior. With or without carpet, this is another idea that's looooooooooong since past due.

6) Water resistant dash electronics. JBL, JL, Alpine, and Kenwood all carry components for these for marine applications on the shelf right now. It wouldn't take too much to at least make the stereo and steering wheel controls rain resistant.

7) Open up a truly "Custom" order ability for those of us that know what we do and do not want on our rigs. I'd love to have the factory lockers and 4:1 T-case, but have no desire to also own the upgraded suspension, wheels, and interior complements.
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Old 06-29-2013, 03:48 PM   #59
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This is what the CJ owners said when they introduced the YJ, which ended up being a better off road vehicle.

This is what the YJ owners said when they introduced the TJ, which ended up being a better off road vehicle.

This is what the TJ owners said when they introduced the JK, which ended up being a better off road vehicle.

This is what the JK owners will say when they introduced the next Wrangler, which will end up being a better of road vehicle.
You saw what fiat did to the Cherokee didn't you?
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Old 06-29-2013, 03:54 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by zerinS4 View Post
Just a bit of a reality check, but you guys realize that the mass majority of buyers aren't anything like the folks that post in this forum, right? They don't care about water proofing, want amenities, and are buying the vehicle for the image. No manufacturer is going to make a vehicle that appeals to less than 1% of the buyers. The stripped down model? Just isn't going to happen, no way, no how. They are going to build models that are competitive to other brands/models that they compete with. To say there is no competition for the Wrangler is flat out wrong. Like it or not, most Wranglers probably will see nothing more than some beach sand at best. That's the reality of it. It's time to realize that this is 2013, not 1985 anymore. People want nice things in their 30k - 40k+ vehicles, regardless of what it's 'supposed' to do.
You are absolutely right. However, the wrangler is an icon that's stood for 80 years in one form or another. Yes the wrangler of today is indistinguishable from the jeep that won the war. The point is that betraying that legend would be suicide for the jeep brand. The rest of the lineup is too much like every other line of SUV's to stand out without an iconic wrangler.

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