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Old 04-20-2011, 12:50 PM   #31
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If this is the only vehicle you own, you'll appreciate the times you have extra room with the 4 door.

I loved the TJ I drove, but it was very limited in what I could carry around in it. The JKU has been a great improvement in that area.

Plus, as someone already said, it looks really bad ass with 4 doors removed and no top.

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Old 04-20-2011, 12:55 PM   #32
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A two door unlimited! Best of both worlds. Or wait for the pentastar.

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Old 04-20-2011, 12:58 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff-jeep View Post
I assume the 2-door Sahara will get me SLIGHTLY better gas mileage (less weight) and have more get up and go. The only reason I'm thinking about the unlimited b/c of the price and extra room. I have no kids, or pets so getting the 2-door would make more sense but you guys/gals might have a different opinion.
Well actually I don't have a different opinion, go for the 2 door. Not to be hating on 4-door wranglers, but I just don't think they are very "authentic." Two doors are the way to go.
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:34 PM   #34
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you are not changing the horsepower(the perception of it yes) by changing gears, you only change when(in the rpm range) it is available, it would also kill his gas mileage at those hwy speeds....the engine would be revving its life away.
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:36 PM   #35
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but he would have torque a plenty from 0-45 :-P
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:47 PM   #36
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Well actually I don't have a different opinion, go for the 2 door. Not to be hating on 4-door wranglers, but I just don't think they are very "authentic." Two doors are the way to go.
agreed
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:52 PM   #37
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2 door LJ, 2004 -06 if you can find one, extra room, only 2 doors Dog, yep... kid, yep... but he has his own 4x4
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:59 PM   #38
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you are not changing the horsepower(the perception of it yes) by changing gears, you only change when(in the rpm range) it is available, it would also kill his gas mileage at those hwy speeds....the engine would be revving its life away.
Don't want to highjack, but to me that says it backwards.

It's true that regear doesn't change the overall horsepower available, but it does indeed change the horsepower produced at a particular speed because you are changing the RPMs required to move at that speed.

For example, if your 3.8 engine on 32s only needs to spin at 1600 RPM to maintain 70 mph, you'll only be getting about 40 hp at the wheels. By contrast, if your 3.8 engine on 32s needs to spin at 2700 RPM to maintain 70 mph, you'll be getting about 85 hp at the wheels.

As it turns out, those numbers are right around the numbers for an auto with 3.21 gears on 32s versus an auto with 5.38 gears on 32s. In other words, after a regear to 5.38 he'd be cruising at 70 mph on the highway at 2700 RPMs and putting out about 85 hp rather than 40.

That's not going to kill his engine, though it might be a higher RPM than he'll want just to cruise. If he wanted to compromise some more, he could regear to maybe 4.56s. That'd put him at 2300 RPMs while still bumping his hp at 70 mph from about 40 to around 65. That's a totally reasonable crusing RPM and would be a nearly 62% increase in wheel horsepower over the stock set up at 70 mph.

PS: FYI, my hp numbers aren't perfect as the only dyno I could find was for a manual, but the RPM and gearing numbers are JK specific for autos, so the idea still holds.

Okay, highjack over. Please continue . . . .
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Old 04-20-2011, 02:19 PM   #39
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MTH the way i read yours post and mine it says about the same thing, only you are trying to quantify it w/ numbers/values. where i say the engine is revving its life away(a little exaggerated). you say at 70 mph he's at 2700 rpm, which would other wise be less rpm at the same speed. either way the more(higher) it revs at a given speed, i believe it uses more fuel, if at that changes is the gearing....

agreed highjack done
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Old 04-20-2011, 03:29 PM   #40
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OK I have a question, why would you want a vehicle that revs at 2,700 rpms at 70 mph??

Thats not good,right???

So some of these 5.88 geared offroad vehicles ,really should not be on a highway, right? At 2700 rpms at 70 mph, isn't that overworking an engine?? or no?

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Old 04-20-2011, 03:58 PM   #41
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OK I have a question, why would you want a vehicle that revs at 2,700 rpms at 70 mph??

Thats not good,right???

So some of these 5.88 geared offroad vehicles ,really should not be on a highway, right? At 2700 rpms at 70 mph, isn't that overworking an engine?? or no?

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Can't . . . resist . . . highjack . . .

M'eh, depends. 2700 would be sort of a "performance" level of revving for highway cruising. But to put it in perspective, if you have a manual rubicon from the factory (i.e., 32s with 4.10 gears) you cruise at about 2500 RPMs at 70 mph. So I don't think another 200 RPM is going to melt anything.

The reason you'd want to be up in the 2500+ range is because that's where the 3.8's powerband is, so you'll be generating much more horsepower at that speed. For a daily driver, you of course want to balance that against your interest in having a reasonably relaxed "cruising" gear.

While a factory manual rubi is turning 2500 RPMs at 70 mph, the most common factory auto sport/sahara (i.e., 32s with 3.21 gearing) will only be turning about 1600 RPMs at 70 mph. That's a huge discrepancy and the result is that the manual rubi is putting out about 75 hp at 70 mph while the sport/sahara is only putting out about 40 hp at the same speed.

That's why folks bit*h about the "underpowered" engine. They're all driving auto sports/saharas, and many of them are four doors which adds a few hundred extra pounds. Even an auto rubi would be a little below the powerband, turning about 2100 RPMs at 70 mph. That's about what a sport/sahara turns with a manual transmission but with only 3.21 gears. In other words, an auto rubi feels similarly powered as a manual sport/sahara--a touch below the powerband but a reasonable performer.

To bring an auto sport/sahara up to the highway performance of a manual rubi, you'd need to regear it to about 4.88s.

As to not using a regeared Jeep on the highway, you definitely can be geared numerically too high and then yes, you'd be practically very limited on how fast you can go. For example, if I put 5.86s in my manual Jeep with 32s, I'd be turning about 3700 RPMs at 70 mph. I'd have great horsepower (about 125), but as you can imagine it would be a very loud ride that I would not expect a long life out of my engine.

PS: I'm no expert at this by the way. I haven't even yet regeared myself (though I will . . . soon). It's just something that's taken my interest recently and I've been studying the various "charts" that float around. I think I'm starting to get the hang of it.
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Old 04-20-2011, 04:18 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by MTH View Post
Can't . . . resist . . . highjack . . .

M'eh, depends. 2700 would be sort of a "performance" level of revving for highway cruising. But to put it in perspective, if you have a manual rubicon from the factory (i.e., 32s with 4.10 gears) you cruise at about 2500 RPMs at 70 mph. So I don't think another 200 RPM is going to melt anything.

The reason you'd want to be up in the 2500+ range is because that's where the 3.8's powerband is, so you'll be generating much more horsepower at that speed. For a daily driver, you of course want to balance that against your interest in having a reasonably relaxed "cruising" gear.

While a factory manual rubi is turning 2500 RPMs at 70 mph, the most common factory auto sport/sahara (i.e., 32s with 3.21 gearing) will only be turning about 1600 RPMs at 70 mph. That's a huge discrepancy and the result is that the manual rubi is putting out about 75 hp at 70 mph while the sport/sahara is only putting out about 40 hp at the same speed.

That's why folks bit*h about the "underpowered" engine. They're all driving auto sports/saharas, and many of them are four doors which adds a few hundred extra pounds. Even an auto rubi would be a little below the powerband, turning about 2100 RPMs at 70 mph. That's about what a sport/sahara turns with a manual transmission but with only 3.21 gears. In other words, an auto rubi feels similarly powered as a manual sport/sahara--a touch below the powerband but a reasonable performer.

To bring an auto sport/sahara up to the highway performance of a manual rubi, you'd need to regear it to about 4.88s.

As to not using a regeared Jeep on the highway, you definitely can be geared numerically too high and then yes, you'd be practically very limited on how fast you can go. For example, if I put 5.86s in my manual Jeep with 32s, I'd be turning about 3700 RPMs at 70 mph. I'd have great horsepower (about 125), but as you can imagine it would be a very loud ride that I would not expect a long life out of my engine.

PS: I'm no expert at this by the way. I haven't even yet regeared myself (though I will . . . soon). It's just something that's taken my interest recently and I've been studying the various "charts" that float around. I think I'm starting to get the hang of it.

Thanks MTH for the explanation,I understand your point.


AJ
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Old 04-20-2011, 05:51 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Techguy94

Well actually I don't have a different opinion, go for the 2 door. Not to be hating on 4-door wranglers, but I just don't think they are very "authentic." Two doors are the way to go.
Jeez, by that logic TJ's and YJ's aren't "authentic"...
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Old 04-20-2011, 06:07 PM   #44
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I have a feeling that if we keep this up, he'll get frustrated and go buy a Hyundai...
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Old 04-20-2011, 10:46 PM   #45
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Thank you so much ppl. I went to the bank and dealership and I'll have to wait on a Jeep. My credit took a hit (short sale on a home recently) and I was misinformed about the duration it would be on my credit report.I didn't want a $450 or more payment with a 17% interest rate. I'll have to do it the old fashion way and pay off my car quickly as possible (even though it doesn't help my credit score) and bank my $$$ so I can have a good size downpayment. I learned a lot about the pros and cons of having a four door/two door, and regearing. By the time I'm ready I can probably get a Wrangler with the Pentastar engine. Thanks again.
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Old 04-21-2011, 06:07 AM   #46
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2 Door!
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Old 06-07-2011, 12:24 AM   #47
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Id stick with the origanl but the unlimeted is closer to that magic number
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Old 09-25-2011, 12:22 AM   #48
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I was in your shoes... I looked at a 4 dr Jeep and though it was kinda weird. But I think the jeep community at large is very accepting of the 4 doors. It's making up 60% of Wrangler sales. So in that regard, you shouldn't have trouble finding a interested buyer should you ever decide to sell. Also, I think the 4 dr is reminiscent of the old Cherokee, a jeep they never should of killed off (i think the new liberty is trying to fill that void, it's much more boxy these days). Now, my paradigm has shifted and I think the 4dr looks better than the 2dr... and that's what I bought, wouldn't want anything less (no offense to traditional jeepers who have stayed true to the 2dr).

btw, if plan on towing the 2dr max. ~1,500lbs. / 4dr max ~2,500lbs. 10 inches goes a long way (that's what she said ).
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Old 09-25-2011, 08:56 PM   #49
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You really need to drive both since IMO they are entirely different vehicles. I realize they are both JK's but they feel entirely different when driving. I owned a '10 2 door and now I have a '12 unlimited. For me it simply came down to function. I have two dogs and the 2 door just didn't suit my needs. IMO the 2 door was way more fun to drive but with that said I love the unlimited I currently own. It really depends on what you are trying to achieve. In the end, you can't go wrong either way.
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Old 09-26-2011, 07:40 AM   #50
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I would say only get the four door if you NEED four doors. Two doors is just the way it was "meant to be" in my opinion. I have never gotten used to seeing four door Jeeps yet, they still just don't look right to me.
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Old 09-26-2011, 08:42 PM   #51
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I had a 2010 Sport 2 door and loved it. Daughter and her 2 kids moved in so I now have a 2011 Sport Unlimited. I miss my 2 door - very nimble.

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