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Old 02-25-2011, 01:20 PM   #1
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Would you buy a JK Diesel?

If the price of diesel fuel was $ 5.80 per gal, would you buy a diesel Wrangler?
This wrangler will have the new VM 3.0 V6 diesel engine , That is expected for the 013 mode year, on dealer lots Oct 012,.This engine has a Wt off 507 lbs, gets 241 Hp at 4000 rpm, has 406 Lbs of torque at 1800 to 2800 RPM, and gets 28 mpg. Note: the 013 wrangler will get a major redesign and looses around 500 lbs. Have your say, the results will go to the Chrysler Gp.

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Old 02-25-2011, 01:22 PM   #2
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Hell ya I would if I had the money

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Old 02-25-2011, 01:32 PM   #3
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if those are the specs, yes.

where did you get this info?
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Old 02-25-2011, 01:43 PM   #4
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I would give it strong consideration. Certainly like the looks of those specs, but would want to see the whole package. Where did those specs come from by the way?
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Old 02-25-2011, 01:47 PM   #5
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Maybe. Here's my competing analysis . . .

HELL YES for three reasons

First, even if diesel was $5.80, it would only mean that I spent about the same amount on fuel I spend now.

Diesel : $5.80 per gallon / 28 mpg = ~ 21 cents per mile
Gas : $3.34 per gallon / 17 mpg = ~ 20 cents per mile

Second, around here diesel is actually close to the price of gas and I think they'll stay close for the foreseeable future, particularly as diesels become (slowly) more popular. In the math formulas above, I would spend significantly MORE on gas fuel than diesel fuel to cover the same distance if the prices were anywhere close to each other.

Third, yeah more torque and horsepower!! I'm fine with the power in my 3.8, I just wish it got better mileage. Or, alternatively, I wish it had more power given the mileage that it gets. The diesel you describe would do both.

YEAH, but wait . . . .

I really like my Jeep. I've been customizing it and will continue to do so. By 2013, who knows where I'll be on that.

If a good US diesel ever appears, I'll give serious consideration to going here, buying one, and trying to convert my Jeep.
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Old 02-25-2011, 01:55 PM   #6
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May be a new one under warranty. But an older one I probably wouldn't. I know from having a fleet of trucks at work that the diesel ones are more expensive to maintain and only certain people in my area will/ can repair them.
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Old 02-25-2011, 02:36 PM   #7
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how much more will the option of the new diesel motor cost?

before buying my last pickup, I did a spread sheet analysis on projected costs over life of the vehicle, and was very surprised to learn in the data fitting my personal use schedule, it would take about 160,000 miles to get to the 'break even' point to where the diesel version was then beginning to pay off.

I've had diesel rigs in the past, and despite certain advantages, I'm not sure I'd leap into a diesel Wrangler....although it would be nice to see in the flesh FIRST....

I've still got hopes for the Jeep Gladiator in diesel.....
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Old 02-25-2011, 02:38 PM   #8
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Probably not.
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Old 02-25-2011, 03:15 PM   #9
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I have to say that I wouldn't although it would be great to have that option.
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Old 02-25-2011, 03:39 PM   #10
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Help me out. Why would somebody NOT want a diesel Wrangler along the lines of what's being described?

Keep in mind I'm talking about (and, presumably the OP was talking about) a clean running, modern diesel. And it'd be bigger than the current smaller diesels in the European JKs, which I understand catch a bit of flak for being a little lacking in upper end power.

The result would be a torquey JK with plenty of power all the way across the RPMs, fuel economy US folks can only dream of, and engine durability far in excess of modern gasoline engines.

What's the downside? Fuel availability? Fuel cost? Stigma? Something about engines that I don't understand? What is it?

When the zombie apocalypse comes you'll get a lot farther on your last tank . . . .
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Old 02-25-2011, 03:58 PM   #11
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yes, if will burn biodiesel..but would perfer the new Cummins v6
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Old 02-25-2011, 03:58 PM   #12
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Help me out. Why would somebody NOT want a diesel Wrangler along the lines of what's being described?

Keep in mind I'm talking about (and, presumably the OP was talking about) a clean running, modern diesel. And it'd be bigger than the current smaller diesels in the European JKs, which I understand catch a bit of flak for being a little lacking in upper end power.

The result would be a torquey JK with plenty of power all the way across the RPMs, fuel economy US folks can only dream of, and engine durability far in excess of modern gasoline engines.

What's the downside? Fuel availability? Fuel cost? Stigma? Something about engines that I don't understand? What is it?

When the zombie apocalypse comes you'll get a lot farther on your last tank . . . .
Yeah, I was wondering the same thing. Diesels, as a general rule, last longer, are cheaper to operate, and have fewer overall problems. I don't see much of a downside beyond those factors you pointed out, which aren't applicable to my locale and situation.
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Old 02-25-2011, 03:59 PM   #13
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loved my 5.9 diesels, but they gave great mpg on cheap fuel. new diesels seem to be very complicated engines with all the pollution "stuff" and fuel is more expensive than reg gas. as turbo technology becomes mainstream, ie ecotech engine, diesels won't really be a good alternative. i am waiting for the pentastar to come with a turbo or maybe 4cyl, version with turbo, that will give us some similar impressive fuel numbers without the premium price of the diesel engine. hopefully a much better trans will be included.
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:03 PM   #14
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Is this for real? Why is it a VM? Will Daimler let them have it? I can't see it, it has to be a Fiat engine. I don't think Daimler corp will let them have the VM motor.
I would be happier if they got CAT to build them an engine.
That all being said I would buy a Diesel JK, I am trying to build one now with a Isuzu 4JJ1-TC that i am trying to bring in from Aus. So if they did this I would buy one. Where can I give my deposit?
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:14 PM   #15
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obviously depends on the price.. a diesel would be great though. would love to know where your info is comin from though
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:15 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by navret View Post
loved my 5.9 diesels, but they gave great mpg on cheap fuel. new diesels seem to be very complicated engines with all the pollution "stuff" and fuel is more expensive than reg gas. as turbo technology becomes mainstream, ie ecotech engine, diesels won't really be a good alternative. i am waiting for the pentastar to come with a turbo or maybe 4cyl, version with turbo, that will give us some similar impressive fuel numbers without the premium price of the diesel engine. hopefully a much better trans will be included.
So the argument is that modern diesels have become less fuel efficient and more prone to failure on account of all the environmental concerns, while, at the same time, modern gasoline engines are catching up in terms of fuel efficiency? In other words, the disparity between the two in terms of efficiency and durability is shrinking and soon will be a thing of the past?
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:25 PM   #17
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loved my 5.9 diesels, but they gave great mpg on cheap fuel. new diesels seem to be very complicated engines with all the pollution "stuff" and fuel is more expensive than reg gas. as turbo technology becomes mainstream, ie ecotech engine, diesels won't really be a good alternative. i am waiting for the pentastar to come with a turbo or maybe 4cyl, version with turbo, that will give us some similar impressive fuel numbers without the premium price of the diesel engine. hopefully a much better trans will be included.
Exactly, with all the new EPA stuff on the diesel trucks, forget about that kind of mileage anymore. My 09 Duramax on 33's got 12mpg around town unloaded. Do some research on the Diesel Particulate Filters all the new trucks are running. The 2011 Duramax and Power Stroke also require Diesel Exhaust Fluid. Also, the electronic injectors they're all running now are $$$. They're awesome when you need that kind of torque like towing heavy, but I wouldn't want one in a JK.

A 5.7 though...
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:37 PM   #18
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So the argument is that modern diesels have become less fuel efficient and more prone to failure on account of all the environmental concerns, while, at the same time, modern gasoline engines are catching up in terms of fuel efficiency? In other words, the disparity between the two in terms of efficiency and durability is shrinking and soon will be a thing of the past?
well, that is the argument, you just stated it better for me.
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:43 PM   #19
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Unless they found a way around the DPF's and Urea Injection for emmissions, there is no way a Diesel JK could be competitive... It may find a niche market somewhere, but too many folks are still stinging after the EPA had their way with us in 2008.

I still haven't figured out how consuming more fuel is giving us "cleaner" exhaust... We are making more of it with increased fuel comsumption aren't we???
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Old 02-25-2011, 04:45 PM   #20
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My '08 JKU Rubi is paid for, it's not a DD, so mileage means nothing to me-

The NV241 OR Rock-Trac xfer case, allows me to use adequate torque the 3.8L provides, off-road-

Everything else I've/Chryslers done to this jeep makes it very capable and I have NO REASON to invest in a probable lost cause Diesel !!

Translated-that all means ---NO DIESEL-

Kapish ??

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Old 02-25-2011, 04:52 PM   #21
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I’ve already owned 3 or 4 diesels, not interested in another.

I have 5.38 gears and all the torque and power I could possible use on the trails - plenty to break all kinds of driveline stuff. It’s also good on the freeway. I certainly wouldn’t mind getting better MPG, but I didn’t buy it because of the mileage it gets - wasn’t even a consideration. Last I looked it takes a lot of miles to pay for the diesel upgrade.

My current drive train is “guaranteed” to last as long as I own the Jeep. Maybe Chrysler won’t honor the warrantee - we’ll see.
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:00 PM   #22
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Yes. I can get diesel that is blended around here and it's cheap. I've considered making the TJ a 4bt cummins.
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:01 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheel2Work
Unless they found a way around the DPF's and Urea Injection for emmissions, there is no way a Diesel JK could be competitive... It may find a niche market somewhere, but too many folks are still stinging after the EPA had their way with us in 2008.

I still haven't figured out how consuming more fuel is giving us "cleaner" exhaust... We are making more of it with increased fuel comsumption aren't we???
Do cars have to use DEF too? I thought it was just trucks and buses.
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:03 PM   #24
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well, that is the argument, you just stated it better for me.
Cool, thanks. I'm no gear head, so sometimes it helps me to try and restate to make sure I get what's being argued.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JIMBOX View Post
The NV241 OR Rock-Trac xfer case, allows me to use adequate torque the 3.8L provides, off-road- Everything else I've/Chryslers done to this jeep makes it very capable and I have NO REASON to invest in a probable lost cause Diesel !! Translated-that all means ---NO DIESEL- Kapish ??
Kapish.

It will be interesting to see how all this plays out over the next few years.

In my (very limited) understanding, there are some pretty fundamental differences between diesel and gas engines that may be difficult (or very expensive) to completely overcome with technology. If one strips back the over-regulation and hyper-complicated technology, it seems like the answer is clear as to which is an objectively better engine format for efficiency and longevity.

With that in mind, along with a recessionary economy and raising fuel prices, we may see some interesting twists over the next decade or so. The market and politics can be funny things, especially if they have a coordinated shift in desires.
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:10 PM   #25
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I just bought a Jeep, and it runs fine.
I got nothing against diesel except that none of my vehicles could use it. Other than the addition of more power, I havent found any reason why a diesel engine would be better than what I already own.
I might be able to add a supercharger and get better power and a little better MPG, it would cost less than buying a brand new Jeep, and I get to keep my current Jeep. If I ever get to the point where I am obsessed with more power or more MPG I will probably mod my Jeep.
Pretty sure I wont be buying a 2012 or 2013 Jeep if the only change is a new engine.
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:18 PM   #26
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No but we will see at least 5 years from now when I get a new Jeep. By then they will have even a new engine lol
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:27 PM   #27
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Is this for real? Why is it a VM? Will Daimler let them have it? I can't see it, it has to be a Fiat engine. I don't think Daimler corp will let them have the VM motor.
I would be happier if they got CAT to build them an engine.
That all being said I would buy a Diesel JK, I am trying to build one now with a Isuzu 4JJ1-TC that i am trying to bring in from Aus. So if they did this I would buy one. Where can I give my deposit?
Daimler has no say in what Fiat/Chrysler do, VM is owned by GM and Fiat 50/50
gee don't you get the news in the out back?
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:34 PM   #28
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For those who want Ref info, look under recent news items for GC to get 3.0 VM diesel atGreen Car Congress
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Old 02-25-2011, 05:59 PM   #29
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I wood prefer a 4 cyl diesel that gets even better MPG. Dont need that much power , Maybe for a Unlimited. I drive a 2 Door [6 speed]and am happy with the power it has,.
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Old 02-25-2011, 06:06 PM   #30
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standard PU diesel option costs $4~7000 more than gas engine, .....that's a LOT gallons of gasoline/////, and adds a LOT of front axle weight bias....every diesel pick up I've driven handles like an agricultural implement...but my old MB turbodiesel 300 SEL was impressive performing compared to the old non-turbo Mercedes sedan...a gutless wonder.

current projected fuel cost within the month: $4/gallon; that means 1000-1750 gallons gas @ 20mpg= 20,000~35,000....for me that's 2-4 years Jeeping.....

By experience I find most rigs after 5-6 years have found ways to bore, annoy or infuriate me such that I'm ready for something new.

Don't anticipate heavy towing, R/O diesel;
don't like the smell, even of the new teckkie models. They all seem to need twice as much oil as gas rigs, and changes are quite spendy. Add in fuel system maintenance, anti gelling and filtering gear, that first 100,000 miles costs more than one might think for basic maintenance.

Plop one down with a decent price/options & I'd take a look....but it would have to pencil out on running expenses.

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