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Old 02-07-2013, 08:56 PM   #1
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wrangler regear intro

Hello - I'm new to the Wrangler world but I've seen a lot of references to "regearing." Can someone provide a URL to a good overview of gear ratios for the wrangler, the benefits of each ratio, when I would want to regear and the impact of regearing or not regearing. Specifically - I want to run 35's on my wrangler and I'm hoping a Rubicon will give me the gear ratio I need for 35's so I can avoid the hassle and expense of regearing....

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Old 02-07-2013, 09:33 PM   #2
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The year and transmission of your JK will vary what you need or don't need to do.

The basics of gears is torque multiplication. The higher the numerical value for the gear, the more torque multiplication. Which means the engine will move the vehicle with less effort...however..that comes with a trade-off. RPM. The higher the numerical value [or in gear terms, the "lower" the gear ratio set], the higher your rpms will be at any given speed.

This can positively or negatively affect your vehicle. Too low of gearing [numerically high number] with a manual can cause constant gear rowing or an excessive rpm on the highway. Reducing mpg. Too high of a gear [numerically lower number] can cause excessive lugging, clutch slipping, transmission heat, reduced milage, more frequent downshifts, lessen the ability to tow, etc.

That is the basics of gearing.

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Old 02-07-2013, 09:39 PM   #3
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Tire & Gear Ratio Chart at Morris 4x4 Center

I've seen this chart before. For example, Rubi comes with 32" tires and 4.10 gearing. The tire size and gearing intersect around 2800 RPM (chart reads 4.11 gearing). If I'm reading the chart correctly, then to to to 35" tires you would want to maintain about 2800 RPM, which puts you into a 4.56 gearing.

Gearing options from the factory are 3.21, 3.73, and 4.10 (only on the Rubi). Depending on what you buy, you can have a 32" tire with any of these gearings. I have a JKU Sport that I put 32" tires on with 3.73 gears. So the instersection between 32" and 3.73 gearing is about 2550 RPM. This runs fine with my Pentastar engine and auto trans. I would expect the same performance with 35" tires and 4.11 gearing - same gearing option as available on Rubi. Think you would be ok with 35" and 4.10 on Rubi, but for serious offroading I would go a to lower (numerically higher) gear like 4.56. This gearing is not a factory option.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:19 PM   #4
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Welcome to Wranglers and the forum!

A couple of things off the bat.

The 07-11 JK's run the 3.8 V6 with either a 6 speed manual or 4 speed automatic transmission.

The 12 and newer JK's run the 3.6 V6 with the same 6 speed manual or the newer and better 5 speed automatic.

*****What follows is only what I have read about and/or heard from others as I jumped from stock 32 inch tires with 4.10 gears to 37 inch tires with 5.13 gears (09 JKU manual trans BTW)*****

The 3.8 with the manual is not too bad with 35 inch tires and can be run with 3.73 gears (good) or 4.10 gears (best).

The 3.8 with the auto is notorious for being difficult to fine tune for all around driveability with 35 inch tires and either 3.73 or 4.10 gears as the gear ratios in the transmission are spread too apart to maintain the programmed parameters in the stock configuration of the PCM and the transmission is almost constantly searching for the right gear to maintain speed.

The 3.6 with the manual is even better than the 3.8 with 3.73 or 4.10 gears.

The 3.6 with the auto approaches (if not equals) the manual in all around driveability with 3.73 or 4.10 gears.

With all that said, on with the information site!

This site can be used to play with some numbers and allows you to compare two different setups side by side (check stock against theoretical).

Gear Ratio Calculator

Use this information to plug into the above site:

Gear ratios for the NSG370 (6 manual) are: (1) 4.46, (2) 2.61, (3) 1.72, (4) 1.25, (5) 1.00, (6) 0.84 and (R) 4.06.

Gear ratios for the 42RLE (4 auto) are: (1) 2.84, (2) 1.57, (3) 1.00, (4) 0.69, and (R) 2.21.

Gear ratios for the W5A580 (5 auto) are: (1) 3.59, (2) 2.19, (3) 1.41, (4) 1.00, (5) 0.83, and (R) 3.16.

To determine what gear ratio you currently have (in case you don't know), you can contact Jeep at this site Contact Jeep and request a Build Sheet for your Jeep which should list the ratio or there should be a metal tag on each differential similar to the one in the following picture that will let you know what you've got.




For the transfer case, you either have this one : X/Sport/Sahara: NV241, 2.72:1 low range or this one: Rubicon: NVG241OR, 4:1 low range.


This one just converts tire sizes: DML Tire and Wheel Calculator

As to the benefits.

Fuel economy - This one can be tricky because the cost of a regear can be difficult to offset if your daily driving consists mainly of running around town. It can be easier to offset if you consistantly drive long distances though.

Driveability - This is for around town and on the highway. Around town, all things remaining stock other than larger tires, you will probably feel a difference in the seat of the pants aspect of aceleration from a stop and you may feel a difference when trying to pass another vehicle (passing is more of an issue with the 3.8 and automatic setup though).

Trailability - For off road. Depending on what kind of off road play you enjoy the most, you may not need to regear. If you generally run mild to moderate trails, you probably won't need to regear. If you plan to get into rock crawling and your Jeep is running 3.73 or 3.21 gears, it would probably be a good idea to regear. If you Jeep is running 4.10 gears, regearing may come down to a subjective call on your part. The main reason for regearing (generally going to lower gear ratios) is to provide more precise control when climbing over large or off camber obstacles.

I'm sure there is plenty that I missed but hopefully this will get you started.
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:45 PM   #5
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thanks greenbay - "serious offroading" isn't my goal. I just want a cool looking configuration that handles reasonably well on the street and can handle an occasional snowy road up to Stevens Pass. Sounds like the 4.10 gear option will give me what I need without the extra hassle and expense of regearing. Sounds like the bigger the tire the bigger the gear ratio needed. So if Jeep decides to offer a 4.56 gear ratio for the 2015 wrangler then that's what I should get if I want to run 35" tires....
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Old 02-07-2013, 11:06 PM   #6
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@rtone - if I'm buying a brand new Rubicon does it seem most practical to you to go with the highest gear ratio available if I want to run 35's? For the current MY that would be the 4.10 on the Rubicon?
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:51 AM   #7
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@ random - You should be just fine with the factory Rubicon setup and 35's. In my opinion, regearing from 4.10 to 4.56 wouldn't be worth the money. If you get to the point where you want to go larger on the tire size or you want to get into more difficult wheeling adventures (hard core rock crawling most of the time you are off road) it would be a good idea to regear.

One thing you can do, once you've bought your new Jeep, drive it stock for at least a month (go for two if you can resist the urge to start modifying it) and this will give you a good baseline for what it is actually capable of. After this, go for the lift and tire mod. You will have a better feel for if the stock 4.10 gearing will work for you or if you will want different gears.

The main reason I went with the regear that I did was to over come the larger tire diameter and mass of the tires against the 3.8 V6.

Also, don't forget, going to 35's will be a big enough difference to throw your speedometer off.

AEV offers a Procal module that you can use to adjust for larger tires among a few other changeable parameters. ProCal Module - Shop By Category
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Old 02-08-2013, 05:35 AM   #8
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Also, in case you don't know, when describing gear sets a numerically higher (4.10) identifier is a mechanically lower gear set and a numerically lower (3.73) identifier is a mechanically higher gear set.

For a 4.10 (or whatever the numerical identifier is) gear set, the driveshaft turns 4.10(or whatever the numerical identifier is) times for every one rotation of the tire.

With mechanically lower gear sets, the motor works harder for the same overall movement, i.e. one rotation of the tire, which produces slightly lower fuel mileage but the trade off is that more power (torque) is put to the ground.

With mechanically higher gear sets, the motor works less for the same overall movement, i.e. one rotation of the tire, which produces slightly higher fuel mileage but the trade off is that less power (torque) is put to the ground.
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:32 PM   #9
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A long time ago I upped the tire size on my Bronco 2 and it made the ride noticeably more cumbersome. Sounds like maxing out the gear ratio on my Wrangler could address this to some extent.

People say that the high gear ratios get worse gas mileage but is the Wranger smart enough to equalize some of that difference on the highway when torque is not needed as much?
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:16 PM   #10
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A long time ago I upped the tire size on my Bronco 2 and it made the ride noticeably more cumbersome. Sounds like maxing out the gear ratio on my Wrangler could address this to some extent.

People say that the high gear ratios get worse gas mileage but is the Wranger smart enough to equalize some of that difference on the highway when torque is not needed as much?
For larger tire size and lower gearing I think you can use a AEV procal to flash the computer. Dealer can only do this up to 32" tires and I think 4.10 gears - the factory options. But use of a procal may void the factory warranty. By using the procal you may be able to optiize autotrans shift points for better fuel economy.
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Old 02-08-2013, 09:23 PM   #11
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I definitely don't want to void my warranty. I'm just hoping to be reasonably satisfied by pairing 35's with a 4.10....
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Old 02-09-2013, 09:58 AM   #12
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Has anyone else here paired 35's with a 4.10 gear ratio? I'd like to hear other people's first-hand experiences with this setup.

Also, do you think jeep might offer higher gear ratios than 4.10 for 2014 or 2015? Sounds like a number of people regear so there might be some demand for this?
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:18 AM   #13
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Has anyone else here paired 35's with a 4.10 gear ratio? I'd like to hear other people's first-hand experiences with this setup.

Also, do you think jeep might offer higher gear ratios than 4.10 for 2014 or 2015? Sounds like a number of people regear so there might be some demand for this?
According to my factory build sheet, my 07 has 4.10 and when I bought it, it had 35's already installed. It seems to have, to me at least, really good pickup, it doesn't seem sluggish at all. One problem, or issue, is though, I don't know if it has been regeared or not.
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:30 AM   #14
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thanks kolector - since your actual gear ratio is unknown it could be 4.56 which would be a different animal than 4.10....
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:38 AM   #15
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I definitely don't want to void my warranty. I'm just hoping to be reasonably satisfied by pairing 35's with a 4.10....
Regarding the warranty, I think it depends on the dealer. Do an advanced search using the keywords "procal" and "warranty" and search titles only in the JK section of WF. Some people say it won't void the warranty, others say less than honest dealers will void the warranty, submit a claim to Chrysler, and charge the owner for the repairs. If you go to 35" tires, your speedometer/odometer will be low by 10% relative to a properly calibrated 32" tire. You can use procal to reset the original settings (in fact it can only be used on one vehicle at a time) if you are concerned about warranty issues. Just don't let the dealer see you use it if you are concerned.
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Old 02-09-2013, 12:36 PM   #16
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if my odometer is low by 10% then that means I get an extra 1500 bonus miles/yr on my lease. 35's ftw
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Old 02-09-2013, 01:07 PM   #17
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I don't have a Rubi but know several people who do/wheel with them. They're perfectly fine with 35s and 4.10s. With the Pentastar you have plenty of gitty up. When I ask them about re-gearing they look at me with a blank expression.

I have 4.56s sitting in the garage because if I am spending the money on a re-gear I might as well get better than stock. But I am sure 4.10s would be fine too. (I have 3.21s for the moment.) IMO.
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Old 02-09-2013, 01:31 PM   #18
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thanks herz - sounds like I should be fine with 35's +4.10 without much if any need to aftermarket modify to 4.56.

However, if jeep starts offering 4.56 from the factory it sounds like that would be a slight edge. Maybe jeep will start offering that on the Rubicon in the next year or two. Worst case scenario it sounds like I should be fine with 4.10....
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:57 PM   #19
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if my odometer is low by 10% then that means I get an extra 1500 bonus miles/yr on my lease. 35's ftw
In a lease situation, I wouldn't touch a thing.

If you do, make sure you keep every stock part that you change out and put it back to stock before the end of the lease, otherwise they will nail you to the wall come trade in time.
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Old 02-10-2013, 11:30 PM   #20
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I knew larger tire size affected my speedometer but i didn't know ut affected my odometer. It makes sense but are you sure about that?
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Old 02-11-2013, 05:34 AM   #21
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if my odometer is low by 10% then that means I get an extra 1500 bonus miles/yr on my lease. 35's ftw
Definitely would NOT re-gear a leased vehicle!!! NO WAY!!!
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:48 AM   #22
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I have to agree- I didn't catch the lease mention. Now- would a dealer actually notice you've re-geared? Chances are extrememly minimal- what are they going to do? Open the carrier? (Just don't get a shiny red Arb one like mine). But on a lease I wouldn't go there....
A friend came over yesterday- I drove his lifted 2012 4 door Rubi with 4.10s, 35s (MTs), hard top, armor- and its just fine. Granted my 2 door softie is much quicker (weight)- but shifting/speed are normal/within reason. If it were mine I wouldn't see the need to re-gear it. Now- 35s on stock height? Another thread.
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Old 02-11-2013, 12:09 PM   #23
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Welcome to Wranglers and the forum!

A couple of things off the bat.

The 07-11 JK's run the 3.8 V6 with either a 6 speed manual or 4 speed automatic transmission.

The 12 and newer JK's run the 3.6 V6 with the same 6 speed manual or the newer and better 5 speed automatic.

*****What follows is only what I have read about and/or heard from others as I jumped from stock 32 inch tires with 4.10 gears to 37 inch tires with 5.13 gears (09 JKU manual trans BTW)*****

The 3.8 with the manual is not too bad with 35 inch tires and can be run with 3.73 gears (good) or 4.10 gears (best).

The 3.8 with the auto is notorious for being difficult to fine tune for all around driveability with 35 inch tires and either 3.73 or 4.10 gears as the gear ratios in the transmission are spread too apart to maintain the programmed parameters in the stock configuration of the PCM and the transmission is almost constantly searching for the right gear to maintain speed.

The 3.6 with the manual is even better than the 3.8 with 3.73 or 4.10 gears.

The 3.6 with the auto approaches (if not equals) the manual in all around driveability with 3.73 or 4.10 gears.

With all that said, on with the information site!

This site can be used to play with some numbers and allows you to compare two different setups side by side (check stock against theoretical).

Gear Ratio Calculator

Use this information to plug into the above site:

Gear ratios for the NSG370 (6 manual) are: (1) 4.46, (2) 2.61, (3) 1.72, (4) 1.25, (5) 1.00, (6) 0.84 and (R) 4.06.

Gear ratios for the 42RLE (4 auto) are: (1) 2.84, (2) 1.57, (3) 1.00, (4) 0.69, and (R) 2.21.

Gear ratios for the W5A580 (5 auto) are: (1) 3.59, (2) 2.19, (3) 1.41, (4) 1.00, (5) 0.83, and (R) 3.16.

To determine what gear ratio you currently have (in case you don't know), you can contact Jeep at this site Contact Jeep and request a Build Sheet for your Jeep which should list the ratio or there should be a metal tag on each differential similar to the one in the following picture that will let you know what you've got.




For the transfer case, you either have this one : X/Sport/Sahara: NV241, 2.72:1 low range or this one: Rubicon: NVG241OR, 4:1 low range.


This one just converts tire sizes: DML Tire and Wheel Calculator

As to the benefits.

Fuel economy - This one can be tricky because the cost of a regear can be difficult to offset if your daily driving consists mainly of running around town. It can be easier to offset if you consistantly drive long distances though.

Driveability - This is for around town and on the highway. Around town, all things remaining stock other than larger tires, you will probably feel a difference in the seat of the pants aspect of aceleration from a stop and you may feel a difference when trying to pass another vehicle (passing is more of an issue with the 3.8 and automatic setup though).

Trailability - For off road. Depending on what kind of off road play you enjoy the most, you may not need to regear. If you generally run mild to moderate trails, you probably won't need to regear. If you plan to get into rock crawling and your Jeep is running 3.73 or 3.21 gears, it would probably be a good idea to regear. If you Jeep is running 4.10 gears, regearing may come down to a subjective call on your part. The main reason for regearing (generally going to lower gear ratios) is to provide more precise control when climbing over large or off camber obstacles.

I'm sure there is plenty that I missed but hopefully this will get you started.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtone1583 View Post
@ random - You should be just fine with the factory Rubicon setup and 35's. In my opinion, regearing from 4.10 to 4.56 wouldn't be worth the money. If you get to the point where you want to go larger on the tire size or you want to get into more difficult wheeling adventures (hard core rock crawling most of the time you are off road) it would be a good idea to regear.

One thing you can do, once you've bought your new Jeep, drive it stock for at least a month (go for two if you can resist the urge to start modifying it) and this will give you a good baseline for what it is actually capable of. After this, go for the lift and tire mod. You will have a better feel for if the stock 4.10 gearing will work for you or if you will want different gears.

The main reason I went with the regear that I did was to over come the larger tire diameter and mass of the tires against the 3.8 V6.

Also, don't forget, going to 35's will be a big enough difference to throw your speedometer off.

AEV offers a Procal module that you can use to adjust for larger tires among a few other changeable parameters. ProCal Module - Shop By Category
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtone1583 View Post
Also, in case you don't know, when describing gear sets a numerically higher (4.10) identifier is a mechanically lower gear set and a numerically lower (3.73) identifier is a mechanically higher gear set.

For a 4.10 (or whatever the numerical identifier is) gear set, the driveshaft turns 4.10(or whatever the numerical identifier is) times for every one rotation of the tire.

With mechanically lower gear sets, the motor works harder for the same overall movement, i.e. one rotation of the tire, which produces slightly lower fuel mileage but the trade off is that more power (torque) is put to the ground.

With mechanically higher gear sets, the motor works less for the same overall movement, i.e. one rotation of the tire, which produces slightly higher fuel mileage but the trade off is that less power (torque) is put to the ground.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rtone1583 View Post
In a lease situation, I wouldn't touch a thing.

If you do, make sure you keep every stock part that you change out and put it back to stock before the end of the lease, otherwise they will nail you to the wall come trade in time.
^^ Pay heed; this guy knows his stuff.
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:49 PM   #24
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I have to agree- I didn't catch the lease mention. Now- would a dealer actually notice you've re-geared? Chances are extrememly minimal- what are they going to do? Open the carrier? (Just don't get a shiny red Arb one like mine). But on a lease I wouldn't go there....
A friend came over yesterday- I drove his lifted 2012 4 door Rubi with 4.10s, 35s (MTs), hard top, armor- and its just fine. Granted my 2 door softie is much quicker (weight)- but shifting/speed are normal/within reason. If it were mine I wouldn't see the need to re-gear it. Now- 35s on stock height? Another thread.
@herz - that's great - you've driven a 35/4.10 and it was reasonable. That works for me
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:50 PM   #25
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Definitely would NOT re-gear a leased vehicle!!! NO WAY!!!
@don - doesn't sound like I'll have to? 4.10 ftw.....
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Old 04-03-2013, 02:16 PM   #26
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We need a gear sticky tread! Will this do?

I'm looking for gears on my 2013 jku 3.6 v6 auto with 35" tires daily driver looking to bring back to stock feel !
4.88 or 4.56
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Old 04-03-2013, 05:57 PM   #27
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Just put 315 70 17 GY Duratracs on our JKU w/3.73 posi and Auto trans. Will probably do a regear to get the performance up. Most of the driving will be between 5 and 8 thousand feet and off road to 11 thousand feet. We alread lose about 3% of HP for every 1 thousand ft of elevation increase. If I calculated right 4.10 will get me too about where the factory performance was stock. I am debating going to 4.56 or 4.88 your input on this would be appreciated. Also plan on beefing up the axles with sleeves and gussets as well as an arb locker at the same time.
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Old 04-03-2013, 06:12 PM   #28
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In the past two months I've (well, 4WD actually) added:
4.56 R&P
Truetracs D30 & D44
315 70 17 (34") duratracs
RR SA wheels
2.5" RE lift
Procal
Steering stabilizer

Love love love the change. Looks badd asss!!!

I wouldn't do 4.88 R&P with 35's.. I'm just a hair over 2500 RPM @ 70MPH and find this perfect. Ran the stock 32's for a couple weeks with the drivetrain updates minus the lift and wheels.. Was about 3grand at 70MPH.. And while only 500 RPM more than now.. It felt way beyond the sweet spot

Good luck. Welcome to the club! (If you hear rubbing with wheel turned in reverse, it's just the damn air dam
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Old 04-03-2013, 06:32 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by JKWrangler2012 View Post
In the past two months I've (well, 4WD actually) added:
4.56 R&P
Truetracs D30 & D44
315 70 17 (34") duratracs
RR SA wheels
2.5" RE lift
Procal
Steering stabilizer

Love love love the change. Looks badd asss!!!

I wouldn't do 4.88 R&P with 35's.. I'm just a hair over 2500 RPM @ 70MPH and find this perfect. Ran the stock 32's for a couple weeks with the drivetrain updates minus the lift and wheels.. Was about 3grand at 70MPH.. And while only 500 RPM more than now.. It felt way beyond the sweet spot

Good luck. Welcome to the club! (If you hear rubbing with wheel turned in reverse, it's just the damn air dam
ya im thinking 4.56 also thanks jeep looks good!
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Old 04-03-2013, 06:36 PM   #30
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I was leaning toward the 4.56 ratio. Got rid of the stock bumper and air dam. I have the 2.5" RK lift with a stubby bumper and warn 10k. Will be going to a lower elevation Phoenix @ 2 thousand ft so it will be interesting how the JKU runs down there w/3.73's versus the 5 to 8k elevation i am at now. Thanks

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